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| Thread: Star Wars And You |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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terje_the_ma...
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Disciple of Herodotus
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posted May 28, 2005 11:08 PM |
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Bah, it's not that bad.
I can still enjoy the beautiful landscape of Naboo.
...
... and th utter boredom of that podrace... 
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"Sometimes I think everyone's just pretending to be brave, and none of us really are. Maybe pretending to be brave is how you get brave, I don't know."
- Grenn, A Storm of Swords.
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TitaniumAlloy
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Professional
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posted May 29, 2005 10:54 AM |
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SPOILER
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And also, are Darth Sidious and Chancellor Palpatine the same person in the end? I'm not sure...
They ARE the same person, as *says a spoiler* Palpatine trains Anakin into Vader.
I know I'm gonna sound like a nerd saying this, but I heard this argument before. I heard (and checked) that on the star wars website, theres two different profiles for Sidious and the other guy, and they look different..
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John says to live above hell.
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jebus
Promising
Supreme Hero
TheJester akaJeebs akaJebfoo
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posted May 29, 2005 05:56 PM |
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Edited By: jebus on 29 May 2005
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Quote:
SPOILER
I know I'm gonna sound like a nerd saying this, but I heard this argument before. I heard (and checked) that on the star wars website, theres two different profiles for Sidious and the other guy, and they look different..
SPOILER
not sure how to answer except in episode 3, you actually SEE the transformation from palpatine into the molested face of the emperor... (and he addresses the senat as palpatine and has the dark robe on..)
And with the profiles you attached above, they look like they're only referring to episodes 1 maybe a bit of 2...
They had to do the 2 profiles or they dive away the entire plot of the 3 movies.
J
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"You went over my helmet??"
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted May 30, 2005 09:04 AM |
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Viceroy: We been expecting you Lord vader
2 minutes later
Viceroy: The war is over BLAWHHHAAAA!!!!!!
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Dreaming of a Better World
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TheRealDeal
Promising
Supreme Hero
Foobum* of Justice!
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posted May 30, 2005 11:36 AM |
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Spoiler
TA i'm sorry to give this information but..
If you'd actually read the 2 links you've given.. you read that.. THEY ARE THE SAME PERSON!
Besides that was knowable during the 2nd film.. Almost in the first.. But now, i also saw them a few times! 
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*We all know the that Foobum is the class of all that is Cake.
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Jebus
Promising
Supreme Hero
TheJester akaJeebs akaJebfoo
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posted May 30, 2005 02:50 PM |
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So can we poke fun at Conan??
(buddy im givin' you the chance to admit your
questions after episode 2... you know what Im talking about!!)
J
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TheRealDeal
Promising
Supreme Hero
Foobum* of Justice!
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posted May 30, 2005 03:17 PM |
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You guys are being so melodramatic.. .. *Spoilers on and off ahead*
I guess i'm the only one here rooting for the Siths! Go Daarth, it's ya birthday!
Just to bad Darth Maul had to die so fast, he was really wicked! ..
And i LOVE all the films.. You can say what you wan't, but they are good.. I like the dialogues and stuff. I only have one comment, some of the effects might be a little .. you know, bad. But other than that i love the fighting, and the epic moments..
Ifd i had to choose between being a Jedi, or a Sith.. I'd go Sith all the way, they are stronger. Look at the number of siths, and the number of Jedis.. and Siths still kick ass! One man (Sidious) turns the world into a warzone, with nothing but his diplomatic abilities! And when the world finally runs amok, he takes his chances and controls everything.. Only ONE thing went wrong for the siths, The Death Of Padmé .. Thats when the siths lose, because that kind of destroys whats left of sense in vader/anakin.. if he had had her, he would still be of somewhat sanity.. All he did, he did for love.. ^_^
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*We all know the that Foobum is the class of all that is Cake.
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Jebus
Promising
Supreme Hero
TheJester akaJeebs akaJebfoo
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posted May 30, 2005 03:42 PM |
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Edited By: Jebus on 30 May 2005
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You guys are being so melodramatic.. .. *Spoilers on and off ahead*
it's all I know... DONT TAKE THAT AWAY FROM ME!!!
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I guess i'm the only one here rooting for the Siths! Go Daarth,
Just to bad Darth Maul had to die so fast, he was really wicked!
And i LOVE all the films.. You can say what you wan't, but they are good.. I like the dialogues and stuff. I only have one comment, some of the effects might be a little .. you know, bad. But other than that i love the fighting, and the epic moments..
