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| Thread: Expansion Pack News |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Darkspirit
Famous Hero
aka Zutus
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posted July 22, 2002 04:05 PM |
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I have warcraft for a week now, and I think it's starting to get boring. I really hate the computer's rush-tactic. I'd love to conquer an ennemies town by only using my hero. But the computer forces you to rush too, this just isn't fun.
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Young moles appear to be in full dispersal which means there are more moles per acre than at any other time of the year
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Henl86
Known Hero
oLd SkOoL RA2 OwNaH
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posted July 22, 2002 04:07 PM |
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Yeah that's the main bad thing with war3, the suply limit. Then it's kinda hard to micro spell casters and other units in big battles.
But ffs, it's supposed to be a rtsrpg game. If you could build 100 units, it would be impossible to micro and it would lose all rpg touches. And just attack constantly to get more units than your opponents if you got an economical advantage. You'll be rebuilding with 3 barrackses while he'll have 1 . Star craft wasn't that good IMO, but that's just me. If I want tanks and such, I'll play ra2 which owns sc, just too bad Westwood can't support their games like blizzard does.
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nidhgrin
Honorable
Famous Hero
baking cookies from stardust
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posted July 22, 2002 04:12 PM |
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WHAT?!
That news about the expansion is ridiculous! 6 New campaigns, some maps, a handful of new artifacts and 4 new creatures, ha! Nobody is gonna buy that, there's lots of good maps on the net already and for a pityful amount of new artifacts and creatures... No, unless this expansion (or major patch, whatever) includes a kick *** random map generator, I won't buy it. Grmfl#!§&?;! What are those guys at 3do thinking? Anyway, glad they're going to release the mp-patch after all.
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~Vegetables don't spam~
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Lith-Maethor
Honorable
Legendary Hero
paid in Coin and Cleavage
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posted July 22, 2002 04:16 PM |
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not good... not good at all...
yeah sure, WC3 is a great game and yes, I want to see SC2 as much as the next guy, but we are talking about HoMM4 and 3D'oh here... the fact they are not to be trusted is not new... the fact they will do anything for a buck (even if by doing so they will lose a great deal of the market) is old news as well... most companies would be ashamed to throw a beta in the market and complete the game in a so-called expansion ...whoever buys the expansion is braindead and should not be allowed to breed...
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You are suffering from delusions of adequacy.
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Djive
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Zapper of Toads
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posted July 22, 2002 04:19 PM |
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Hmmm.... with the exception of Armageddon's Blade which included a new town.
Isn't the contents of this expansion pretty much what every expansion in the Heroes series have been so far?
I haven't bought the Chronicles, but did these offer more than new Campaigns and Scenarios? (Weren't they using SoD without adding anything new.)
New Maps: Patches never contain them. Only expansions do. Sure, there is better maps on the net but it requires you to do the effort to find them.
Multiplayer: It's plain wrong to announce Multiplayer as a feature, if it's going to be in a Patch (as promised). They won't get any friends by this marketing tactics.
New Heroes: As Sikmar says, it probably a bunch of new faces. And the faces are probably campaign heroes so you won't get to use them in normal scenarios anyway. How about adding a little customization to Heroes instead?
Four new creatures: I'd say this is a fairly normal dose of new creatures. Anyway, new neutral creatures tend to add little to the game. The creatures that matters are the ones you can recruit in towns. They are the ones you can consistently count on getting.
Hmmm... This doesn't look promising but hopefully they at least enable most of the things they have disabled in the Map Editor, like the Outpost Town, Artifacts and so on.
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"A brilliant light can either illuminate or blind. How will you know which until you open your eyes?"
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undead_wolf_...
Adventuring Hero
Undead Wolf Wrangler
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posted July 23, 2002 01:28 AM |
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grrrrr....
absolutely ridiculous and a potential franchise killer.
Pis_ing off your main audience by having them pay for the beta and then get the FINISHED game for another $20-30 when those features were supposed to be in the original is quite possibly the worst decision ever made in the game world (oh no, buying Daikatana was  ).
I love Heroes 4, but I'll be dam_ed if I'll spend money on a patch. This seriously pis_es me off.
4 creatures??? No new town??? a few artifacts, maps, and campaigns (which were probably scenarios not good enough for the original release tweaked slightly) and new hero portraits??? I don't think so...
Minimum for an expansion: a new town with 2 new hero types, a minimum of 8 new creatures (probably more like 10. 8 town creatures, 2 neutrals), Random Map Generator.
Maps, campaigns, and artifacts are nice, but they are hardly worthy of an expansion.
