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Heroes Community > Library of Enlightenment > Thread: Necropolis vs Castle
Thread: Necropolis vs Castle This thread is 5 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 · NEXT»
Shadow_Phoenix
Shadow_Phoenix


Known Hero
Shadow Ruler
posted July 29, 2001 04:26 PM
Edited By: Hexa on 3 Jul 2002

Necropolis vs Castle

I would like to know some good startegies to use in a battle where I must beat a castle army a little bigger then mine and I am using necropolis troops.

Edit: revived!@

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Thunder
Thunder


Responsible
Famous Hero
posted August 02, 2001 03:05 PM

Ok, here I am!

First of all it`s unlikely that you would have an edge over Castle with tactics (and especially with Necromancer). Your both heroes are quite magic oriented. Both hero types have fixed secondary skill (necromancy) and starts with a spell book.

IF you were a castle what could be opposite necromancer`s most dangerous or annoying troop? Well, at start we can count zombies and wraiths out. Ghost Dragons are your fastest unit but won`t do much damage (although the special can hurt). Vampire Lords are fast unit too and will resurrect themselves back to alive but won`t do much damage either. Power Liches are strong shooters and WILL do a lot of damage. Dread Knights are fast and strong grunts who will do an awesome amounts of damage if their damage is doubled. Lastly opponent will usually have a plenty of skeletons and will do huge amounts of damage to opposite.
So Necropolis hero will have 5 units which should be beaten off from the battlefield as soon as possible. First of them would be Liches and Dragons which wouldn`t last for long.

Now, let`s see what are your main targets as a Necromancer (or a Death Knight). Halberdiers are slow but tough and will do good damage, but they aren`t a threath to you. Marksmen have a double shot but won`t last long in a melee.
Royal Griffins have unlimited number of retalitions and are fast. Zealots are shooters with no melee penalty. Crusader will do lots of damage but aren`t in defense any better than demons. Champions are tough and will do more damage per hex they move. Arch Angels have strong fixed damage, they fly, +1 to morale, are one of the fastest units and they resurrect.

If Arch Angels attacks your troops right away, just make first strike on them with zombies and then with rest of your troops killing them. Next round: Dread Knights will will strike their mighty blow either to crusader or champions. Try to eat up retalition of Champions with either Wraiths or Zombies, and then kill them with Skeletons. Try to reach Marksmen with your Vampire Lords (if they are shielded with Griffins and Halberdiers let enemy taste how Death Cloud of your liches feels on them.) If there is few marksmen attack Zealots. Also Make follow up attack with your Dragons on either Champions or Crusaders or attack shooters.

Don`t try to curse or slow castle troops before they have casted their spell. After Mass Curse there will be Mass Bless and after Mass Slow there will be either Mass Haste or Prayer, leaving the opponent the initiative.

If the Arch Angels waited on their turn, wait with all of you units (except with liches, of course). And then wait what opponent does. If he casts Mass Haste cast mass slow.
If he don`t cast spell before Arch Angels turn, blind Angels and attack with your Dragons on shooters. Regardless what your opponent have casted move your units closer. On the next round Cast mass haste, if you have it if don`t teleport your skeletons.

note: if Castle Hero have Expert Clone and lots of Acrh Angels you have most likely already lost.



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thunderknight
thunderknight


Promising
Famous Hero
posted August 02, 2001 04:55 PM

Agreed with thunder.

Only one thing.
Maybe attack zealot BEFORE attack marksman.

Just maybe.

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Thunder
Thunder


Responsible
Famous Hero
posted August 02, 2001 07:43 PM

I disagree Thunderknight.

Marksmen have few hp:s and will do only quarter of their damage when they retaliate. One attack of strong stack will see them crippled beyond recovery
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Ichon
Ichon


Responsible
Famous Hero
posted August 03, 2001 02:45 AM

Leave weak enemies alive longest

Your V-Lords will need a food source later on in the battle. It's best to leave creatures low in defense and HP's to fuel their renewal. I personally prefer to leave Marksmen, Griffons, and the leftover Crusaders(they need to be killed off by death knights or ghosts before they can do much, but no need to finish them off unless large numbers still leftover) to the V-Lords. Halbierders in suffecient numbers can actually do some damage especially blessed or with a lucky blow or morale move, kill them before the others in normal circumstances.

