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Heroes Community > Heroes 4 - Lands of Axeoth > Thread: PNGs to make new objects / creatures
Thread: PNGs to make new objects / creatures This thread is 2 pages long: 1 2 · NEXT»
NimoStar
NimoStar


Promising
Supreme Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted June 17, 2018 04:31 PM
Edited by NimoStar at 17:13, 18 Jun 2018.

PNGs to make new objects / creatures

So, more than one person now has the skill to make good new objects from PNG images.

Unfortunately I am not one of those people as I got frustrated by it even though I was one of the researchers in the topic :V


BUT, there is something I can contribute still.

I have many PNG images that could be made into new objects, isometric files that could go easily with Heroes 4

If others want to convert it, it is as easy as opening it in GIMP, pasting it in an appropiate .ora, and reconverting it and hex editing whatever is necessary ("as easy", quotes intended :V)

Without further ado, here are some things which would be nice to see converted to begin...



(click for larger; pyramids are the correct size of the H4 pyramid, to be placed within its template)


These will also serve as reference for other users, what type of image they need.

In other words, to look right in H4, an image will need the next characteristics:

- PNG filetype
- Diisometric rendering
- Empty pixels as background
- No hard edges around
- No sharpening
- Anti-aliased if appliable
- No integrated shadows (shadows are different frame)
- Manageable dimensions (below 400x400)
- Not too dark (H4 has global illumination)

Pictures can be converted to these purposes, for example, a .gif can be resaved as a .png, shadows can be deleted, etc.

This can be done with Photoshop or GIMP itself, but please do it before posting anything here, so that we prevent having bad assets converted.

So, what do you think?

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radmutant69
radmutant69


Known Hero
posted June 17, 2018 10:36 PM

Well I think these will be good objects, so I'll convert them immediately when I get back close to any computer.

But this is easy now. How did you get frustrated by it when actually you (and Baronus) told us how to do this ?

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NimoStar
NimoStar


Promising
Supreme Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted June 17, 2018 10:58 PM

I mod many games so I forget the systems of one or the other, also have many real-life problems that reduce my temper and concentration...

Perhaps will try again someday if everything settles.

At the moment I think my ability insofar I can concentrate on this is finding and editing nice .png isometric images which fit the game, so that others may convert them if you want :V

Later when I pack a new version of the mod these sprites can be distributed to the thousands that download it from ModDB, so the effort won't be for just a few people.

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Karmakeld
Karmakeld


Famous Hero
posted June 18, 2018 10:25 AM

Nimo, have you tried the guides posted in the Researching how to add new objects tread? Guides are posted on page 7 & 9. The tread also contains the important infos about object editing.

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radmutant69
radmutant69


Known Hero
posted June 18, 2018 10:52 AM

Well, your images are objects now.



The pyramids are pyramids of course, but I forgot to ask what would be the temple-like stuff, so it is a big Order Temple and a smaller Quest Hut for now

Of course the object types can be changed easily if needed.

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NimoStar
NimoStar


Promising
Supreme Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted June 18, 2018 04:05 PM
Edited by NimoStar at 17:08, 18 Jun 2018.

Cool, very cool.

My idea was that the Temple will be a Dragon Utopia since the current one looks nothing like the H3 one, or an Uptopia at all... lol

Of course I didn't say anything so I cannot fault you. You see, my original idea was to do all of this myself :V

The big temple looks too blurry <(probably the fault of GIMP resizing algorithms, I use Photoshop for that), but the small one is perfect, at least for hut-like buildings!

The pyramid conversions look very nice and you preserved the quality.

I have many beautiful PNGs for buildings such as this one:

But they are animated (bottom are the animations), so I will rather wait if we get better tools and I can convert them with animations included and all.

So for now...

These ones don't have animation or shadow so they are good to be converted as-is by you or any volunteer.

