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Heroes Community > Heroes 7 - Falcon's Last Flight > Thread: Remove direwolves from haven units
Thread: Remove direwolves from haven units This thread is 4 pages long: 1 2 3 4 · «PREV / NEXT»
RMZ1989
RMZ1989


Supreme Hero
posted August 30, 2014 04:20 PM

VOKIALBG said:
Not really. But in this case - yes. Wolfs are nonsense in this town.

You are not giving any arguments except "because I think so". Considering we are playing now with Wolf Duchy instead Griffin Duchy, Wolves make all the sense to be in this town.
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ChrisD1
ChrisD1


Supreme Hero
posted August 30, 2014 05:19 PM

VOKIALBG said:
Not really. But in this case - yes. Wolfs are nonsense in this town.

to a wolf duchy...
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Wellplay
Wellplay


Famous Hero
Poland Stronk
posted August 30, 2014 05:27 PM
Edited by Wellplay at 17:30, 30 Aug 2014.

this haven is based on wolf duchy so direwolfs have right to be in this game!

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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted August 30, 2014 05:43 PM

Quote:
Wolves are as worthy of god's blessing as any other animal on earth. Why people have such hatred for them is an absolute mystery. You're much more likely to be killed by a bear, or even a mosquito.

Not really, they used to kill livestock, attacking sheep herds, cows etc etc.

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Raelag84
Raelag84


Famous Hero
posted August 30, 2014 09:33 PM

artu said:
Quote:
Wolves are as worthy of god's blessing as any other animal on earth. Why people have such hatred for them is an absolute mystery. You're much more likely to be killed by a bear, or even a mosquito.

Not really, they used to kill livestock, attacking sheep herds, cows etc etc.


Other animals do that as well, http://usda01.library.cornell.edu/usda/current/CattDeath/CattDeath-05-12-2011.pdf

but none seem to incur the powerful hatred that is aimed at wolves.

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MattII
MattII


Legendary Hero
posted August 30, 2014 10:09 PM
Edited by MattII at 22:18, 30 Aug 2014.

Mostly because it's in wolves that we most recognise ourselves I suspect. Oh, and dogs were once wolves, so wolves represent all the elements of dogs, without the aspects we bred into them (mostly, being friendly towards humans).

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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted August 30, 2014 10:52 PM
Edited by artu at 22:56, 30 Aug 2014.

Raelag84 said:
artu said:
Quote:
Wolves are as worthy of god's blessing as any other animal on earth. Why people have such hatred for them is an absolute mystery. You're much more likely to be killed by a bear, or even a mosquito.

Not really, they used to kill livestock, attacking sheep herds, cows etc etc.


Other animals do that as well, http://usda01.library.cornell.edu/usda/current/CattDeath/CattDeath-05-12-2011.pdf

but none seem to incur the powerful hatred that is aimed at wolves.

Well, coyotes and foxes aren't animals that are very popular either. And among them, wolves are the most common and most dangerous (that's why sometimes they also represent strength like the lion). You wanted to know the reason why folks demonized wolves, it was because they stole our food. The stigma is mostly historical anyway.

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Dave_Jame
Dave_Jame


Promising
Legendary Hero
I'm Faceless, not Brainless.
posted August 31, 2014 12:10 AM

I remember many time when people wanted something like a wardog in Haven. Now we have it and you complain?

And for those who want "Alternative Haven armies" you will have them in the campaigne

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lokdron
lokdron


Famous Hero
posted August 31, 2014 03:31 AM
Edited by lokdron at 03:34, 31 Aug 2014.

Dave_Jame said:
I remember many time when people wanted something like a wardog in Haven. Now we have it and you complain?

And for those who want "Alternative Haven armies" you will have them in the campaigne


Yup, I personally can't wait to see how the dire wolf plays I am also can't wait for the watcher and chaplain reveal since they also look interesting.

Plus I wonder how the sword bearer is going to play people wanted a more "grounded" haven army we are getting it yet some people still have problems.

Plus lore wise it looks like the wolf duchy is supporting Ivan hence the wolf duchy units.

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Danny
Danny


Famous Hero
posted August 31, 2014 07:49 AM

It's one of the best decisions in Haven to mix it up... The H6 lineup was so bad, I hated it. I still wish to have at least one Heroes game without the medieval knight humans and their angels but that'll never happen...

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Kurush
Kurush


Known Hero
posted August 31, 2014 10:19 AM

Though I like the wolves I'd still prefer hounds or maybe wolfsbreed (half wolf - half dog) Just because it seems kind of impossible to tame wolves(and especially direwolves), where's the guarantee the won't attack your own troops? But if they make a drawback ability like that, it'd be okay.

