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| Thread: Advanced Classes |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 · «PREV |
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted October 25, 2006 07:37 AM |
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You are very right that the chances of acquiring the Alchemist class is small - probably too small for the Wizard - but I see no problem with the game favoring one class over the other - after all, the current classes are inclined to one of the sides, and it would be natural for this class to be most inclined to stay in this site. However, the Wizard is an extreme example, because this class is VERY focused on Magic and only Magic, which makes it almost impossible to get Alchemist status - and that might probably need a little tweaking.
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Sindbad
Famous Hero
The lost soul
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posted October 25, 2006 02:54 PM |
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Well, I disagree with this! Each of the available classes ought to be accesible at same chance! For example, the Alchemist - what do you see so *mighty* on him? A wizard could possibly become one, why not? Makes sense to me! Therefore I suggest changing the percents of availability of the skills needed for each class.
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted October 25, 2006 03:56 PM |
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Of course there should be a reasonable possibility of getting to both classes - but I don't think the Wizard should have equal chances of having all 12 Skills - he is a Magician, so of course most of the Magic skills will come easier to him than the Might skills, which will favor Sage over Alchemist. So, some tweaking would be in place, but I don't see a need for 100 % equality - that would make the original class seem very unrealistic to me.
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Sindbad
Famous Hero
The lost soul
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posted October 25, 2006 04:56 PM |
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Edited by Sindbad at 09:34, 28 Oct 2006.
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Well I didnt mean to have all 12 skills having an equal chance of learning, just that the skills that are need to achieve the class should be equal. For example:
-Alchemist - needs war machines (11% chance) and sorcery (14% chance) - average 12.5%
-Sage - needs learning (15%) and light magic (10%) - average 12.5%
(dont take this seriously, just as example)
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cantaresg
Known Hero
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posted October 28, 2006 03:21 AM |
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If the chance of getting a class more easily than another, everyone will be using one class more than another, purely due to skill restrictions. That's why I had hoped for skill independence in the decision of advance classes. The player gets to choose the advance classes he desires, and receives bonuses accordingly.
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Sindbad
Famous Hero
The lost soul
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posted October 28, 2006 09:37 AM |
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Yes, thats exactly what I meant. If one class would be easier to get, nobody will choose the other one. The other one would be chosen only if it was more powerful than the common one. And thats out of control - the classes should be equal! Equal in power and in availability!
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted October 28, 2006 09:52 PM |
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Well, I think you're missing a point here: If all the Advanced Classes should be equally accessible, you'd have to have equal propability of all the Skills, or at least most of them. That would essentially make all the Basic Classes very much similar, just with a different name! Sure, there'd be different starting skills and Class Skills and stat progression, but the differentiation between Skills available is for me a large part of what makes each class unique, and that would dissapear. Therefore, I'd vouch for staying with the present system with a few modifications. I will give my 5 cents for an Advanced Class system in a different topic (here).
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Vlaad
Admirable
Legendary Hero
ghost of the past
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posted October 28, 2006 10:59 PM |
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Edited by Vlaad at 23:07, 28 Oct 2006.
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Quote:
Well, I think you're missing a point here: If all the Advanced Classes should be equally accessible, you'd have to have equal propability of all the Skills, or at least most of them. That would essentially make all the Basic Classes very much similar, just with a different name! Sure, there'd be different starting skills and Class Skills and stat progression, but the differentiation between Skills available is for me a large part of what makes each class unique, and that would dissapear. Therefore, I'd vouch for staying with the present system with a few modifications.
I agree, but he may have a point. Certain advanced classes would become too hard to reach. Perhaps the solution would be creating three advanced classes for each basic class. For example, a Demon Lord with three magic skills on Expert level would become a Fury, with three magic skills he'd be promoted to a Heretic, while a mixed set of skills (two might and one magic or vice versa) would grant him the Seer status.
How would it work? A level 8 Ranger with high Defense and Knowledge would benefit from becoming a Sharpshooter (higher chance to get an attack bonus), a Warden (spellpower) or Sentry (equal chance to get attack or spellpower).
The one-time bonus could be similar to the existing abilities (e.g. +10% to damage) or unique, such as Stealth. If we were talking about WoG or H4, this system would be actually easy to script. Any further suggestions would be interesting. 
