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Heroes Community > Other Side of the Monitor > Thread: The New Wild "Mid" West
Thread: The New Wild "Mid" West This thread is 2 pages long: 1 2 · NEXT»
markkur
markkur


Responsible
Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
posted January 09, 2017 06:05 PM

The New Wild "Mid" West

Just watched a short vid on the stats of Chicago last year...over 4,000 shootings and over 700 dead.

Just had an idea (more a Band-Aid) and I'm wondering what folks around the globe might say about it?

In the "old" Wild-West, one way that gun-crime was effectively curbed was to prohibit fire-arms inside Dodge-city. This was enforced to control the gun-violence of drunken-cowboys coming into to town after weeks if not months behind the butts of a herd.

At the time, Sheriff Earp did not even think of making it a national mandate (he could not have even if he had wanted the idea) because folks living out side the arm of the law were at the mercy of whatever armed-villain happened to come their way. iow, People not living in towns with effective law-enforcement (chiefly think on response time)had to be ready to defend-themselves or "be killed behind the needs of a nearby city".

With all the high-Tech that is being used today, why not ban all guns of any type within all Cities around the Globe, where only the Police are armed with the simplest of defense weapons? Truncheons were very effective in Victorian England, when it was not full of gun-toting desperadoes.

I realize, that one argument for a heavily armed-police force now is that the public is heavily-armed in cities, and I understand that but to me, to correctly solve this problem, a hell of a lot more thought needs to go into a solution, instead-of the typical American "there's only two polar-options" in this case; Ban-All-guns...or allow all guns no matter there localization.

<imvho> City versus Country, is still a very, very relevant part of the argument and I have not seen it even mentioned by anyone.

We have metal-detectors screening "normal peaceful citizens" - we have cameras both watching and recording every thing those same people do while all the while dangerous people are armed and live in cities, waiting to get drunk or high on some damn street-drug that are ticking time-bombs just like the "drovers" were every time they came into Dodge.

I'm just curious but would YOU willingly submit to i.e. one future measure could be a check-point (like airport security now) upon entering a large Metro-area.

A side-car-idea. Most countries have National-armies or some sort of Militia...why not put the countryside under their over-arching security (investigation(...and their ARE Military-Police already - my Father was one in the USAF) and let country-dwellers alone on gun-rights so they can damn well defend themselves.

Chicago is a disaster and something MUST be done. I am not ADVOCATING my points above...only thinking about this sad outcome and "thinking" on what measures might find the needed middle-ground?
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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted January 09, 2017 06:51 PM

Well, the problem would be, how would you execute such a law in practice? In the old times, those towns were real small, when somebody entered in with their gun in their belts, it was something noticeable, so the law men directly approached them and took away their guns temporarily. How would you be able to control that in a city of millions?
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Maurice
Maurice

Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
posted January 09, 2017 06:51 PM

markkur said:
With all the high-Tech that is being used today, why not ban all guns of any type within all Cities around the Globe, where only the Police are armed with the simplest of defense weapons?


In case you were unaware, but that's basically the regulation in most countries across the world already. Death rate per capita of the population due to gun-related violence is pretty low here in the Netherlands. Just last year, we had around ~100 murder cases across the country, on a total of 17 million people. While that figure of ~100 murders doesn't include missed cases of murder, when it was incorrectly assumed someone died of a natural cause or accident (guestimates put that at an extra ~20-odd people), it does includes deaths by knifing or other means as well.

From my (Dutch) perspective, I consider the laws allowing people to carry and own guns for private use to be ... strange. Even if they say that guns don't kill people, because it's people who kill people, guns sure make that a whole lot easier. That even excludes accidents when guns fire unexpectedly, for instance when a kid somehow gained access to a gun and unintentionally fires it, killing a bystander or themselves in the process.

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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted January 09, 2017 07:09 PM
Edited by artu at 19:10, 09 Jan 2017.