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mvassilev
mvassilev


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
posted August 31, 2014 01:25 PM

Wolves should be neutral or in Sylvan. They have no place in the Medieval Human town. If they were something like battle hounds, it would make some sense - but not wolves.
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Wellplay
Wellplay


Famous Hero
Poland Stronk
posted August 31, 2014 02:42 PM

Line up for haven is decided so they won't change it cause minority don't like wolfs

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Raelag84
Raelag84


Famous Hero
posted August 31, 2014 04:13 PM

Not everything in heroes needs to correspond perfectly to the typical fantasy setting. If it did then the setting could get boring. Having dire wolves in Haven helps very things up a little. That said, having the dire wolves in Sylvan is an interesting idea.  

artu said:
...You wanted to know the reason why folks demonized wolves, it was because they stole our food. The stigma is mostly historical anyway.


Hmmmm. That would be understandable. On the other hand, when my ancestors cleansed the land of wolves, the coyote population exploded, and they lost sheep all the same.  

I would like to say my ancestors learned the hard way that wolves unwittingly do things for us, but they never did and neither have their decedents. For that reason I appreciate any attempt to improve the image of wolves.

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VOKIALBG
VOKIALBG


Honorable
Legendary Hero
First in line
posted August 31, 2014 04:56 PM
Edited by VOKIALBG at 16:57, 31 Aug 2014.

RMZ1989 said:
VOKIALBG said:
Not really. But in this case - yes. Wolfs are nonsense in this town.

You are not giving any arguments except "because I think so". Considering we are playing now with Wolf Duchy instead Griffin Duchy, Wolves make all the sense to be in this town.


They doesnt look heavenish. Wolfs cant be trained in such a way, and there are now good wolf in any folklore.

Mvass has exactly my point.
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ChrisD1
ChrisD1


Supreme Hero
posted August 31, 2014 07:10 PM
Edited by ChrisD1 at 19:11, 31 Aug 2014.

VOKIALBG said:
They doesnt look heavenish.
again,WOLF duchy.
VOKIALBG said:
Wolfs cant be trained in such a way
if dragons can be trained as champion units, wolves can be trained as well.
VOKIALBG said:
there are no good wolf in any folklore.
who said the wolf duchy is the good guy? and dragons are usually the villains in folklore yet you want them as a champion unit for even good factions.
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MattII
MattII


Legendary Hero
posted August 31, 2014 10:57 PM
Edited by MattII at 22:58, 31 Aug 2014.

VOKIALBG said:
They doesnt look heavenish.
And it's about bloody time, the knights-in-armour routine was getting boring by H3.

Quote:
Wolfs cant be trained in such a way...
It'd be hard, yes, but not impossible, and a 'wolf' doesn't have to mean a wild-captured animal.

Quote:
...and there are now good wolf in any folklore.
Except Roman, and Norse, and Mongolian, and Japanese, and Chechen, and (native) American. Please, if you're going to make a claim at least do your research first.

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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted August 31, 2014 11:37 PM

As I said, they can represent power, too. I'm Turkish, the Turkic/Mongolian myth of Ergenekon, a gray wolf leading the people out of the mountain to spread around the realm is childhood tale to me. The hand gesture of the nationalists here, is still the head of "the" gray wolf:



The myth of Romulus being raised by the wolves is another very famous example. But myths operate in symbols, ancient people can respect what the animal symbolizes, yet, still see the animal itself as an everyday menace in practicality. A villager's instant reaction to a wolf would be killing it.

It would also be good to remember that while nomadic hunters naturally thought of the wolf as an ideal hunter and based their myths on a similarity, the shift to agriculture and domestication led the rhetoric to focus on animosity. Think how the symbolization changes in Christianity: "I am sending you out like sheep among wolves." To a society with shepherds, wolf is the enemy.

Of course, a game can bend things and none of this means Haven with wolves is categorically an absurd idea but personally I don't like it either. Something does not click.

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Stevie
Stevie


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
posted September 01, 2014 12:04 AM

The only thing connecting the wolf to Haven is the Dutchy bearing its name. That's it. I'm not pro nor against - I think debating their presence in the lineup from a lore perspective is pointless. What I do care about is how they play on the battlefield, and after seeing them being big creatures (2x2) contrasting with the djins being small let's just say that I have my reserves.

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mvassilev
mvassilev


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
posted September 01, 2014 01:01 AM

MattII said:
And it's about bloody time, the knights-in-armour routine was getting boring by H3.
You've got to have the Knights in Armor town. Any decent fantasy game will have them, otherwise it'd be missing out on an easy and appealing alignment design.
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