As for the quest-based classes, such system may be reserved for Sylvan only; the existing Avenger's Guild seems convenient...
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted October 28, 2006 11:25 PM |
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Well ... It would make an awfull lot of different classes, which would require an awfull lot of skill developing - trust me, I've been through the whole mill here.
My suggestion would be: Stick to 2 Advanced Classes. However, tweak skill progressions for Wizard and Knight, so that all classes have at least 3 Skills in each group with 8 % probability or more (we could even say at least one at 10 % and two at 8 %). With the 8 % restriction, minimum propability of one group is: (2 + 2 + 2 + 8 + 8 + 8)/90 = 33 %. That means propability of not getting offered one of the skills from that group in 3 level ups is a mere 30 %. This means, that 70 % of the times, you'll get an option from the "rare" group within your first 3 level ups, and 85 % of the times within the first 5 level-ups. Even if you choose one of the skills at 8 %, there's a 60 % chance that you'll get ANOTHER skill from this group within your NEXT 3 level ups. Picking again an 8 % skill, there will be some 45 % chance that you get a THIRD skill from this group within your next 3 levels ups! That means - plenty of propability for getting 3 Skills from this group - numbers increase significantly, if you're patient, and start picking some Abilities (which you probably will) besides maxing out your skills!
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Vlaad
Admirable
Legendary Hero
ghost of the past
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posted January 02, 2007 06:14 PM |
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Edited by Vlaad at 18:15, 02 Jan 2007.
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Quote:
Well ... It would make an awfull lot of different classes, which would require an awfull lot of skill developing - trust me, I've been through the whole mill here.
Excellent work.
Quote:
My suggestion would be: Stick to 2 Advanced Classes. However, tweak skill progressions for Wizard and Knight, so that all classes have at least 3 Skills in each group with 8 % probability or more (we could even say at least one at 10 % and two at 8 %). With the 8 % restriction, minimum propability of one group is: (2 + 2 + 2 + 8 + 8 + 8)/90 = 33 %. That means propability of not getting offered one of the skills from that group in 3 level ups is a mere 30 %. This means, that 70 % of the times, you'll get an option from the "rare" group within your first 3 level ups, and 85 % of the times within the first 5 level-ups. Even if you choose one of the skills at 8 %, there's a 60 % chance that you'll get ANOTHER skill from this group within your NEXT 3 level ups. Picking again an 8 % skill, there will be some 45 % chance that you get a THIRD skill from this group within your next 3 levels ups! That means - plenty of propability for getting 3 Skills from this group - numbers increase significantly, if you're patient, and start picking some Abilities (which you probably will) besides maxing out your skills!
Ugh, my head hurts.  Truth be told, I won't go there since my Maths paper usually looked like this:
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted January 02, 2007 06:20 PM |
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Ugh, my head hurts. Truth be told, I won't go there since my Maths paper usually looked like this:
Ha ha ha - if you've been spending all that time away from this post just to come up with that answer I'd say - yes, you should probably quite the mathmatics. 
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Vlaad
Admirable
Legendary Hero
ghost of the past
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posted January 02, 2007 06:25 PM |
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Ha ha ha - if you've been spending all that time away from this post just to come up with that answer I'd say - yes, you should probably quite the mathmatics.
Nah, I'm an English teacher... and you've just made a spelling mistake! 
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted January 02, 2007 06:27 PM |
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Quote:
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Ha ha ha - if you've been spending all that time away from this post just to come up with that answer I'd say - yes, you should probably quite the mathmatics.
Nah, I'm an English teacher... and you've just made a spelling mistake!
Touché ... Suppose I should quit the board then and return to my math and physics. 
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Vlaad
Admirable
Legendary Hero
ghost of the past
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posted January 02, 2007 06:40 PM |
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Edited by Vlaad at 18:40, 02 Jan 2007.
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Quote:
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Ha ha ha - if you've been spending all that time away from this post just to come up with that answer I'd say - yes, you should probably quite the mathmatics.
Nah, I'm an English teacher... and you've just made a spelling mistake!
Touché ... Suppose I should quit the board then and return to my math and physics.
In my opinion, you're the best H5 poster, so don't even joke about it! (<--- Brownie point of the month LOL)
Now let's stop spamming this great topic. 
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