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Heroes Community > Heroes 4 - Lands of Axeoth > Thread: Heroes 4 Enhancement Mod Alpha RELEASE
Thread: Heroes 4 Enhancement Mod Alpha RELEASE This thread is 2 pages long: 1 2 · NEXT»
Albyx
Albyx


Hired Hero
posted July 20, 2022 08:39 AM bonus applied by Galaad on 01 Aug 2022.
Edited by Albyx at 10:58, 02 Aug 2022.

Heroes 4 Enhancement Mod Alpha RELEASE

First version of Enhancement Mod. Includes improved building trees for Life, Order and Might, rework of undead transformer and more!

Mod is available at ModDB.com:
https://www.moddb.com/mods/heroes-4-enhancement-mod
!!! Crash in might castle fixed in updated Enhancement Mod archive, if you downloaded mod before this message appeared, I recommend to reinstall it!!!


Main changes:

Overall improvements:
- Buildings no longer require Tavern, all creatures can be accessed even on maps with one hero.
- Resource costs of buildings are rebalanced to focus on rare resources more.

Improvements of Life:
- New unique building tree, that allows to play aggressive all-in.
- Ballista and Monk are reworked, they must be more than 2 plain shooters.

Improvements of Death:
- Undead transformer is reworked! Now it's named Evil transformer and converts creatures into one from you town (more info in changelog enhancement file).

Improvements of Order:
- Dragon golems buff.
- Genies building requirements are less strict.

Improvements of Nature:
- Gargantuans added to creature portal.
- Sacred grove is now a bit more useful.

Improvements of Might:
- New unique building choice (two of three).

Improvements of Chaos:
- Minotaurs require Battle academy.
- Small buffs here and there, mainly preparations for future update.

More details in changelogs !

This mod also includes all Equilibris 3.55 improvements and some changes from Equilibris++ by H4Zer0 (more info in changelog_equilibris_plus_plus file).

Thanks to Equilibris team, H4Zer0, RoseKavalier, iliveinabox05, NimoStar and other modders from this forum!

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NimoStar
NimoStar


Honorable
Legendary Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted July 22, 2022 07:08 AM

I will never get tired of telling people that genies and life are already pretty OP genies don't need any more help...

But, good work with the coding.

I see you also made a way to make Undead and Demons in death more symmetric with the transformer. I did some similar adjustements on my own to make demons appear more (for example making succubi the GM necromancy creature instead of vampires, and enabling all demon summons)
____________
Never changing = never improving

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Albyx
Albyx


Hired Hero
posted July 22, 2022 07:58 AM
Edited by Albyx at 08:04, 22 Jul 2022.

NimoStar said:
I will never get tired of telling people that genies and life are already pretty OP genies don't need any more help...


Yes, life and order are OP, but their strength is in OP magic.
Buff of ballista will have no effect on OP part of life. Monks... maybe New champions still require a ton of investments, and they are still dying a lot while clearing the map. To have early champs, you must stop getting magic guild, and it means you'll get to the most OP life part, for example regeneration, later.

Genies didn't really get buffed, if you think about it. It's just for convenience. If your hero learns death magic, you don't have to build useless life library, you can build death one instead.

P.S: life got huge nerf with max attack/defense bonus changed in Equilibris++. It means that all small creatures in fact deat x2 damage than before.

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NimoStar
NimoStar


Honorable
Legendary Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted July 22, 2022 08:10 AM

Quote:
Genies didn't really get buffed, if you think about it. It's just for convenience. If your hero learns death magic, you don't have to build useless life library, you can build death one instead.


Still a sort of buff.

Genies require life for a reason.

Genies use Life magic spells (IE Mirth, Song of Peace) and no death magic spells so for "lore" reasons they require Life library.

anyways, my greatest concern is already genies being buffed by equilibris... specifically the mass spells, when there were already arguably best creature; equi++ with defense/atk change is also indirect buff to magic over might.
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Never changing = never improving

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Albyx
Albyx


Hired Hero
posted July 22, 2022 08:51 AM
Edited by Albyx at 09:01, 22 Jul 2022.

NimoStar said:
Quote:
Genies didn't really get buffed, if you think about it. It's just for convenience. If your hero learns death magic, you don't have to build useless life library, you can build death one instead.