They took quite a while to get at this state, though... image editing to fit the game, remove JPGization, partially transparent pixels, etc. is also work. Over an hour probably.

Though I still have my doubts on the frst one, if it will fit because it was originally just pixel art... so that one is optional. I will work on better bulding next times.



(Click for bigger versions, although in the non-pyramid ones, the thumbnails already look fine)

First Image: This is a dragon utopia now.
And yes, I love pyramids :V

Second Image: A level 5 Death Magic shrine...

Third Image: Quest hut, pirate version.


...More:


This is a simple 2x2 or 1x1 (if resized) do-nothing doodad (technizally or could work as slime/"demon spawn" recruiting or w/e). However, if placed there is something important: it is intended to see if partial PNG transparency works in main images.

If it does as I expect (since it does, for example, in Equilibris "Lights"), then we can use many more effects such as (still) smoke, lights, and integrated "shadows"

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radmutant69
radmutant69


Known Hero
posted June 19, 2018 03:30 PM
Edited by radmutant69 at 15:40, 19 Jun 2018.

NimoStar said:
Cool, very cool.

My idea was that the Temple will be a Dragon Utopia since the current one looks nothing like the H3 one, or an Uptopia at all... lol




NimoStar said:
Of course I didn't say anything so I cannot fault you. You see, my original idea was to do all of this myself :V

The big temple looks too blurry <(probably the fault of GIMP resizing algorithms, I use Photoshop for that), but the small one is perfect, at least for hut-like buildings!


Well this is why Karmakeld must working on his object images alone, since I'm probably the worst image editor around here. But it looks like the new Resource Editor tool is almost done so maybe you should just wait for it instead.

NimoStar said:
The pyramid conversions look very nice and you preserved the quality.


Yeah, preserving the quality wasn't so hard in this case because I simply didn't have to edit or resize them

Now I tried to make objects from these new images too.

I think this Dragon Utopia would be better as a Heroes III object but I made it anyway.



The others are working as well. I love this Skulls and Bones stuff



About the semi-transparecy stuff, well it looks like this:



I don't know you wanted to see this result or not...

@Anyone: I WANT A DANCING JACKO SPRITE RIGHT NOW!!! Give me one and I will fulfill one of your wish in exchange (if I can of course )



It would be a small isometric sprite in the S, SE or SW  or all of these three directions. Just like these zombies above...

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fred79
fred79


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
SCOURGE OF THE H-SEA
posted June 19, 2018 04:33 PM

Neat!

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NimoStar
NimoStar


Promising
Supreme Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted June 19, 2018 05:52 PM
Edited by NimoStar at 18:29, 19 Jun 2018.

Of course, I made the pyramids to the exact size because I was converting them, it just didin't work (maybe because of the shadows. Has anyone done objects with shadows yet? I was insistently trying that...)

Yeah, this new pyramid doesn't fit just as I thought... (actually, it woudn't fit H3 either. Maybe it can be edited. I didn't expect it to be that dark. But I didn't have any screenshots of H4 handy to copy-paste before publishing it.

Thanks for the new conversions.
The hatch looks as I expected. It was just a test so I didn't pay that much attention to the extact details of the smoke exhaust.

Though the small hatch does have the resizing curse, this time in the form of sharp and ragged edges lol. From now on I will make sure to provide all the necessary sizes in correct fashion, with a grid etc for reference.

So partian PNG transparency does work as intended. This opens many doors such as making mists

The skeleton does look like fred79's avatar :V
That was unexpected

*spoopy music plays*

***

For now I have some extra ones, which I have taken the work to "test", etc. (as a copy paste image to see if they fit and their dimensions, I haven't actually converted them)

Indiana medium temple is 3x3 and comes in two versions

Indiana Big temple is 4x4 and comes in a single version






As always, click for full version.

Auto-thumbnail resizes actually have good quality too, in case someone wants to use those for smaller ones, as my versions are possibly a bit bog.

