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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted July 29, 2001 10:32 PM |
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I am very impressed how Yawacko gives credence only to players figuring in High ranks. Shut up, Crag, you are far from that skill. This remembers me Jex's posts, where sometimes the only answer was acording to difference of rank between him and his (words) opponent.I think arguments should be different, specially when knowing that Craig Hack already were a skilled heroes player by the time when Wacko even hadn't a computer.
I am not trying to deconsiderate Wacko or Jex, they are very skilled players, without doubt. Just sometimes they have to remember us their wins/loss to give themselves the last word.Is this the goal of those threads?
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted July 29, 2001 10:47 PM |
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this to Jinxer
Ok, Junkieser, he overplayed you by hiring an archangel and winning the game. But how? You forget to tell us the he proved anyway high skills, by building lev 5 mage guild, by having enough spell power to kill 7(!) of your lev 7 creatures. This should be around 25 spell power, but if I am wrong the argument could be the choice of maps in ToH.
It seems to me that building lev 5 mage guild and having 25+ power on a NORMAL map is the proof you played a master.
If only that ugly archangel helped him to win, besides the fact he found (maybe) tome of earth and titan cuirass, that proves that map was able to give to one of you that big luck. So, why to complain?!
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CraigHack
Known Hero
Have fantasies, will travel...
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posted July 29, 2001 11:01 PM |
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Ability?
Actually old bud, I dont consider you a weak player at all. Matter of fact its not the weak players I am ranting about. Its the players who always find an excuse for their losses.
These may be weak or strong players but by and large they are bad losers. Anyone can be a good winner and I know its tougher to be a good loser but thats how all the rules got started. A player with some ability loses a game and suddenly he wants to prevent that from happening again by imposing some rules.
Ability cannot be judged solely on ToH rank. Some high ranked players got their rank by working hard and finding the possibilities within the game and others got their rank by playing favorite town/favorite hero/favorite map only and some just beat the hell out of a bunch of newbys. I dont mind any of these methods I have earned a few points by using all of them myself. But when you lose a game, get over it and move on. Quit trying to take away the loss by finding some reason why the other guy played unfairly!
Hit & Run, 4th level spell hero, lucky Artifact, Refugee camp, Mouse twitch, whatever..... move on.
If you shoulda won you woulda won.
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The Gods have brought us together... I can't imagine why.
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted July 29, 2001 11:16 PM |
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Salamadre --
I forgot to mention he picked up the EARTH Tomb as his random relic. SO he didnt even have to work to build a mage guild at all.
Anymore thoughts from you?
Jinxer
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jb239
Famous Hero
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posted July 29, 2001 11:17 PM |
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how I see it...
Who cares? 
play people with similar ideals or compromise...just stop the stupid Hit and Run arguements.
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Sha_Men
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jack-Of-No-Trades
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posted July 29, 2001 11:25 PM |
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Let me correct you...
Sorry to interrupt this "discussion" between "top" players...I myself haven't played in tournament but somehow I have opinion about this whole thing...
Craig Hack...
So you are saying that somebody comes up rules when he loses? And if he wins by this tactic he shouldn't be even complaining?
I think you should read the "honor..."thread and think what you feel when you won by tactic that feels unfair. It felt like that for me and despite the fact that I also try to defend those who want to play with tactic I don't find reason why I would put down players that win regularly and then are beaten by this tactic by saying that they are bad losers. Of course if they use the same tactic themselves to win and complain only when they lose, but if I got this right some players aren't even using it at all but have sometimes lost to it and I understand how they feel.
I think (if my opinion is nothing to oyu as my both win/lose charts shows total zero) there shouldn't be one tactic or game flaw that can be used so easily and cost effectively that all other ways to play the game comes very difficult to use or obsolete. Rulers are made because somebody feels that some part of game must be "shut down" as too powerful. This doesn't necessary mean that rulemaker is loser, he can be true winner but in the faceless internet community nobody earns respect without having some kind of number. Being nice isn't here enough. In this community post count and new star system seem to be the way to get some respect. Some people in internet have so big egos that they don't even listen other peoples opinions because they aren't given face to face. In tournament play it's easy to look win/lose chart and say that who's the king. This doesn't mean that this person should be respected, but it seems this is the case.
What I meaning to say (as I feel being pretty outsider now) is that it doesn't really help to get the element of who's good and who's weak to this discussion. It doesn't help at all because it seems that strong are here those who win by using any means at all. Those who don't use there means are considered as weak or just stupid.