There's like 30 pages of debate about that in two gun threads already. The new suggestion here is to keep it out of big cities, but considering how armed to the teeth Americans are, especially in the rural areas, it would be hard in practice. Netherlands dont have the gun culture U.S. does, so I assume other than hunting purposes, not much people have guns in the country side either, and the ones they do have are not semi-automatics and stuff.
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fred79
fred79


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Undefeatable Hero
Crotch Connoisseur
posted January 09, 2017 07:27 PM

illegal drugs are still illegal, and yet you are able to buy them if you talk the right people. which would, techically, be criminals. if criminals are the ONLY people with access to firearms besides the cops, guess who wins? take a minute to think about response time. what cops do, is clean up a situation after it already happens. the only time they're there DURING a volatile situation, is when there's hostages involved. and guess what? the people who are taken hostage are ALWAYS UNARMED.

to first solve gun-related crime, you have to understand the bulk of it. and what is the bulk of gun-related crime where i live? ghetto black people, simply put. just like chicago. until people stop glorifying ghetto criminality, and creating music that glorifies it, and movies, whatever else glorifies it, it'll continue.

think about what happened with serial killings. it was sensationalized in the media hugely in the 80's, and because of that, serial killings got publicity. which means, promotion, to the right(or wrong, if you want to look at it that way) people. and when you have promotion, you have an increase in whatever's being promoted, right? right.

take your "wild west" example, markkur. how many cowboys are shooting people these days? don't see that a lot in the news, do you? know why? because nobody has made cowboys shooting people A CULTURE.

if you were to get rid of the cause of the ghetto criminality, which is it's CULTURE, you would get rid of nearly ALL the gun-related crimes in the u.s.

i keep shaking my head, when people demonize firearms. it's like demonizing kitchen knives, or hammers. or plastic bags. or rope. or rocks. might as well demonize everything in existence that can be used to kill people, right?

next, we'll be demonizing people's hands, because THEY'RE whats doing the killing. not people. never stupid-ass people.

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markkur
markkur


Responsible
Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
posted January 10, 2017 01:27 AM
Edited by markkur at 01:37, 10 Jan 2017.

Ok, for grins, we (all that have posted and anyone that will join in)are the HC "think-tank" assigned to this one problem and we are paid big bucks to come-up with some way to reduce danger in American cities.

I am not pretending to have any answers but together we have to make Chicago safe. Therefore I will try to glean specific comments and see if anything or nothing can come out of it.

artu said:
Well, the problem would be, how would you execute such a law in practice?


Exactly Artu.

There is, as I said two totally opposing views and it is also a fact that the left (in-power) here in the States has tried to go after our second-amendment right to bears arms.

Maurice said:
In case you were unaware, but that's basically the regulation in most countries across the world already. Death rate per capita of the population due to gun-related violence is pretty low here in the Netherlands...

TY Maurice, no, I did not know anything about the Netherlands but I have watched some videos on what "seems" to me a well thought-out approach to this issue in Switzerland. Of course, iirc, I think all citizens are a part of the citizen-militia...full military training?

Seen or heard more on their laws and safeguards?

artu said:
...The new suggestion here is to keep it out of big cities, but considering how armed to the teeth Americans are...
Absolutely difficult for sure. Although, in a perfect world no one should need to be heavily-armed in city-limits (at least) but with the growing powers (and nasty corruption) of Govs. around the world" it seems madness for citizens anywhere to yield anything to this same people?

fred79 said:
...the people who are taken hostage are ALWAYS UNARMED.

...just like chicago. until people stop glorifying ghetto criminality, and creating music that glorifies it, and movies, whatever else glorifies it, it'll continue.


I agree very much Fred...I do hope you did not think I had taken leave of my senses. Clearly the culture FEEDS this crap, so how does this Elite-Highly-Paid, sit-on-our-arses (like the real ones) think-tank...end the menace/terror?

How do we leave law-abiding citizens alone and yet get a hell of a lot of guns off the streets?

The Airport-killings in FL (another gun-free zone)may give us some clues? I'm only thinking of all the angles of this issue because as most here know, this society is armed to the teeth and drugs and alcohol abound.

Not that I am against either but todays younger Americans seem to have no idea what moderation is until a life is regrettably changed for the worse...very generally speaking from experience and observation.

How about everyone's beloved high-tech? Anything here or on the horizon? Just wondering...even if I find more bad than good coming from Society-Techs.




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tSar-Ivor
tSar-Ivor


Legendary Hero
♀ DEUS VULT!!! ♀
posted January 10, 2017 02:28 AM
Edited by tSar-Ivor at 02:29, 10 Jan 2017.