As for the roles of these buildings... I'm thinking both are quest huts, but they could just as easily be Learning Stones, Light magic altars of high level, or Gold Golem dwellings.

BONUS:

New atlantis pyramid version... because old habits die hard :V
(and because I wanted to test techniques for achieving this with non-fitting graphics)

Thumbnail (Click)


Blending test



I think it passed.

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mirage
mirage


Hired Hero
posted June 21, 2018 12:43 PM

here you go.

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NimoStar
NimoStar


Promising
Supreme Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted June 22, 2018 06:59 PM

Thanks Mirage!

For the moment I will leave the thread to see if someone else has PNGs to convert...

In the future probably I will work on some nice mists and lighting effects to take advantage of partial transparency.

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Karmakeld
Karmakeld


Famous Hero
posted June 25, 2018 03:03 PM

NimoStar said:
Of course, I made the pyramids to the exact size because I was converting them, it just didin't work (maybe because of the shadows. Has anyone done objects with shadows yet? I was insistently trying that...)


I know you been away for a while but clearly you havent read up on relevant posts since then. I already directed you to 2 guides where you will also see that shadows can just as easily be added. Gee I mean you even commented on the mirrored objects where NEW SHADOWS has been added and yet you ask if anyone did it yet

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NimoStar
NimoStar


Promising
Supreme Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted June 26, 2018 07:19 PM
Edited by NimoStar at 19:20, 26 Jun 2018.

a simple "yes" would have sufficed :V

You try to gang on my alzheimer's but the mirrored objects I noticed had the same old shadows, like the Dream Teacher...


And many new objects by others didn't have shadows. And new creatures/heroes don't have correct shadows.

I'm not saying it can't be done, but you can't blame me for asking...

Ajnd you "directed" me at those guides like a year ago? :V

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NimoStar
NimoStar


Promising
Supreme Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted June 26, 2018 10:13 PM

Anyways, now you will see the project of my experiment:

Old h4 go away, cause there's a new H4 in town!



PNGs and some instructions soon...

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NimoStar
NimoStar


Promising
Supreme Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted June 27, 2018 06:43 AM
Edited by NimoStar at 06:51, 27 Jun 2018.

Now, let's see the following.

I will release the PNGs now, but first, I want to "teach" something and give some specifications, because I use brushes to make lush and realistic-looking randomized terrain, but many people don't-.

These considerations are special because they affect how brushes work.

Brushes normally make things occupy squares according to their size, and not overlap. The only exceptions are when one layer overlaps with the next (never with the previous).

So, the size of objects is important.

The size and location of objects also determines whether they go front or back of something when displayed by the game or map editor.

The key I think is to make 1x1 overlays, which start BELOW the grid they occupy. These should have passable passability. This way they bathe in "light" whatever is "behind" them.


Another version can be used for "backlighting". This would be a 2x2 (can also be 1x1, but for some reason I thin 2x2 will go better), and used for putting light Behind an object. The cell alignement can also be further up to differentiate it from the other and gove more variety of effects, but here in the example I use the same, just back instead of front.


+

For elevated things such as coulds, the bottom of the "used" part of the frame must be quite down, and the image quite up. This allows you to superimpose the cloud over tall things such as mountains. Otherwise the mountsins will be over the clouds and the intended effect is lost. Same happens with hovering lights such as the "good" light.

+

An additional note for some objects. They depend on being a certain height. The light beam depends on this for working correctly with the Learning Stone. This is important because we can only move H4 objects a full cell at the time, so there is no ingame "Position adjust".

Same gos for mirror light beam which would be used with mirror learning stone (From Karmakeld's object pack which he refuses to release in beta )

Now, without further ado... the PNGs that will help update H4 to the next graphical level! (I am depressed in real life, so let me use the pretentius tone :v)

As always, click for full sized images.

