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Heroes Community > Tournament of Honor > Thread: - New Map: Twilight World -
Thread: - New Map: Twilight World - This thread is 6 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 · «PREV / NEXT»
fiur
fiur


Promising
Supreme Hero
Map Creator
posted February 02, 2009 11:43 AM

Quote:
And Fiur, what a marvelous job you've done with that uber creature, Balrog! Really full of imagination! You have my utmost respect as a great modder!



ty Duncan

I'm currently finished another "creature mod job" for another magnificent map maker (read Insatiable)
this time I've made 6 custom creatures for his upcoming map....
and it's gonna be great fun trust me....  

so far I've made lots of mods (and a few maps.. 6 in total so far)
maybe I gonna make 7'th map also not sure yet.....
it's getting harder and harder to overcome my latest maps now...


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Zilonite
Zilonite


Famous Hero
posted February 07, 2009 02:00 PM

Quote:
3. I'd like to hear comments from those who've played might factions such as Haven/Sylvan/Fortress. What is the earliest week you can break through? My impression is that magic factions (Inferno included due to their gating ability) have the upper hand in this map, because breaking is critical in the game. You cannot turtle. Summoning skill is also important, especially to take down Balrog.


It depends on what you mean by "break through" As far as my experience in series of games vs. Kisp goes, there is no single "right" pass to go, in some games you go one way, in some games another way..

If you want to stand at least some chances against very good player (like Kispagat), schedule looks something like this:

day 3-5 - capturing shipyard
day 8-11 - break to mine zone
then things usually vary from game to game but in general:
week 4 or 5 - break to the center and/or taking out 5 balrogs garnizon
week 5 or 6 - taking out weakest center garnizons
week 6 or 7 - taking out anything

Schedule is the same for all factions, since all factions have roughly equal chances here.


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DrOwnage
DrOwnage


Adventuring Hero
posted February 08, 2009 08:33 AM

Quote:
..., since all factions have roughly equal chances here.




I think it's the most balanced map that's momentarily out there, a bit in favor of light magic though.
I was wondering if the boost for inferno shouldn't be greater, because inferno is sooo weak on any map. I mean for example in the end fight your units get mostly blasted or torn to shreds before they can summon something.
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Zilonite
Zilonite


Famous Hero
posted April 02, 2009 07:03 PM

Here goes 1.7 version of the map:

Twilight World (version 1.7)

Again, changes from previous version are not major, mostly only balace tweaking:
- added 2 sky-daughters and replaced 5 gobs with 35 gob-trapers in mine zone garnizon
- changed creature growth rate per week: sylvan hunters - 1 (from 7 to 6) and dungeon riders +1 (from 4 to 5)
- banned Ythlin and Helmar
- minimaly reduced gems and added sulfur in mine zone
- replaced stack of vampire lords (in the center, guading magic shop and major artie) with simple vampires, but increased their average number (now its random between 270-720 on day 1)
- updated Twilight pdf guide-file (included in the zip file)

Have fun!

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Elit
Elit


Famous Hero
posted April 02, 2009 07:19 PM
Edited by Elit at 19:20, 02 Apr 2009.

Quote:
Here goes 1.7 version of the map:

Twilight World (version 1.7)

- changed creature growth rate per week: sylvan hunters - 1 (from 7 to 6) and dungeon riders +1 (from 4 to 5)
- banned Ythlin and Helmar
Have fun!


I juts start like map and you want to kill it with "balances" like it.

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Fraudatio
Fraudatio


Famous Hero
posted April 02, 2009 09:42 PM

Dear Elit, myself, and probably most others, would be happy to play version 1.6 with you, so just keep that:-)

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DrOwnage
DrOwnage


Adventuring Hero
posted April 03, 2009 09:26 PM

Banning Ythlin was right. I played her once vs academy and she is definitly the most broken hero on this map with regen from the start + 2 unicorns.

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infinitus
infinitus


Supreme Hero
posted April 04, 2009 10:27 AM

Author of map have the right to ban staff, players have the right to ban maps that use tons of modded content and banned staff ... To me good mapmaker is mapmaker that know how to create balanced map without banning content ... Thanks god i can find opponents to play on non modded maps
____________
Nothing's impossible

http://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=loCSLJ6IodY

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Jinxer
Jinxer


Legendary Hero
*****
posted April 06, 2009 04:46 AM
Edited by Jinxer at 04:54, 06 Apr 2009.

Quote:
To me good mapmaker is mapmaker that know how to create balanced map without banning content


Well its impossible.. since UBI didnt make the game balanced. They made this game based around single player mode and campaigns.. multiplayer was no where on the table when concepts of this game was being designed. When you are playing Single or campaigns.. who cares about Balance? Balance doesnt matter.  So Mapmakers fill the gaps on balance that Drunk UBI didnt take the time to contemplate.

