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Heroes Community > Library of Enlightenment > Thread: Not in the Manual
Thread: Not in the Manual This thread is 26 pages long: 1 ... 5 6 7 8 9 ... 10 20 26 · «PREV / NEXT»
LegendMaker
LegendMaker


Promising
Famous Hero
The Metal Specialist
posted March 26, 2006 11:59 PM

Quote:
@Legend  How's the testing going? I can still do some if you're not up to it. Let me know which ones.
Should be finished in a few days tops.

Well, you're asking so nicely I just don't have it in me to refuse your help a second time.

I'm doing them in increasing order from 1 to 50. Would the last 10 (from 41 to 50) be okay for you to do ?

Tia, Bin.

Legend.

PS : Since you're taking over Xarfax's leadership for the last stage of the project, does that make you my new boss ? Lmao

PPS : If so, I think it wouldn't be too well perceived that you gave yourself a case of german beer as salary... Forward it all to me, instead !
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LM

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dimis
dimis


Responsible
Supreme Hero
Digitally signed by FoG
posted March 28, 2006 03:29 AM
Edited by dimis on 27 Mar 2006

Magic Arrow again ...

Well, I also thought that Magic Arrow belonged to Fire Magic School before this thread and I 've understood everything you 've written so far as explanations for not casting Magic Arrow on Efreets. But, there is another way of viewing this inability of casting (which forces Magic Arrow being a Fire Spell). Suppose I have a hero with expert Fire Magic, no other magic school and I cast Visions (which belongs to ALL Magic Schools) on a nearby opponent hero who carries Efreets. I will be able to view the exact number of Efreet that hero is carrying with him, meaning also an exact number of his Efreets. But this contradicts the fact that Efreet are immune to Fire Magic (of course Visions belongs to ALL magic schools, since it can not belong NOWHERE) which is not the case. So, either Efreet Immunity takes place ONLY on the battlefield, or Magic Arrow IS a Fire spell ... Anyhow, we have a new item for the alternative manual.
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angelito
angelito


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
posted March 28, 2006 05:44 AM

lol...u donīt cast visions "ON" a unit. Like u donīt cast view air "ON" an artefact. Visions is a map spell, which allows u to get more infos from the map (including wandering monsters). It isnīt affected by any resistance (you can use it on Black Dragons aswell.) or immunity.

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Binabik
Binabik


Responsible
Legendary Hero
posted March 28, 2006 12:10 PM
Edited by Binabik on 28 Mar 2006

I've tested 41-50, except 47.

41 OK
42 OK
43 OK

Quote:
44. Armorer specialistst and air shield do increase the damage you receive from the castle's towers, instead of reducing.

OK as is.

FYI: I didn't do enough testing to get exact percentages, but:
Basic Air Shield increases damage approx 30%
Advanced and expert Air Shield approx doubles damage
Exp Armoror increases damage approx 15%.


45 OK
46 OK

Quote:
47. A hero without creatures will disappear as soon as he gots attacked.

I couldn't figure out how to do this. As I mentioned in an earlier post, I thought a ghost hero was created by winning a battle with only summoned creatures left. But that doesn't work.

Quote:
48. Warmachines count as level 2 units. So if a hero starts with a warmachine, he will never have a level 2 creature with him aswell.

That's almost right, but not quite.  A hero with Balista or First Aid specialty NEVER starts with level 2 creatures, even if they don't start with their war machine. This includes Torosar who has the specialty, but not the Artillery skill.

The 3 heroes who have Artillery skill, but are not specialists, never start with a ballista and can have level 2 creatures.

Quote:
49. Each Mighty Gorgon in a stack has a 10% of Death stare, but Death stare only happens 1 time per 10 Mighty Gorgons.

Wording similar to this is OK for the tavern rumors. But can anyone think of a better technical way to word it? For example 11 MGs can kill 2 and 21 MGs can kill 3.

