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| Thread: Worst Creatures of every town....... |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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bjorn190
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jebus maker
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posted February 12, 2006 12:49 AM |
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Worst creatures by level:
Level 1: The imp
Level 2: The walking dead
Level 3: Wight
Level 4: Pegasi
Level 5: Genie
Level 6: Cyclops
Level 7: Bone dragon
Worst relative creature by town:
Castle: Monk
Rampart: Dwarf
Tower: Gargoyle
Stronghold: Cyclops
Fortress: Hydra
Conflux: earth elemental
Inferno: Imp
Necropolis: Walking dead
Dungeon: Manticore
Worst creature in the game: Walking dead
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fortress_fan
Disgraceful
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posted February 12, 2006 09:52 AM |
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Quote:
Well the summoned deamons STAY after the fight. Maybe you didn't know that.
Do they!? I didn't know that...
And System_Error, I was NOT joking!
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System_Error
Tavern Dweller
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posted February 12, 2006 11:48 AM |
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Apparently you have a lot more to learn than you thought.
You weren't joking? Really? I find it VERY hard to believe it. It's either that or you're twice the newb as I am. I might offend you but come on! Zealot, Horned Demons, Harpy Hags, Dragon Flies being worst creatures of their towns is pure stupidity. I'm affraid to think what you consider SECOND worst unit of each town.
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csarmi
Supreme Hero
gets back
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posted February 12, 2006 01:24 PM |
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About conflux, let's see:
Sprites: huge numbers, great damage, no retaliation with 9 speed. Even pixies have 7 speed already, that is, combined with...
Air Elementals: 7 speed, huge damage and hp; your heroes start fast and stay fast. I don't wanna talk about storm elementals.
Water Elementals: do you actually believe you can start the game with 6-10 of them if you are lucky. I wouldn't either. But it's true. Amazing hp, good damage and a great oppurtunity to play them out for the last hp for no losses. In the end they are still too strong for a level 3 (and ice elemtentals are nice too).
Energy Elemental: well, they are weak, but fast. They are there to be sacrificed on shooters.
Magma Elemental: slow, but quite strong.
Magic Elemental: one-hex hydra with magic immunity. No one likes to fight them.
4 phoenixes a weak. talking about balance.
Dwellings are very easy to build. Firebird is cheap.
Magic University is unbelievable.
Elementalists start with 0033 AND magic skill (guaranteed earth if you want to).
Planewalkers probably have the best levelling amongst all and they field heroes such as Monere. Wow!
Various immunities of troops.
EVERYTHING is unbalanced about conflux. I think in some cases they can even challenge necro. Not on XL maps, though.
Now for worst creatures by towns:
Castle: I think it's Halberdiers. Yes they are good (and pikeman are strong at the start) and in large numbers they do a lot of damage even endgame, but they are slow and I rarely get them used. Gryphons come in as close 2nd, by the time I build them they are obsolate.
Rampart: Dwarves. Yes I like them, but seldom use them. If not prebuilt, the same applies as for Griffins.
INferno: Cerberi. I am always too occupied to build their dwelling. Gogs and imps are useful at the start, I'll have a lot of deamons and the high level units just rock. Cerberies are very good IF I have them. But I usually don't. Unless someone builds it for me.
Fortress: I vote for Lizardmen. Hard choice.
Tower: Golems.
Conflux: Magma
Necro: Zombie
Dungeon: Very balanced. I don't really like their shooters. Maybe Medusas.
Stronghold: Orcs are pretty useless. I don't think anyone ever builds cyclopes though. They are cool, but stand out of the building list.
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System_Error
Tavern Dweller
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posted February 12, 2006 03:12 PM |
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Pixies/Sprites: I don't think they do that much damage but, yeah, there are A LOT of them.
Air/Storm Elementals: could qualify as lvl3. Great unit, huge damage IF you're lucky. It could reach up to 7 but there's the 2 damage as well. So without bless it's quite uncertain.
Water/Ice Elementals: same thing as previous, except WITH melee penalty 
Fire/Energy elementals: 8 speed = fast? Well I guess it's ok but I don't think 8 is enough to compensate for their other stats.
