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Heroes Community > Heroes 4 - Lands of Axeoth > Thread: Good tricks to use
Thread: Good tricks to use This thread is 10 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 · «PREV / NEXT»
Agent00BLeRD
Agent00BLeRD


Adventuring Hero
posted December 18, 2002 02:16 PM

Since most people put at least two heroes in an army, there is a good way to get good classes when you're playing with order. Make one hero, a wizard king, by order magic and nobility, which is quite easy with the university. Make the second hero a crusader, get a knight from the tavern and give him life magic. This way, you're sure to get the first turn in combat and if by late game, your crusader has master order magic (quite easy to get at around level 20 plus a few libraries) you can cast mass slow and give your wizard king the next turn. And speaking of the wizard king, that is an extremely good specialty since it works with ranged attacks meaning you do 150% damage to the target. Wicked, and remains useful even in the late game.

And if you have an order, life or death town, be sure to hire a lord hero to give your town +10% growth. Besides, the hero will pay for himself in 15 or 20 days and result in extra gold everyday after that.

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csarmi
csarmi


Supreme Hero
gets back
posted December 18, 2002 02:43 PM

It is almost always useless to have two heroes with tactics, since you get the bonus only once.

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Agent00BLeRD
Agent00BLeRD


Adventuring Hero
posted December 19, 2002 04:08 PM

Morale isn't much of a problem in most fights because it rises as you kill the enemy troops. However, it might be very useful in a balanced fight where casualties on both sides are close. Luck on the other hand...well, it's much better to give the enemy bad luck than to have good luck on your side. You'll receive 66% damage with good luck (because your troops get +50% defense) but the enemy will receive 150% damage with bad luck (his troops get -50% defense), which IMO is much better.
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furryeifle
furryeifle

Tavern Dweller
posted December 20, 2002 03:15 AM

luck

well, it's a lot easier to give your creatures positive luck, and even though I agree that doing more damage is probably more useful than taking less damage, 33% damage reduction is equivalent to a 50% damage increase, mathematically at least (which i'm sure you knew).  It depends mostly on what sort of battle is being fought...if you have more shooter power, misfortune for them will be more useful...if they outshoot you, it probably goes the other way, as your ground forces will take fewer losses by the time they get across the battlefield.  

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EmperorSly
EmperorSly


Known Hero
Destroyer of Liver
posted December 20, 2002 01:10 PM

de-vampirizing

another way of looking at pain mirror -- it is the opposite of vampiric touch. when vampires attack your pain mirrored guys, all life they drain is taken away by pain mirror. but while vampiric touch works best on strong creatures, pain mirror is best on the weakest.

yet another view on pain mirror -- it's a wicked version of counterstrike. cast it on your imps, and they basically get unlimited retaliation -- whoever hits them, gets hurt. whats even better -- when phoenix attack them, they dont retaliate as imps agains phoenix (read: low damage) but as phoenix against imps (=high damage).
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Abort
Abort

Tavern Dweller
shapeshifter
posted December 24, 2002 08:31 PM

Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I tried this, and lost creatures -- I know that if I had managed the fight, I would not have lost any creatures.  Hence, not a good thing to do.

Put your strongest creatures in the first line and if you have a good army you won't lose any creatures.


I already lost a Dragon Golem to a ridiculous army consisting of thousands Dwarves! I surely wouldn't lost anything if I had managed the combat on my own. Never hit the Quick Combat butom again (Sorry for my bad english).


Yes, I know, what are you talking about, I lost two of fifty behemoths against 3 thousands 1-th level creatures if my memory serves well. But I am also unpunishable (I donīt know if this is the right word) and I use quick time almost every time I can.
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terje_the_ma...
terje_the_mad_wizard


Responsible
Supreme Hero
Disciple of Herodotus
posted March 17, 2003 11:57 AM

Easy, and quite basic little trick:
If you're playing as Death, choose Venom Spawn in your town(s).

The reason you should do this, is simply that you will probably get GM Necromncy pretty quick anyway (I got it at level 15, or something and then I had lots of other skills, too...), at least at a map of a certain size (XL or L, that is).

Through this method, you can, if you sacrifice the 'benefits' of skellies and imps, get an army that looks something like this (if you have two towns or one town and one 4th lvl dwelling):

Cerebi/Ghost - Ghost Dragon - Vampires - Venom Spawns
            Hero - Devils - Hero

It's rather nice, I think...
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"Sometimes I think everyone's just pretending to be brave, and none of us really are. Maybe pretending to be brave is how you get brave, I don't know."
- Grenn, A Storm of Swords.

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dale
dale


Known Hero
posted March 28, 2003 07:56 PM

Quote:
Easy, and quite basic little trick:
If you're playing as Death, choose Venom Spawn in your town(s)


I disagree.  I work to build the vampire generator as soon as I can (usually after only a few days).  Then with my small number of vampires, I can take out almost any stack of live creatures that is likely to be around -- and do so without any losses.