Ifd i had to choose between being a Jedi, or a Sith.. I'd go Sith all the way, they are stronger. Look at the number of siths, and the number of Jedis.. and Siths still kick ass! One man (Sidious) turns the world into a warzone, with nothing but his diplomatic abilities! And when the world finally runs amok, he takes his chances and controls everything.. Only ONE thing went wrong for the siths, The Death Of Padmé .. Thats when the siths lose, because that kind of destroys whats left of sense in vader/anakin.. if he had had her, he would still be of somewhat sanity.. All he did, he did for love.. ^_^
Hey Im a HUGE fan of Darth Vader... (man if I could force choke people Id......
Good films??? Unless you're blind AND deaf (or never saw the originals) how can you say that??
-horrible acting
-horrible script writing
-what the hell is a midi cholorian??? (luckily wrapped up in episode 3)
You are right in that Darth Maul died too fast... he was wicked bad!! In the new 3 movies we didn't have time to hate or love either villain.
And what was the point in bringing in the wookies?? that scene was too short...
Also, you're telling me that We (as fans) are ok with the concept that Darth Vader (as a child) created C3PO???
C'MON PEOPLE!!!!
You made another good point... The Jedi get mowed too easily... what ever happened to "Darth Vader helped hunt down and destroy the jedi"??? He killed the younglings... that was it... clones did the rest!
And more than 80% of the Jedi you see in the first 3 movies were really SAD! Even Mace looked pathetic in his "Jedi" fighting....
(Man I told myself I wouldn't do this....)
why didn't Anakin force choke Jar Jar??
more to come
J
(EPISODE 3 SPOILER)
here's some more:
1)and where in the end did you see the "master and slave" dynamic between vader and sidious???
Why would the sith lord really care if his apprentice was in trouble and if he did value the power of vader, should he have tried to manipulate the situation by making vader look weak and worthless??? make him beg for his life and pledge a life of servitude to the emperor and at least the famous lines "You don't know the power of the dark side. I must obey my master." would hold a little more meaning!!
2)didn't sidious promise to heal padme of her pendind death with his power (you know the entire reason vadder chose that path??) where was the show of deception by vadder to sidious for letting her die after he said he'd show him the power to stop death???
There should have been a final conflict between the 2 siths and the emperor could have had one final display of exceeding power over vader to reinforce the master slave relationship.
J
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"You went over my helmet??"
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terje_the_ma...
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Disciple of Herodotus
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posted May 30, 2005 10:50 PM |
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THIS POST CONTAINS SPOILERS!!!!!
Quote:
1)and where in the end did you see the "master and slave" dynamic between vader and sidious???
Why would the sith lord really care if his apprentice was in trouble and if he did value the power of vader, should he have tried to manipulate the situation by making vader look weak and worthless??? make him beg for his life and pledge a life of servitude to the emperor and at least the famous lines "You don't know the power of the dark side. I must obey my master." would hold a little more meaning!!
2)didn't sidious promise to heal padme of her pendind death with his power (you know the entire reason vadder chose that path??) where was the show of deception by vadder to sidious for letting her die after he said he'd show him the power to stop death???
There should have been a final conflict between the 2 siths and the emperor could have had one final display of exceeding power over vader to reinforce the master slave relationship.
Sad to say it, bud, but you've misunderstood things. There never was a slave/master relationship between Vader and Sidious. Sidious protrayed himself as the benevolent friend, who tried to help Anakin in his struggle to gain acknowlegdement from the Jedis. Anakin voluteerly decided to aid Sidious, there never was any threats from the Emperor against Anakin, if you don't count the indirect threats to Padmé.
Which brings me to my next point - the promise Palpatine/Sidious/Emperor made to Anakin, concerning Padmé.
First of all, on the volcano planet, Anakin, in his mad ravings, decided that Obi-Wan had turned Padmé against him, and that she now was her enemy (he didn't say that outright, but remember his words - if you're not with me, you're my enemy, and PAdmé sure as hell wasn't with him!). His love for her, although not dead, most likely turned into a kind of manical love-hate relationship to her.
Second, when she died, wasn't he still a crippled, half-burned madman? How do you propose that the Emperor and Vader should go about and "resuce" her from the hands of Yoda, Obi and that senator, when they were hidden and the Siths busy elsewhere? Not to mention that her death would give Sidious further ammunition in his quest to make Vader hate Obi, Yoda and those guys even more...
Oh, and rooting for the bad guys, that's just pathetic. "Whooo, look at me, I'm special! I'm evil! I'm rooting for the Bad Guys!". Sounds like something some stupid goth'd do, if you ask me...
But hey, each to her taste...
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"Sometimes I think everyone's just pretending to be brave, and none of us really are. Maybe pretending to be brave is how you get brave, I don't know."
