|
| Thread: If HOMM2 is your favorite... why? |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 · NEXT» |
|
zombiewhacker
Adventuring Hero
|
posted January 15, 2014 10:34 PM |
|
|
If HOMM2 is your favorite... why?
Of the first four games in the HOMM series, the second installment is the only one I somehow managed to skip over. (I do have the disc, in fact, but never really played it.)
So I'm fascinated to read so many posts here where people say "HOMM2 was my favorite." If so, please explain why.
If you guys intrigue me enough, I might dig my HOMM2 disc out of mothballs and play it after all. 
|
|
Storm-Giant
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
|
|
posted January 15, 2014 10:40 PM |
|
|
Some will say nostalgia, but I think it isn't just that.
The game has a very interesting economy, where you have to be very cautious on where do you spend your money. On top of that, your army becomes another resource to be managed, since your town produces 6 creatures and you can only carry 5 into your hero.
Also, H2 started to settle some of the fundamentals of a HoM&M game: creature upgrades, Black Dragons vs Titans, Necromancers....
And then you have beautiful hand-made graphics 
____________
|
|
OhforfSake
Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
|
|
posted January 15, 2014 10:42 PM |
|
|
I like the scenarios that followed with HoMM2 much more than those of HoMM3 & 4.
____________
Living time backwards
|
|
Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
|
|
posted January 16, 2014 02:34 AM |
|
|
Everyone can explain why H2 is better than H3 and vice-versa, but one fact only is relevant: most of us never came back to H2 once we tasted H3.
H2 maps hosting sites vanished long time ago and no one asked to return. H3 maps are still produced on a monthly base.
Most of us still continued to play H3 when H4 came out.
Guess what, H6 is out and most of us still play H3. So I have a little idea about which is the best in the series, but I'll let you guess.
|
|
OhforfSake
Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
|
|
posted January 16, 2014 02:45 AM |
|
|
You got a good point there Sal. First time I played heroes 2, I found it entertaining, I can't say the same about H3 or H4, but that's because the changes confused me back then, and I adapted to both games, and didn't look back afterwards.
To be honest though, I recall after adapting to H3 not wanting to go back to H2 for nothing else than to try to complete it without cheating. After adapting to H4 I still tired of it rather quickly and felt like playing different games.
When I hadn't played any heroes game for years (many years later), it was Heroes 3 I wanted to play, it was heroes 3 I had ultimately invested the most time in (I'd made my own map during the time before I got H4..), and despite I still had the H2 cd-rom, and not the H3 or H4 one, it was only H3 I wanted to play.
I think Heroes 2 is a great game, but I gotta agree that Heroes 3 is a better game (for me).
____________
Living time backwards
|
|
artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
|
|
posted January 16, 2014 02:52 AM |
|
Edited by artu at 02:54, 16 Jan 2014.
|
Salamandre said:
Everyone can explain why H2 is better than H3 and vice-versa, but one fact only is relevant: most of us never came back to H2 once we tasted H3.
H2 maps hosting sites vanished long time ago and no one asked to return. H3 maps are still produced on a monthly base.
Most of us still continued to play H3 when H4 came out.
Guess what, H6 is out and most of us still play H3. So I have a little idea about which is the best in the series, but I'll let you guess.
Exactly. H3 improved on H2, if somebody still preffered H2, it was mostly personal nostalgia. H4 and H5 didnt improve the same concept that worked, they changed it. Now, some can say they changed it for good but one thing is for sure, they changed something a lot of people prefered they hadn't. H3 was like, so Chess works, lets add a marble board and a move called Castling, also let's make the pawns who reach the other side turn into any piece the player wants them to. H4 and H5 was like, Chess got old, let's turn it into something else. Chess wasnt old, well, it was old but that didnt matter, it aged well.
|
|
xlnt
Known Hero
|
|
posted January 16, 2014 12:03 PM |
|
Edited by xlnt at 12:03, 16 Jan 2014.
|
HoMM2 was the 1st Heroes game i played and the graphics were the best i could have ever imagined - so when HoMM3 came out - i hated it because the style was so different 
The random generator in HoMM2 was worst though.. so there was this problem with knowing all maps and having bad new ones.
There was a big difference in how the Dwellings worked and in multy it was one of the most important things to do - go get a dwelling that was not touched for 3-4-5 weeks (:
also - shooters/fly_ers worked in a (imo) better way in HoMM2
anyway - i love them both, can't say the same for 4 or 6
|
|
JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
|
|
posted January 16, 2014 12:31 PM |
|
|
At the time HoMM 2 got me hooked completely. There were a couple of odd things, but also a couple of things that worked amazingly well
HoMM 1 & 2 are - and I admit that it's strange - the only HoMM games I really liked to play the campaigns. I never liked the carryover stuff of the campaigns after that
Also, towns were really different, and playing towns with "alien" heroes and mixed armies was more or less normal.
