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| Thread: Manifest for monster redesign |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 · NEXT» |
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vladpopescu79
Promising
Famous Hero
a vampire of taste
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posted April 05, 2005 08:04 PM |
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Poll Question:
Manifest for monster redesign
There's nothing else I can think of but asking other people who dislike what Ubi has made of dedicated or not-so-dedicated characters of the heroes world to join me and vote against them. This has never worked, meaning that companies have never taken any advice from the forums, starting with 3do. There is still time for major redesign (hell, if I'd be a designer I'd make enough characters for 2 sequels in one year).
So, this is for all who hate, do not like, slightly dislike, are indifferent, like or love those monsters: vote here and have them changed/unchanged for the better, it will cost you nothing.
Message for Nival is:
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MANE, TEKEL, FARES
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IYY
Responsible
Supreme Hero
REDACTED
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posted April 05, 2005 08:08 PM |
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Bah, they look fine, take a chill pill.
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vladpopescu79
Promising
Famous Hero
a vampire of taste
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posted April 05, 2005 08:12 PM |
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I'm out of them, can you give me some of yours? What do you take? 
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MANE, TEKEL, FARES
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IYY
Responsible
Supreme Hero
REDACTED
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posted April 05, 2005 08:27 PM |
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Such discussions are unfit for a PG-13 forum 
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gerdash
Responsible
Famous Hero
from the Animated Peace
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posted April 05, 2005 08:32 PM |
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Quote:
join me and vote against them.
i'll try to estimate that you will get about 1:10 (bad:good) votes at best. so what are you trying to show exactly? you know, all this excitement and no alternative creature graphics.
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companies have never taken any advice from the forums
quite sure that you cannot say 'any'
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There is still time for major redesign
i am afraid that the possible benefit that would come from redesign might be less than the cost of redesigning.
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(hell, if I'd be a designer I'd make enough characters for 2 sequels in one year)
you mean, pen and paper or in 3d?
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Lord_Woock
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Daddy Cool with a $90 smile
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posted April 05, 2005 09:04 PM |
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Complete with animations, textures...
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vladpopescu79
Promising
Famous Hero
a vampire of taste
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posted April 05, 2005 09:17 PM |
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I was expecting that you might ask that. What I do might have two outcomes (although I expect indeed that most people are satisfied with the graphics - in fact, they'll take anything you give them, that's the explanation for some succesful games on the market with no real merits): a) majority agrees with me (improbable) and Nival can descend and take a look or b) majority disagrees (hopefully not a 1:10 ratio, otherwise mankind progress is at risk ) and that confirms some of my thinking. Either way, I lose nothing.
If I replace "any" with "maybe 10% of good ideas" will that work better for the company?
Well, I think Nival is in Russia, right? I've seen your profile, so you know what I'm talking about when I tell you that you only need ridiculous sums of money to hire some graphic designers with common sense and a couple of computer geeks to render the sketches in 3D for a year.
Don't argue about the costs, because costs are not that high. At least the sketch part worths 2 months' salary, and that's for sure. (In fact, I'm pretty sure that if you post it on the jobmarket, some people will offer to work for free knowing that this is for H5. )
As about myself, I could draw them (maybe not on paper, I have modest skills in Corel, even though MS Paint is enough) and it would not take me more than a couple of months.
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MANE, TEKEL, FARES
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vladpopescu79
Promising
Famous Hero
a vampire of taste
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posted April 05, 2005 10:34 PM |
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for IYY
IYY, I hope you recognize these words:
"So here's the thing. Ubisoft should have their artists study the art of H2 and the designs for each creature, and try to make something that looks like that. Then maybe the rest will follow."
You of all people decided that the creatures look OK and to tell me to chill?
And lingering on old threads, here is a prophecy from Lordskeleton:
"My only fear is that they'll do the Wc3/Warhammer thingy with grotesquely muscled soldiers, or in other ways blow selected bodyparts out of proportion. It does NOT befit the Heroes series."