- Grenn, A Storm of Swords.
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jebus
Promising
Supreme Hero
TheJester akaJeebs akaJebfoo
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posted May 30, 2005 11:41 PM |
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Edited By: jebus on 30 May 2005
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Uh... Terje??? you slammin' me here??? not sure!
And I hate to say it but I think you missed my point..
here goes:
Quote:
Quote:
1)and where in the end did you see the "master and slave" dynamic between vader and sidious???
Why would the sith lord really care if his apprentice was in trouble and if he did value the power of vader, should he have tried to manipulate the situation by making vader look weak and worthless??? make him beg for his life and pledge a life of servitude to the emperor and at least the famous lines "You don't know the power of the dark side. I must obey my master." would hold a little more meaning!!
2)didn't sidious promise to heal padme of her pendind death with his power (you know the entire reason vadder chose that path??) where was the show of deception by vadder to sidious for letting her die after he said he'd show him the power to stop death???
There should have been a final conflict between the 2 siths and the emperor could have had one final display of exceeding power over vader to reinforce the master slave relationship.
Sad to say it, bud, but you've misunderstood things. There never was a slave/master relationship between Vader and Sidious. Sidious protrayed himself as the benevolent friend, who tried to help Anakin in his struggle to gain acknowlegdement from the Jedis. Anakin voluteerly decided to aid Sidious, there never was any threats from the Emperor against Anakin, if you don't count the indirect threats to Padmé.
There was a slave/master relationshipe between Vader and sidious??? ARE YOU KIDDING?>???
have you even seen episodes 4-6???
All through those oldies, Vader always refers to Sidius as "my master"! (and I know you're going to say that that 's how they talk but in JEDI (6), the emperor clearly states: "It is unavoidable. It is your destiny. You, like your father, are now mine!"
(looks like possession to me!) and vader states: "You don't know the power of the dark side. I must obey my master."
What I was trying to demonstrate was the Master/Slave relationship in episodes 4-6 that is never really established in 3. I my commments were to demonstrate the possible manipulation by the emperor to portray this.
Quote:
Which brings me to my next point - the promise Palpatine/Sidious/Emperor made to Anakin, concerning Padmé.
Second, when she died, wasn't he still a crippled, half-burned madman? How do you propose that the Emperor and Vader should go about and "resuce" her from the hands of Yoda, Obi and that senator, when they were hidden and the Siths busy elsewhere? Not to mention that her death would give Sidious further ammunition in his quest to make Vader hate Obi, Yoda and those guys even more...
Im not sure of your point...
I never stated that the emperor and vader should rescue anyone... I said that vader should have shown some malcontent with the emperor because he promissed to help vader learn the power to stop her from dying! And when she did die, there was nothing... no "but you said.." or "you lied" or "you deceiced me"!!
These ideas were, imo, ways that they could have demonstrated the hold that Sidious would have over Vader in the next films... that's all!
Quote:
Oh, and rooting for the bad guys, that's just pathetic. "Whooo, look at me, I'm special! I'm evil! I'm rooting for the Bad Guys!". Sounds like something some stupid goth'd do, if you ask me...
But hey, each to her taste...
Who is this directed to???
I don't think I even mentioned going for the bad guys...
confused
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"You went over my helmet??"
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terje_the_ma...
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Disciple of Herodotus
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posted May 31, 2005 12:26 AM |
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Quote:
There was a slave/master relationshipe between Vader and sidious??? ARE YOU KIDDING?>???
have you even seen episodes 4-6???
All through those oldies, Vader always refers to Sidius as "my master"! (and I know you're going to say that that 's how they talk but in JEDI (6), the emperor clearly states: "It is unavoidable. It is your destiny. You, like your father, are now mine!"
(looks like possession to me!) and vader states: "You don't know the power of the dark side. I must obey my master."
The way I see it, there's no master-slave relationship, but a master-apprentice thing. But I guess the difference is marginal, since the Sith aren't exactly inclined towards democracy.
So the Master is still master, and the Apprentice is still the subordinate guy.
Quote:
What I was trying to demonstrate was the Master/Slave relationship in episodes 4-6 that is never really established in 3. I my commments were to demonstrate the possible manipulation by the emperor to portray this.
Im not sure of your point...
I never stated that the emperor and vader should rescue anyone... I said that vader should have shown some malcontent with the emperor because he promissed to help vader learn the power to stop her from dying! And when she did die, there was nothing... no "but you said.." or "you lied" or "you deceiced me"!!
These ideas were, imo, ways that they could have demonstrated the hold that Sidious would have over Vader in the next films... that's all!