When HoMM 3 came out, three years had passed, and I suppose HoMM 2 had simply reached the end of its life cycle for me - although I think that some things, like economy and the afore mentioned diversity and the fact that there was less army slots than creature tiers worked better than what HoMM 3 came up with, HoMM 3 added so much to the game that there was just no way back.
I will gladly admit, that when HoMM 4 came out I played that game with fascination and rapture - until suddenly, after a couple of months it was all over for a reason I still cannot fathom.
Anyway, what happened with HoMM 3 and WoG is fairly clear, considering that HoMM 4 was a different game.
But what I would really like to see is a "remake", if you can call it that way, of HoMM 2: the main concept of THAT game, add to it a variation of HoMM V's skill system, add the combat rules of HoMM 3 and the map object diversity, add an army slot and a creature tier, and voila.
I still put a nostalgia map in once in a season or so, but that's it.
|
|
JoonasTo
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
|
|
posted January 16, 2014 12:46 PM |
|
Edited by JoonasTo at 12:52, 16 Jan 2014.
|
I am one of those weird people who vouches for H2 over H3.
There are a lot of differences between the two games:
- Graphics, H2 graphics are cartoony, fantasy style while H3 offers realistic style, aside from the lower resolution of H2 graphics, the style is a preference question, for me personally, you can't beat that H2 phoenix
- Money Economy, H3 offers the expanded money production of town hall, city hall and capitol instead of the statue and castle like H2. This changes the importance of gold mines and second castles/towns in the grand scheme of things. It also enables one to keep up his unit production from his main town with very little difficulty even if he doesn't own much anything else. This is not possible in H2.
- Unit Production, H3 offers citadel, castle and unique buildings for recruiting more units each week, H2 only has the well and unique buildings. The way well works compared to H3 fort upgrades also means low level creatures are left behind in weekly growth while the last level creatures get a +200% boost.
- Creature stats, H3 changed the formula and spread the skill range by a HUGE margin. Peasant has 1 stats in everything while we have Azure dragon with 1000hp, 50 in skills and so forth(regular creatures top at 300hp 30 skills). H2 peasants are the same but the highest stats come with Titan at 15 skills and 300 hp. Now if you're familiar with the formulas you know these should transfer to about the same difference(to regular units, not azures). And they do, but when you look at the difference between different tiers, then suddenly they start looking a lot closer.As we all know creatures are lead by heroes and heroes have primary skills...now add to the fact that steelskin adds 6 defence to a creature and you should see where I'm coming from.
- Flyer mechanics, In H3 flyer doesn't mean anything other than obstacle crossing. In H2 it means a lot, lot more. Even if you have an average speed griffin, because it's a flyer, it can traverse the whole battlefield in one turn. This makes battle tactics, quite different from H3 where that griffin would have to spend two(or even three if cross corners) turns crossing because of it's speed.
- Creature upgrades, H3 has one upgrade for every unit. H2 might have one, might have none, or it might even have two. This creates variety in the game. Plain and simple.
- Castle lineups, H3 has two more castles(no, conflux does not count), H2 has castles lined up by their hero themes while H3 is already switching towards race themes(excluding knight/castle which has always been human)
- BALANCE, as much of a horrible clustersnow as H3 is it's got nothing on H2 in this regard. That snow is totally snowed up. And while this is great fun and awesome campaign setting it SUCKS in competitive multiplayer.
Aside from the obvious multiplayer crowd moving over the H3, most people on this forum are simply too young or got into games too late to play the earlier HoMaMs before H3. You cannot simply pass by the fact that H3 was a HUGE hit back when computer/video gaming made it's breakthrough. So instead of H2 being the one that gets nostalgia points, it's more often H3 that's the one with the nostalgia. We H2 preferers have our nostalgia points further back in the series, oh those purple dragons...
H2=H5ToawesomE>H6=H3>H4>H5>H1>H5HoFuckingDwarves
PS. Have you ever tried upgrading giants in Heroes 2?
____________
DON'T BE A NOOB, JOIN A.D.V.E.N.T.U.R.E.
|
|
VodevilX
Hired Hero
Skeleton Jack
|
|
posted January 18, 2014 02:28 PM |
|
Edited by VodevilX at 14:28, 18 Jan 2014.
|
Well, for me the everlasting journey also started with HOMM2.