And for the record... even you Infinitus dont believe this game is 100% Balanced... otherwise you would choose Random Hero and Random town when you play..    
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Towerlord
Towerlord


Promising
Supreme Hero
Hero of Good, Slayer of Evil
posted April 06, 2009 10:22 AM

I think free regeneration and 2 light unicorns are turning Yilthin and Helmar from strong late game heroes to superheroes, but the solution to that is not removing those two from the map, but instead, removing free regen and unicorns and weakening(removing) starting garrisons
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Warmonger
Warmonger


Promising
Legendary Hero
fallen artist
posted April 06, 2009 02:39 PM

Quote:
They made this game based around single player mode and campaigns.

I think exactly opposite as single player has too many unjustified limitations and lacks features H3 and H4 had. They were meant to balance the game for fast skirmishes with medium-level heroes and shortage of treasures.

After all these games we come to conlusion that H5 simply sucks, don't we?

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Zilo
Zilo


Promising
Adventuring Hero
posted May 28, 2009 02:29 PM
Edited by Zilo at 14:32, 28 May 2009.


Under the brand of "Wise Dwarf" now and then I will post some short tips and replays on what to expect from and how to deal with "Twilight World". Other Twilight veterans are welcomed to share their experiences as well

First things first - so first week of the game.

Your main task during first days of the game is to clear starting island and prepare for the shipyard battle. Main trick here is to use always-joining 2 pristine unicorns and regenaration combination to maximum. Those 2 ponnies can do miracles, if you use them wisely (as can be seen from this replay)

Vinrael v. crossbowmen

Yet be very carefull, sometimes entering battle with ponnies only can lead to suicide, they are not immortal

Some other general tips here:
Be very carefull with mana, you will need way more then you will have it. Therefore good idea might be to plan your route so that you can visit +1 knowledge booster and magic well afterwards.
If you are playing with inferno, get Consume Corpse ability as fast as you can.

I usually play first week with an ultimate aim to register lvl 6 dwell till the end of the week. But even with different plans, getting to shipyard very early is of ultimate importance. So in day 4 or 5 shipyard attack should be done.

Here are few samples, how those battles can be played. They are not uber-perfect, but just give the idea how the battle can go on.

Shipyard battles

Some general tips here:
If you are defending garnizon against hero with warmachines skill, it might be good idea to split gremlin saboteurs in 2 stacks. Don'g forget that ammo cart can be sabotaged as well (this is really evil trick against dwarves )
Otherwise good option is to use one separate minotaur stack that can boost morale of nearby units.
If you are attacking garnizon, usually defensive strategy with focusing on protecting your shooters works the best.
Be really carefull with your 2 ponnies here, don't miss the time when regenaration is casted

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Zilo
Zilo


Promising
Adventuring Hero
posted May 30, 2009 12:07 PM
Edited by Zilo at 21:51, 26 Jun 2009.



Some ideas how to approach mine zone garnizon.

Expected time when to try it out is about mid-week 2 and by that time this garnizon is capable of showing some really nasty surprizes, if you take it too lightly (especially since in 1.7 of the map the garnizon is slightly boosted).

This time collection of the replays serves as a sort of warning not to take it all too lightly
Mine zone garnizon - The Dark Side

On a general note, this garnizon battle somewhat reminds the first Moria-battle from the Fellowship of the Ring movie: there are some small goblin-orc-wolves running around, yet in the center of the whole thing is cave troll (in our case - 3 untamed cyclops) Those 3 not-too-bright fellas can deal quite a punch, very often way greater then one expects.

So the first thing here is to know whom they actually gonna hit:



Some more tips for defenders:
Don't forget to split your forces! This time there are 2 free slots that provide pretty great variety to your battle strategy. Most likely splitting combos include:
- 3 stacks of sky-daughters (most likely combo)
- 3 stacks of wolves (good option e.g. against inferno, so u can take down those single stacks fast and clear the way for clopes)
- 2 (or even 3) stacks of goblins

Those clopes can throw some goblins, so, if you want to do some damage right away, teach those goblins how to fly

And those clops can eat goblins, too. Guess, everyone knows that one. Yet the catch is that clopes can eat enemy goblins as well (this might cause a nasty surprize in fight against orcs)

If you plan to cast series of slow/haste with your skydaughters and attacker still has those 2 pristine ponnies good idea is to cast all haste's first and then put slow on ponnies.

In most cases haste/slow combo is the way to go with skydaughters, yet sometimes it is worth considering to get more mana in order to cast chainlightning. The damage output is not that great, but it can be usefull to take out several of those 1-unit stacks with a single move.

Some more tips for garnizon breakers:
In most cases best strategy here is to rely on your lvl 6 stack and regeneration and avoid bringing to battlefield small and vulnerable units (like archers or imps). Yet getting in with only 4 pit fiends or thanes is hell risky, especially if the mana pool is low and if your hero don't have warmachines/light magic perk.

Those clopes present danger not only to your units but to their fellow goblin/wolves brotherhood, too. So always watch for the possibility to hit those fat dumbasses with your single stacks in a way that retaliation hits some wolves or earth elems as well.


When you are done with mine zone (in very good games its early week 3), its time to decide what to do next. Your primary targets now are 3 mega-dwellings on the map. However, since all 3 dwells are in different places on the map and all are guarded pretty hard, the choice where to go should be made carefully.

