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Heroes Community > Library of Enlightenment > Thread: Fire Magic in Heroes 3
Thread: Fire Magic in Heroes 3 This thread is 4 pages long: 1 2 3 4 · «PREV / NEXT»
phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Supreme Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted June 01, 2018 01:02 PM
Edited by phoenix4ever at 13:06, 01 Jun 2018.

Curse VS Dungeon does'nt affect dragons and VS Inferno does'nt affect efreeti. Curse can also be resisted or protected against with different artifacts. Curse really does'nt come close to Haste or Slow, maybe not even Bless.
Also you people mentioning Blind and the damage spells, remember the benefit is very small from no Fire Magic to expert Fire Magic.

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Zaio-Baio
Zaio-Baio


Promising
Famous Hero
posted June 01, 2018 09:59 PM

Curse vs stronghold has great effect vs many units and barbarian heroes cant learn water magic to get rid of it

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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Supreme Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted June 01, 2018 10:42 PM

^^ Yes good point, Curse could be good against barbarians. I guess barbarians should try to learn Resistance to avoid stuff like that then.

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Ben80
Ben80


Adventuring Hero
posted June 12, 2018 04:51 PM

zmudziak22 said:
Curse - excellent level 1 spell, good vs stronghold, dungeon, inferno
Blind - obvious, expert blind, no retalition.
Fireball and Inferno - weak but they are good against low level creatures or in campaigns
Frenzy - excelent vs high defense creatures or heroes with lots of defense skill.
Berserk - combining with Armor of the Damned and fast creature against opponent, game changer. with some tricks it is possible to use berserk on all 7 enemy stacks.
Armageddon - powerful, best combined with Phoenixes and Efreets(both can resurected). Insane damage  with Sorcery specialist + fire orb cheaper then implosion and better then chain lighting.

Sacrifice - if you are low sp and mana it can help save your best unit, because it ressuct stronger then level 4 ressurection.


Yes, Fire Magic School is very strong in Battle. Expert Frenzy can be more efficient than Clone or Implosion. Expert Curse can be really cheat against many low-level monsters.
And finally Protection against Fire is best spell among analogous spells. It can be used to protect against Armageddon of enemy but can be used to provide own Armageddon.

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Wasti
Wasti

Tavern Dweller
posted June 13, 2018 12:01 AM
Edited by Wasti at 00:21, 13 Jun 2018.

For unknown reasons I have to reply first in a topic before i can create my own one:

I'm stuck in the end of the Scenario "Shores of Hell" of the campaign Horn of Abyss. I need to create the Cornucopia and am missing the Everpouring Vial of Mercury. It was already bought by me or my opponent from the seer but it is lost. Any ideas how  I can finish this scenario? Furthermore an opponent is still displayed as alive in the Tavern and his army overpowers mine, but I cannot see a path to him nor to the region where a dozen of artifacts lies (in underground).
The cheat codes dont seem to work for Hota.
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Revolut1oN
Revolut1oN


Famous Hero
posted June 13, 2018 10:02 AM

Why wont you post this in an approperiate thread, like HotA thread for example?

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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Supreme Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted January 28, 2019 06:32 PM

What do you guys think about mass Fire Shield, would that be OP or fair? Do you have any other good ideas about improving Fire Magic?

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phe
phe


Famous Hero
Life and Freedom
posted January 28, 2019 07:11 PM
Edited by phe at 19:21, 28 Jan 2019.

Slayer +50%

Inferno +100%, +1 range at Expert Fire Magic

Fireball +1 range at Expert Fire Magic

free Land Mines and Fire Wall at Expert Fire if Fire Magic would be still to weak(if free cast every round too strong so only every 2-3 rounds...)

if new spells considered:

Firewalk: allows to walk over lava on adventure map

Fire Transit- adventure map teleport between tiles adjacent to previously visited and visible fire related places (fire lakes of terrain, lava, Fiery Fields, Altars of Fire, Pyres, Fire Lakes(dwelling), Pillars of Fire, Inferno and Conflux towns); also surface/underground, 16 tiles range

Speed Run- increase movement points amount limit up to 2000(basic)/2250(advanced)/2500(expert) regardless of Logistics and movement artifacts; if it was cast after some movement during the day it should be recalculated by part of move used so far

Obelisk Teleport between visited obelisks with limited or unlimited range

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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Supreme Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted January 28, 2019 07:26 PM
Edited by phoenix4ever at 19:30, 28 Jan 2019.

Thanks phe, I'll try to respond to everything:
Slayer: I made Slayer a mass spell, which I'm really satisfied with.
Inferno: I already improved power modifier, but made Inferno and Meteor Shower cost 4 more mana, but Inferno is now comparable to Meteor Shower and Chain Lightning. I don't know how I feel about larger range.
Fireball: Also improved power modifier and made it as cheap as Frost Ring. I don't know how I feel about larger range.
Land Mine and Fire Wall: Also improved damage of those and mana cost of Land Mine, I still cast Fire Wall very rarely and Land Mine like never.
New Fire Spells: Yeah could be interesting, but beyond my skill level sadly.  

What do think about mass Fire Shield?