Earth/Magma Elementals: How are they strong? 11AS, 11DS, 6-10Dam, 40 HP. Actually they're the weakest unit of their level. Zealots or Power Liches would almost kill them before the elemenatls reach them (+Zealots don't have melee penalty). Every other 5th level creature would beat the living daylights out of the Magma Elementals. Especially Minotaur Kings or Might Gorgons.
Psychic/Magic Elementals: not bad but they can't stand constant beating.
Firebirds/Phoenixes: Like I said, their quantity makes them dangeous, not their stats. Only their speed is good.
Those units that are truly strong have smaller growth per week (lvl2 & 3), all other levels except for lvl6 have higher growth to compensate for their weaknesses.
Onto worst units: Griffins are actually quite good. VERY balanced and always retaliating. And their growth is nice.
Cerberi are actually one of the better units Inferno have (along with the Efreet Sultans and Pit Lords).
You don't like Dungeon's shooters? Not disliking something and it being bad are two different things. 
Medusas are well worth their price. More than Evil Eyes.
Medusas aren't that expensive, have decent statistics, no melee penalty and stone gaze. They're more than OK if you ask me.
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maretti
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted February 12, 2006 03:34 PM |
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Castle: Zealots, amazingly weak lvl 5 unit with only 30 hp, not very good shooters(your marskmen allways do more damage even though they are only lvl 2) and easy to take out with their low hp.
Rampart: Battle dwarves, normally you dont have dwarves build week 1 so its rare you get them in big numbers, dwarves are so slow that they are difficult to get anything good out of before upgraded and with gold dragons being as expensive as they are its normally better to spend the money there.
Tower: Obsidian gargoyles, good unit for scouts speed but thats about it, can be used as decent fodder.
Dungeon: Trogs, not enough hp allthough you get them in pretty high numbers.
Inferno: Imps, the only good thing to say about them is that they can be made into demons, if you have some health arts you can get a nice amount of demons out of them.
Stronghold: Hop goblins: Good fodder but thats about it, orcs chiefs arnt that bad with their 20 hp.
Fortress: Wyverns, the good thing about them is that you can get big amounts from hives and that they have decent speed when upgraded and a good specialty, but there stats are simply too low. Low hp and dosent deal very much damage. Greater basiliskd are a medium lvl 4 unit, not bad at all, stone effect, 40 hp and speed 7.
Necropolis: Zombies, pure crap, at least u can transform walking deads to skelletons if you have enough money.
Flux: Earth elementals, very weak in all stats considering its a lvl 5 unit allthough you could say that all 4 elemental groops could be considerd being lvl 2-5.
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Crag rules, Orrin and Ivor suck
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fortress_fan
Disgraceful
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posted February 12, 2006 05:50 PM |
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Quote:
About conflux, let's see:
Sprites: huge numbers, great damage, no retaliation with 9 speed. Even pixies have 7 speed already, that is, combined with...
Air Elementals: 7 speed, huge damage and hp; your heroes start fast and stay fast. I don't wanna talk about storm elementals.
Water Elementals: do you actually believe you can start the game with 6-10 of them if you are lucky. I wouldn't either. But it's true. Amazing hp, good damage and a great oppurtunity to play them out for the last hp for no losses. In the end they are still too strong for a level 3 (and ice elemtentals are nice too).
Energy Elemental: well, they are weak, but fast. They are there to be sacrificed on shooters.
Magma Elemental: slow, but quite strong.
Magic Elemental: one-hex hydra with magic immunity. No one likes to fight them.
4 phoenixes a weak. talking about balance.
Dwellings are very easy to build. Firebird is cheap.
Magic University is unbelievable.
Elementalists start with 0033 AND magic skill (guaranteed earth if you want to).
Planewalkers probably have the best levelling amongst all and they field heroes such as Monere. Wow!
Various immunities of troops.
EVERYTHING is unbalanced about conflux. I think in some cases they can even challenge necro. Not on XL maps, though.
Now for worst creatures by towns:
Castle: I think it's Halberdiers. Yes they are good (and pikeman are strong at the start) and in large numbers they do a lot of damage even endgame, but they are slow and I rarely get them used. Gryphons come in as close 2nd, by the time I build them they are obsolate.
Rampart: Dwarves. Yes I like them, but seldom use them. If not prebuilt, the same applies as for Griffins.