Idk, you could try to move citizenship into tiers? Not that would really work, you guys have like what 20mill illegal aliens, but maybe it would idk.
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fred79
fred79


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
Crotch Connoisseur
posted January 10, 2017 05:26 AM
Edited by fred79 at 05:33, 10 Jan 2017.

markkur said:
I agree very much Fred...I do hope you did not think I had taken leave of my senses. Clearly the culture FEEDS this crap, so how does this Elite-Highly-Paid, sit-on-our-arses (like the real ones) think-tank...end the menace/terror?


there's no way to end it in it's current state of prevalence. it'd be like trying to dye an ocean purple or something. the issue was let go back in the 80's(as far as the music part of it goes; which is what became one of the pillars of the issue), and since then it has bloomed into what we see today. and the really bad part about it, is that blacks were being pushed to their limits by the racist whites. they had had enough of what was going on in the u.s. against their race, and they made movements to extinguish this racism towards them(forgetting the fact that, they and their violent music was used by racist whites to further seperate blacks from whites. pretty simple, if you look at it. "see how violent they are? do you want them living near you?", and other such anti-black propaganda). unfortunately, they've had to become violent, just to get some elbow room in the states. from the black panther party to gangster rap, what everyone is seeing is a repeat of the reasons why the bloods and crips were created: to defend against the white and latino gangs. the psychology of it is simple: violence = power. in a poor neighborhood, that is the first power that you can grab ahold of(and it also happens to be the easiest), to try and feel like you're equal to those better off than yourself. ghetto black kids have the idea that nobody cares about them, and they're largely correct; if only because most people don't really care about others outside of their own little safety bubbles anyway. the crux of the issue is: "take care of our own, before anyone else. if we have safety and our stuff is secure, we can care about others".

but if you're poor, you, nor your stuff is safe; unless you are willing to defend it. because predators abound in society, in all ranks and all classes. so, they become violent, just to hold what they can; be it their belongings, or a street, or an area to control for lucrative criminal enterprises. the poor are largely violent, because of the "power" issue. they constantly have to validate their own lives, let alone anything under their thumb(however illusory).

markkur said:
How do we leave law-abiding citizens alone and yet get a hell of a lot of guns off the streets?


you can't. like i stated above: it's like trying to dye an ocean purple. the issue is too far gone now, to try and control without military force. you can't win over ALL the gee-gosh-whatever-you-say-boss people, simply through influence, rhetoric, and propaganda alone. you can come close, but not everyone will drink the koolaid. take myself, for example. nobody will ever tell me that i have to hand anything that keeps me and my family safe, over. i'll be a corpse before then. this country would either be a police state, or another mexico, without our guns.

markkur said:
The Airport-killings in FL (another gun-free zone)may give us some clues? I'm only thinking of all the angles of this issue because as most here know, this society is armed to the teeth and drugs and alcohol abound.


how many mass-shootings do you see at gun shows? any? how about police stations? a few there, sure. but think of WHY police stations might be a target(hint: the news/t.v. that everyone watches where the media[read: government/corporate propaganda] does what it can to keep people seperate from one another). now, compare these highly-armed site attacks, to sites where no one, or next to no one, was able to defend themselves because of no-firearm zones. which of these numbers is significantly larger? why? because of access to deadly guns? because the people who were killed the most, DIDN'T have access to them. they had NOTHING to keep them from being harmed. and what did the cops do(serve and protect, right? no.)? show up after the attacks were already over. mostly(i think one or two shootings were actually cut off by cops, but the number is most likely pretty low).

markkur said:
Not that I am against either but todays younger Americans seem to have no idea what moderation is until a life is regrettably changed for the worse...very generally speaking from experience and observation.

How about everyone's beloved high-tech? Anything here or on the horizon? Just wondering...even if I find more bad than good coming from Society-Techs.


todays younger americans, especially the ghetto lifestyle-indoctrinated ones, don't really give a snow. take a look at worldstarhiphop.com. if you've ever been around ghetto youths, then you'll see that the ghetto lifestyle is like the new-age gangster lifestyle. it makes criminality something fabulous; a status symbol(another "power" aspect where nothing else really exists). jail time, even prison time, is seen as a badge of honor among these youths. you'll see some pretty deplorable behavior, exhibited by some pretty deplorable youths. being "ruthless" is something that the ghetto youth strives for. you'll find it glorified in the popular music and lifestyle of the ghetto culture.