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phe
phe


Famous Hero
Life and Freedom
posted January 28, 2019 07:38 PM
Edited by phe at 19:40, 28 Jan 2019.

phoenix4ever said:

Slayer: I made Slayer a mass spell, which I'm really satisfied with.


Single stack Slayer can be 50% more powerful for single stack than mass version
phoenix4ever said:

Land Mine and Fire Wall: Also improved damage of those and mana cost of Land Mine, I still cast Fire Wall very rarely and Land Mine like never.


that makes me to give these spells free (0 mana cost) for Expert Fire users  
Quote:

What do think about mass Fire Shield?

There is mass Fire Shield casted by Phoenixes for all ally stacks in WOG at high experience levels so I'm in favour of Mass Fire Shield...

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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Supreme Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted January 28, 2019 08:00 PM

I like the mass version of Slayer honestly.  
0 mana cost for Fire Wall and Land Mine surely sounds good, I don't know if perhaps too good. The problem with buffing these spells too much is that AI can't cast them.
Mass Fire Shield cool, I'm just a little uncertain if it would be overpowered. Personally I hate fighting Efreet Sultans and heroes who cast Fire Shield, so for it to suddenly be mass would be very annoying fighting against. On the other hand Ironfist of the Ogre also casts mass Fire Shield in HotA, but AI never has that artifact.


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bloodsucker
bloodsucker


Legendary Hero
posted January 28, 2019 10:38 PM
Edited by bloodsucker at 12:27, 29 Jan 2019.

Mass Slayer and Mass FireShield would be good in my book but I only see one reason to take Fire and that is Berserk.
It's the spell necessary to do disproportionate  battles against neutrals, it can be the reason why you progress at an acceptable pace in certain user-made maps and it can be comparable to Slow or Haste as the spell that most drives you to pick that school but you only need it in VERY specific occasions. It's a bit like Summon Boat spell, you can design a map where it is vital but most of the times it's just a waist of a slot in the mage guild.
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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Supreme Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted January 28, 2019 11:20 PM

Summon Boat (and of course Slow) are actually vital in my map.
Berserk is great when fighting huge armies, as long as they are not immune and yes it really seems the best and perhaps only reason to pick Fire Magic.

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Ghost
Ghost


Supreme Hero
Therefore I am
posted January 29, 2019 11:03 AM

Also expert blind, when you cast a blind into the legion, and you strike the legion, it after you cast a blind again, etc the legion can't revenge you, because of expert blind.

Yes OP mass FireShield. It should also immune to dragon breath like Heroes 4.

You aren't poor player. If playing only 3D0 maps, you have played reason map. And you developed speed, example of Galaad beat a Pirates (RoE) map in 47 days. If I remember correct. At least you can try to beat 47d. And all maps. My map In the Land of Nod, I beat in about 50 days, and reason for I know my map, so you did the same your own map, later on fanmaker maps. Another reason for known map. Easy playing multiplayer.    
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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted January 29, 2019 12:39 PM
Edited by Salamandre at 12:40, 29 Jan 2019.

Berserk is the Heroes 3's disgrace, I never used it except in the campaign nagas battle because it was designed for that only. Combined with speed advantage and mass slow, which are super easy conditions to reunite, + battle bait knowledge - not so difficult to learn, it is invincible and should be avoided if you look for a decent game.

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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Supreme Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted January 29, 2019 12:54 PM

Yeah I tend to agree with you Salamandre, Berserk is OP, but if you take that away Fire Magic becomes incredibly unattractive. In HotA AI can at least also cast Berserk and I'm not looking for ways to make Fire Magic weaker, but stronger.

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted January 29, 2019 01:12 PM

Expert blind can be incredibly strong on custom maps. Remember that it allows first attack without retaliation, so with a strong stack, one slower bait + cast every turn, you can win impossible battles.

Now, if you wanted a real revaluation of fire magic, you could set blind to scale with expertise, as clone does. Below expert, you can blind only level 1-3/1-5 creatures. That would be a challenge.
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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Supreme Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted January 29, 2019 05:17 PM
Edited by phoenix4ever at 17:18, 29 Jan 2019.

Well Blind is also OP, but it does'nt gain much from Fire Magic imo.
The same with all the damage spells (Fire Magic has the most) and Hypnotize and Animate Dead.

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Maurice
Maurice

Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
posted January 29, 2019 06:26 PM

phoenix4ever said:
Well Blind is also OP, but it does'nt gain much from Fire Magic imo.


The only thing it gets is a reduction in retaliation damage - which is completely nullified at Expert Fire Magic. I consider that a considerable boost, as it basically gives the attacking stack a no-retaliation attack.
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The last Reasonable Steward of Good Game Design and a Responsible Hero of HC. - Verriker

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Czarlson
Czarlson


Hired Hero
posted January 29, 2019 09:04 PM

I can say that this school of magic is quite good for fractions which posses units immune to fire + Armageddon. Of course only like a second school of magic because earth is rules now.
Sometimes it's  good to have scout with expert fire magic to do some damage to the enemy.
P.S.
I'm talking only about multilayer mode.

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