50 OK
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dimis
dimis


Responsible
Supreme Hero
Digitally signed by FoG
posted March 28, 2006 12:23 PM
Edited by dimis on 28 Mar 2006

Quote:
lol...u donīt cast visions "ON" a unit. Like u donīt cast view air "ON" an artefact. Visions is a map spell, which allows u to get more infos from the map (including wandering monsters). It isnīt affected by any resistance (you can use it on Black Dragons aswell.) or immunity.

The fact that I can use it against Black Dragons doesn't mean a thing. I see that I didn't express myself correctly on the post above. My proposition is the same: Creature immunities are for the Battlefield - NOT THE MAP, or (AND) Magic Arrow IS a Fire Spell.

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Vlaad
Vlaad


Admirable
Legendary Hero
ghost of the past
posted March 28, 2006 12:33 PM

Quote:
Quote:
47. A hero without creatures will disappear as soon as he gots attacked.

I couldn't figure out how to do this. As I mentioned in an earlier post, I thought a ghost hero was created by winning a battle with only summoned creatures left. But that doesn't work.


You need two heroes, each with 1 stack of 1 creature. When they meet, choose one of the creatures and click "split creatures". You cannot move the split bar, but the single creature of one hero will be transfered.
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Binabik
Binabik


Responsible
Legendary Hero
posted March 28, 2006 12:43 PM

OK, thanks.  #47 is tested now.

Except I thought they were supposed to be able to travel further, but mine didn't.

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angelito
angelito


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
posted March 28, 2006 01:59 PM
Edited by angelito on 28 Mar 2006

Quote:
The fact that I can use it against Black Dragons doesn't mean a thing. I see that I didn't express myself correctly on the post above. My proposition is the same: Creature immunities are for the Battlefield - NOT THE MAP, or (AND) Magic Arrow IS a Fire Spell.


And where is the proof for the "fire spell"?? You said this:
Quote:
I will be able to view the exact number of Efreet that hero is carrying with him, meaning also an exact number of his Efreets. But this contradicts the fact that Efreet are immune to Fire Magic

But this is not true...it does NOT contradict the fact efreets are immune to fire, coz u donīt cast visions directly ON them.

Try your scenario without giving expert fire to your hero, but expert air (or wate, earth).
Now lets see if u can get infos about the efreets. You will for sure get the same results.
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dimis
dimis


Responsible
Supreme Hero
Digitally signed by FoG
posted March 28, 2006 03:06 PM

Quote:
Quote:
The fact that I can use it against Black Dragons doesn't mean a thing. I see that I didn't express myself correctly on the post above. My proposition is the same: Creature immunities are for the Battlefield - NOT THE MAP, or (AND) Magic Arrow IS a Fire Spell.


And where is the proof for the "fire spell"?? You said this:
Quote:
I will be able to view the exact number of Efreet that hero is carrying with him, meaning also an exact number of his Efreets. But this contradicts the fact that Efreet are immune to Fire Magic

But this is not true...it does NOT contradict the fact efreets are immune to fire, coz u donīt cast visions directly ON them.

Try your scenario without giving expert fire to your hero, but expert air (or wate, earth).
Now lets see if u can get infos about the efreets. You will for sure get the same results.


Well, I migh not cast Visions directly on Efreet, yet I do so indirectly (that's the way I see it). If you cast Visions on wandering monsters you are able to see numbers of Black Dragons, Efreets, etc. This can be because as you say you cast Visions ON THE MAP (reasonable), or because Creature Immunities refer ONLY ON THE BATTLEFIELD. The problem is that there is no other spell that belongs to all Schools of Magic and can be casted on battlefield and know the outcome of our ability casting this other spell over Efreets. So, I don't see the objection with the inclusion of the sentence:
"Creatures' immunities refer ONLY on the battlefield or (and) Magic Arrow is a Fire Spell" which certainly implies something not given in the manual - you can not cast Magic Arrow on creatures immune to Fire.

Of course this reasoning can not contradict your arguments behind your logic and the effect that ALL Magic Schools have over Magic Arrow. But also your arguments of Magic Arrow belonging to ALL Schools of Magic can not contradict the sentence I have above and the way I see Visions effect; meaning that eventually I apply it on creatures immune to it.