I sometimes end up playing with nothing more than multiple stacks of vampires and perhaps a stack of devils.  The other creatures just get in my way<G>.
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Grey Beards of the world, Unite :-}}

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TheEmperor
TheEmperor


Hired Hero
posted April 03, 2003 03:45 PM

Sorry if I'm ignorant, but how do you manage to get a powerful hero in H4. I just bought H4 (played H3 for years) yesterday, and I just can't seem to afford to take the experience or buy mage guilds. I seem to need every piece of gold to buy troops. Just now I play with Life town and have a Life level 8 magic heroine and all she can do is summon some sprites and armor. I'm really interested in how you can build up a really good hero, I seem to spend all my money on creatures and taking gold over experience.
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Guitar, black metal and HMM4

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EmperorSly
EmperorSly


Known Hero
Destroyer of Liver
posted April 03, 2003 04:55 PM

building a mighty hero...

good question. i would say on small (or even medium) single scenario you CAN NOT build a kickass hero who can summon devils or do other such trix. if you want to build a really high level guy, play campaign. or play on beginner difficulty.

on medium size map muliplayer game i manage to build max 2 level 14 heroes (normally less) before the final showdown comes. and thats when treasure chests are always used for exp.

but even more important is specialization. let your hero do only one thing so she can do it real good. i guess everyone agrees that its cooler to cast level 2 spells than level 1 spells. if you use the experience to get beginner life and beginner nature magic, you can choose between large variety of different crappy spells. but when you specialize, and use the same exp to gain advanced life magic only, you can already choose between some crappy (lvl 1) spells and some less crappy (lvl 2) spells. sounds like a better choice to me. after all, in combat you can each turn utilize only one skill (e.g. life magic, for casting bless, OR nature to summon sprite). if you specialize, you use all of your experience every turn, to cast heal. but if you diversify, some of your experience e.g. that invested into nature magic lies idle while you simply bind wound.
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jacktrades
jacktrades


Hired Hero
posted April 16, 2003 11:33 PM

saccrifice or not ?
a common "strategy" I use to gather resources is to split a week army in "groups" of 1 creature when I want a resource of some kind.
If I want a pile of wood for example,and if I take it it will be a fight,I send one week creature,that will die,but I remain with the wood...and leave the defender defend nothing...he he
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dale
dale


Known Hero
posted April 19, 2003 08:12 PM

Here is something that just dawned on me after playing HOMM4 for a long time, and I don't think I have seen it mentioned either.

When you are trying to take a resource (or mine) and cannot quite get there -- take a look at your army and their movement for each stack and hero.  Your army stopped moving because of the slowest creature.  It is likely that some creature or hero still has movement left.  You can split him out from the army and often can move enough to gather in the resource or mine -- and maybe even to get back to the army.

Only caution is if there is a moderate enemy or neutral stack nearby that might attack your single creature but not your full army.
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Grey Beards of the world, Unite :-}}

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csarmi
csarmi


Supreme Hero
gets back
posted October 28, 2003 08:49 AM

a small trick - movement

Not that important though. Suppose your main army is in one of your towns. You want to move him to east, for example. Now, if every single movement point counts for you (for example you are 1 movement point short from reaching the oasis this turn), you can choose on what side your hero appears when leaving the city. Just buy a level 1 troop, get him out of city, move to the eastern entrance of the city and make your main army join him. Then just dismiss it or whatever.

The same goes trick when traveling with a fast scout. If you want to remove him from army (temporarily for example) and you would like to choose where it gets to, just move another stack to that position and problem solved.

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barb
barb


Hired Hero
posted October 28, 2003 11:04 AM

nice hints ppl these helped me alot
ty
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UndeadLord
UndeadLord


Known Hero
posted October 28, 2003 01:58 PM

That is good to know Csarmi. You have helped me alot.
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csarmi
csarmi


Supreme Hero
gets back
posted October 28, 2003 02:51 PM

So someone has understood it. I was afraid it was too confusing. Hard to tell, easy to describe. Maybe we should put up illustrations (screenshots) too.
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Yes, I play the game only on the forums.

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delfontes
delfontes


Known Hero
Sorcerer Extraordinaire
posted October 28, 2003 06:34 PM bonus applied.
Edited By: Lich_King on 28 Oct 2003

Lovely tips here guys .

One tip that I have found extremely useful on multiple occasions is the "Decapitation" strike.

In desparate times, you may find yourself with very little to defend against a much much greater adversary.  Hopefully because you're main force is far away, and not because you're just way behind.

One thing you can do if you have a decent level hero is attack the entire army with just that hero (who naturally has immortality drunk).  If possible also buy a first level hero to tag along, also with an immo potion.

Then wait, so the enemy forces move, hopefully out of the way of the enemy hero.  Ignore the 50 angels coming at you and shoot/cast on the hero.  