Still a sort of buff.

Genies require life for a reason.

Genies use Life magic spells (IE Mirth, Song of Peace) and no death magic spells so for "lore" reasons they require Life library.

anyways, my greatest concern is already genies being buffed by equilibris... specifically the mass spells, when there were already arguably best creature; equi++ with defense/atk change is also indirect buff to magic over might.


In equilibris they also made nagas require nothing. I think choise between nagas and genies isn't no-brainer, but maybe I should return golden pavilion to its' previous state.

In Equi++ magic resistance also grows faster, H4Zer0 tried to balance it. Also attack/defense change make casters weaker against lvl 1 and 2 creatures, because they get more damage.

I should think about reversing order level 3 changes. I'd like to get more such feedback on my changes (I hope you tried Enhancement Mod, not just looked in changelogs )

Edit: I made some calculations. Equi++ atk/def change doesn't affect creatures at all. It works if attacker has 9 attack and defender 90 defense etc. It's not even a nerf to combat skill.

It means all our previous statements about life getting a nerf and casters getting a buff are just not true

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Albyx
Albyx


Hired Hero
posted July 22, 2022 11:16 AM
Edited by Albyx at 21:42, 22 Jul 2022.

Thought about Genies a bit...

In Enhancement Mod magic guild and libraries have their cost increased. It means that genies are more expensive to build (if we assume lvl 1 mage guild is prebuilt, they cost +2 wood and +2 ore. If town is empty, they cost +3 wood and ore, + 1 sulfur, +1 gem compared to equilibris).

It also means level 2 in order is a bit more expensive if there is no magic guild in town.
So making it possible to choose which library to build compensates that cost increase and slower start on some maps.

Genies should have their cost increased to match other lvl 3 units(in equilibris they reduced growth, but cost remained the same as far as I remember)

Nagas dwelling should be reversed to 6250 gold.

!!! Crash in castle window fixed, check it out !!!

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NimoStar
NimoStar


Honorable
Legendary Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted July 23, 2022 07:11 AM
Edited by NimoStar at 07:12, 23 Jul 2022.

+2 wood and ore is not significant, plus you probably need the mage guild anyways even if no genies, Order is very dependent on magid as you said yourself.

And anyways, mhm to the "only affects very large numbers" ok, my original point still stands, it was more about the mass spells as I mentioned. These are significantly more powerful (mass Mirth is no laughing matter, H4 morale gives not only act first but also +20% damage afaik?).

Seeing that you still buff life, any nerfs on that frontĄ?

At least, agree to making genies more expensive.
____________
Never changing = never improving

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Albyx
Albyx


Hired Hero
posted July 23, 2022 09:07 AM
Edited by Albyx at 09:11, 23 Jul 2022.

NimoStar said:
+2 wood and ore is not significant, plus you probably need the mage guild anyways even if no genies, Order is very dependent on magid as you said yourself.

And anyways, mhm to the "only affects very large numbers" ok, my original point still stands, it was more about the mass spells as I mentioned. These are significantly more powerful (mass Mirth is no laughing matter, H4 morale gives not only act first but also +20% damage afaik?).

Seeing that you still buff life, any nerfs on that frontĄ?

At least, agree to making genies more expensive.


I think mass spells are a good change, they are available at mid/late game and make casters to scale like other creatures.
Plus you should keep in mind, that all factions are getting a buff at some point, so no one is OP when everyone is OP

For Life I think about banning or reworking sanctuary, but it won't be done soon. Maybe revert stables or champs dwelling gold cost (need more feedback on that).


Right now I'm focused on chaos.
Thieves gauntlet should get a rework (maybe increase growth of bandits? or give next level of Melee/Combat skill?).
Stealth should give +0/1/1/2/3 speed to hero.

Also my concept on nobility:
Grandmaster Nobility: you can build twice a turn in city governed by this hero.

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baronus
baronus


Promising
Legendary Hero
posted July 28, 2022 06:14 PM

Fantastic new H4 era! Gdy another mod! Very good you build your own H4 enhancement! This game for years was abandoned by modders. Now we have really restoration!
In future I think you sholud made H4Zero version of your mod because its now base mod so is no sense making something on nie mod but with cancelling nhis Mmain content. The best is full compability and second your unique version.
And better to have one thread about your mod. Very good work!