An idea also might be to leave zombies behind or turn them into skeletons before you leave your castle and divide the ghosts into 2 stacks. Two different methods, if your enemy has many AA's then make 2 equal stacks of Ghosts so if they do a first strike you still have some leftover. If not, make 1 stack only 1 or 2 ghosts the other stack the rest of them. Leave the largest stack further up so it moves first, you want both to survive as long as possible to make the most use of ghosts special.

Other than that, pretty much the rest have good ideas. most important thing for Necro vs Castle is the spell initative, if you can blind AA's then cast mass haste, the battle will probably be yours if you also have animate dead. If no blind or castle casts mass prayer or mass haste first and attack killing your liches and ghosts, then you must cast mass slow or something prevent AA's moving first again next turn- you can't survive two rounds of castle inatiative probably without huge amount of skeletons. Your best bet is to attack with skeletons first every time to absorb retaliation- animate dead works best on skeletons.

Don't forget your Wraiths, they are good vs Griffons or Marksmen only, better to use them to get retaliation then move them back and let them drain enemy mana.

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Thunder
Thunder


Responsible
Famous Hero
posted August 03, 2001 12:56 PM

Don`t bother to turn zombies to skeletons. Zombies are good units to eat retalitions. And those skeletons would be too costly (you get your skeletons free with necromancy), and the disease is a little bonus when it comes.

If 7th level stack wants to join you let them do so and turn them into bone dragons in skeleton transformer.
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thunderknight
thunderknight


Promising
Famous Hero
posted August 03, 2001 04:35 PM

Woo, maybe I should put it a bit clearer.

Attack zealot first. Ya, you may got crippled but zealot cannot destroy the whole VL stack. Then you attack marksman to recover. Then zealot or marksman or anything you can handle. One of the good way to use VL is to attack strong stack and regain hp from weak stacks.

Anyway, flexibility is the key.

That's why I say "maybe"

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malkia
malkia


Promising
Famous Hero
posted August 03, 2001 07:38 PM

If he got archangel he's going to get your liches. Always have zombies and skeletons near liches (zombies to be nearer). Attack with zombies arch's to get from them retaliation, then strike with skeletons. Move liches out, and if you have blind - blind archangels. Later you'll haste your liches to start first - or mass slow his units (if archangels are blinded). Better way actually is to first suck with vampires the archangels, then attack with zombies (arches will retaliete on them), then skeletons, and other units. Make sure that your vampires are on the 4th hex (liches are on the first, archangels on the next two, then your vampires). This way vampires can go into castle next turn. Make sure that you can attack at last with dread knights the archangels (then blind them).

Then - wait with all units.

If his army is stronger and he got shooters he'll not come out - but gather armies around - this is good for liches.

If you don't have blind:
Archangels are stupid enough sometime to ressurect troops instead of doing some real damage - when they are many. So if they didn't ressurect anything till now - try to kill their lowest unit starting from marksmen - they'll resurect marskmen again - which is good for vampires - to get food.

So generally if you have blind - start to blind his strongest creatures - archangels - cavalry - then griffins.

I don't use ghost dragons so much - I'm sacrificing them most of the time - try killing zealots at first. If you want marksmen - then don't hit them - just go where marksmen are - and hit the other unit guarding them - marksmen are bad at melee.

Wrights are wrights - no so much of use - use them as zombies - for units to get the retaliation.

Generally: if you have blind - go for it. If you don't make them mass slow - if you don't have it - accelerate your creatures (mass haste).

Things can go bad - if there is something to prevent the spells - castle - is strong without magic, but necroes not so much (they are the evil side - and they use evil magic to survive).

Make sure that you are better spellcaster before attacking (having 20 for spell power will ensure you that his creatures will be blinded more).

And of course you must have good necro - you'll need - ballistics! (cause most of the time you'll play with skeletons and dread knights). Earth magic is next to it for animate and mass slow. You don't need fire magic - well blind will be better - as it can't be retalieted... but... Humm.. somethin i forgot - you need AIR - you need AIR magic very much - because your Disrupting Ray is +5 (well Sha_Men can do that +7 - but he's not necro. If archangels are blinded - then after you've used mass slow/haste and blinded all others - start using disrupting rays!

If you have water - make sure you have it expert - so you can teleport your skeletons/dread knights. But maybe not so important. If you have large stack of skeletons (and I assume they will be your strongest unit) - then mirror will be good for them - to strike twice.