Some of these images appear to be blank. But they are not. Two are actually white beams of light of variable transparency, that will be displayed as such ingame. You can see this by opening it in an image editor or using a non-white background.






















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radmutant69
radmutant69


Known Hero
posted June 27, 2018 03:15 PM

Wow, yeah just throw us into the deep water

I tried to make the 'evil lights' and the 'Learning Stone lighbeams' now.

I think the lightbeams just work as well. I think. Although I cannot guarantee the mirrored one will be fully 'compatible' with the final mirrored Learning Stone.



I tried to meet all your requirements with the evil lights. I hope I was successful.



You can download them from this link. All of them can be adjusted (almost) freely either with the Resource Editor or even manually so feel free to tell me if some further adjusting is needed.

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Karmakeld
Karmakeld


Famous Hero
posted June 27, 2018 03:40 PM
Edited by Karmakeld at 15:51, 27 Jun 2018.

NimoStar said:
a simple "yes" would have sufficed :V


Hmmm.. likewise you could've said it was great to see the modding progress made during your absense, rather than expressing your amazement by the fact that others had progressed despite your lack of presence .
I guess you could say I just had a 'NimoStar moment' there, where I felt I didn't get the acknowledgement as deserved, hence my reply got a bit of a sharp tongue

NimoStar said:

You try to gang on my alzheimer's but the mirrored objects I noticed had the same old shadows, like the Dream Teacher...


And many new objects by others didn't have shadows. And new creatures/heroes don't have correct shadows.

I'm not saying it can't be done, but you can't blame me for asking...


Then you obviously haven't read my posts regarding the object package. I have quite clearly stated that due to lack of skills, there are limitations to what I can accomplish. I'm not a graphics artists and I'm not used to working with graphics programs. I've customized hero portraits in freaking Windows Paint, and the HD townscreens were made using some auto correction tool in another Windows image program - nothing fancy there. I'm still in the process of improving both my methods and alot of the objects.

I'm not blaming you for asking (only in the case you didn't do your reading), and I'm not saying it can't be done either, but do compare the Dream Teacher and the Knights Chapter. With the Knights Chapter I already had some 'square' and 'circlular' shadows to work from wheread with the Dream Teacher I would have to do it from scratch. I could spend days on it without getting a decent result. The same applied for the Sun Temple quest hut. Imagine how the mirrored shadow should look like. Then all you gotta do is draw it. Don't get me wrong, it's not that I don't want the Dream Teacher to have a shadow to match the mirrored angle, but I got the following choices, 1) either leave the object out coz shadow can't be changed properly 2) make a crappy shadow simply coz original shadow should be changed 3) keep original shadow coz I can't make something decent to replace it 4) remove the shadow completely to avoid either crappy shadow or the wrong angle of original shadow. For me the choice wasn't that hard. Now I have been given some ideas as to how to fit shadows to the new angle and hopefully objects like the Dream Teacher can be improved, but you're merely pointing out the obvious - the shadow is recycled - I was hoping for your eyes to catch new shadows being off angle, highlights and shades missed or colors being off (like the Pyramid - not quite pleased there when they are compared).

As for new objects and creatures/heroes made by others, I'm not sure what they have to do with me. They're not my work. I can either add them or leave them out of the package. Sure I could say all new objects etc MUST have shadows to be included, but I could also say objects which doesn't fit won't be included etc. I'll leave that judgement for the mapmakers or community members.

NimoStar said:

Ajnd you "directed" me at those guides like a year ago? :V


Speaking of Alzheimers, I'm sorry to witness the obvious state that you're in, coz if you scroll to the top and look at the 3rd post, by you, you complained about the lacking ability to make new objects and in the very next post I directed you to 2 guides, and that was a mere 9 days (!) ago - NOT a year ago..