When I got my PC in '99 I was new to the whole gaming scene, besides my few hour weekend gamins at my friend. And totally unintended, but somehow miraculously the tech guy gave me 2 cd's with random games, one of them being this one (the twist is: that time H3 already came out! But i'm glad it happened this way)
And so it was love at first sight.
The perfect game for a kid like me, having around a brother, a cousin or a few classmates... Every Day, Every time rush home from school just to spend an eternity playing hot seat. So the pros are definitely come from nostalgia for me, not game mechanics. But yet, the game came up a early December, and the FUN it still can provide (besides some Win 8.1 compatibility problems...)! Oh it is flawless!
|
|
oi_polloi
Tavern Dweller
|
|
posted February 08, 2014 02:47 PM |
|
|
I think that JoonasTo nailed it, and I'd like to expand on that:
Economy - As JoonasTo said, the castles can't sustain themselves by building money-generating structures alone. Therefore, exploration and conquest of towns or gold mines is much more important and adds strategic depth. The feeling of accomplishment which follows victory over a guardian of a gold mine in early and even mid-game is huge.
Creatures - Again, as JoonasTo mentioned, the differences between creature tiers is not that big compared to H3, and you don't have to go as far as taking Azure dragons into that equation - it's simply about the differences in att/def/dmg/hp between tiers 2/3/4/5 . That creates a situation where low-mid level creatures (lvl 1 are somewhat an exception) are not cannon fodder or placeholders for the elite creatures - they can many times be the main factor for winning a battle. In other words - again, more strategic depth.
Diversity - Each faction has a single Hero type, and it plays very differently from other types (opposed to H3 where all might (magic) heroes end up being basically the same, no matter which faction they came from). There are only 6 creatures in every tier overall (excluding neutrals), which again gives enough room for them to be really different. As much as I liked having more of everything in H3, sometimes less is more.
Scenarios - I thing that the titles which followed H2 had pretty dull and soulless maps (H4 is somewhat an exception). H2's maps were simply awesome, each was a small world on it's own and I remember many of them really well even after all these years.
Atmosphere - That is imo the most important aspect which makes H2 rise above all others. Its the hand-drawn graphics, the fantastic music, the naive and simple "Good vs. Evil" approach. I'm aware that some nostalgia also plays a role here, but I thing that the atmospheric properties mentioned above are truly implemented in H2 better than in it's followers (H4 and H5 actually did a better job there than H3 imo).
Personal taste about various minor aspects - I found the idea of an ultimate artifact being a powerful weapon rather than a town upgrade much better. Neutrals had cool abilities. Streamlined campaign was more fun and gave a bigger sense of purpose (alliance with dwarves was awesome!). And finally, as a canine lover, the wolf in H2 isn't a neutral or a weak 2nd tier unit, but a strong offensive 3d tier creature 
____________
|
|
olorin
Adventuring Hero
tophatchild.blogspot.com
|
posted August 29, 2014 11:57 AM |
|
Edited by olorin at 11:59, 29 Aug 2014.
|
Hiya, friends!
HOMM2 is definitely my favourite whithin our saga. Regarding the reasons that support my opinion, well, I cannot deny some kind of "nostalgia", but come on! What about those beautiful "hand-made graphics"? (the heroes portraits, the colourful global map, the solid castle's aesthetics...). And for sure it comes into my mind its easy-going interface and the map editor, which is both simply and efficient.
It has everything that a Heroes of Might and Magic should have: naive-graphics, astonishing soundtrack, addictive ways. If I were the one in charge for developing a new HOMM, by all means I would elaborate an up-to-date Heroes II, imitating its cartoonish shapes and models and expanding its philosophy. Heroes III matches only partially my point, otherwise a great game, for sure.
Due to these arguments, I cannot fathom why this lacking of mods, patches, new creatures or graphic add-ons, that I have checked out, apart from the well-known "HOMM III The Succession Mod".
Regards!
|
|
Oculomenti
Tavern Dweller
Fitzgibbon of Misfortune
|
|
posted September 04, 2014 05:01 PM |
|
|
Ah, Heroes II... Hmn, well, I'd be hard pressed to list just one reason it's my favorite Heroes Game, but I'll try all the same!
First off - I don't dislike HoMMIII, or any of the games. I may mock the later ones a little bit, and they certainly aren't near and dear to my heart, but they're still good. As for III, it's my little sister's favorite, and she can't understand why my older sister and I prefer HoMMII. I play it semi-regularly, but usually only with friends, and mostly because I can't convince them to play HoMMII - let alone get HoMMII to play reliably for multiple people! :-P
But Heroes of Might and Magic II was different, and is different. A lot of people I know going into game design today seem to be espousing the idea that minimalism is good, that story is unimportant, and that all that matters is gameplay - which I feel miss the fact that gameplay and story are absolutely entertwined.