About towers - if you have balistics - always try to break the bridge - not the shooting towers. You must get in!
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Aculias
Aculias


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
posted April 02, 2002 04:14 AM

Well mostly the castle units are faster then you & does not matter if it is a last battle week one or week 3 necromancer should have a good army for using the necromancy skill to have skeletons & the castle units should come to you & if you can with liches go & attack to creatures in one but if not & if there are any enemies close hit them most likely would be an angel or champions because of their speed.
Zealots & marksmen only do half damage & depending on stats should you make the right decision.
Necromancers should be more offensive then castle on spells.
Watch out for the ground units they can be deadly & you should have more skeletons then you think.
Vamoires can be a good factor, you can do the wait hit & run or attack the strongest creature.
Try not to attack too soon with necromancer & if they do decide to bring in the arch angels Mayhaps have the zombies attack them first & then go all out with the rest.
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pikon
pikon

Tavern Dweller
famous wizard of magic
posted April 02, 2002 03:45 PM

In my oppion it could have been determed by a couple of things.

1. IF you had a strong hero or not
2. The level of your magic and what type.
3. Artifacts!

But if I were you I'd dicth necropolis because I did and now I'm on a 4 game win streak with both: tower once and castle 3 times. I actualy played as castle and liked it.
castle doesn't suck! ONLY TOWER IS BETTER!!!!
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Lord_Pegusus
Lord_Pegusus


Commanding Pegusi in Battle.
posted April 03, 2002 12:10 PM
Edited By: Lord_Pegusus on 3 Apr 2002

hard question

The ghost dragons and the AA's are reflections of each other.The GD's aging is cool but AA's resurected reflects that but resurect only works once a battle and aging can happen any time.The GD's -1 morale to opposition comes in handy but the AA's reflect that with +1 morale to troops in battle.But then the AA's are better in damage and speed.

The dread nights can beat champs BUT it depends on how far the champs move when they attack! (5% more damage every hex)

Zealots vs power liches is hard to say.Zealots dont get melee penalty but power liches attack all adjectant hexes while not hurting undead.I'm not sure who does more damage between them.

Vampire lords can beat crusaders as they suck hp and have no retaliation.Crusaders may attack twice but then vampires suck that back.

Royal griffins vs wraiths is easy to say.Royal griffins win as they have unlimited retaliations and are pretty much plain stronger!

Marksmen are weaker but will still win because they shoot twice move further so they will get first shot and zombies wont make it there until their dead.

Skeleton warriors are weaker but are way more numerous.Halberdiers are the strongest lvl 1 creature move further but still are less numerous because all necro heroes have necromancy.Skeletons Might win but i'm not sure.

Then again necro has WAY better magic but castle is made for battle.Necros aren't that good for battle.
SO IN ALL END CASTLE WILL MOST PROBABLY WIN!!!

PHEW
my fingers hurt
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Aculias
Aculias


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
posted April 03, 2002 01:02 PM

Not neccarily though.
COmpare the stats with the archs & the ghosts & plus Archs always has the maximum damage they are way powerful to a ghost also depends on streghnth.
Vamp lords would have better things to do then to work on a crusader & crusaders can wipe a vampire out with the right strategies.
Mostly does not matter who is better in their numeral order but stats & how you play the battle
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Mz
Mz

Tavern Dweller
posted April 23, 2002 09:20 PM

I think it depends....

I think Necromancer victory over Castle is quite possible although IMO quite hero based.  Level 20 Thant with 10+ spell power can animate 300+ skeletons per cast.  For castle skeletons are the biggest problem since if they don't widdle their numbers quickly they will lose (I tried it and skeletons go through Arch angels like knife through butter [not frozen butter   that is actually hard to cut]).


Necro arsenal includes:

- Dread Knights

 These guys are  quite annoying and will do quad damage or at least double damage alot of the time [certainly more than they should].  For some reason when I play with Thant, I always get a choice of Tactics, Earth Magic, Intelligence, Logistics, and Offense as skill choices.  The ones I get at least 95% of the time are Tactics and Earth magic, which is a good thing.  Thus Necropolis is my favorite town and Thant is my favorite hero (Secondary good ones are Galthran, Isra, Vidonmnia because of skeleton buff factor).  With expert Earth magic animating skeletons is very effective (ditto for dread knights).  And Tactics allow units to close in fast to do the damage.  I think that necromancers need to play more aggresively, like Stronghold players.  Ganging up on the most feared unit, possibly Arch Angel, depending on numbers is almost always a good idea, then crusaders, griffins, and then the rest.  Shooters will do no significant damage is you block them.