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MANE, TEKEL, FARES
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Gerdash
Responsible
Famous Hero
from the Animated Peace
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posted April 06, 2005 11:14 AM |
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by the time i posted my previous post the most positive vote was 'keep and try to do better next time', so.. interesting.
btw i must say that if you should accidentally get the suggetsion for redesign from this poll, the wording of the last and most positive choice puts you at a difficult position when you try to claim that your poll was objective.
myself was between 'redesign monsters' and 'keep and try to do better next time', thanks for reminding that the orders of magnitude of salaries may be somewhat different. so this must be a political rather than exonomical decision and it might as well be that the nice landscape is probably what went out of ubi's control.
btw i really cannot understand 'modify some monsters', in my opinion the concept that all the creatures seem to follow is bad.
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what is the safest way to pass your time? heroes community -- your posts won't affect almost anything
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Ellderon
Adventuring Hero
Lightbringer
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posted April 06, 2005 12:18 PM |
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I'm wondering...does anyone from 3DO actualyl ever look inot this forums?
all these suggestion and discussions are pointless if they don't even cast a glance this way...
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elen síla lúmenn' omentielvo
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Daddy
Responsible
Supreme Hero
and why not.
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posted April 06, 2005 07:25 PM |
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Edited By: Daddy on 6 Apr 2005
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Quote:
I'm wondering...does anyone from 3DO actualyl ever look inot this forums?
all these suggestion and discussions are pointless if they don't even cast a glance this way...
I guss, you mean Ubisoft
Well, you can also post in their Forum...
http://forums.ubi.com/eve/ubb.x?a=frm&s=400102&f=1851065692
reg
Daddy
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vladpopescu79
Promising
Famous Hero
a vampire of taste
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posted April 06, 2005 09:27 PM |
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Quote:
the wording of the last and most positive choice puts you at a difficult position when you try to claim that your poll was objective.
the nice landscape is probably what went out of ubi's control.
btw i really cannot understand 'modify some monsters', in my opinion the concept that all the creatures seem to follow is bad.
Well, here is something objective: 142 views of the thread and 12 votes. It seems very close to the 1:10 ratio that you anticipated and it should be like that since my poll, as you remarked, and as I agree, was biased. Probably those who just looked were the satisfied category. So there is the objectivity. Personally, I don't want to be objective.
I didn't really understand what you meant in the last part of your post, but if you were to ask me, I'd hope that at least some of the monsters will be enjoyable to watch. At this moment all are crapy so any change is for the better. (I pray alongside that the landscape will be further "ignored" by Ubi. too bad that Heroes as a whole could not be ignored by the same ignominious company)
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MANE, TEKEL, FARES
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IYY
Responsible
Supreme Hero
REDACTED
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posted April 07, 2005 10:40 PM |
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Quote:
for IYY
IYY, I hope you recognize these words:
"So here's the thing. Ubisoft should have their artists study the art of H2 and the designs for each creature, and try to make something that looks like that. Then maybe the rest will follow."
You of all people decided that the creatures look OK and to tell me to chill?
Yes, and I think they did a pretty good job. Not a great one, but definatly better than H4. Some creatures (like the mounted hero) look better than H3. The angel is the only one I don't really like, and the demons look a bit boring, but other than that I think that their designs are pretty good.
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vladpopescu79
Promising
Famous Hero
a vampire of taste
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posted April 07, 2005 11:32 PM |
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Quote:
Yes, and I think they did a pretty good job. Not a great one, but definatly better than H4. Some creatures (like the mounted hero) look better than H3. The angel is the only one I don't really like, and the demons look a bit boring, but other than that I think that their designs are pretty good.
I kindly ask any of you who knows how to work with pictures to put side by side the champion from the H3 and the mounted hero of H5. Please do that so we can have a real start for a serious comparison. I believe the image will speak for itself.
if you take the angel and the demons out of the picture, what is left? the fairy on the mushrooms...
we should not set an example of H4 because that was just as awful in graphics as this one. So far, the 3D revolution has burned everything that it touched in Heroes.