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NimoStar
NimoStar


Honorable
Legendary Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted July 29, 2022 12:26 PM
Edited by NimoStar at 12:28, 29 Jul 2022.

Quote:
I think mass spells are a good change, they are available at mid/late game and make casters to scale like other creatures.


They aready scale by default. Casting Mirth on 100 halflings insn't the same as in 100 titans. Mass spells make exponential power instead of linear.

Quote:
Maybe revert stables or champs dwelling gold cost (need more feedback on that).


Stables is already one of the best buildings in the game. +movement is crucial and this works like master pathfinding basically.

Quote:
Grandmaster Nobility: you can build twice a turn in city governed by this hero.


By the time you get GM nobility your town will be fully built and/or buildings will be so expensive that you can't afford two in a turn.

Rather would like to see a rework of Minin/estates as they aren't much worth it to upgrade.

eq360 made this better but changez werent included by h4zer0
____________
Never changing = never improving

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Albyx
Albyx


Hired Hero
posted July 29, 2022 11:24 PM

NimoStar said:
Quote:
I think mass spells are a good change, they are available at mid/late game and make casters to scale like other creatures.


They aready scale by default. Casting Mirth on 100 halflings insn't the same as in 100 titans. Mass spells make exponential power instead of linear.

Quote:
Maybe revert stables or champs dwelling gold cost (need more feedback on that).


Stables is already one of the best buildings in the game. +movement is crucial and this works like master pathfinding basically.

Quote:
Grandmaster Nobility: you can build twice a turn in city governed by this hero.


By the time you get GM nobility your town will be fully built and/or buildings will be so expensive that you can't afford two in a turn.

Rather would like to see a rework of Minin/estates as they aren't much worth it to upgrade.

eq360 made this better but changez werent included by h4zer0


That was my idea with GM nobility. You can change governer to new town, if you want to build it faster. But you'll loose bonus growth in main town.
I'm thinking about mining rework. It doesn't work in Equi 3.55, it's bonus is already in estates skill. So it can be changed to anything. I think about "Education" skill, because lords are hard to level up.

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Albyx
Albyx


Hired Hero
posted July 29, 2022 11:57 PM

baronus said:

And better to have one thread about your mod. Very good work!

Is there a way to change thread name? For example if new version of mod comes out?

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dD_ShockTroop
dD_ShockTroop


Hired Hero
posted August 01, 2022 11:55 AM

Very cool to see H4 getting some love again. "Transforms creatures 1 to 1 (without exp restriction). For example, 1 imp turns into 1 skeleton." RIP imps lol. Guess they're back to 1-stack duty and skeletons for the rest. Not complaining though; I'll take whatever necro earlygame buffs I can get.

Btw, are you making this mod with PvP or PvE in mind? Some of the changes you've made are buffing already OP units vs AI to even further heights while nerfing the weak vs AI choice. (Ogre Magi was a no-brainer vs AI in Equilibris due to the truly massive knee-jerk buffs it got while Cyclops got mega-nerfed. Having access to mass snake strike on top is an incredibly huge deal) That said, if this is a PvP focused mod you're probably correct with these balance changes; cyclops AoE is a lot more debilitating than mass snake strike on your melee brawlers.

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Galaad
Galaad

Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
posted August 01, 2022 12:07 PM
Edited by Galaad at 12:08, 01 Aug 2022.

Albyx said:
baronus said:

And better to have one thread about your mod. Very good work!

Is there a way to change thread name? For example if new version of mod comes out?


Yes, I can do it for you, just tell me how to rename it (you can send me an HCM).
I've also marked your thread as "project" so that you can keep editing the OP as long as you want.
Keep up the good work!

Ps. Might throw a picture or two in the OP, so that your mod is more noticeable.
____________

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Albyx
Albyx


Hired Hero
posted August 01, 2022 10:37 PM
Edited by Albyx at 08:39, 02 Aug 2022.

dD_ShockTroop said:
Btw, are you making this mod with PvP or PvE in mind?