INferno: Cerberi. I am always too occupied to build their dwelling. Gogs and imps are useful at the start, I'll have a lot of deamons and the high level units just rock. Cerberies are very good IF I have them. But I usually don't. Unless someone builds it for me.
Fortress: I vote for Lizardmen. Hard choice.
Tower: Golems.
Conflux: Magma
Necro: Zombie
Dungeon: Very balanced. I don't really like their shooters. Maybe Medusas.
Stronghold: Orcs are pretty useless. I don't think anyone ever builds cyclopes though. They are cool, but stand out of the building list.
Csami, I don't think soo. I think YOU are a Forge-lover who hated that conflux tock forges place!
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Zsa
Famous Hero
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posted February 12, 2006 07:00 PM |
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Castle - monks (as mentioned)
Rampart - Dwarves (as mentioned)
Tower - gargs(as mentioned  )
Inferno - imps - ditto
Necropolis - walking dead - yes
Dungeon - harpies without upgrade
Stronghold - orgre
Fortress - lizards
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csarmi
Supreme Hero
gets back
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posted February 12, 2006 10:06 PM |
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Yes, Griffins and Cerberi are great, but you are not going to have them because of the way things work in the game.
To fortress_fan. You should learn some internet-etiquette.
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System_Error
Tavern Dweller
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posted February 13, 2006 01:29 AM |
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This is a bit silly. Some people list UNupgraded creatures and other list upgraded. I think only upgraded should be considered as it is certain that an UNupgraded version of an unit is worse than the upgraded one. Except for Gogs/Magogs.
True, some units are hard to get due to how the game works but it doesn't mean the're the worst.
One more thing, I think you underestimate Monks and Zealots and you underestimate them a lot. They are shooters damn it. And damn good IMO.
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Zsa
Famous Hero
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posted February 13, 2006 03:46 AM |
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I don't see where the confusion is, if there's no special mention, the unit can be upgraded/unupgraded it doesn't make a difference.
I mentioned harpies without upgrade because I can't remember the last time I upgraded my harpies before week 3, and they are definetly my crapiest unit when playing dungeon.
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System_Error
Tavern Dweller
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posted February 13, 2006 05:42 AM |
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Quote:
I mentioned harpies without upgrade because I can't remember the last time I upgraded my harpies before week 3, and they are definetly my crapiest unit when playing dungeon.
I 'm not sure how to understand that. Could it be that you upgrade harpies AFTER week 3? Saving resources for something else?
Only speculating here, no offense.
But... following logic applied here, what turns out is the following:
BAD units:
Castle:
- Pikemen/Halberdiers: slow!
- Griffins/Royal Griffins: not worth the money, not part of dependancies so they're not built. Crap.
- Monks/Zealots: very weak shooter, it doesn't matter they're fast for shooters, and it doesn't matter if they do good damage
-> Following the logic I could add: Archer: very weak, baddly dressed one-shot shooter with low damage. Marksmen: A bit better because of double-shot, otherwise same crap as Archer.
Rampart:
- Dwarfs/Battle Dwarves: slow, building not part of dependancies, so they're not trained. Crap.
- Pegasi/Silver Pegasi: low damage, very weak
- Dendroid Guards/Dendroid Soldiers: tough? yeah, bu very slow and very low damage (9 attack - cerberi have more and they are level 3 whereas Dendorids are lvl5)
-> Following the logic I could add: Wood Elves: one-shot, very fragile, not cheap. Grand Elves: same thing, only double-shot, so a bit better
Tower:
- Gremlins/Master Gremlins: very weak, slow, 8 shots only (when upgraded), melee penalty, experience for the enemy
- Stone Gargoyles/Obsidian Gargoyles: can't be resurrected, only flyer so can't be sent alone to battle enemy's army (shame, isn't it). Expensive. Crap
- Stone Golems/Iron Golems: Slow, damage not good enough.
- Genies/Master Genies: Weak, damage not good enough. Upgrade makes the unit a spellcaster? Well, it doesn't cast the nice spells often enough. Magic Mirror, Counterstrike and other crap.
-> Following the logic I could add: Magi/Archmagi: weak, damage could be better, cost an arm and a leg.