since the time of the internet, anything can make you "famous". it's like the serial-killer reporting all over again, only now it's WORLDWIDE. just THINK of what that has done for violence and every other deplorable human act. everyone and everything is center-stage. everyone is important. who is out there, thinking, "what can i do to STAND OUT, now that everyone has a voice?" take the cartel/isis torture/death videos, for example. and kids these days are EXPOSED TO ALL OF IT.

really, trying to fix a problem this large now... there's just no way. even if you were to try and show the people who follow this culture blindly, that they could be better than this, DO better, you would end up being called a racist. "racism" has been the popular callword to decry, when ANYTHING goes against this "new black culture". and can they really think any differently, when everywhere they turn, there are people who hate them and try to control them; and the more difficult(and largely ridiculed) lifestyle of the straight-and-narrow is seen as a cowards way out, from more-easily-gained violent "power" status?


artu, you mentioned in another thread, how it was strange that wisdom and intelligence would be something to be ridiculed in u.s. culture. this ghetto culture, is another form of that same thing, artu. it's by and large one of the biggest hurdles of black youths today; and has been for 2 decades at least.

and the whites in power just sit back and laugh; and let the blacks do their work FOR them.

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Blizzardboy
Blizzardboy


Honorable
Legendary Hero
Elvin's Lightside
posted January 10, 2017 07:06 AM
Edited by Blizzardboy at 07:14, 10 Jan 2017.

There were as many deaths by firearm at the Fort Lauderdale shooting in Florida as there were firearm deaths in Japan in the year 2016

This isn't going to go anywhere. Weaponizing the population means people die. It means being almost forced to militarize the police. If common sense were implemented today, it would take generations to fully come into effect. Firearms as a symbol of power and safety are branded into the culture's brain.

Banning firearms in select localities will do minimal good or possibly be harmful. Changes in firearm laws need to come from the federal government. This will not be happening in the near future.
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Gryphs
Gryphs


Supreme Hero
The Clever Title
posted January 10, 2017 08:03 AM

Switzerland has its civilians heavily armed too and it has an incredibly low murder rate as is, an even lower gun death rate. The US's culture is, as fred said, significantly more violent by nature so it is little surprise its gun homicide rate is so high.
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Maurice
Maurice

Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
posted January 10, 2017 11:15 AM

I have to agree with Gryphs on this one. Even Amerika's neighbor, Canada, has a similar situation like Switzerland. It's for a large part also mentality of the people that make up the population.
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markkur
markkur


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Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
posted January 10, 2017 07:58 PM
Edited by markkur at 20:02, 10 Jan 2017.

I do truly appreciate each one for giving a damn and saying something/anything in a constructive way.

artu said:
...when somebody entered (Dodge) with their gun in their belts, it was something noticeable, so the law men directly approached them and took away their guns temporarily.


Tech today has made our combating-society even more problematic.(with bad guys) Have you seen those Ads where a gun-holding-device can have the weapon in your hands in a second?

And what the hell is that mini-flashlight about?

artu said:
...and the (guns in the Netherlands countryside) that they do have, are not semi-automatics and stuff.


This is the one area I do stumble over. I buy a pee-shooter, neighbor buys a leadball-sling, I get a bow, he gets a single-shot 410,- Pump Shotgun to Win-73 - Gatling to BAR - Thompson to Glock-17 to Ak-47 and what do we have now Bazooka's, Mortars, S to A Missiles?

However, to rest on that escalation is <imo> to get sidetracked, because I see that as symptom not the Cause.

fred79 said:
take your "wild west" example, markkur. how many cowboys are shooting people these days? don't see that a lot in the news, do you? know why? because nobody has made cowboys shooting people A CULTURE.

<Also>

...if you were to get rid of the cause of the ghetto criminality, which is it's CULTURE, you would get rid of nearly ALL the gun-related crimes in the u.s.


I think that has a high probably of being true.

fred79 said:
artu, you mentioned in another thread, how it was strange that wisdom and intelligence would be something to be ridiculed in u.s. culture. this ghetto culture, is another form of that same thing, artu. it's by and large one of the biggest hurdles of black youths today; and has been for 2 decades at least.


Blizzardboy said:
Banning firearms in select localities will do minimal good or possibly be harmful. Changes in firearm laws need to come from the federal government. This will not be happening in the near future.


Gryphs said:
Switzerland has its civilians heavily armed too and it has an incredibly low murder rate as is, an even lower gun death rate. The US's culture is, as fred said, significantly more violent by nature so it is little surprise its gun homicide rate is so high.