First thing at this point is to tame your greed and convince yourself that you can't get everything Basically this means that you should plan your route the way that suits best to the town you are playing and to the spells/skills you have, aiming to get 2 megadwells before going to the center.

Necro garnizon
Relatively easiest garnizon, especially if you have storm wind or mass slow. Yet in fact this one has caused the most suicides of all 3 If that bunch of ghosts gets into action or if the death knights special trigger, things can turn out pretty bad for attacker.

Necro garnizon

Fire garnizon
Triksy one - total damage output here is not that big, but the catch is that this damage will land very swift. From defenders point of view, obvious choice here is to split dwarven fire-ball priests. If you will manage to put the mark of fire on and, even more, land gargs nearby, those fireballs will deal incredible amount of damage. Good choice to go there with towns that has some weapons against fire damage (like Fortress, Academy, Inferno).

Fire garnizon

Balrog garnizon
This one is the triksiest of them all, especially if you haven't encounter balrogs before. Few things to notice about those beauties:
Balrogs have storm strike ability, which means that damage can be dealt to several targets and protecting your shooters is harder then usual
Balrogs are dark magic masters, so splitting them in several stacks is must have (in order to put max dark magic on attacker stacks)
sometimes Balrogs can put frenzy as well with their attack, so, if possible, you should take into account that thing

Yet Balrogs are not immortal as well and and are really vulnerable to things that always kill at least one unit. So, if you are playing with towns like Dungeon or Academy (cold death from destructive magic), Necro (harm touch) or Inferno (vorpal sword), they might go down pretty easy.

Balrog garnizon

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Zilo
Zilo


Promising
Adventuring Hero
posted June 12, 2009 01:57 PM
Edited by Zilo at 15:12, 27 Jun 2009.

Inspired by the discussion on possible map improvements, decided not to wait any longer with 1.8 version of the map. You can download it here:

Twilight World (version 1.8)

Changes:
replaced Ressurection scrolls with Ressurection wands
decreased amount of wood in the starting area (replaced 2 preset wood piles on starting island with random resource piles + removed 3 woodpiles in the sea)
added two random lvl 1 spell shrines in front of the starting towns + added another two random lvl 1 spell shrines and preset Ice Bolt shrine in the spot nearby the entrance in the mine zone
replaced 4000 gold stacks near megadwellings with stacks of random resource (amount 40)
removed Earthquake from possible spell list + added scroll of Earthquake after last garnizon (nearby mentor in the center)
increased Staff of Netherworld garnizon guards (+140 paladins)
instead of -5 to goblins weekly growth its now +5 (30 goblins per week)
boosted chance for orc heroes to get warmachines skill

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Jinxer
Jinxer


Legendary Hero
*****
posted June 26, 2009 11:07 PM
Edited by Jinxer at 00:20, 27 Jun 2009.

Quote:

increased Staff of Netherworld garnizon guards (+140 paladins)




wouldnt matter if you made it 400 Paladins.. with Dark Magic that garrison can be taken.  Now maybe replace 140 paladins with 65 Black Dragons. Make the reward COST something. Sacrifice some army to balance out the silly initiative boost.


Also if you insist on leaving them BOTH in and soo close.. you should also increase the guards in the RING Garrison.. The rewards behind that garrison with the 3 artifact merchants and ring and blind immune helm is HUGE. But again just my opinion..

At anyrate I will wait on the 1.9 Bus...  
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Elit
Elit


Famous Hero
posted June 27, 2009 06:01 AM

Quote:
Inspired by the discussion on possible map improvements, decided not to wait any longer with 1.8 version of the map. You can download it here:

Twilight World (version 1.8)

Changes:
replaced Ressurection scrolls with Ressurection wands



I cant understand why? Look prety bad change.

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Towerlord
Towerlord


Promising
Supreme Hero
Hero of Good, Slayer of Evil
posted June 27, 2009 07:54 AM

I am guessing , it's done in order to be able to equip tome + ress

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DrOwnage
DrOwnage


Adventuring Hero
posted June 27, 2009 08:45 AM

WM change and Earthquake out are good. Now i can play somebody else than Telsek
Rest looks okay, but i wonder if dungeon wont be even more powerful than it was before with that wand ...

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Elit
Elit


Famous Hero
posted June 27, 2009 09:15 AM

Quote:
I am guessing , it's done in order to be able to equip tome + ress


Maybe you are right...but wand is limited for use. Maybe 2 cast max ? So if i dont get resurect killing barlogs for get tome can be very hard.
Maybe only new games can prof are its good or bad change. Rest look OK.

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Strider_HL
Strider_HL


Famous Hero
posted June 27, 2009 09:42 AM

Wands are brilliant idea. They have 6 casts and can be refilled at castle. Needless to remind that casts are without actual consumption of mana. There are several arguments behind this change but the final conclusion can be reached only via tests.

Anyway, change log is quite innovative per se and opens a range of tactical opportunities. Well done, Zilo

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