Inferno:
- Imps/Familiars: very weak, low damage.
- Gogs/Magogs: bad shooters, upgraded can hit own army. Crap.
- Hell Hounds/Cerberi: not strong enough, building is not part of dependancies so it's not built. Expensive. Not cool.
- Demons/Horned Demons: not fast, damage not good enough, no special abilities.
-> Following the logic I could add: Pit Fiends: decent stats but expensive. Not cool. Pit Lords: same thing except it can summon demons. Requires Mage Guild Level 2.
Necropolis:
- Walking Dead/Zombies: slow, low damage, no/bad special ability. And this unit costs gold????
- Wight/Wraith: building not part of dependancies so it's not built. Weak unit, low damage. Crap
-> Following the logic I could add: Bone Dragon/Ghost Dragon: Not fast enough, not strong enough, special ability kicks in too seldom. Pathetic 7th lvl creature.
Dungeon:
- Troglodytes/Infernal Troglodytes: not fast, low damage. Stupid unit.
- Harpies/Harpy Hags: weak, low damage.
- Medusas/Medusa Queens: 4/8 shots only, ugly, damage not good enough, not cool.
- Manticores/Scorpicores: Pathetic lvl6 unit. Low damage, weak. Upgraded has decent special ability. If it kicks in, that is.
-> Following the logic I could add: Beholders/Evil Eyes: expensive and nothing worth the gold.
Stronghold:
- Goblins/Hobgoblins: very weak, low damage. Crap.
- Orcs/Orc Chieftains: slow, low damage. Stupid shooter.
- Ogres: slow, not required for Behemots so rarely built. Not very cool. Upgraded are a bit better but due to not being build they're out of the picture.
- Cyclopes/Cyclope Kings: cost a lot of crystalls, not very tough, not needed for Behemoths
-> Following the logic I could add: Wolf Riders/Wolf Raiders: weak, damage could be better
Fortress:
- Gnolls/Gnoll Marauders: weak, slow.
- Lizzardmen/Lizzard Warriors: slow, low damage.
- Serpent Flies/Dragon Flies: not very strong, when I send it alone to battle the enemy it dies (duh).
- Hydras/Chaos Hydras: not fast, not worth the money.
-> Following the logic I could add: Wyverns/Wyvern Monarchs: HP not high enough, damage could be better
Conflux:
- Pixies/Sprites: weak as hell.
- Fire/Energy Elementals: weak and damage is not very good.
- Earth/Magma Elementals: pathetic 5th lvl creature, weak, low damage. Costs money?
-> Following the logic I could add: Air Elementals/Storm Elementals: Without bless they're crap due to high damage amplitude.
Summing up opinions in this topic is fun. It seems Necropolis is best seeing how the least of their units are credites as worst.
One more thing. Have I got the wrong impression or do people here dislike shooters a bit? Monks and Zealots LOW HP shooters? Hello, and what about elves? They're low HP too but this doesn't seem to bother anyone. Orcs are tougher for their level yet they're crap?
Cyclopes are hard to get due to the building cost but I don't think this makes THE UNIT bad.
I myself find Archers crap. The only thing that makes them better than Pikemen is the fact they SHOOT. Makrsmen are better. They are weak as hell and that too bothers noone. Griffins and Royal Griffins are a great unit. If one builds the building. The building not being required for later levels and therefore not being built DOES NOT MAKE the unit bad. Azure Dragons are crap. I can't recruit them in my castle for some reason so they are crap. Logic? Dendroids Should be considered BIG CRAP since they are very slow and deal low damage. It doesn't matter if they're tough. Pegasi on the other hand are fast but weak. Again they're crap. Yeah, Rampart's lvl3, 4 and 5 have THE SAME ATTACK SKILL - 9. How about that?
Someone said Zealots don't do as much damage as Marksmen. I don't agree. Zealots do some pretty nice damage. I get the impression that shooters are not appreciated much. This shooter sucks, that shooter is crap. Forgive my ignorance but I find shooters to be VERY important units. Often the key to success.
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Zsa
Famous Hero
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posted February 13, 2006 07:31 AM |
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you've made a very powerful entry I'd give you that.
And from all that stuff you've written there, the only good conclusion you were able to draw is that necropolis is the best. At least you've gotten that far .