- Skeletons

 IMO the best unit of the game.  I can easily obtain around 300+ first couple of weeks with vampire lords and animate dead.  After that if you are lucky and you get Diplomacy wandering monster stacks will join like flies.  Off course it is not on every map that you can take advantage of this skill but on many you can (if Diplomacy is a waste on a current map then I usually choose water magic, -another skills Thant gets offered alot for Teleport and Prayer).  The above has a snowball effect, since the more creatures you have the higher the chance that a wondering stack will join your cause.  I am currently playing a XL map where I have managed to get over 2000 skeletons (most are veterans from the start of the game), for the past 15 minutes of the game I was able to accumulate close to 400 Ghost dragons (It is quite amazing really to see their special kick in almost every attack because of large numbers).

- Vampires

 Pretty much useless in later part of the game except maybe to take out weak units or to block shooters.  Early in the game, they are the primary means of conserving skeletons for late game.

- Zombies

 These are my favorite, I can't tell you how many times my friends cursed me when I blocked they units or ate up their retaliations.  Overall, just another way to conserve skeletons.

* Liches and ghost dragons are a bonus but quite useless against superior power of castle troops unless they are in large numbers and the castle player clumps low level units together to allow liches to do splash damage.

The main problem is that Necropolis lacks creatures that give initiative (Besides Ghost dragons).  There are several solution to these problem.  One, if I am not mistaken, if the opponent does not have tactics you get to go first.  Second, Air magic with haste, third getting a high level creature to join your cause (This is not difficult with 2000+ skeletons and expert diplomacy = 11 phoenexes or AA begging to join your ranks).

Failing to take advantage of the above option the scenario is still not lost.  IMO aggresive play is the key.  Place units during Tactics phase in the front lines and make sure that Zombies, Dread Knights and other eaters (of retaliation) for a semicircle around skeletons such that they cannot be ganged up upon.  Be prepared to use animate on the important units (dreads, skels possibly others, unless vampire lords are badly damaged dont bother animating them since you can attack the shooters and get health back). Although I cannot comment on specific attack, since they depend on too many factors (army strengths, spells used, battlefield layout), I do believe that killing AAs if they are in large amount is the best target choice.  Attack with Zombies, Dreads, followed up by skels.  Use implosion if you can.  Leave wraiths to drain the casters mana, or to block  shooters.  The main threat, again depends on numbers, are either AAs or crusaders.  Granted that griffins are good eaters but they suck on offense do to the lack of damage.  Champions may be annoying, but require tons of wood and ore to produce (again, map dependent).

Remember Necropolis units are like Zerg in SC.  Cheap, die easily, but become very powerful in large numbers.  For this reason, you should avoid attacking for as long as you can.  Generally, there are two good time scales to attack at.  One, is very early in the game, where you have 100-150 skeletons, and 20+ Vampires.  Here you will rely mostly on Thant's powerful animated dead spell to keep your units alive and kill the opposition.  Late game is also plausible since you will greatly outnumber your opponent.  Artifacts should also be mentioned since they can turn the tide of battle.

I don't think that Castle units are that bad to fight against, although they are pretty powerful and can wipe the floor with you if you are completely unlucky with skills (getting Eagle Eye and other useless skills), or make a very crucial mistake when combatting their units.

Mz
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HALT
HALT


Known Hero
Knight of Justice
posted April 23, 2002 10:31 PM

1. Do not take spawn take a vompiers. They have that bad sucking ability that helps them to stay at the same quantity.
2. Use bone dragons they have taro spell that makes creatures to run away from it without counterstrike.

gl
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d_yang1
d_yang1

Tavern Dweller
posted April 24, 2002 05:39 PM

i'm a skeleton groupie

Quote:
I think Necromancer victory over Castle is quite possible although IMO quite hero based.  Level 20 Thant with 10+ spell power can animate 300+ skeletons per cast.  For castle skeletons are the biggest problem since if they don't widdle their numbers quickly they will lose (I tried it and skeletons go through Arch angels like knife through butter [not frozen butter   that is actually hard to cut]).
Quote:


Mz is totally right.  the only point i'd argue against is about zombies being the best?!?  going up against castle, you need to charge and charge fast.  tactics sure helps but mass haste would help even more.  use your skeletons/death knights to take out crusader and large numbers of halberdiers (unless there's large numbers of champions/AA - or otherwise who hasn't attacked yet).  use your VL to cancel out the shooters and use GD primarily for its aging bonus.  whenever possible, use wraiths and zombies to take the initial retailiation of troops.  and liches attack the largest number of troops you can damage.