Maurice said:
I have to agree with Gryphs on this one. Even Amerika's neighbor, Canada, has a similar situation like Switzerland. It's for a large part also mentality of the people that make up the population.


Agree 101% with you all. That's why I mentioned the Swiss. I add, that after I watched a couple of good docs on that Nation, I realized a dreadful paradigm regarding our Nation. "see below"

-----------------------------------------------------
Maurice said:
From my (Dutch) perspective, I consider the laws allowing people to carry and own guns for private use to be ... strange.


tSar-Ivor said:
Idk, you could try to move citizenship into tiers? Not that would really work, you guys have like what 20mill illegal aliens, but maybe it would idk.


Fred has covered much and quite well and coupled with Maurice's last comment and his use of the appropriate..."Strange" and finally, tSar's statement on his estimated numbers regarding our National problem of illegal aliens? Added together, behind the backdrop of ALL of your collective thoughts, <imvho> we have absolutely highlighted the "bottom-line"; we have a continual earthquake happening on the streets of America.

----------------------------------------------------------------

The U.S. has had continual hammer-blows and the power of the strikes never known through decades now,striking the American Culture at the root. This directed social engineering has been supported by this 4-term single-Government.I believe this is the leading reason, it IS NOT the only necessary ingredient but again I refer to much of Fred's common-sense statements regarding, a sinister motive has enabled and facilitated...the demise of our youth-Culture.

A Needed Note: I live an hour from any major city and hear and witness, a rusty and dented old pick-up-truck, with the typically imagined backward "cowboy-hatted hillbilly" (with straw in mouth) sitting behind the wheel of his "beater" while he shares and blares gangsta-rap, from said truck, in ear-damaging decibels, and likely from a likely expensive music-system? Strange is far too kind of word.

-------------------------------------------------------------

Before starting this thread I set-aside constant illegal activity and for a reason...I truly wanted to put all our minds together and look at only Chicago's serious problem. Trust me on this one, I thought our Roundtable would likely be a fruitless effort but thru exp. I've found effective "Teamwork and Problem-Solving" absolutely requires discipline to have "any" hope of arriving at a well-reasoned solution.

I am a <ahem> mature (wrinkled Grizzly-Adams), however, a very handsome codger, according to the latest poll of one...my Wife & Princess. I'm soon to hit 62 and I emphasize this fact because I believe it does matter, when it comes to Society. I have-lived to see everything I value "high-jacked or usurped" - i.e. my Faith, Science & Education at times, Governments, Politics, Laws and just as bad, I even have witnessed continual Information and Dis-information shredding common-sense where it is not exactly "common" anymore. All of this regression has been very alarming to me as the Grandfather.

Sorry, had to get that bit off my chest.

-----------------------------------------------------------

When I mix all of your reasons together behind the backdrop of what I just shared, what I seek to see is lost in "shadows".

HC Think-Tank seems to conclude;

1. We are dealing with huge-numbers of people, of which numbers alone can make a problem very difficult to overcome.

- In addition to that problem, it is amplified into the Twilight-zone because we only have shabby "estimates" that put the number of illegals here circa 40,000,000, depending on source and possibly the intent behind the number given.

2. We have always been a heavily-armed Society.
- However, our one time Society did not absolutely "need" Conceal & Carry, as has been made quite evident in forced "gun-free-zones" where our citizens are point-blank executed and have no means of defense.
Europe is in the same boat; it's a bit hard to Dodge (key word there) bullets with your arms (the two long members that attach your hands)full of Christmas presents or groceries.

3. High-Tech does not provide an answer because in the end, it always seems to go against law-abiding citizens instead of reducing anything. It's akin to having nuclear-power but seldom building power-plants and choosing to make even more Bombs instead. The Pat-Act was sold to the little people for "their protection" but has proved mostly "their probing and data-mining".

When any Government can separate itself from its own people? then inject and allow anti-social behavior? propagandize race? destroy national sovereignty? all because of wanting to get needy folks from all over the world to vote "welfare-gifts" to keep ANY party in power(Dems & Reps here)and cares NOT one iota about laws of the land in doing so? We have exactly what we have. Nothing Strange about that, it's a perfectly reasonable outcome.