And yes, I didn't express myself in the best way, but you got what I said anyway, so all's good 
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csarmi
Supreme Hero
gets back
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posted February 13, 2006 12:03 PM |
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I realize that you are trying to be sarcastic, but what you write in your listing is all just true; not considering the last lines.
And yes, being out of the building list DOES make the unit bad. And yes, you are right, Azure Dragons are crap.
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angelito
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
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posted February 13, 2006 02:23 PM |
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Iīm not really sure this thread makes much sense to be honest. The value of a unit also depends on the kind of map u play. If u play a very poor map on high difficulty, u normaly upgrade your archers to marksmen on day 1 or 2 when playing Castle. That way, u have quite a decent army and can do some battles for gold, resources and exp.points. When playing dungeon on that kind of map, i upgrade my harpies to hags day 1 or 2, and u are also able to do many fights without much losses. Wyverns are very weak compared to other level 6 units, no doubt. But u can have them day 1 or 2. And having 2 units with 70 hitpoints in your army that early will surely help a lot, especially when u r able to get a first aid tent. Troglodytes are awesome coz of their numerous amounts. An army with nearly about 70 (not talking about Shakti here...) troggies and 15 harpy hags on a poor map is great stuff.
Walking undead for sure is a crappy unit, but can be used as fodder very well. If u have some of them in your army, the AI will mostly go for them instead of your skelly stack. They have decent hitpoints, and that way, u wonīt lose too much skellies at tha stage where your necro skill is still 10 or 20%, so u will not raise many skellies after the fight.
Mastergremlins are your big power stack on poorer maps with Tower. You will have some dwellings normaly, so u have about 100 mastergremlins besides some gargoyles. Get an ammocart, and a throng of golems will be easy prey. That would be more than 3000 exp.points...not too bad for day 1 or 2..
Gnolls are one of the most underestimated level 1 units in my eyes. They may have lower hitpoints and 1 point less in attack compared to pikemen, but they do more damage and are more numerous. Crypt fight with fortress is much easier than with Castle in my eyes. And crypts are essential early in the game on poorer maps.
So u see, u have to think about the kind of map u play, before u judge about a unitsī value. Only because u donīt use a unit in the endfight on a average to rich map, doesnīt mean it is crap at all.
Coz then i would say Archangels and Titans are crap, coz i only play Small maps without under 200%...and will rarely have them in endfight..
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Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
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System_Error
Tavern Dweller
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posted February 13, 2006 05:42 PM |
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Quote:
Iīm not really sure this thread makes much sense to be honest. The value of a unit also depends on the kind of map u play. If u play a very poor map on high difficulty, u normaly upgrade your archers to marksmen on day 1 or 2 when playing Castle. That way, u have quite a decent army and can do some battles for gold, resources and exp.points. When playing dungeon on that kind of map, i upgrade my harpies to hags day 1 or 2, and u are also able to do many fights without much losses. Wyverns are very weak compared to other level 6 units, no doubt. But u can have them day 1 or 2. And having 2 units with 70 hitpoints in your army that early will surely help a lot, especially when u r able to get a first aid tent. Troglodytes are awesome coz of their numerous amounts. An army with nearly about 70 (not talking about Shakti here...) troggies and 15 harpy hags on a poor map is great stuff.
Walking undead for sure is a crappy unit, but can be used as fodder very well. If u have some of them in your army, the AI will mostly go for them instead of your skelly stack. They have decent hitpoints, and that way, u wonīt lose too much skellies at tha stage where your necro skill is still 10 or 20%, so u will not raise many skellies after the fight.
Mastergremlins are your big power stack on poorer maps with Tower. You will have some dwellings normaly, so u have about 100 mastergremlins besides some gargoyles. Get an ammocart, and a throng of golems will be easy prey. That would be more than 3000 exp.points...not too bad for day 1 or 2..
Gnolls are one of the most underestimated level 1 units in my eyes. They may have lower hitpoints and 1 point less in attack compared to pikemen, but they do more damage and are more numerous. Crypt fight with fortress is much easier than with Castle in my eyes. And crypts are essential early in the game on poorer maps.