Although you do have a point, I still don't see it as a Master-slave thing. Master-servant/successor/apprentice/something, but no master-slave. The masters of old used to be quite harsh on their apprentices.
Well, for one, there's really no turing back for Vader now, is it? What could he accomplish by "attacking" his new master?
And the way I understood the film, I got the impression that Vader kinda blamed Obi for turning her against him, and all that, so although I'm sure he still loved her, I think he wouldn't take her death that hard. Umm, that didn't come out right. Of course he'd take her death hard, but I think he'd lay more blame at the feet of Obi than those of the Emperor...
Who is this directed to???
Quote:
I don't think I even mentioned going for the bad guys...
confused
Not you man.
Read a post a couple of posts up. 
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"Sometimes I think everyone's just pretending to be brave, and none of us really are. Maybe pretending to be brave is how you get brave, I don't know."
- Grenn, A Storm of Swords.
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jebus
Promising
Supreme Hero
TheJester akaJeebs akaJebfoo
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posted May 31, 2005 12:54 AM |
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Well there's a few references to "my servant"
from the emperor to Vader (or to Luc about vader)
in the old trilogy.
I think it's important to understand that the sith dynamic is about control and power. The master wants to stay the master and in most cases the apprentice is trying to find his own apprentice, to then, together overthrow his master.
In JEDI, the emperor attempts to convince Luc to strike down Vader and take his place at the emperor's side.
Just like Vader in Empire tries to convince Luc to join him to overthrow the Emperor. "he has forseen it"
I don't think the apprentice relationship is the same for the Sith as for the Jedi. It's more a domination issue than having a mentor.
That's why there's never multiple sith... They only want 2. Master and apprentice. So the master can make sure he's not overthrown by a new comer...
J
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"You went over my helmet??"
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terje_the_ma...
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Disciple of Herodotus
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posted May 31, 2005 01:41 AM |
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Quote:
I don't think the apprentice relationship is the same for the Sith as for the Jedi. It's more a domination issue than having a mentor.
That's why there's never multiple sith... They only want 2. Master and apprentice. So the master can make sure he's not overthrown by a new comer...
Yeah, I agree wholeheartedly with you here, but I still think that master-apprentice fits better than master-slave. Also, like you said, it's in the nature of the Sith to try and overthrow their masters. The way I see it, this seems like the most probable way a Sith gets promoted from apprentice to master.
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"Sometimes I think everyone's just pretending to be brave, and none of us really are. Maybe pretending to be brave is how you get brave, I don't know."
- Grenn, A Storm of Swords.
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jebus
Promising
Supreme Hero
TheJester akaJeebs akaJebfoo
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posted May 31, 2005 03:50 AM |
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Quote:
Yeah, I agree wholeheartedly with you here, but I still think that master-apprentice fits better than master-slave. Also, like you said, it's in the nature of the Sith to try and overthrow their masters. The way I see it, this seems like the most probable way a Sith gets promoted from apprentice to master.
Exactly so wouldn't it make sense for the master to dominate the apprentice... total servitude.
In Jedi, the emperor says to luc something along the lines of "you make yourself more my servant".
That's how it works actually... Palpatine mentions to anakin in 3 how the Sith that could alter or control life was killed by his apprentice in his sleep AND mentions how he learnt this power (of controlling life) by a powerfull dark lord. Basically, indirectly saying he murdered his master after learning the power.
Makes you want to be part of the chain don't it???
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"You went over my helmet??"
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Leo_Lion
Honorable
Supreme Hero
The 5th Element & 6th Sense!
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posted May 31, 2005 06:12 AM |
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Episode II & III spoilers ahead...
One of the points that really stuck with me, while watching Episode II, was when Obi-Wan is taken captive by Dooku on Geonosis. When Dooku enters the room and starts telling OB1 (good acronym, by the way, Jebus  ) the truth about "a Sith Lord controlling the Senate", OB1 responds by refusing to believe him.
I always wondered why Dooku took the chance to tell all of this information to OB1; but from reading the discussion so far, I now realize that Dooku was trying to see if OB1 would join him in trying to overthrow Darth_Sidious and assume power themselves...with OB1 as Dooku's apprentice, of course.
It all falls into place now, because when OB1 fights with General Grievous, the cyborg tells OB1 that he was trained by Dooku in the Jedi arts...which means that Dooku was still looking for an apprentice to help him overthrow Sidious. And that explains why Sidious was so willing to have Dooku killed by Anakin, as well. Eliminate the unruly Dooku and replace him with "a younger and more powerful" apprentice.