I went to Mexico a few times in my youth and it was a scary damned place in the 70s. I doubt that all people here at HC really understand what is underway in the West, unless they have travelled abroad, the reality of teleporting from a 1st-world society to a 3rd-world disaster, is a very alarming step.

Greed has imported the mess we have in our cities and without check, without effective control while drug-cartels from Mexico and cattle-man-Coyotes (ripping-off the poor Mexican people) are all over the damned US doing things like what happened in VA; where a freakin' Semi-tractor-trailer loaded to the gills with illegals shoulder to shoulder in the long hot-ass metal box, that made the trip up from the Swiss-cheese border, for this wonderful, law-abiding and compassionate driver to open the doors of the "coach of death" (some die) to spill out a hundred sun-blind and hungry people on the roadside of, they know not where, to NOT fend for themselves but fall upon the local population in any way they can to...survive until they can make it to...FREE $$$$ sanctuary; all the while, the land promised sold-out and the trip paid-for...on the Mexican side of the border.

Finally, transport this perfectly uncivilized treatment of human-beings and inject this cruelty into our city-centers where our own neglected poor people live? (some are white after all) where our Police-force is told to stay out of those areas and have lost any once-held connection to the community they protect? I do NOT wonder that the Gangsta mentality is thriving but far more question why kill-songs are marketed more effectively as public-goods than the safety of this nations citizens? Strange is a good word...but only coming form the outside of this particular nation. Purposed, I believe far better fits.

Let's get back to the era of Gunslingers; If any person that posted in this thread or read this thread, mandated and injected into any house in Europe, Jesse James? The inhabitant of that house would either;
a. Surrender & flee their own home
b. Join the James-Gang and pretend they're the same ol' law-abiding person and maybe even still greet, laugh and smile.
c. Or become a Bob Ford and seek Glory by eliminating Jesse for $.
----------------------------------------------------------

A final thought related to the impact on Black and legal-Hispanic Societies.

During the 1990s in Houston Texas, my Father, a white-man in his 70s met the following fate in his home community. He was disabled and barely surviving on a meager fixed-income and living in a poor mostly, not all,  white neighborhood of old people, renting cheap old homes living in the same fixed-income circumstance as himself. Yet this people did not complain and even if they did no one listened.

Then a slow trickle of illegals, that very soon became a roaring Rio Grande, poured into this/his community. 10-20 illegals soon began sharing the same small apartments or small rental-homes. Large numbers of strangers, practiced a continual-din in a once quiet no-where inner-city neighborhood. Large groups of people standing in the streets at all hours of the night, with Mexican music blaring from noisy cars at all hours...especially in the wee hours of the morning, became the hourly norm.

Landlords loved(native immoral greed) the hike in the rent-price they could charge a large group of law-breakers that banded-together their money and their mindset - very often Aztlan conquest rhetoric and cared nothing about learning English or had any notion of integrating in a Nation and Society that owed them everything.

In short my Father, even if he could have dealt with, having the worst of Mexican society, being transplanted to his own poor streets, he could not begin to pay the "new Rent price" (fixed income makes this impossible folks) to remain as he was. He was FORCED to move.

I can tell you, he damn well made sure he did not move to any other metro-area in Houston, nor did he contemplate any other in Texas and HAD to move back to a much smaller Kansas town, of which he had not the slightest notion to live but only because it was well back from our long-time mostly imaginary U.S./Mexico border and enforcement.

Strange indeed!

There is so much more to this story; like the tell-tale rise of previously eradicated diseases once again; as if we were no longer a first-world civilization? In truth, we are now more a 2nd-world nation and if we do nothing to end this madness? we will be just like the third-world nations that people have left to come here. Some Blacks & Latinos have talked about that very thing but as Fred said, for some people, like my Father, because he was white, he had no voice and add to that when people of color are also outraged they too are ignored. Indeed that makes Racism dance to the different color of Purpose.  
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Blizzardboy
Blizzardboy


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Elvin's Lightside
posted January 11, 2017 06:06 AM
Edited by Blizzardboy at 12:05, 11 Jan 2017.

@Markkur:

Although there are 3rd rate aspects of the country and there always has been, violent crime has hit a new low in decades, and this includes violent crime with guns. This doesn't make it a smart idea to have a US population with loaded pistols tucked against their crotches, but since the causes of violent crime are multifactorial, there are obviously good things happening in other areas.

