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Heroes Community > Tournament of Honor > Thread: The RAMPART v. Bad Skellies
Thread: The RAMPART v. Bad Skellies This thread is 2 pages long: 1 2 · NEXT»
zilonite
zilonite


Famous Hero
posted March 08, 2003 03:37 PM

The RAMPART v. Bad Skellies

Alternative thread name - "Unbeatable Necro?"

Purpose of the thread - just to save energy of real game experts, explaining 100x time, why might is better than magic

Main issue for debate: do I have a fair chance to beat Necro with Rampart on L, if my opponent is pretty good?

I as true elvies fan would like to propose the aswer "yes". I tried a couple of games and i won more than lost. Oponents were not the most powerful (yet not the newbies, too ). Was it an accident or do long-ear-arrow-buggers really stand a chance agaist hordes of skellies?

Also if there is any hot-blooded answer "no" defender, may be we can arrange a game? (my rules for this: no diplo, no dd/fly, 4 min turns, avg creature strength, at least 160% dif)

Or if there will be pretty many people on both - Rampart and Skellies - sides, may be we can arrange sort of mini tourney?

The gauntlet of challange has been thrown...

Zilonite

P.S. Sorry, if this topic was discussed already, this is my first year in ToH. Yet even in this case "repetitio est mater studiorum", ain't it?

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Sir_Stiven
Sir_Stiven


Honorable
Legendary Hero
banned
posted March 08, 2003 04:04 PM

hmmm if fast meeting week 2 on a L it is possible, but playing XL against a necro town is suicide if playing a good player. Same goes for random L usually.

And playing without diplo vs necro is a really tough thing to do. Off course it is possible to win a rampart vs necro game but if playing a good player you will need lots of luck to pull if off.

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Lord_Woock
Lord_Woock


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Daddy Cool with a $90 smile
posted March 08, 2003 07:01 PM

Quote:
Also if there is any hot-blooded answer "no" defender, may be we can arrange a game? (my rules for this: no diplo, no dd/fly, 4 min turns, avg creature strength, at least 160% dif)


If we play WOG, I choose the wogify options and you knock off that 4min turns limit, I'm in.

What ya staring at? I'm a far below average player .
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Yolk and God bless.
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Uncoatedtitan
Uncoatedtitan


Adventuring Hero
posted March 08, 2003 07:50 PM

:)

Hia all
Depends on the template
Uncoated
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Aculias
Aculias


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
posted March 08, 2003 08:35 PM

No Ms Titans it has nothing to do with the template at all but the spells you  both have & the situation your in .
Say if you are being attacked in your castle you can simply destroy thier catapult & only worry about the vamps & liches but like I said depends on the spells so water on expert lv can come in real handy for nec for numerous reasons.

If you like elves so much can come in handy to have expert force field so troops wont go near your elves but spells can still hurt them, also cloning them if you have water can help.

Those are just some examples if you are facing 10 millions skellies .

Also you got to work quickly vs the nec because you dont have the right power or spells you may get hurt
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Dreaming of a Better World

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Hexa
Hexa


Responsible
Legendary Hero
posted March 09, 2003 01:02 AM

Necro is almost unbeatable if u don't get diplo to counter the necro advantage.

There area few situation were u can win versus necro but I would say the changes of winning from necro on a large map (when u don;t meet tooooo soon) are about 25% at best.

So yeah I wil take u up on that offer!@


We still need to play that fun game remember
____________
If you want to realize your dreams >>> you have to wake up!@

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Aculias
Aculias


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
posted March 09, 2003 03:36 AM

I disagree Hexa I think the more time you have the better the chances you have to beating Nec.
You may have a hugh number of skellies but with the right spells there are ways to avoid the skellies, afterall thier only ground units.
The spells will determine who will win.
Water specialty is almost a defanate win for Nec though since you can teleport them, clone them etc.
Implosion & slow is nec worst enemy. Plus my above examples are just a few of many ways to fend off vs Nec.
Try to take as much time as you can, try to get stronger & work on getting your creatures & your guilds going.
Get a couple scouts to gain some resources with semi powerful troops to beat the lv 1-2 guarding your native area.
Get your main to explore around try to view where your oponent is.
If you can get your stats going, kill some time & get some great spells.

I played someone a while back & he was pretty confident with almost 2000 skellies & a few other troops while I had 2 weeks of my stronghold troops.
I am pretty strategic so I first cast slow on them & wore them down with Orcs, he tried to cast haste but my Thunders were too fast.
Strategiclly I had him miss my goblins by exactly one step while all my troops were smack in the middle of my formation.
Not having any cyclops yet I formed two groups of Goblins, one with only one goblin & one with a full group 2 weeks worth plus what I started with.
So I attacked first with my 1 goblin, lost my goblin then I unloaded on him with my 3 behemoths, cast slow on my next turn & by the time I was done with my whole turn it was pretty much over with only one casualty.

Of course Dracos & I saw him coming like 4 days before I was discussing with him where & when I should attack.
I decided to meet him before he hit the Subteraneam.
Good game anomynous one .
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Dreaming of a Better World

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zilonite
zilonite


Famous Hero
posted March 09, 2003 04:26 AM

Quote:

If we play WOG, I choose the wogify options and you knock off that 4min turns limit, I'm in.



Sorry, man - i don't play WoG. Of course, your agreement to play this little Ramp v. Skellie game could be a start for my WoG carrier... But yet I think I will remain within the ranks of conservatives HOMMers


Quote:
Necro is almost unbeatable if u don't get diplo to counter the necro advantage.