BUT!!! What really surprised me was when Anakin was talking to Padme on "the lava planet", he was already referring to overthrowing his Master...even though he had just recently become his apprentice.  I remember him telling her: "We can rule everything and create the galaxy that we've always wanted!"
I guess he jumped the gun a little, eh?!
As to why Sidious was concerned with Anakin being in trouble...There's only one way that I can see this making any sense: Since all (or most) of the Jedi were already killed, Sidious would not have been able to recruit another apprentice right away and it would have taken him a while to search out someone else from the general population.
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*The end to no beginning...
*Take care, Leo
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Jebus
Promising
Supreme Hero
TheJester akaJeebs akaJebfoo
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posted May 31, 2005 04:16 PM |
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I thought I'd bring new light to the argument in inviting a pure Star Wars fan (see reference to blind loyal fans above) to the discussion...
"always 2 there are with the sith... A master and an apprentice..."
J
The floor is yours BadouneJr (a.k.a. Darth Cousin)
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"You went over my helmet??"
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BadouneJr
Tavern Dweller
Darth Cousin
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posted May 31, 2005 04:24 PM |
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LOL... Darth Cousin... I like that!! (I couldn't have said it better myself)
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"Do or do not, there is no try"
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BadouneJr
Tavern Dweller
Darth Cousin
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posted May 31, 2005 04:58 PM |
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Alright... so although I agree with my cousin (Jebus) in most respect when it comes to Star Wars... there are certain areas that we disagree on... but one thing we agree is that Princess Leia looks good in a metal bikini.
Now if we're still talking about ROTS (Revenge Of The Sith) we really have to bring up the coolest fact about that movie...
SPOILER
When Anakin force chokes Padme... now that was sweet!!
That's evil if I ever saw it.
Ok... so here what SW means to me... (sounds like a 4th grade class assignment) lol
My first memories of SW are of playing with my cousin Miguel's action figures and being totally obsessed with characters and vehicle from a galaxy far far away. Before ever seeing the movies, I had the bed sheets, toys, cereal, pyjamas and lunch box.
I remember the first time I saw ANH (A New Hope) was on TV and the VCR was set... I was blown away by lightsabers and wookies. I must have watched that movie until the tape wore out...and when I thought I could not be more blown away by a movie we rented a copy of TESB (The Empire Strikes Back)and even until this very day... it remains my favorite episode of all.
Then in 1983 when I was 7 years old and ROTJ (Return Of The Jedi) was in theatres... I had the pleasure of seeing my beloved heroes on the "Big Screen" for the first time.
Now if you ask me about my dedication to Star Wars I'll tell you this... I don't know of any other movie that would make people stand in line for hours when they've seen it 100 times before. When the Special Editions of the 3 original movies were released, I couldn't wait for the chance to FINALLY see these movies in Widescreen format on the big screen... at 21 years of age in 1997 when they were in the theatres... I sat in my seat with anticipation and when the 20th Century Fox theme played and when those two words in yellow flashed across the screen, I had a grin like I was 7 and seeing them for the first time.
In a nutshell that's the affect SW has had on me. My friends can attest to that fact.
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"Do or do not, there is no try"
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Jebus
Promising
Supreme Hero
TheJester akaJeebs akaJebfoo
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posted May 31, 2005 05:34 PM |
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Conan,
you asked to see mine (wait that sounds bad!! )
but you've yet to show me yours!! (d'oh!!)
Where's your StarWars story bud??
J
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"You went over my helmet??"
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TheRealDeal
Promising
Supreme Hero
Foobum* of Justice!
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posted May 31, 2005 05:59 PM |
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LoL rooting for the sith is bad? Oh my god.. How?
1: Jedis are so ... uptight and dumb. They never see anything comming, and thats kinda sick since they can see into the future.
I see this Sith/Jedi thing like politics, both sides has advantages, both sides have downs... Example: Jedis are so uptight they can't even make good jugdement anymore.. and a downside for siths: They'll do everything to rise to power, no matter what, which is a little harsh.
And siths have better fighting powers... cooler powers in general. Example: Ressurecting people, keeping them from dying.. See that'd be sweet. Now what can a jedi do? mm... well the sith can do all does things aswell, woopi dee do?
The Sith has got the coolest powers, but the become... mad, so to speak. Which is a major downside.. And their madness is only decreased by a gain of power, or deep sorrow. (i Can bring examples, if needed)
The Sith has just got some kind of Řdipus complex (the greek god who wanted his mother, he was blind, etc) @ the master/aprentice part.. or thats the way i see it..
Siths for teh win!
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*We all know the that Foobum is the class of all that is Cake.
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