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| Thread: Dimension Door |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Phoenix4ever
Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
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posted October 03, 2023 08:35 PM |
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Phoenix4ever said:
I'm sure it has been discussed somewhere before, but what is up with the movement cost of Dimension Door? It's supposed to cost 300 movement points at unskilled - advanced and 200 movements points at expert, but it is somehow possible to cast it even if you have fewer movement points left than that, as long as you don't have 0.
Does anyone know how this works exactly?
I don't really like quoting myself, but does anyone know anything about this?
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BrandochDaha
Hired Hero
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posted October 03, 2023 11:08 PM |
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In this video (at ~16 minute mark) Xenofex talks about this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JsPJ8KimM1w
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Phoenix4ever
Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
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posted October 03, 2023 11:27 PM |
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Thanks.
It's a little bit unclear how many movement points you need to have left to actually cast it, it seems to depend on if you are on a road and which kind of road you are on.
But as long as you have 100 you should be fine.
That means DD is best saved for the end of the turn to spend only 100 (or less) movement points instead of 300 or 200.
Still feels a bit buggy to me when the description clearly states it cost 300 or 200 movement points.
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NimoStar
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
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posted October 04, 2023 02:48 PM |
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The needed amount for the jump is the amount for a single step (expert), two steps (advanced) or three steps (basic/no magic)
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Never changing = never improving
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phoenix4ever
Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
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posted October 04, 2023 03:12 PM |
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Hmm are you sure about that?
Movement cost should be the same from unskilled to advanced according to https://heroes.thelazy.net//index.php/Dimension_Door
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NimoStar
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
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posted October 04, 2023 03:22 PM |
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I seemed to remember it differently. In any case I still believe the minimum movement is strongly correlated to the number of steps - IE why you can move on Road but not on normal land on some circumstance. If you can so a step you can teleport, but if you can't you don't. I tried that many times I believe.
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Never changing = never improving
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heymlich
Famous Hero
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posted October 04, 2023 05:41 PM |
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Edited by heymlich at 17:41, 04 Oct 2023.
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The issue with DD is, that you can pick up all the artifacts without a fight. This cannot be canceled out by an increase in cost or moving points.
DD has been there since HMM1 and it was fine then. Because by the time you are able to build a lvl4 mage guild you have long killed most of the guardians, and because the use of DD was limited through the different spell system. Starting from HMM2 DD became an OP spell because of the introduction of the new spell system, the market place and the general abundance of resources.
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phoenix4ever
Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
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posted October 04, 2023 06:01 PM |
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heymlich said:
The issue with DD is, that you can pick up all the artifacts without a fight.
You can't do that in HotA, besides I limited DD to only 1 time per day, so I think it's pretty reasonable now.
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bloodsucker
Legendary Hero
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posted October 04, 2023 06:21 PM |
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phoenix4ever said:
You can't do that in HotA, besides I limited DD to only 1 time per day, so I think it's pretty reasonable now.
That is completely unreasonable. 
So with or without Air, the difference is how many spell and movement points you spend?
Just guessing but you always pick Earth and Water.
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phoenix4ever
Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
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posted October 04, 2023 06:34 PM |
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Actually I also moved DD to Fire.
So Air has Fly
Earth has TP
Fire has DD
Water has Water Walk
That means every school has 1 useful adventure spell and that every tome has 1 useful adventure spell.
Moving DD to Fire also makes Fire Magic a little better, but yeah DD does'nt benefit much from Fire Magic, just a bit cheaper and a bit less movement points spend.
I hate how you are still forced to always pick Earth and Air though.
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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted October 04, 2023 06:43 PM |
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DD destroys the gameplay pretty much by allowing you to cheat your path through uncharted lands. This is so called shortcut for lazy players who want to beat their AI opponents without any effort. In online games DD is particularly dangerous for you can't beat it even with logistics specialists. Acquiring so called "control spells" is considered an auto-win situation. Often banned.
