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| Thread: sanctuary |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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MSG-1-1
Known Hero
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posted June 26, 2003 03:35 PM |
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Edited By: zud on 26 Jun 2003
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its strange that when ur in a battle, and u have a crusader, when u cast sanctuary thats the only thing the crusader is going to cast during combat (maybe something crap in end or divine) Its stupid that the other 20 spells that the crusader uses are forgotten and crusader just sitting in sanctuary.. I agree that sanctuary is too strong, but without it life sucks in my opinion..  Maybe someone could try to make a map where all lv5 spells are banned, or maybe lv4 also... that would make battles interesting and really army vs army games... and about arties, is the bug fixed that dragon scale shield (30% def and fire res.) is a minor ...? if something should be banned from majors that would be tynars dagger of despair... i guess 3do crew was drunk that day when they added it to majors...andi personnally think halberd is too good for minor.. it could easily be major....
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haile73
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted June 26, 2003 03:38 PM |
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blarg
wouldn't hurt if some people would use the term "in my opinion" every now and then. One of the benefits would be that the opinion of an individual doesn't sound like the ultimate truth.
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Tc_Fear
Famous Hero
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posted June 26, 2003 04:18 PM |
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Quote:
its strange that when ur in a battle, and u have a crusader, when u cast sanctuary thats the only thing the crusader is going to cast during combat (maybe something crap in end or divine) Its stupid that the other 20 spells that the crusader uses are forgotten and crusader just sitting in sanctuary.. I agree that sanctuary is too strong, but without it life sucks in my opinion.. Maybe someone could try to make a map where all lv5 spells are banned, or maybe lv4 also... that would make battles interesting and really army vs army games...
if sanctuary is cast u donot need any other spels .while army is makein theyr path to tacktic.after that any sucky hero casts dispel and angels finish tackic. thats all
a map there r no lvl5 spells?u r kidding.what map would suck.if there is army there got to be all magic
but if there is barbarmap(all it needs is external tavern) u can remove everything ,its balanced anyway
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AzureDragonTM
Known Hero
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posted June 26, 2003 07:02 PM |
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Jinxer... stop dreaming baby  . I'm not threaten by you at all. And that JOKE about Zud "abusing" you is a common thing among the heroes players  and isn't my invention ... mebe u heard it first time from me thats all. Anyway Jinxer ... peace man. The only thing that I say it is a dangerous habbit for map makers to ban certain spells.
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Evil Ghost Pirate LeChuck
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EmperorSly
Known Hero
Destroyer of Liver
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posted June 27, 2003 04:46 PM |
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'bout sanctuary
sorry for goin offtopic, but could someone describe a little closer what is the tough thing with sanctuary that needs countering? at least with sanc lasting 6 turns only, it wont give much of advantage. ok, i imagine one can use it to build a ring of sanced creatures around a badass directdamage or shooter hero/creaturegroup, but: you waste one turn on casting sanc, you waste about 2-3 turns on walking around with your creatures, hero wastes a turn or two waiting for your creatures to take positions, and finally you can take a few safe shots at enemy with only a fraction of your army. at the same time your opponent can cast each and every beneficial spell on his troops, summon a bunch of animals, and in the end of sanctuary end up stronger than before it. alternatively, you need a mirthed hero to wait on his turn, then teleport into the sanc circle, get another move right in the beginning of next turn and teleport the circleprotected non-sanced badass out in the midst of your hungry creatures. anyway, i cant see more harm in opponent casting sanctuary than in opponent cutting into his leg. please, prove me wrong, i'd lige Life faction to be stronger...
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Arangar
Famous Hero
Weak ranger - lost viking
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posted June 27, 2003 05:31 PM |
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benefit of sanctuary
Imagine having all your creatures and heroes suddenly immune to everything. Then, walk over to your opponents' side with all your badass slow units. Now, stay calm, breathe, then cast dispel on his tactic hero. This is when it starts getting interesting. Kill his tactic hero (you have all your creatures and combat heroes near him at this point) while your own tactic hero is safe in sanctuary. (as is your priest for DI later on) Now, this is only about turn 3-4, still have plenty of time to keep your tact hero safe.
Around this time you start the carnage, his creatures will fall almost instantly, and your priest can revive every hero that dies in combat. Now combine this with a hero with expert order w/ townportal spell. after killing a snowload of his troops, if you suddenly feel threatened by him having (in some miraculous -read: impossible- way) killed your priest or tactician, towngate out
Painful?
Arangar
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Arangar
Norwegian viking
ranger of the north
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted June 27, 2003 07:06 PM |
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Sanctuary puts me in mind of the Old Heroes 3 Blind trick.