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MANE, TEKEL, FARES
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Lord_Woock
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Daddy Cool with a $90 smile
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posted April 07, 2005 11:42 PM |
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What I don't see the point of is comparing the H5 hero with the H3 champion. What next? Comparing the H2 goblin to the H4 zombie (if there is one, never played the game so I wouldn't know)?
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Devareaux
Tavern Dweller
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posted April 08, 2005 01:42 AM |
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I've warmed up on them, I think they look fine... when I first looked at the screenshots though, I was like "Nooo... not WoWish!" But they're not... they're alot better than that garbage/style of characters 
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vladpopescu79
Promising
Famous Hero
a vampire of taste
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posted April 08, 2005 05:21 PM |
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Quote:
What I don't see the point of is comparing the H5 hero with the H3 champion. What next? Comparing the H2 goblin to the H4 zombie (if there is one, never played the game so I wouldn't know)?
Because they're both mounted and fully combat dressed. We don't have yet the image of the cavalier in H5 so the best we can do about style is to compare what we have. It's enough, though. Now, in turn, what relation do you see between the goblin and the zombie? You must have one, because irony works only when based on something...
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MANE, TEKEL, FARES
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Lord_Woock
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Daddy Cool with a $90 smile
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posted April 08, 2005 05:24 PM |
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Both are low level weaklings that were greenish at some point in the series
Now really, if the HoMM3 mounted heroes didn't look anything like the champions from the same game, then how can you expect that kind of relation between the H3 champion and an H5 hero?
EDIT: rephrased first sentence
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vladpopescu79
Promising
Famous Hero
a vampire of taste
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posted April 08, 2005 10:29 PM |
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Quote:
Both are low level weaklings that were greenish at some point in the series
Now really, if the HoMM3 mounted heroes didn't look anything like the champions from the same game, then how can you expect that kind of relation between the H3 champion and an H5 hero?
EDIT: rephrased first sentence
He, that was a good one. I guess they have two legs and two arms, too, both of them....
I can expect anything really... because if you compare the levels of detail from the map and battlescreen of H3 you can tell a difference. If you compare the style of the same shots of H5, they're very alike (suppose what we have here are indeed map and battlescreens, though I doubt it a little).
H3 heroes were still very schematic compared to H4 for instance. I suppose those were the limitations at that time. There was more freedom in the battlescreen, I don't know why; all I know is that creatures were far better looking than heroes.
in h5 they're not. they're on the same level of details so you can compare this time. Once again, I base my comparisons on the assumption that what we have here is the hero (and it should be, since it looks nothing like the cavalier in the artwork).
If you put aside the graphic level of detail (H3 creatures for instance were slightly blured, H5 ones are very sharp) the style is what matters (to me).
I guess it all comes down back to toon or non-toon. The h3 champion is "for real", the h5 hero is just a toon character. know what I mean?
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MANE, TEKEL, FARES
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IYY
Responsible
Supreme Hero
REDACTED
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posted April 08, 2005 11:42 PM |
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Edited By: IYY on 8 Apr 2005
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Quote:
Quote:
Yes, and I think they did a pretty good job. Not a great one, but definatly better than H4. Some creatures (like the mounted hero) look better than H3. The angel is the only one I don't really like, and the demons look a bit boring, but other than that I think that their designs are pretty good.
I kindly ask any of you who knows how to work with pictures to put side by side the champion from the H3 and the mounted hero of H5. Please do that so we can have a real start for a serious comparison. I believe the image will speak for itself.
if you take the angel and the demons out of the picture, what is left? the fairy on the mushrooms...
we should not set an example of H4 because that was just as awful in graphics as this one. So far, the 3D revolution has burned everything that it touched in Heroes.
Here you go:
I'd say that the H2 cavalier still looks better, but the H4 one is the next best. The H3 one looks nearly as bad as the H4 one, to be honest. And the flag looks very good in comparisson to the little blue flag in H2 and the complete lack of flag in H3.
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