Quote:
Remember Necropolis units are like Zerg in SC.  Cheap, die easily, but become very powerful in large numbers.



good analogy, necropolis has a army of darkness thing going on.  avoid huge battles until you can ensure a strong hero with expert tactics/mass haste and a crap load of skeletons.  using the bony guys effectively being the key to victory.

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Mz
Mz

Tavern Dweller
posted April 25, 2002 11:07 PM
Edited By: Mz on 25 Apr 2002

Couple more thing...

The reason I chose zombie as a good creature is because they are nasty like Castle Griffins.  A necromancer could care less if he loses 200-300 of them (I know I don't), as a compensation you remove the creature's ability to retaliate (which is great when you follow up with an attack by skeletons or dreads).  Also few problems such as vampires not leeching from golems need to be looked at from a different perspective.  By attacking golems with vampires you are effectively lowering their number without being retaliated against.

I do have a major problem with Necropolis though: The apparent lack of strong units (even with Dreads).  Here is why...

I am playing a scenario against computer (my ISP has been giving my trouble lately).  I do not remember the map, but it is impossible difficulty and the map is also impossible difficulty.  I believe its an SOD medium sized map (one of the last ones in the list).

The towns you can choose are Dungeon, Inferno, Necropolis, and Conflux I think.  Conflux is boring to play with and the other towns are relatively weak at start.  Your opponent is a 4 town Tower (all 4 towns are Tower) and its a free for all.  Well, since I am mostly a Necro player I start out with a standard build (getting Vampire Lords asap and hording skeletons.  Note that the map is not particularly resource rich nor does it have many joiners (except if its a "week of the ...").  I manage to kill most of the towns on the map (some are eliminated by the Tower AI).  Now I am faced with a problem...

There is only 1 Necro town on the whole map (starting town), so hording Dreads, Vampires, and Ghosts is out of the question.

It is week 8 and my main army consists of:

4000 Skel
350 Zombie
80-90 Wights (for mana drain)
135 or so Vampires
40 Dreads
22 Ghosts

I have Thant with all Skills around 10 (+ some items that make certain skills around 15).  I have Animated Dead, Implosion, Armageddon and a bunch of other useful spells.

Necromancy, Mysticism, Air Magic, Earth Magic, Ballistics, Tactics, Offense and Diplomacy, all expert, if I remember correctly.

I am able to successfully destroy enemy Tower heroes all except one.

That one has:

145 Titans
400 Gargoyles
300 Naga queens
100 Master Geenies.
400-500 MGremlins.
and 50-100 Mages.

Advance with Tactics, mass Haste and go at 'em.  However 145 Titans do pose a problem.  They butcher my skellies in 1 hit doing around 12k damage.  If that wasn't enough 300 Nagas further punish my army.

The map consists of 8 towns I think.  4 in each corner and 2 in the middle, also 2 in upper left and lower right corners underground.  The enterances to underground towns are in upper left and lower right respectively.  Furthermore, the two underground cities are connected by a 2 way monolith.

Anywho, after 2 hours of repeated battle against the main Tower army I realized it was pointless unless a miracle happens (i.e. Cloak of Undead king).  So, I gave up my Necropolis (which got siezed right away) and started doing hit and runs of all of the Tower towns hoping to find Necromany amulet (already have Dead Man's boots, and Cape).  Just to mention, I can defeat any one of his heroes except the one with 145 Titans, that is how I built up my skeleton army.  Hopefully, with 1000+ liches I can end the scenario.
Town portal really helps.

Any suggestions?

Mz
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d_yang1
d_yang1

Tavern Dweller
posted April 26, 2002 05:38 PM

Quote:

The reason I chose zombie as a good creature is because they are nasty like Castle Griffins.  A necromancer could care less if he loses 200-300 of them (I know I don't)



that's what i think of them, but they do take up an army stack, which would be better used with a stack more active in a battle (i tend to use higher level creature from a different town, like titans, devils or even cyclop kings)
when i start out in a map i love to assign 1 or 2 quick but extremely few/weak creature as army stacks, which i then use as a first attack to eat up retaliatory attacks in tougher battles.