For me, Heroes I is where I started, and is subject to most of my nostalgia. The bizarrity of it, the surreality of it still make it my second most played Heroes game, after II. Is it the most solid? Naaaah. But it has the ROOTS of what I love about Heroes II.
The early II Heroes games, like the M&M games proper, were weird. If you played one, with it's huge purple dragons, pikemen and centaurs, you'd know a world that was oddly egalitarian and more interesting, even if in goofy or stupid ways, then most any games now... Often including Heroes. Anyone could be anything - it felt truly like a fantasy game; not the bland tripe that rehashes the same things again and again, but actual fantasy, where you never knew what might be just around the corner.
Heroes II took that and perfected it.
The campaigns were not simple, though they were incredibly cheesy - they were fun and interesting. But the maps that came with the game, let alone some of the scenarios you could find on line had absolutely amazing stories or scenarios; stories and scenarios that would find their way in to most later Heroes games and inspire loads of Custom Mapmakers, sure, but they really took off in Heroes II.
Ghost Planet! Colossal Cave! Plains of Aekon! You name it, from silly to serious to sci-fi, there was a story that might win your heart and make you fascinated enough to replay it just to see what events might befall the 'other side'. Sometimes I'd even crack open the editor after beating a scenario, just to see what I'd missed! I can't began to describe the last time a game has made me want to do that.
And integrating with that story, the gameplay to me feels the most balanced, and most suitable of the Heroes games. Heroes III, for all it's great innovations (Wait buttons and defend? Yes please!) started the trend of two things - arbitrary limitations, and 'unifantasyism'. No longer could you have the weirdly regal Barbarians, the surprisingly beautiful Necromancer town themes, weirdly diverse medieval fantasy - everything began to become ordered, organized - and to my mind, boring. Indistinguishable from any other extruded fantasy product that ever existed.
The Liches in V, for example, look hilarious - not in the goofy way of prior games, but they're trying so hard to look tough they look ridiculous. In II, liches have no fancy adornment - they are simply dead, and cruel. The art design in II is just pretty to look at - from every iteration since II, troops have to share colour codes, design style, etc. It may be more realistic - but it's painfully boring, to me at least. In six, I just remembered factions by their colour palette, more then by individual units. ;-) And that was despite my hope that the new Slavic feel of the Castle/Haven town might bring some life to Ubisoft's take on the franchise.
Heroes II had this blend of fantastical setting, amazing art design, more 'crunchy' feeling balance (I don't really know how to describe this one better. Units felt more to scale, more valuable; economics was, as has been pointed out, less easy to 'win' - you generally worried about running out of resources!) and just overall is one of the few games I return to period; for me at least, it's not just the best Heroes game, but my personal favorite game of all time. :-)
Now, that being said, even though I despair the new setting, I'll of course be getting Heroes 7 because the music and support for the franchise - but at the end of the day, I'll probably beat the campaign and return to Heroes II. I guess the short form would be - I like what it did, what it represented, how seriously it managed to make me care while knowing how to not take itself seriously at all, the art design, the sound direction, the non-standard choices it made in unit design, town layout, troop organization... Just, everything.
Hope that helps!
____________
|
|
Doomhammer
Known Hero
Smasher of pasties
|
|
posted September 17, 2014 01:28 PM |
|
|
Homm2 is my favourite, this is however not because it was the best game of the homm series, let me try to explain....
Homm1 was great but homm2 improved everything.
Homm3 had improved graphics, more factions, more creatures with more upgrades, basically more of everything and really was a better game but in my view it lost the magic, the fun and some of the atmosphere that homm2 had.
Homm4 was a great game, i actually think its my 2nd favourite. Even though it was controversal and lots of people didn't like the changes i actually think it brought back some of the feel of homm2. I liked the fact it changed things and i really liked the campaigns.
Homm5 was an attempt at recreating homm3 and i really like this game but its still not got the same feel as homm2, it doesn't make me as happy playing it. Same with homm6 really but i think this was by far the worst in the series.
I suppose it is really a nostalgia thing and its probably because i played homm2 alot when i was at an impressionable age. But i LOVE homm2
|
|
Jesper2
Tavern Dweller
|
|
posted September 30, 2014 05:37 AM |
|
Edited by Jesper2 at 05:57, 30 Sep 2014.
|
Salamandre said:
Everyone can explain why H2 is better than H3 and vice-versa, but one fact only is relevant: most of us never came back to H2 once we tasted H3.