The illusion of things getting worse is because of the popularity in the 21st century of celebrity homicides, where a person shoots up a bunch of people and it gets plastered everywhere on the news. These celebrity homicides ultimately make up a small portion of US gun deaths and trends in general are on the decline and have been for over 20 years now.

In the real world, people tend to move where it is warm, busy, and fun. If you have some sort of job prospect in Africa and you have connections, then you might go, simply because happiness isn't neatly contained by statistics on crime or anything else. New life and new adventure awaits. Why do you think so many Canadians move to the US and not as much the other way around? They're not fleeing from crime or gangs or poverty. They're fleeing from Canada.

Where do Americans go? New Zealand or Africa.
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markkur
markkur


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Once upon a time
posted January 11, 2017 04:53 PM

Blizzardboy said:
The illusion of things getting worse...

...Where do Americans go? New Zealand or Africa.


Blizz I want to know, I hope it is YOU that is correct but I do not think so. I think you have a good-heart and you hope and believe this nation is as peaceful as it once was and that is a very good thing but in this instance, I think your perspective is misguided.

How you can dismiss what I shared that happened with my father and his friends and all being forced to leave an American city to make room for a mass of people that did not give a damn about this nation?

I do not understand you, where I have lived is no Illusion my young friend. i.e. One of the old neighborhoods where I grew up was full of a Italian immigrants, then later, the blacks and Asians were forced out by illegals etc. from all over the world and now that same old neighborhood looks as bad as any other razor-wired, boarded-up and trashed part of the world. In the 60s and 70s this was one hell of a nice-neighborhood. In CT, IL, KS & FL I saw the same thing as I have seen in MO. But you go on believing in statistics I just hope for your sake and the sakes of my Grandchildren you are correct to do so. What happened last year in Chicago was not 700+ deaths of Celebrities. That one statistic is "supposedly" no illusion.

With the U.S. following in the footsteps of the EU...where do you want to live? Myself I would head to Switzerland, where, for the moment, reason reigns. About Africa, you surely do not think that Americans will leave here and live like missionaries in hovels along dung-filled water, caring not about their own earthly lives? Just like ol' "Cock-Robin", they'll raze an area and build their own new world. The Peasants do not matter...never did. Btw, war-destroyed zones make great new-ground for shining-oasis.

The Rich and Ultra-Rich worry not about things we small folk might have to meet head-on, they not only have had gated Castles they also have gated-islands and with "Mercenary-Corporations" thriving in the lucrative business of War around the world now they can buy their own <ahem> border-defense.

Cheers Blizz


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fred79
fred79


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posted January 11, 2017 05:06 PM

markkur said:
The Rich and Ultra-Rich worry not about things we small folk might have to meet head-on, they not only have had gated Castles they also have gated-islands and with "Mercenary-Corporations" thriving in the lucrative business of War around the world now they can buy their own <ahem> border-defense.


you're forgetting something. they're outnumbered by 1000 to 1(at least). border defense doesn't mean snow when you have wave after wave of armed(even unarmed) civilians. even technology won't hold back brute force in numbers. they'll be annihilated. all that is needed is guidance on our side. or desperation from lack of food and drinking water. then it'll just be an idiot stampede. there won't be anything left in the first hour, barring proximity to target(s).

normandy beach was overrun; despite high defenses and machine gun nests.

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markkur
markkur


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Once upon a time
posted January 11, 2017 08:35 PM
Edited by markkur at 20:37, 11 Jan 2017.

fred79 said:
markkur said:
The Rich and Ultra-Rich worry not about things we small folk might have to meet head-on, they not only have had gated Castles they also have gated-islands and with "Mercenary-Corporations" thriving in the lucrative business of War around the world now they can buy their own <ahem> border-defense.


you're forgetting something. they're outnumbered by 1000 to 1(at least). border defense doesn't mean snow when you have wave after wave of armed(even unarmed) civilians. even technology won't hold back brute force in numbers. they'll be annihilated. all that is needed is guidance on our side. or desperation from lack of food and drinking water. then it'll just be an idiot stampede. there won't be anything left in the first hour, barring proximity to target(s).

normandy beach was overrun; despite high defenses and machine gun nests.


fred79 said:
you're forgetting something... they're outnumbered by 1000 to 1(at least). border defense doesn't mean snow when you have wave after wave of armed(even unarmed) civilians.