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"where's a damn werewolf when you need one?"
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Sir_Stiven
Honorable
Legendary Hero
banned
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posted July 23, 2002 01:33 AM |
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Hooorray for the 3do delay!
This means TOH will support heroes3 for a longer time and thats all that matters. Heroes4 is crap anyway.
so there 
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"Youre zeroes and ones, youre wrong where im right"
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Xenophanes
Promising
Famous Hero
Chief Consul to Queen Mutare
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posted July 23, 2002 02:11 AM |
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Djive's right, The Gathering Storm is essentially like any other Heroes expansion pack. New creatures, artifacts, and maps, and of course the really distinguishing feature--new campaigns.
Now, I get to go on my rant to those who keep on belly-aching and whining and jumping to conclusions about the multi-player patch.
First of all, you have nothing to complain about the multi-player itself. So what if it is included in the Expansion pack, and you have to oh-no, oh-horror-of-horrors, give money to the company that publishes, and, in turn, the company that makes the Heroes games? The expansion pack most likely won't be more than twenty to thirty five dollars, and with multiplayer being free, that's not much you're saving.
However, IT HAS BEEN STATED MANY A TIME BY 3DO AND NEW WORLD COMPUTING WORKERS THAT THE MULTI-PLAYER PATCH WILL BE RELEASED EARLIER THAN THE EXPANSION PACK. I quote Christian Vanover,
"We will be releasing multiplayer well before the Expansion."
Also heard from Celestial Heavens is,
"...again and again he stated that the multiplayer patch will be released well before the expansion pack."
Some of you just don't have the intellect to get it, do you? The multi-player patch will come, and then the Expansion will come too. Really, if you think about it, it's rather stupid not to include Multi-Player in the Expansion pack, just in case someone misses the patch, or is just introduced to Heroes IV and buys both the original and the expansion.
Yes, I agree that 3DO has horrible management. However, that is no reason to turn your back on a respectable series. If you don't like the way things are turning out, though, then just DROP IT. If you don't like Heroes IV or the Expansion pack, quit with the melodrama and complaining and just don't play it, and don't comment on it. We've heard that ever since it came out. Before then. Rather than repeating the same tasteless argument over and over again, try and concentrate on what should be done in the future rather than what has been done.
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<Dragons rule, Titans drool!>
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Jenova
Famous Hero
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posted July 23, 2002 08:58 AM |
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Quote:
Yes, I agree that 3DO has horrible management. However, that is no reason to turn your back on a respectable series. If you don't like the way things are turning out, though, then just DROP IT. If you don't like Heroes IV or the Expansion pack, quit with the melodrama and complaining and just don't play it, and don't comment on it.
True.. but I think their whining is actually improving the game.. They announce a product that is not too promising (4 new units especially). Now you could either shut up and don't buy it, or you can express your objection and hope that the developers take notice of your disapproval and make necessary changes. After all, if it wasn't for excess whining and boycotting, H3 AB would have released with the silly Forge town. If no one spoke up, that's what people would have gotten. Not good.
The game hasn't come out yet, the only way you can get it to change is if you speak up. Otherwise they will release something crap, and judging from what they've revealed there doesn't seem to be anything innovative or new as far as expansion packs go. More of the same. Hopefully they can add something that hasn't been done before, something that improves the game.. Not just new maps and campains. That is more of the same. Add new gameplay elements, revise current systems that don't work good (whatever they may be), don't just add more scenarios to play and leave the game unchanged.
As far as shutting up and whining.. You have two choices:
1. Shut up, miss out.
2. Speak up, ensure the released game is better that what would have originally be promised. Enjoy game.
I'd prefer option 2. And I'm thinking if it means increased sales, so will 3DO. So therefore, if there are issues with something that hasn't released yet, please do express your concerns or else it will be too late to change things. Or just miss out on a game that could have been good, if only they had listened.
I actually think previous expansions added more than this one did. At least AB added a new town. This just gives you more of what you already have, without adding anything new that improves the gameplay (unless those artifacts are innovative).
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dragonsister
Hero of Order
MapHaven administrator
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posted July 23, 2002 09:33 AM |
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A lot of people would like to see a Random map generator included in the expansion. Well, I remember a lot of people being disappointed that HOMM4 didn't include it. But I don't see a 'random map generator' on the features list for that expansion, and you'd think they'd put it there if they had it.
I suspect there are some very overworked programmers there at 3D0. I mean - they're trying to write the multiplayer code they skipped earlier. They've got the AI in need of some serious improvements. They're missing quite a number of experienced team members. And there's a new expansion in the works? It's not *too* surprising that 3D0 said to the artists and story-tellers 'make a few new creatures and some maps' - that'll keep them profitably occupied while the programmers strain to handle what's already on their plate - though I won't argue that it makes for much of an expansion!