H2 maps hosting sites vanished long time ago and no one asked to return. H3 maps are still produced on a monthly base.
Most of us still continued to play H3 when H4 came out.
Guess what, H6 is out and most of us still play H3. So I have a little idea about which is the best in the series, but I'll let you guess.
I've never met a fanbase more annoying with their favorite of the franchise to the point they barely mention anything else and constantly argue about it. We're very lucky the franchise is even still alive, with the Heroes 3 fanboys trying their best to kill it with cynicism. And yes, I DO go back to Heroes 2 way more than Heroes 3.
I like Heroes 2 much more than Heroes 3. Its music is better. Its atmosphere is less grim dark. The creatures feel less like they're designed for specific roles and more like they're there to be fun. It's a more innocent, enjoyable game to me. I also prefer Heroes 5 and 6 to Heroes 3, simply for their atmosphere.
|
|
Orzie
Responsible
Supreme Hero
|
|
posted September 30, 2014 09:21 AM |
|
|
|
I also play H2 much more often. It is a plain simple, a kind and magnificent game with the fairy-tale atmosphere and warm graphics. Heroes 3 just brought some new things like RMG and more abilities for mapping/modding, being already a Windows game.
|
|
mvassilev
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
|
|
posted September 30, 2014 10:08 AM |
|
|
H2 excels in two categories: art style and music. With those two combined, it has the best atmosphere of any HoMM game. However, in terms of balance and general gameplay, it's not as well-polished as H3 or H5. This is why I'm excited about the Succession Wars mod - it'll bring the good parts of H2 into H3.
____________
Eccentric Opinion
|
|
Orzie
Responsible
Supreme Hero
|
|
posted September 30, 2014 10:34 AM |
|
Edited by Orzie at 10:36, 30 Sep 2014.
|
By the way, if we speak about technical aspects, surprisingly there is a selection of features which are lacking in H3 while being present in H2.
- Player flags. Heroes 3 has them with a monochrome color, which is looking less fancy in contrary to H2. Unfortunately, H3 does not support half-transparency, so it is barely possible to implement a flag mask while the direct replacement of the flags is possible only for the heroes on the adventure map. Not achieved by anyone by the current moment, but expected from VCMI.
- Dynamic castle looks on different terrains. Achieved by H3SW and VCMI, also expected from HotA in future.
- Fonts. Like flags, Heroes 2 fonts contain multiple colors which allow them to fit much more to the background. Heroes 3 fonts have only the white and black (shadow) color, if we speak about generic message windows. Partially achieved by WoG and VCMI, which allow to use different font brush, but still there is no possibility to add the tones or the half-transparent mask.
- Internal scripts. Heroes 2 have them in a rudimentary form (or probably hex-editing), which we can see in the Awards section of H2 campaigns. Such things like winning scenario after capturing the Dragon City, dwarf joining/scattering, and new heroes available to hire in tavern are created that way. Lua scripting for H2 is finally implemented in Project Ironfist, while ERM scripting is implemented in H3 by WoG. If WoG 3.59 will be able to survive, we will also have Lua scripts there.
|
|
Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
|
|
posted October 01, 2014 01:42 PM |
|
|
mvassilev said:
H2 excels in two categories: art style and music. With those two combined, it has the best atmosphere of any HoMM game. However, in terms of balance and general gameplay, it's not as well-polished as H3 or H5. This is why I'm excited about the Succession Wars mod - it'll bring the good parts of H2 into H3.
I share so much your feelings.
+1 Orzie
|
|
e-lysander
Known Hero
Lysander
|
|
posted October 01, 2014 11:36 PM |
|
|
Doomhammer said:
Homm3 had improved graphics, more factions, more creatures with more upgrades, basically more of everything and really was a better game but in my view it lost the magic, the fun and some of the atmosphere that homm2 had.
Honestly, this represents my feelings most accurately. I first discovered the game in '96 in demo form on the PCGamer disc. The atmosphere just blew me away, even as a six-year-old. The combination of the art style and music is simply magical and isn't really rivaled by any of the other games... save for Heroes I, to a slight degree. Heroes III does have an atmosphere, but a lot of the time it gets somewhat stale.
Another point is that, Heroes I was simplistic, and Heroes III was more complex; I feel like Heroes II hit the sweet spot. Heroes II is such a cozy, easy-to-play game (while still challenging) that requires just enough brain power to be able to slightly zone out and just unwind from a long day at work, for example, while still providing enough cognitive stimulation to interest me.
Lastly, Broken Alliance is the best HoMM map. Period.
|
| |
|
|