One more note: On my first post last night I forgot the existence of Black Dragons (lol ) and thought my argument was much stronger than it seems now ...
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angelito
angelito


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
posted March 28, 2006 04:03 PM

You can test the following scenario with visions and magic arrow. (If it would be a "bug" like Xarfax mentioned, it makes me wonder why it is the same for BOTH spells)
If magic arrow would be a firespell, shouldnīt it be shown as firespell in your spellbook then, especially for the case u donīt have any magic secondary skill?
If u have fire and earth magic, it is shown as earth spell. If u have air and fire, it is shown as air spell. Same with visions. The reason in my eyes is not, it is a bug, but just its order is alphabetical when refering to all magic schools (air, earth, fire, water). Thatīs why u can see the same procedure in your spellbook for visions and for magic arrow.

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dimis
dimis


Responsible
Supreme Hero
Digitally signed by FoG
posted March 28, 2006 04:09 PM

Perhaps this is exactly the bug. You see that it behaves in a way like belonging to all magic schools, yet, you can not cast it on creatures immune to fire. I admit I prefer your explanation, but I also note that your explanation says not much on refuting that magic arrow is indeed a fire spell.

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LegendMaker
LegendMaker


Promising
Famous Hero
The Metal Specialist
posted March 28, 2006 11:40 PM
Edited by LegendMaker on 28 Mar 2006

ALL or EVERY ?

My problem with that magic arrow debate is in the "belongs to ALL magic schools" part. To me its at the very least unclear, if not simply untrue.

To me, it can mean EITHER :

* Every single magic school includes MA and gives it increased effect and reduced price based on its level.

OR

* MA doesn't belong to any magic school in particular, it is instead a schoolless spell that will work as a "mercenary" with any available school.

In both cases, the fact that Fire immunity automatically includes MA immunity, even when MA is clearly assiocated an affected by another school can either be a bug or mean that MA actually belongs to Fire School "in its heart of hearts".

Btw, I just thought of a way to test that ACCURATELY.

You peeps forgot about the 4 spells that affect each A WHOLE Magic School : PROTECTION FROM !

So this is what i'm going to do :

* Place two heroes of different factions face to face on the map editor, one with expert MA and the other with expert Protections.

* Compare damage of MA on the same stack of creatures when that stack is protected from each school with when the stack isn't protected.

If it IS a FIRE spell, protection from FIRE (and ONLY protection from Fire) will reduce its damage.

In any case, said test WILL DEFINITELY determinate the school(s) MA belongs to or not.

Nuff said (until I come up with the result).

Legendary ADDIT

Okay, guys, CASE SOLVED !

* 72) PROTECTION from ANY School will reduce the damage taken from MAGIC ARROW, no matter what School(s) the hero casting MA has.

So, Magic Arrow does belong to ALL Schools at the same time and gets affected by ALL Schools at the same time, no matter what School symbol you happen to see on it.

So of course it isn't a Fire Spell. It's a Air-Earth-Fire-Water spell. Whatever affects ANY School will affect it.

Really 'nuff said, now.

The Legendary Visionnaire.
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LegendMaker
LegendMaker


Promising
Famous Hero
The Metal Specialist
posted March 30, 2006 01:57 AM bonus applied.
Edited by angelito on 30 Mar 2006

Better LATE than NEVER, Part ONE

Like Bin said : all tested using Heroes III Complete Edition and the Map Editor.

01. Cavaliers/Champions "charging" bonus does NOT work on Pikemen/Halberdiers. (Xarfax the Ruthless)

TRUE. Pikes don't care if the Champ hit them point blank or if he had to do a World Tour before he could reach them. Same damage.

02. Use space bar for tile activation. (example: 2-way teleport) (Consis the Knight)

TRUE. FYI : And it doesn't cost ANY movement, even if you do it a zillion times back and forth.