Oh, by the way, I understand it was Gus Smedstad who did the random map generator with AB. I saw some information on the nitty-gritty of it once. Seriously non-trivial stuff.
DragonSister
(Who will be buying the expansion packs, if only because she has to be able to examine maps made using them!)
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MapHaven
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undead_wolf_...
Adventuring Hero
Undead Wolf Wrangler
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posted July 23, 2002 10:12 AM |
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we get it...the multiplayer patch will be done before the expansion AND it will be a part of the expansion, but it was advertised as part of the original HOMM4 and was not in there. Then it was mentioned to be available as a patch shortly afterwards. It has been far longer than what was advertised. And for some who bought the game primarily for the multiplayer aspect, it is essentially paying in advance for an unfinished product. Now if that isn't worthy of some complaints from customers, like those here, who are venting then I have no idea what is.
And I'm sure the patch will be available just as the expansion goes gold.
As a game industry pro myself, it's just not ethical to put out an unfinished game to meet a deadline and then have promised features in the initial game be new features in an expansion. Yes, it goes on, but it certainly shouldn't. Patches are necessary, but dropping a huge feature like multiplayer which was promised from day one is just crap. I notice they didn't make any mention that MP would not be included until it was out. Did they wait until the release week to drop MP? NO, of course not. They knew it would hurt sales so they didn't mention it until they had to and then hoped that it didn't cut into the sales.
OK, I'll stop ranting, in fact, I like the game, but it has been far underplayed because of the lack of MP...but telling people who've spent money to stop whining about a completely legit complaint is a bit much. You don't order and pay for dinner and a beer and NOT complain if they forgot your beer for 3 months
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"where's a damn werewolf when you need one?"
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Henl86
Known Hero
oLd SkOoL RA2 OwNaH
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posted July 23, 2002 11:34 PM |
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Quote:
/me mines 25000 gold
/me builds 25 grunts and 5 bloodlust shamans
"YOUR TOWN IS UNDER ATTACK"
/me watches as a group of 2 heroes walks into the base and kills everything with no effort.
Oh, and don't grunts cost " 3 "!!! 3 freaking supply, with such a damned low cap. The heroes in this game or so effing powerful that its stupid. I can have a base with about 40 ancient protectors, and a hero still wipes them all out. The only fun tactic is zerging with the undead's ghouls. hehe. THe only thing i Can do is build massive base defense, and pray my resources are all mined soon so that I can get units. > They need to have all small units cost just 1 supply. unless they are cataults or a large unit. like dragon sized costs 4, and catapults / large cost 2.
He outplayed you massively, you lose. That's your fault. You say it's a bad game cause you're not instantly a god at it?? Yes heroes are good. Better than other units worth the same price. But you can only get 3! And you have to upgrade your main base to get the secondthird. You make a hero and a few grunts, you go kill creeps and power up your here, attack and hopefully win. You don't sit in your base building towers hoping to win without conquering the map and without using heroes.
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Xenophanes
Promising
Famous Hero
Chief Consul to Queen Mutare
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posted July 25, 2002 05:05 PM |
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Quote:
True.. but I think their whining is actually improving the game.. They announce a product that is not too promising (4 new units especially). Now you could either shut up and don't buy it, or you can express your objection and hope that the developers take notice of your disapproval and make necessary changes. After all, if it wasn't for excess whining and boycotting, H3 AB would have released with the silly Forge town. If no one spoke up, that's what people would have gotten. Not good.
True. However, the whining here never seems to suggest anything. So far all I've seen for the most part is various ways of saying "3DO sucks, lets sue them," or, "I"m not buying the Expansion because I'm not going to pay for Multi-Player." I'm sure that various ways of saying those two things are extrememly constructive comments, and will help everyone at 3DO to realize their flaws, and cause New World to rethink the entire expansion. NOT!
Quote:
The game hasn't come out yet, the only way you can get it to change is if you speak up. Otherwise they will release something crap, and judging from what they've revealed there doesn't seem to be anything innovative or new as far as expansion packs go. More of the same. Hopefully they can add something that hasn't been done before, something that improves the game.. Not just new maps and campains. That is more of the same. Add new gameplay elements, revise current systems that don't work good (whatever they may be), don't just add more scenarios to play and leave the game unchanged.
That's pretty much what an expansion pack is, though...more of the same. Key word, "expansion - enlargement upon a topic, idea, etc., go into detail..."