It's somewhere in between. My idea is to speed up the game by giving every faction some kind of early game and making low level creatures stronger (good for PvP), but also to make factions "feel" more unique (I guess it's more for PvE). I'm also improving AI: in full release it will purchase creatures from creature portal, use undead transformer etc. And giving AI access to mantises really boosts them I must say

Lots of things changed since my alpha release. Enhancement mod will be the first to use full potential of RoseKavalier Modding System. It's completely modular and you'll be able to toggle most of changes. It also means that other modders will be able to use components of my mod in their projects, or to add their own plugins to my mod!

Right now I'm working on adding customisation options for AI using creature portal. If you wish, you'll be able to make them buy 10 mantises a day with no restrictions

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Galaad
Galaad

Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
posted August 02, 2022 10:44 AM

You're welcome.
____________

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Albyx
Albyx


Hired Hero
posted August 02, 2022 10:57 AM

Galaad said:
You're welcome.

You changed release in title to be capsed? Thanks

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NimoStar
NimoStar


Honorable
Legendary Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted August 03, 2022 01:17 PM
Edited by NimoStar at 13:19, 03 Aug 2022.

Quote:
Very cool to see H4 getting some love again. "Transforms creatures 1 to 1 (without exp restriction). For example, 1 imp turns into 1 skeleton." RIP imps lol. Guess they're back to 1-stack duty and skeletons for the rest. Not complaining though; I'll take whatever necro earlygame buffs I can get.


I did say this is incredibly unbalanced for infinite skeleton hordes from things like peasants, squires sprites and halflings but oh well


Quote:
That was my idea with GM nobility. You can change governer to new town, if you want to build it faster. But you'll loose bonus growth in main town.
I'm thinking about mining rework. It doesn't work in Equi 3.55, it's bonus is already in estates skill. So it can be changed to anything. I think about "Education" skill, because lords are hard to level up.


People can change the nobility from a town to another, build, then change it back for growth...

my dear, think of the exploits ;=
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Never changing = never improving

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Albyx
Albyx


Hired Hero
posted August 04, 2022 10:09 PM
Edited by Albyx at 22:28, 04 Aug 2022.

NimoStar said:

People can change the nobility from a town to another, build, then change it back for growth...

my dear, think of the exploits ;=


Double building bonus is set at the start of the turn if lord has Nobility GM. You can't manipulate with it just reassigning governor.

Imps need some buff because of new transformer.
My current idea:
+2 movement (38 -> 40). Grants them +1 movement in battle.
+2 attack (10 -> 12). Means they have the same damage with skeletons.

Doable idea for chaos:
Change Thieves Gauntlet to Refugees Camp:
Spawns random neutral chaos creatures in town every week. Their level depends on max level of dwellings in town.

Thieves Gauntlet is useless, so at first I tried making it to increase bandits growth by 20%. But this is boring and bandits are still bad, even when there are 20% more of them.
So I got inspired by the name of Chaos town: Asylum. Refugees camp fits in really well.
Chaos have a TON of neutral creatures, so why can't they get them?

Also idea for might:
Increasing bonus from arena and wrestling pits up to 12 (maybe 15), but making player to choose one of them.

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NimoStar
NimoStar


Honorable
Legendary Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted August 04, 2022 11:48 PM
Edited by NimoStar at 23:49, 04 Aug 2022.

Quote:
Double building bonus is set at the start of the turn if lord has Nobility GM. You can't manipulate with it just reassigning governor.


I see. Anyways, the objections I said before still stand:
* GM nobility requires lots of levels and you won't have that fast necessity to build.
* Just change back to main town after a double bout of double-building or too.
* Nobility isn't a bad skill.

I mean go ahead but I don't think it's the most necessary change ever, however it woudn't do much damage, unlike...

Quote:
Imps need some buff because of new transformer.
My current idea:
+2 movement (38 -> 40). Grants them +1 movement in battle.
+2 attack (10 -> 12). Means they have the same damage with skeletons.



That's just even more death op. But won't be enough for anyone to use imps still:
* People still converted ULTIMATE imps to skeletons, even if imps had Long Weapon and unfavorable XP rate.
* Imps, specially without long weapons are vulnerable to archers. What the hell they are vulnerable to everything, and die like flies. So either skeletons live (with skeletal ability and undead protection, higher HP and defense) or imps die, not much of a choice.

***

I really like refugee camp idea

Could it be done calculating XP cost like portal? I don't mean recruit screen, just the spawning. I don't think it should be tied to creature level since if so only Pirates would spam every week as base.
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