I tried to understand you Craig Hack but now it's my time to give up. It seems that the one paragraph I wrote about players being greedy and stuff like that can be true with you too. Or is this the case?
Win through any means at all, Just Win, win, win!
No, that shouldn't be the case,
It should be:
win through honor and respect towards you opponent.
And at the same time have fun.
BTW Is hit'n'run really so fun to use?
I doubt it.
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Catch the vigorous horse of your mind.
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted July 29, 2001 11:27 PM |
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Crag, I was not complaining about my loss. LMAO. You obviously cant read. This thread title is Hit and Run. NOT I hate to lose here is why!
I was giving an example of how rediculous it is to have hitand run in this game. All it does it prove how HOMM3 is only about luck and not about skill. My record is like 127-90 I ahve tons of losses. Who cares I dont. But I do care about my time. Not worth wasting 5 hours of game play just to have a guy win becasue of 1 fast creature. As someone said in an earlier post I would have rather just gave him the win and saved my time in the beginning. But it is becomeing more and more obvious that you really have NO clue what your talking about, you just like sounding like you know something. So I am going to quit wasting my time with you also.
JB is right I will just stick with playing with others who enjoy the game as I do and wont worry about this hit and run debate.
Btw, JB you want a game? 
Jinxer
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Pandora
Honorable
Legendary Hero
The Chosen One
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posted July 29, 2001 11:58 PM |
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CraigHack, are you the same person we (yawacko and I) used to chat with on ICQ, from the Knights of War tournament? i'm not asking for any reason other than curiousity.
Sal, we did have a computer, we just weren't online and didn't play in Oracle - does that somehow mean that even tho we did play Heroes2 - we are clearly always to be considered lesser players? Yawacko's point was in naming known skilled players - not to list all and the only players of skill out there.it demonstrates that there is no need whatsover for this animosity between players who prefer a different style of play. In spite of the fact that they don't agree 100% on what is the best style of play for them, they can still play a game for the only reason to play..which is to have fun! If i misunderstood your post Sal sorry, you know i respect you and am not trying to sound as if i'm starting a fight with you
Honestly, i'm tired of this whole H&R debate, i think it's just sad that people can't accept it if someone else feels differently than them. To constantly throw around insults, and always look for some superficial way of saying you're better than someone else (ie: i made more posts, i have more ToH points, my comp is faster than your comp, my dad could beat up your dad - and oh yeah, he could!!!) is just childish - it would be nice to come read the board once in a while without having to wade thru this stuff.
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"In the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends."
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CraigHack
Known Hero
Have fantasies, will travel...
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posted July 29, 2001 11:59 PM |
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Let me get this right.....
Quote:
Anyways, I would concider myself a fairly skilled player. BY far not the best, but atleast knowlegable in the game. And recently I played in the Grandmasters tournamnet. Which is supposed to be a collection of the most skilled players in TOH. My opponent outplayed me big time! You know how? He moved his hero strategically to the refugee camp...then once entered it he seen an Arch Angel was there. Then this was the most unique and talented part he PURCHSED him! OMG, I was just floored at the awesomeness of his skill. Then since there was no recanters or shackles or speed artifacts around for me to take. Since those are always available according you you craigHack since it is soo easy to counter hit and run... I was then attacked but this Arch Angel and he Imploded 7 of my lvl 7 creatures and promply surrenderd. Bravo! Bravo!
This is not complaining about losing??? Sure looks like it to me.
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The Gods have brought us together... I can't imagine why.
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CraigHack
Known Hero
Have fantasies, will travel...
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posted July 30, 2001 12:14 AM |
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Let me get this right.....
Quote:
Sorry to interrupt this "discussion" between "top" players...I myself haven't played in tournament but somehow I have opinion about this whole thing...
I tried to understand you Craig Hack but now it's my time to give up. It seems that the one paragraph I wrote about players being greedy and stuff like that can be true with you too. Or is this the case?
You havent played in a tournament????????
What the hell difference could any of this be to you.
Yes, I am Greedy!
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The Gods have brought us together... I can't imagine why.
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CraigHack
Known Hero
Have fantasies, will travel...
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posted July 30, 2001 12:18 AM |
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Yes
Quote:
CraigHack, are you the same person we (yawacko and I) used to chat with on ICQ, from the Knights of War tournament? i'm not asking for any reason other than curiousity.