Oh and you displayed the original Learning Stone Nimo, not the mirrored one
Anyway, if you upload those images as objects I'll consider releasing beta versions of the object package... shoot, Radmutant, I just saw you did that... Hmm nah I don't think that counts

Lastly, Nimo if you could find or make weather animations like rain, snow, fog etc I  know both Radmutant and I would be pleased. It's on our work list, but you just might have more succes pulling it off than us..

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radmutant69
radmutant69


Known Hero
posted June 27, 2018 04:12 PM
Edited by radmutant69 at 16:18, 27 Jun 2018.

Karmakeld said:
As for new objects and creatures/heroes made by others, I'm not sure what they have to do with me. They're not my work. I can either add them or leave them out of the package. Sure I could say all new objects etc MUST have shadows to be included, but I could also say objects which doesn't fit won't be included etc. I'll leave that judgement for the mapmakers or community members.


Well we can blame for the lack of shadows on my new objects either my lack of any image editing skills or simply my lazyness in some cases (I could add decent shadows from existing objects eg. to the obelisks if I really wanted I think. Maybe I'll try to do that some time later when I'll have enough time but not now.)

Also I think that drawing proper shadows for any new creatures would be a horrible amount of work for anyone even with good drawing skills. I don't say that can't be done but to be honest I don't expect any great fixes in those things. That will be too much for the wannabe modders around here

Edit: I think he didn't say that is the mirrored Learning Stone above. He talked about the beam for that one.

Also is there any 'official' mirrored learning Stone? I think we made one already but I can't find it anywhere. That thing in my above post is just a fake static Stone what I used to adjust the lighbeam...

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NimoStar
NimoStar


Promising
Supreme Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted June 27, 2018 09:04 PM
Edited by NimoStar at 21:33, 27 Jun 2018.

Great, Radmutant! I can't wait to try those on maps.

Quote:
Oh and you displayed the original Learning Stone Nimo, not the mirrored one


That was just the beam as Radmutant said. His stone is just a mockup.

Quote:
Hmmm.. likewise you could've said it was great to see the modding progress made during your absense, rather than expressing your amazement by the fact that others had progressed despite your lack of presence


Amazement is a good thing...

Plus, modding of H4 hadn't progressed since Equilibris in like 2003 until I made my mod in 2016. In fact most techniques of Equilibris had been lost. You can't blame me for being amazed... but as I said, that is a positive.

And anyways, I already apologize for my bad memory, there's just too much going on for me to concentrate. (my grandmother used to say that as well)

Quote:
Lastly, Nimo if you could find or make weather animations like rain, snow, fog etc I  know both Radmutant and I would be pleased. It's on our work list, but you just might have more succes pulling it off than us..


It is within my abilities, but it takes times as these have to be APNG animated by hand (gifs would look bad on H4 because they only have one transparency level instead of 256)
I can do it if you release the object pack beta first :V

Even if you perfect the objects in the future, having one already lets using these objects on maps, then the images would be replaced by the corrected by just replacing the graphics files.

That is why I insist, as I could have already used many of these for maps.

Anyways, doing animations was next in my list. Although these objects are fully functional and look good enough on their own, these were also so to speak "tests" of overlays concepts and I have to do some testing first to ensure the anims works correctly based on this implementation. In fact we could eventually have animated versions of  these objects as well. (but first newly animated ones, so as to not step on our own feet)

PS: Please upload somewhere else. I can't download here since it requires social networks and I don't use them.
[img]C:UsersAbolethDesktopGreen2018-06-27 16_32_25-Descargar - Nimo_Lights_01 - Descarga - 4shared - Mihály Nagy.png[/img]

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radmutant69
radmutant69


Known Hero
posted June 27, 2018 10:50 PM
Edited by radmutant69 at 14:17, 28 Jun 2018.

Try this then. Last time I downloaded something from there without logging in that site didn't require anything.

Edit: Various clouds and mists here.

I made high and low versions with 1x1 and 2x2 footprint because I don't know how will they working in brushes. Try them out

I can't upload any screenshots thanks to my current slow connection speed...

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