So u see, u have to think about the kind of map u play, before u judge about a unitsī value. Only because u donīt use a unit in the endfight on a average to rich map, doesnīt mean it is crap at all.
Coz then i would say Archangels and Titans are crap, coz i only play Small maps without under 200%...and will rarely have them in endfight..
That was my point exactly. Only thing was, I tried to express it the hard way hoping someone would catch my drift. I guess I should have said it directly.
There is no unit that is COMPLETE CRAP. Although there are units that are really near that category. Meaning that they are usefull in RARE cases. These units are very few. Maybe Dwarfs and Walking Dead. Let's take Dwarfs for example. If I know I'll have a full scale battle with an oponent and I know/suspect he would go for my shooters and I wouldn't be able to rely on them much I would take the dwarves if they are considerable number. If I know/suspect I'd have oportunities to shoot, I'd leave the dwarves in my town and split my Grand elves in two group, one in each corner. That's what I do when I'm taking control over mines, battling wandering stacks, gathering experience and all that jazz. Dwarfs would slow me down, they would be useless vs neutral shooters and they're not fast to manoeuvre around the battlefield so apllying som form of tactics is out of the question vs fast units. I won't be able to outsmart the creatures with dwarves due to their slow speed. This would most likely mean losses. Why take them and have losses and less movement when I can leave them behind and use tactics and spells to fight my battles. Grand elves, centaur captains and Silver Pegasi are perfect. All of them are fast so picking unit with elves and finishing them off with CCs and Pegasi is quite easy.
If we follow the logic applied here and find negative sides about every unit, we'll end up with races with maximum of 2 creatures playable.
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Russ
Promising
Supreme Hero
blah, blah, blah
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posted February 13, 2006 05:43 PM |
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Quote:
Russ, basilisk is physically one of the strongest level 4's and it's speed and special are not bad either.
Well... consider the alternatives:
Vamp Lords (do I need to comment? )
Crusaders - they do more than 2x Basilisk's damage and they only have 5 hp less
Ogre Lords = more damage, MUCH more hp (60), cheaper AND a very useful specialty
Inferno - demons have similar stats, BUT they can be hoarded
Tower - Arch Mages, well, those are far more useful because they can shoot, and because of their 2 specials, not to mention that they do more damage.
All of the above are physically stronger than the basilisks.
What are we left with? Dusas and Pegasi? Well, those are just a little bit weaker, but the first ones can shoot and silver pegasi are FAST and have a nice special.
Quote:
I tend not to use them though
No wonder They are always the last fortress unit I hire.
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TNT_Addict
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Beautiful Liar
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posted February 13, 2006 08:05 PM |
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And lizardmen are also not too bad. Upgraded lizards with the help of fortress heroes become very tough to kill at the end fight, they can take any other archer 1 on 1 be it zealots or elves, thats if you take a good care of them and not scrifice them somewhere.
They won me several fights that way, then the enemy must come closer and no other town is stronger than fortress at hand to hand combat.
Wyverns are so weak, that with a little luck even the sixth level T-birds can handle them.
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Russ
Promising
Supreme Hero
blah, blah, blah
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posted February 15, 2006 05:05 PM |
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Edited by Russ on 15 Feb 2006
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Quote:
Wyverns are so weak, that with a little luck even the sixth level T-birds can handle them.
Their strength lies in their numbers.
Fortress can get those from:
1) Its own EASILY-BUILT level 6 dwell (well, obviously) So, you WILL have those on week 1 even if you play a poor map on 200% difficulty setting.
2) Hives
3) Another fortress. They can be built on the same day you capture a new fortress town (if it has a fort) and on the 2-nd day if it doesn't have a fort. No other town can do that.
Ever fought a stack of 50+ wyverns? On a decent hero they can kill any other level 6 stack in 1 hit. 50+ weaklings will rip through 10 or 14 good level 6-es (10 or 14 is approximately how much you'll have in the end fight).
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Evil_Warrior
Famous Hero
Duke of Demon
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posted February 18, 2006 01:03 PM |
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Wyvern
So weak......
But cheap.......
Easy to build.......
Easy to upgrade.......
Great number......
Over average Speed.......
Poisoning if upgraded........
The Wyvern is weak if we conclude it by view the creature stats. But in battle, the situation may different...........
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