Actually no, I am forgetting nothing because I avoided the topic of insurrection (I hate war for any purpose) but I did choose to represent, as a likely probability, the very real mindset of the very ones that use corruptly gained power and how they think they are safe.

The good news is the long-reigning status-quo were shocked, after being made somewhat visible to an ignorant public and then were "temporally" ousted to a very small measure.

We have a chance but all depends on the honesty and intent of the entire government now and the people continuing to demand that their taxes "serve the citizens of this nation".

A great way to start would be enforcing our borders and quit bringing anyone here by breaking our existing-laws and subsequently teaching those that come to live off the welfare state (provided by the U.S. taxpayer, whom can hardly have a voice about the damned matter) to do the same.

You know we mostly agree but I just hold a wee bit of hope that the people will wake from their fevered-purchase-syndromes, orgasmic-centered-banners and endless sugar-rushes and take the "We the people" of our inherited Government back into their own collective hands by using the Constitution and not with armed-force, even pitchforks. That might not happen and I know that other events could unfold, I just believe reason can prevail in the end.
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markkur
markkur


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Once upon a time
posted January 11, 2017 09:02 PM
Edited by markkur at 16:42, 12 Jan 2017.

Here are some discussions that relate to the issues surrounding gun-violence (not explicitly like "pull the trigger") but I believe can supply some of the puzzle-pieces behind the breaking of western Civilization by a "new ideology" centered far more on wishful-thinking than a practical process observable by science and reason. This applies,  not only to the U.S. but all of the West and other nations are also being impacted around the world.

Huge changes are being forced on successful and established societies and the voice of the masses is not being formally recognized behind the drumbeat of the "new ideology" - as our Liberties fade behind the false-moral smokescreen of Modernity and never-ending massive injection of FEAR.

Century of Enslavement: The History of The Federal Reserve
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5IJeemTQ7Vk

The Truth About The Fall of Rome: Modern Parallels
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qh7rdCYCQ_U

The History (And Future) of Social Engineering
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-EKOJ5GFbk

The Death of Nations: Globalism, Immigration and Migrant Crisis
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZN7Jv-3uvk

Living Outside The Box
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fRWjPl_vWl4

I suggest people listen to the above (sensibly) and decide or pursue each or every facet themselves as I am nobody to debate; I seldom agree with everything I hear but within discussions I discover trails- of thought I think worth pursuing.

I have no power and I sure as hell have no money to change anything.
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blizzardboy
blizzardboy


Honorable
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Elvin's Lightside
posted January 11, 2017 11:24 PM
Edited by blizzardboy at 23:25, 11 Jan 2017.

@Markkur:

People in Chicago eat perogis. Of course they have high violent crime. Who the **** eats perogis? Besides me.

If you break apart the country, there might be some places that are experiencing a rise in crime, but overall, violent crime is going down and has been going down.

I recommend instead of allowing people to down pistols, they carry hand grenades for self-defense. If they only ever have one piece of ammunition, it means they're only going to use it if they really, really need. Otherwise they might just use it to intimidate.

I still have a dream that one day, the true form of self-defense will be using guns from the future:


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fred79
fred79


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Crotch Connoisseur
posted January 11, 2017 11:53 PM

i've always wanted grenades. i second blizz's recommendation, but i'll add that we keep what we already have. just that + grenades will make me happy.

and it'll help clear up the traffic somewhat.


OH! OH! could we have machine-gun turrets for our cars? that would be even awesomer! for clearing up traffic!

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markkur
markkur


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Once upon a time
posted January 12, 2017 04:33 PM
Edited by markkur at 16:39, 12 Jan 2017.

blizzardboy said:
People in Chicago eat perogis. Of course they have high violent crime. Who the **** eats perogis? Besides me.


Sorry man but your not downtown unless you eat raw fish rolled up in squares with unknown-sea-veggies and scorning your fate, as a mere meat-truffle.

Btw, In the vid, I skipped to the beige-suited dude with the telekinetic powers. Take away all the other people in the Bollocks-wood production and remove that control over others and objects and you have the Ancient...well...never mind.

----------------------------

Fred, use mud to make balls and then stick short-broken-sticks into the centers...let completely dry in the sun...or, in hindsight, bake them.  Upon completing production; pull the sticks & hurl them at concrete walls and it's Really cool man. Well, it was when I was 10 and all my neighbors looked on me from a distance in agitated fear. However, they feared much-more my rock-grenades for some strange reason.

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