You could blind there units and while they sat there helpless unable to move or do ANYTHING you could get all your army in position then Hit them with lightning bolt or shooter then RE-Blind them before they got a turn. So essentially the game was over even if you had 2000 Behemoths it didnt matter becasue there was no way for yu to move again.
Sure many people loved it. It is tactics like the Blind trick or H&R from H3 that gave people a chance to win a battle that they didnt really deserve to win. But trust me, most people didnt hesitate to accept the win for it.
Same thing goes for H4. There are a handful of spells that can truely be very unbalancing with little ways of countering them.
@ Aranger. The townportal hit and run tactic you mentioned. Is terribly low and dirty. About the ONLY time I ould ever use it, is if my opponent cast Sanctuary or Divine intervention. Besides those 2 silly spells, I rather be earn the battle and not wimp out and portal out lol
Jinxer
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balcough_dra...
Supreme Hero
unlucky? i want to pump you up
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posted June 27, 2003 07:53 PM |
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hey arangar you missed something
now if opponent has disinagrate your life mage will be gone the first time she pokes his or head out
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slayer
whos your daddy and what does he do?
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Arangar
Famous Hero
Weak ranger - lost viking
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posted June 27, 2003 08:43 PM |
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Up to the player to be smart enough to take care of potential threats
Besides, priest (crusader) will be in sanctuary, and when he uses DI (if), that chaos magic hero is probably dead.
Not to mention Disintegrate is Line of sight I believe.
Arangar
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Arangar
Norwegian viking
ranger of the north
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balcough_dra...
Supreme Hero
unlucky? i want to pump you up
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posted June 27, 2003 09:28 PM |
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yes it is but a good player on the side with no sactury will know better what to do
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slayer
whos your daddy and what does he do?
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AzureDragonTM
Known Hero
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posted June 28, 2003 01:39 PM |
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Once again I read the Jinxer's post and I must reply : "to deserve to win", "tricks to win" ... this a game Jinxer, a game like chess... if u want to win u must do all is necesary to win (not cheating of course, but u must use all game's features). In love and in war all is ok... remember Jinxer? I really do not understand what I have to do if my opponent army is bigger ? Hit ALT+F4 and gave him the victory ? Of course not... I must try to use all is possible to bring him down. This is the beauty of this game ... to beat your opponent when there is no chance for u. The most inventive player must win... not the good old fellow which uses standard tactics ... more concerned about what the other good old boys will think about him than about the win . BTW I miss Sacred_Warrios one of the most inventive players I meet.
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Evil Ghost Pirate LeChuck
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted June 28, 2003 05:42 PM |
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LMAO Azure SOunds like you were one of the players that thought it was INventive in Heroes 3 to Run the Map with 1 ArchAngel and 1000 Implo H&R and beat armies 50 times bigger.??!?!?!! That isnt inventive thats exploiting a flaw in game and cheap. You dont deserve a win like that.
I am not saying avoid using creative ways of winning a battle, I am just saying that there are SOME spells and tactics that can be used and exploited that give an overwhelming advantage and possiblly an edge or win that other wise wouldnt be possible.
For example, I personally refuse to use Sanctuary any more in battle no matter what map or situation. If I lose then I lose. But a win is not that important to me that I gotta resort to ANY tactic.
But Azure I guess thats why you are an emporer, and I am a struggling Legionairre.
Jinxer
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Blue_Camel
Famous Hero
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posted June 28, 2003 07:57 PM |
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Quote:
LMAO Azure SOunds like you were one of the players that thought it was INventive in Heroes 3 to Run the Map with 1 ArchAngel and 1000 Implo H&R and beat armies 50 times bigger.??!?!?!! That isnt inventive thats exploiting a flaw in game and cheap. You dont deserve a win like that.
I am not saying avoid using creative ways of winning a battle, I am just saying that there are SOME spells and tactics that can be used and exploited that give an overwhelming advantage and possiblly an edge or win that other wise wouldnt be possible.
i dont understand... if a certain tactic really is a "flaw in the game" then why dont you just make a rule against it before game? btw, i dont think sanctuary is flaw in game. maybe a bit overpowered, but shouldnt be banned. Still, if you think it is a bug, make the rule that it wont be used before game with your opponent.
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van
Tavern Dweller
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posted June 29, 2003 09:54 AM |
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I beleve Azuredragon is right here.
If you ban sanctuary than you must also ban hypnotyze, dragon strenght,DI, sum mantises/feries, desintegrate, barbs/archers , necromancy , black dragons , demonologists, devils assasinations ...
immediately , some lvl 4 spells start to shine too much so
continue with cloud of confusion , vampiric touch, blind, cat reflexes , mass slow , also genies and nightmares, seminary and university , creature portal, breeding pens , thiefs ...