I am he.
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The Gods have brought us together... I can't imagine why.
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Sha_Men
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jack-Of-No-Trades
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posted July 30, 2001 12:30 AM |
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What it matters to me?
It matters because there is a chance that people are using this in future tournaments and despite I like to be joining these tournaments I maybe rather find something better to do than using my time to playing hit'n'run games against players like you.
No, I don't mean that you're good or bad player, but just a player that I despise. "the winner" type I mean.
It's very nice that you give such quality answers to all posts. It really shows your characteristics...
And good day to you too.
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Catch the vigorous horse of your mind.
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted July 30, 2001 12:48 AM |
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Pandora san, I apologize but you missunderstood it. It was only an argument to counter Wacko ( "craig hack, you are far from it") speaking about high ranks as first quality to bring here our ideas. Hope to see you in MiRC chat and start a tender fight, the one we always started together and never finished
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted July 30, 2001 01:00 AM |
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I care
JB,this message board is for those who dream convincing others about the veracity of their opinions. So, some are wrong, others not, but everyone at least seems to be honest and willing to get the better game.
If everytime when someone fights for his ideals, could be this in a video game or real life and gets the answer "who cares, do whatever you want, or make compromise", I can not imagine what could be the sense of improvement opposed to tribe one self ideas.
If you don't care, why reading this?
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jb239
Famous Hero
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posted July 30, 2001 01:07 AM |
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it amuses me because it is so dumb.
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AndiAngelsla...
Disgraceful
Famous Hero
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posted July 30, 2001 02:00 AM |
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lol ya...
it amuses me too...
but i feel for jinxer, getting hit and run by implo and archangel is no game, its just a waste of time.
It is not even hit and run, hit and run for me is if for example a opponent has 2 single drag flies, i take them out with scouts and arrows before i attack with main, that would be a tactical move.
Hitting with a Arch and implo is just the move of a looser.
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted July 30, 2001 02:08 AM |
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Jinxer, your post here is not about hit and run, not about loosing but about maps. Obviously you didn't lose to hit and run, he just got amused to humiliate you a bit before crush. As everyone knows, ressurect or implosion makes you win most of games. When you get them both from a "free relic" as you said, the problem is other. And here you have a big clue about what I am talking about.
Getting implosion on "me vs you" or BFH is really mastering the game. because there building high guild is a strategy, and a risky one. Thats why those maps will remain as perfect for both "hit/runners" and no HRunners.
Getting tome of earth as "free relic"(!) on whatever map is pure decisive LUCK and hit and run is little ugly flower in a large cactus field.
And now,honestly, check your saves and tell us: could he win also without hit and run and with such great SP and relic?
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted July 30, 2001 02:29 AM |
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"Hitting with a Arch and implo is just the move of a looser. "
Here comes the great words! Most of total tactics players try to convince others that hit and run can be countered.They don't accuse of weakness or cowardise, just offer solutions. What they have instead? Big 11th commandement by God Andie.
Game is never waste of time. I remember allied finals between me/Frank vs JB/Wacko. I could add this to "wasted time of my life" because wacko got that necro relic(skeletons=liches) by week 2. Am I thinking game was over by that time?
No, I fought to death, and it was my death in front of his 150+ liches. It is a game, and we enjoy it, sometimes we win, sometimes we lose. I am not seeing the difference beween hitting with archange and implo and coming with 150+liches by week two.
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AndiAngelsla...
Disgraceful
Famous Hero
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posted July 30, 2001 02:50 AM |
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lol sal....
...i just say as it is...if i got implo i dont need to be afraid of a battle, if someone chooses to avoid the fight by such a move, well everyone can think about it what he wants, i think it shows who plays for fun and who for a win at all cost, and so theres 1 more person im sure ill never play if i dun need to.
thx for telling jinxer ;-)
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted July 30, 2001 03:04 AM |
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First off thanks Andi Nice to know there are lots of people out there with my same ideals to play with. We havent played in awhile we should get a game going again.
2nd, Salamandre, I think you might be partly right, the map we played was The CHallenge, and he had almost all teh relics available. Only 2-3 was banned. My opponent had Firebook and Earthbook. And the map maker took red orb out. So in a way I can see your point that the map was not properly setup to begin with, but it was GM game we didnt pick it
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