Quote:

Your opponent is a 4 town Tower (all 4 towns are Tower) and its a free for all.  
...
There is only 1 Necro town on the whole map (starting town), so hording Dreads, Vampires, and Ghosts is out of the question.



if this is the case your best solution would have been to capture as many tower towns as possible and use town portal to build up your tower army and eventually abandon your necro forces (not especially appealling when you spend the time to develop your army but the most strategic one).  the big key here would be to avoid that intensely nasty army which I'd argue is completely impossible to defeat given the quantities of armies you've described - at least for me it'd be impossible to do.

Quote:

Advance with Tactics, mass Haste and go at 'em.  However 145 Titans do pose a problem.  They butcher my skellies in 1 hit doing around 12k damage.  If that wasn't enough 300 Nagas further punish my army.



expert forgetfulness/air shield can be invaluable spells when it comes to fighting tower armies.  the best way to negate the advantage of tower's ranged attacks is to use spells or the mad rush.  of course tower is likely to have better spells than you and if you're fighting in seige combat (tower defending), you're defintely screwed.

Quote:

Any suggestions?



if it were me and i couldn't build up a comparable tower army by using town portal every new week, then i'd probably spend a good 10 minutes cursing the inanimate objects right in front of me and go do something else.

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Mz
Mz

Tavern Dweller
posted May 02, 2002 04:03 PM

Finally figured it out...

I finally got this map done after restarting the scenario with the Necro again.  I believe I gave too much time for the Tower to develop its 4 towns and then mass Titans.

When I replayed it I early rushed (week 2 I think with around 300 skellies, through hiring heros and skeleton transforming their troops).

Even though it set me back a bit financially, I was able to capture a dungeon town early on and use mana vortex to boost my spell points.  Using animate dead I had around 600 skeletons by week 3, and then rolled over 2 Tower towns, purchased cape of velocity, and won the  scenario .  Didn't even get to vampire lords.  Cape of velocity + manticore = initiative.  Rushing is the only way to beat a Tower player who has more Tower towns then you have Necro towns (Luckily I got Ballistics as one of my first choices, otherwise siege battles would have been very costly).

Mz
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Dingo
Dingo


Responsible
Legendary Hero
God of Dark SPAM
posted November 19, 2003 04:18 AM

Interesting thread, lots of Qps should be handed out.
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binabik
binabik


Responsible
Legendary Hero
posted November 22, 2003 02:27 AM

Just wanted to add a couple things to the above.

As always, it depends on the numbers. With first strike/retal, the AA could be thinned out from previous battles. So even with moderate numbers, the AA may not be nearly as much threat as the champions who haven't taken as much retal in previous battles.

With spells, it's always a decision to cast or wait to see what the enemy does. If castle hasn't cast yet, there is a good chance on it's second turn it will mass haste those champions. If the AA didn't hit your liches first turn, the champions likely will ..... with a long diagonal across the field to get there. Champs are the only unit in the game that get increased damage from haste, potentially +25% for an already strong unit.

Mass hasted champions are dangerous and you're taking a chance by not blinding them if castle hasn't cast yet. Round two, they can go almost anywhere on the field, and will hit your dreads and ghosts who are probably not nearby. That's another long run for the champs and also takes them out of range of the zombie/skels. Since the skels/zombies probably hit the champs round one, they haven't taken a single step toward where the action is likely to be. It could even be over with by the time they get there.

Necro vs castle is great for blinding and dealing with them later. What could be the most dangerous castle stacks are AA, champs and Griffins. All two hex units. Necro has four one-hex melee units and can surround blinded unit and gang up.

Cast slow, disrupt, whatever.

First strike by either GD OR dread but not both, It depends on numbers, the other waits (unless you're trying to prevent a high level hero from retreating). no retal

Next is vamps. no retal
Next is liches. no retal
Now red-eyes. first retal
finally skels, zombies and whoever waited first time ---- assuming castle hero hasn't already run as fast as they can for the nearest tavern.

Necro's order of attack and special ablities allowed three "no-retal" in a row and only skipping one unit to do it. And those attacks were all level 4 and higher.
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