Hopefully you can take him out, it is very unlikely they will be able to kill both heroes twice before you can retreat.

Now all that army can do is cry, and run back home.  It can no longer take mines, or attack your practically undefended castle simply because there are no living heroes.

You can do this a bit more expensively if you have devils etc. and are willing to lose them (if your hero isn't up for the task)... better than your castle.

If you have pathfinding, or just some luck, you can outrun that enemy stack back to its own castle and effectively win the map without having to ever fight their main army.

Cheap eh?

Edit: Good ideas, thanks for input
+Qp applied...

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csarmi
csarmi


Supreme Hero
gets back
posted October 30, 2003 09:32 AM
Edited By: csarmi on 30 Oct 2003

Decapitation

Cool idea. Well, I agree it is cheap, but if your enemy knows what to do, it will never work, I am afraid.

1, His heroes will be out of touch, and most likely he shall have too much heroes in the army.
2, He shall finish your army before you could do anything.
3, He won't lose too much turns. If there is a sanctuary near, hero alive. If not, he jut chains his hero home (as an artifact), and the hero is alive with full HP to rejoin the army.

Here is another little evil trick which will seldom have effect against a decent opponent.

Removing potions

Before attacking an enemy army with heroes (endfight for example), it can be a cool idead to attack it with a fast scout at first. If he has drunk potions or visited fountains, the effects will wear off. I mean, the effects of the potions with duration of 1 round (ice, toughness, etc.). You can also look at his army, line up, etc.
If you have some imps, that's better.

But think before you do it.
If the guy forgot to drink it's immo potions, you actually help him (this is what my enemy did once).
If he has a wounded hero and a staff of healing, you help him.
If his hero needs only 5 XP to level up, you help him.

Killing heroes

Everyone knows that dispel, cancel, steal will cancel the immo potions effect and there you go with troops. That's not my point.
If you have a stack who attacks twice and soes enough damage to kill enemy hero in one blow (GM archery, Elves, Crusaders, Cat Reflexes on anything), you can kill his hero even if he has immo potion on. First hit kills him, he is revived instantly and second hit finishes.

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Yes, I play the game only on the forums.

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Delfontes
Delfontes


Known Hero
Sorcerer Extraordinaire
posted October 30, 2003 04:11 PM

My tip was mainly for computer opponents.  They don't "chain" heroes.  

Even chaining though, they'd still need to buy a creature at their city and run towards the army.  Most people don't have chains pre established for things like that.

Even if they are human, and can get back to their city in time to ressurrect the hero, you've still bought at least 3-4 days.

In that time if you have GM pathfinding and the terrain is right, you can still take his castle before that main army gets back... it can't be chained and has no hero bonus.  

This tactic really is devistating against a computer, and could at least be very very annoying on a human not expecting it.
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csarmi
csarmi


Supreme Hero
gets back
posted October 30, 2003 05:40 PM
Edited By: csarmi on 1 Nov 2003

Well, pre-made chains are necessary. At least 1 creature per flagged mines. That easy.

As for going too far away from your city with a hero alone, without pathfinding and being so silly to have all his heroes killed. Well, ...

Quote:
You can do this a bit more expensively if you have devils etc. and are willing to lose them (if your hero isn't up for the task)... better than your castle.



I strongly disagree. In most situations, losing 2 Devil2 is worse than losing the a castle. I'd try to runaway with the Devils instead.

More tricks

Elementals

Fighting elementals. Problematic ones are Water Elemental (too much damage) and Air Elemental (too fast and 32 defense).

Now if there are only Waters, there is no problem. Place sacrificial stacks (lonely level 1's) in the first row closing any line of sight. The elementals won't shoot at them, they cast other spells instead and they wil charge at you, so you should try to slow them.

If there are Fires or Airs too, you are in a trouble. Your fodders will be killed and you are exposed.

There comes plan B.
It can still be done with two barbs.
1st has GM combat and GM resist
2nd has GM combat and GM melee

1st hero defends the second with his body. Charging Airs will be killed easily and Fires do not do enough damage from range to really hurt you.
Beware! Do not bring sacrificial stacks with you, you want those elements in as few stacks as possible.

(to be continued)

Sanctuary

Pretty dirty trick I was buying. You cast sanctuary, then mass dispel. Now the enemy's immo potions are gone, yours aren't.
Gustn did this to me and I had a very hard time winning the battle.

When sanctuary is a curse

If enemy casts sanctuary and has a walker troop - like crusaders - waiting to engage you, try to completely surround him with quicksand. Make sure you do not move any of your troops near that stack. This way, he cannot attack, and thus, he cannot leave sanctuary. His Crusaders will sit there 6 turns doing nothing. Since Sanctuary also prevents friendly spellcasting, enemy won't teleport them away :-)

Note however - do not make the same silly mistake I did: do not let those troops out of quicksand. Be very careful.
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