Than you must take care of lvl 3 spells like town gate , sum water/air , forgetfulness, mas dispel , teleport, mass cancelation ,antimagic ...
Of course , cancelation/steal enchantments/ must go as well in lvl 2 department and because of that all wards too...
than dispel and bind wounds ...
Doubt though that some people will be happy and ready to play even than ...
For me , only questionable part is retreating system.
Of course , you can ban retreat too
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Tc_Fear
Famous Hero
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posted June 29, 2003 10:00 AM |
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Quote:
Once again I read the Jinxer's post and I must reply : "to deserve to win", "tricks to win" ... this a game Jinxer, a game like chess... if u want to win u must do all is necesary to win (not cheating of course, but u must use all game's features). In love and in war all is ok... remember Jinxer? I really do not understand what I have to do if my opponent army is bigger ? Hit ALT+F4 and gave him the victory ? Of course not... I must try to use all is possible to bring him down. This is the beauty of this game ... to beat your opponent when there is no chance for u. The most inventive player must win... not the good old fellow which uses standard tactics ... more concerned about what the other good old boys will think about him than about the win
Quote:
I am not saying avoid using creative ways of winning a battle, I am just saying that there are SOME spells and tactics that can be used and exploited that give an overwhelming advantage and possiblly an edge or win that other wise wouldnt be possible.
For example, I personally refuse to use Sanctuary any more in battle no matter what map or situation. If I lose then I lose. But a win is not that important to me that I gotta resort to ANY tactic.
1. possibilitys are various
2. there are no creature map balanced enough.and it wont be
3. couse H4 is build up for barbars
4. and cruisader sucks
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MSG-1-1
Known Hero
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posted June 29, 2003 10:38 AM |
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I might agree on banning retreat, im still upset about that game i lost to kenny, me winning the battle , he retreating and finishing me off... I like final battles...no cat chase after the big battle.
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the_teacher
Supreme Hero
Talk to the hand!
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posted June 29, 2003 02:58 PM |
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against no one
have any of you thought of banning sanctuary ?
i guess not. yo should make a new thread about this.
The game is nice the way it is. far better, regarding balance , tactics, design , strategy, etc, than h3 that i love it with a big minus to transfer , though.
I read jinxer writing about having 2 divine intervention and other harcore stuff in the army. If one of the players could reach such a level of development i assume that the opponent will not have lvl4-5 heroes and only few lvl 1-2 creatures in his stack. I think 2 gm priests and a big demonologist guy , tactician could have hard time agaisnt 4 sorcerers gm with desintegrate and cloud of confusion maybe with a combat hero for back-up , even if they would cast sanctuary, divine nterventionhas almost no point, etc. ( those sorcerers could be mages with hypno/berserk as well) . As you can see , I'm reffering to those maps where you can easily reach high levels , big and reach maps, with timed gates (day 50 first stage ...)
Regarding the other one is hard to talk about lvl 5 spells, because i think its a great joy to reach master tops. Everything has something to be countered it by, but it depends on your strategy, and inspiration, that is 30% from winning.
Inspiration means to choose heroes that can take maximum advantage from artifacts you got during game
I must admit that sometimes snow happens , and it's possible to have the ultimate bad luck in getting skills or artifacts and the other one gets only stuff that fit like a glove. But these cases are very seldom, and could affect only a fight between players with almost same skill.
Note. All i wrote above starts with IMHO
have a nice day
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Arangar
Famous Hero
Weak ranger - lost viking
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posted June 29, 2003 04:36 PM |
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all in the magic post above
made perfect sense
IMHO
Arangar
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Arangar
Norwegian viking
ranger of the north
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valkyrica
Supreme Hero
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posted June 29, 2003 07:58 PM |
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IMHO Jinxer can start playing checkers, he will be safe there, kinda like in a sanctuary
now on a serious note, i wrote it before, and i will do it again, if one has 2,3 gm magic heroes and the other has 1 master one and a bunch of advanced ones of course the first seems like an unstoppable force, maps are usually equal for both sides, and if players are same level they should have equally powerful heroes, or about the same .
IMHO IMHO IMHO IMHO IMHO IMHO IMHO IMHO IMHO IMHO IMHO IMHO
yes, yes, I know Jinxer, TOSS is all i do ... *yawn*
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I'm Guybrush Threepwood, mighty pirate
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Tc_Fear
Famous Hero
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posted June 29, 2003 08:19 PM |
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that's what we are talkin about(maybe)...
sanctuary kill's thouse equal
but I donot mind
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