There area few situation were u can win versus necro but I would say the changes of winning from necro on a large map (when u don;t meet tooooo soon) are about 25% at best.

So yeah I wil take u up on that offer!@


We still need to play that fun game remember


Of couse, I do remember, Hexa


To Acculias:

It is good to see that someone supports non-necro side, too. Yet in your sample your opponent didn't his best, i think

To Sir_Steaven:

U agree to challange - u as necro, I as Rampart?



Any more opinions?

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Aculias
Aculias


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
posted March 09, 2003 04:56 AM

I am pretty strategic in my battles.
Also I doubt you can beat the oponent I am thinking of lol
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Dreaming of a Better World

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zilonite
zilonite


Famous Hero
posted March 09, 2003 06:24 AM

Quote:
I am pretty strategic in my battles.
Also I doubt you can beat the oponent I am thinking of lol


no offense meaned,

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bjorn190
bjorn190


Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jebus maker
posted March 09, 2003 01:11 PM

Quote:
I played someone a while back & he was pretty confident with almost 2000 skellies & a few other troops while I had 2 weeks of my stronghold troops.


Acu.. did u really beat 2000 skels with 2 weeks of stronghold troops?  sure u dont mean 200?

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Xarfax111
Xarfax111


Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
The last hero standing
posted March 09, 2003 01:18 PM

if u got a good necro player your chance to win on a Random L without diplo wents down to zero after day 14.

Xarfax1
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midnight
midnight


Promising
Famous Hero
posted March 09, 2003 02:34 PM

i agree with xar, u get a few necro heroes with some vamp lords and u can harvest huge # of skels on any random, esp templates like ring which r loaded with small stacks.

The other thing is animate undead is easier to get and use than res, so that is another big advantage. Makes all those lvl 3 shrines really useful.

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splexx
splexx


Known Hero
posted March 09, 2003 04:37 PM

Quote:
if u got a good necro player your chance to win on a Random L without diplo wents down to zero after day 14.

Xarfax1


Absolutely,
plus remember if diplo allowed, the necro player can get it also..
Necro hero with diplo and skell transformer= dead opponent
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Azif..

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tewilligar
tewilligar


Famous Hero
Just another willigar
posted March 09, 2003 07:04 PM

lets not forget

...what happens to hydras and dragons in the transformer
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zilonite
zilonite


Famous Hero
posted March 09, 2003 08:46 PM

summarasing this far

So, this far it looks that bad boys skellies rulz the voting...

OK, then, if i will lose this rampart v. skellies game with somebody, i will know that there is no shame in it.

May be only a little bit of shame - because i didn't took good advices not to play rampart vs skellies

However as I saw that only good (well, and really good )players responded here, may I count on anyone of you to play this rampart vs. skellies game (rules see in above thread + plus, may be, no obvious hit and run)?
As for template, i propose something neutral like 2sm4d (this especially relates in case of Midnight )


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Hexa
Hexa


Responsible
Legendary Hero
posted March 09, 2003 08:50 PM

Sure I will play u!@
I am just an average player so u might win with rampart

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If you want to realize your dreams >>> you have to wake up!@

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sos
sos


Known Hero
posted March 10, 2003 01:12 AM

I kinda disagree with the notion that necro will guarantee you a win on a random map L or bigger map. While I think necro to be the best I dont think it's so much better than the other towns.

I remember a game of Fortress vs Necro on random XL vs a very good TOH player. To make things worse he got diplo early as well. However, in mid game I find a DD scroll and having expert air start jumping all over the map, hitting boxes, utopias, etc (yea, I had a magic hero ). In one of the topias I find the earth book also. In the final battle he didnt have a chance vs my implosions.

That's why I think that when the games goes long and utopias come into play chances are virtually equalized. All that matters is the arties that you get and the skills.

Some things that can beat necro:
1. Hit and run
With a speed of 14 necro is at the bottom end. Flux, Castle, Inferno, Rampart, Dungeon can hit and run them (assuming no speed arties or native terain). If necro dont have ghosts yet virtually any town can hit and run them. That's why it may be better to have a good magic hero vs necro, if you are in a faster town. Of course, shackles will screw you for good.
2. Diplo
Not much to say here.
3. Spells
DD and Fly especially, implosion.
4. Any random factor on a random map
This could be external level 7 dwelling, box with all level 5 spells, etc.

In the case of Rampart vs Necro on random I think Rampart is as good vs Necro as you can get. Very good heroes (logistics, armorer, intelligence, resistance), good spells (implosion seems to show very often), resistant creatures, killer shooter. Rampart has a good chance.


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splexx
splexx


Known Hero
posted March 10, 2003 05:50 AM

ok Zil...anytime u want bud..
necro vs ramp random lg or xl...
name the time an place

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Azif..

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zilonite
zilonite


Famous Hero
posted March 10, 2003 01:06 PM

Quote:
ok Zil...anytime u want bud..
necro vs ramp random lg or xl...
name the time an place



Hexa ans Splexx!

I will be in zone today somewhere around 11 PM Latvia's time (6 PM this forum time, however, i'm not sure about it). If u are up to game, we can do it. If u are busy, then zm as u see me in zone or I will zm as I will see u.

Arrow-sharpening Zilonite

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Elephants commonly have a bad eyesight. Yet with their bulk this is not a major problem for them.

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