Now, that last part there, go into detali, and elargement upon a topic, that reflects the storyline, e.g. campaigns. I will say it again, the main purpose of an expansion seems to always have been to add new campaigns, and expand the storyline.
New gameplay elements, you'll see those as far as new creatures and artifacts go, but anything truly dramatic never has happened in an expansion...if you're expecting that, you'll have to wait for Heroes V. Anything truly dramatic is why the game goes through the various "versions": Heroes I, II, III, IV...
Now, don't say that they should "add" more creatures. First of all, unless you want to wait for two years, four will have to suffice. However, these four will most likely be neutral creatures, and as it has been stated before, in Heroes IV, it's really the town creatures that count. Neutral creatures really don't have the same effect as they used to. Besides, with four more, there will be about as many neutral creatures total as there were after the AB expansion pack. The original Heroes III started out with six, and then AB added around 15 more. The original Heroes IV started out with around 15, and the Expansion added four.
Lastly, your thing about a new town...I think we can mostly agree that the Conflux was rather unbalanced. With the way the new pentagram system is perfected, I don't think anyone at New World wants to tinker with that, regardless of what fans think, until Heroes V.
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<Dragons rule, Titans drool!>
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dragonsister
Hero of Order
MapHaven administrator
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posted July 26, 2002 04:21 AM |
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An insightful and interesting post, Xenophanes. :-)
I'd like to comment that the biggest single reason I see, at this stage, for buying the HOMM4 expansion, would be to get the six new campaigns ... indeed, I'm still working my way through the original campaigns, and enjoying them considerably. (And I'll have to play them again when I want to do walk-throughs and write-ups, making save-games for crucial points in the campaign ... gee, what a pipedream! I never have enough time to do everything I want! Which are people going to value more - another set of walkthroughs, or one of my maps?)
There is *one* thing I'd like to see in the expansion campaigns. And that is scenarios where opposing armies come from the full variety of alignments. While I do understand why heroes and castles might all be the same alignment or nearly so, I do *not* appreciate any reasons for all wandering monsters to be the same alignment. In the last few scenarios of the chaos campaign, for example, my two heroes fought minotaurs, medusae, minotaurs and medusae, troglodytes, evil eyes, troglodytes and evil eyes, ... why can't I fight squires, elves, griffins, bone dragons, gold golems, genies, satyrs, etc? I think that wandering monsters should come from the full variety of creatures within the game - then I won't fight the same battle of two heroes against dozens of minotaurs so many times in one map!
And there is one thing I'd like to see among the 'new campaign editor features' - and that is a capacity to export and import scripts, so that they could be debugged by reading lines of code! Get *that* in, and like SoD the expansion will be worth it for the amateur maps that are made with it!
DragonSister
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MapHaven
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Camelnor
Famous Hero
Also known as Blue Camel
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posted July 26, 2002 06:21 AM |
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I think what the sane ones have been trying to say is...
If you dont like the game, then state your opinion once, and then go sip on a freshly brewed cup of STFU! Jesus.
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My Site
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Largo_LeGrande
Promising
Known Hero
from the Carribean
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posted July 26, 2002 09:13 AM |
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I think we don't need to make new aligments for new towns. Just add the towns to the old ones: inferno to death, underwater town to order/life/might, fortress to might, somekind of drow town to chaos... they would have the same mage guild/library buildings, spells, skills and heroes. Only problem with this is still the necromancy and inferno.
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Klauts
Famous Hero
lost in a mourning hall!
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posted July 26, 2002 09:26 PM |
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Don't worry about the price of the expansion pack.
Sooner or later after it will be released it will become possible to download from the internet!
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Juulcesaar
Adventuring Hero
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posted July 29, 2002 03:06 PM |
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HELLO. 'homm4 is bad, it shouldn't have been released'...
Why am I hearing this all the time? 'I won't buy it' Fine. But do you think the downloadable Mplayer patch will do something about the game?N It will simply allow you to play on the net. Why? Would you make a patch with full ernhancements if you know the patch will mostly be downloaded by poeple who won't buy the expansion pack? 3do just thinks like every other would think.
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I do no longer exist...
Check 'reynaert' if you want to see me...
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qingshuiwujian
Tavern Dweller
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posted August 05, 2002 02:10 PM |
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i think the muti patch will never be released untill the expansion pack be anounced.
i think the patch will come out 3 or 4 weeks later than the expansion pack do.
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Lich_King
Honorable
Supreme Hero
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posted September 27, 2002 11:02 PM |
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It didin't In fact it came 3 weeks earlyier.
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