What spell would be better than DD, but allowing you to shortcut great distances in a non-cheater way? Lloyd's Beacon, for example. First, you can set up a beacon only on explored areas of a map. Second, you can set up limited amount of beacons. Say, 1/2/3/4 for None/Basic/Advanced/Expert Air Magic.
Moreover, DD has no sound logic in allowing you to teleport within a rectangle shaped area, as well as to teleport to uncharted lands. Actually, I think, you should not see if you can teleport to a cell in uncharted lands or not. It's your risky decision. So, if you dare teleport blindly to ocean or inside a mountain, your hero should die immediately 
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Ghost
Undefeatable Hero
Therefore I am
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posted October 04, 2023 06:45 PM |
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bloodsucker said:
phoenix4ever said:
You can't do that in HotA, besides I limited DD to only 1 time per day, so I think it's pretty reasonable now.
That is completely unreasonable.
So with or without Air, the difference is how many spell and movement points you spend?
Just guessing but you always pick Earth and Water.
WoG/ERA too.. HotA copied WoG/ERA, and WoG/ERA took H4 style, thus 3.5 version.. But you can't also pick resources in H4..
Limited DD means you hate AIs.. And I'm not interested in nerfing and buffing..
I pick all SS, except EE, even if improved in WoG/ERA gives to EE virtuoso to repel 100% spell in 30% possibly. An example of Mass Slow failed completely. It's a EE bonus!  But EE for AIs, thus I failed to cast magic on the opponent is exciting game.
So DD  When Difficulty Mod by RerryR can enable to Fly or DD, and then AIs don't need a Mage Guilds.. An example AIs never builds from a conquered towns, thus legion and over 50 PS.. But pro players know how to destroy in 3DO maps.. Only I can do mapmakers and random maps.. Think about over 50.. or my Remote Mountain II can achieve over 115 PS..
But I guess you pick an easy HotA and to nerf AIs..
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Fight MWMs - stand teach
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bloodsucker
Legendary Hero
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posted October 04, 2023 06:59 PM |
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phoenix4ever said:
I hate how you are still forced to always pick Earth and Air though.
??? If Fly and DD are disabled, I only pick Air with some rando, so I can cast View Air.
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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted October 04, 2023 07:01 PM |
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Btw, DD could work great in synergy with The Eye of Magi spell from my mod. First, you should ban to cast it on uncharted lands. Second, you should make it work only within limited radius. Then it would be a great synergy (The Eye of the Magi + DD).
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Ghost
Undefeatable Hero
Therefore I am
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posted October 04, 2023 07:06 PM |
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bloodsucker said:
phoenix4ever said:
I hate how you are still forced to always pick Earth and Air though.
??? If Fly and DD are disabled, I only pick Air with some rando, so I can cast View Air.
So of great importance in Difficulty Mod  But Fire shows Berserk is a very valuable in Difficulty Mod.. True problem..
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Fight MWMs - stand teach
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phoenix4ever
Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
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posted October 04, 2023 07:13 PM |
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bloodsucker said:
??? If Fly and DD are disabled, I only pick Air with some rando, so I can cast View Air.
Who said they were disabled?, both are allowed in my map.
But with this discussion I'm almost considering removing them, that would also free up that forced Air Magic slot.
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thecastrated
Famous Hero
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posted October 04, 2023 08:06 PM |
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you can get goodies behind guards with dd? just dd directly ON the goody? didn't know this
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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted October 04, 2023 08:17 PM |
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Edited by AlexSpl at 20:17, 04 Oct 2023.
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You cannot directly DD on treasures, but you can DD near them not triggering a monster defending them.
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phoenix4ever
Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
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posted October 04, 2023 08:17 PM |
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AlexSpl said:
You cannot directly DD on treasures, but you can DD near them not triggering a monster defending them.
It won't work in HotA though.
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thecastrated
Famous Hero
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posted October 04, 2023 08:38 PM |
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does this dd trick happen with all guards? and dd just beside best the three tiles away from the guard?
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