03. The distance a hero travels depends on the creature's speed and artifacts at the beginning of the day, not on changes after the day starts. (Binabik the Barbarian)

TRUE. YET : terrain penalty on the other hand is counted WHEN the hero travels, so the distance a hero travels can still vary immensely depending on the creatures he gets or dumps and the terrain type he travels DURING the day. Only the "base distance" he can travel is calculated at the beginning of the turn.

04. If hero is attacked when standing inside a mine (gold, crystal, abandoned-trogs) then the battle terrain will be subterranean. (Consis the Knight)

TRUE. FYI : Not just a hero, it's also the case if the mine's owner left some troops in the garrison. Could rephrase it as "the inside of a mine is always underground".

05. Neutral or AI-controlled Harpy Hags often fly next to shooters, especially balistas or catapults, without attacking them. (Lord Zx the Zx)

TRUE. FYI : If they did attack, then their special would send them back to their starting hex, which would contradict their goal to block them.

06. If you cast clone and there is no space to put the clone stack, they will not appear and
the original stack will disappear after the fight (Medusa Queen Shiva)

TRUE. FYI : Not "after the fight", the very next time it's the original stack's turn to move DURING the fight.

07. An “A” will get your Behemots 1 step closer, if in Tactics Phase. (Xarfax the Ruthless).

FALSE to me. Maybe it's due to our having different versions and/or some qwerty / azerty conflict ?

08. Balistas have endless shots. (Angelito the wise Wizard)

TRUE. Lmao ! (see the screenshot).



09. Even if they only have 1 shot left at the start, Marksmen and Grandelves can shoot twice in a round. (Angelito the wise Wizard)

UNAPLLICABLE to me. In my world, they can NEVER have an odd number of shots, since they always shoot twice and start with an even number of shots. Only case barely close I could test was if they morale right after shooting their last couple of shots. They get zero shots and can't shoot at all.

10. Even if u cant see it, the Ammocart works in utopias. (Angelito the wise Wizard)

TRUE. FYI : It's not just invisible, it's invincible as well !

11. Armor of the Damned does NOT cast disrupting ray. (Angelito the wise Wizard)

TRUE. BUT it's in the description of it in the game itself. (See screenshots).



(from the Shadow of Death manual)



(from the game itself, complete version)

12. The badge of courage also makes your troops immune to spells such as blind, hypnotize and sorrow. (Mike the Angel)

TRUE but INCOMPLETE : Badge of Courage gives MIND SPELL Immunity : Hypnotize, Sorrow, Curse, Blind, Berzerk, Frenzy, Mirth and Forgetfullness.

13. With the Sea Captain`s Hat u can summon boats out of nowhere, if you are skilled in Water. (Xarfax the Ruthless)

TRUE but REDUNDANT to me. (See the screenshots). Besides, there is a limit of 64 boats in the game at the same time. Even with both the artie and Expert Summon Boat, you can't create a new boat if 64 already exist on the map.





14. Mastergenies cast with spellpower 5 on advanced level. (Xarfax the Ruthless)

TRUE.

15. Creatures in external dwellings still grow on plague months. (Mike the Angel)

TRUE. FYI : Same for the ones the Portal of Summoning gives.

16. Faerie Dragons cast with spellpower 5 on advanced level. (Angelito the wise Wizard)

TRUE.

17. Townportal doesnīt work while hero is in a boat, while Dimension Door does. (Angelito the wise Wizard)

TRUE but MISLEADING. DD works only to send your BOAT elsewhere on the SEA. There are no towns in sea, so no wonder TP won't work at all from a boat. But the way you phrased it, its highly misleading : one could imagine that DD will send you from a boat to the land, which is absolute bs. Could rephrase it to "Dimension Door also works in the ocean, where it will teleport the boat on top of the hero that occuppies it".

18. If you have a tome or a spell scroll u can cast high level spells without Wisdom. (Angelito the wise Wizard)

TRUE. FYI : please refer to my previous posts on the subject if you want more details.

19. The Artefacts a seer ask u to bring , will be unique. (Angelito the wise Wizard)

HELP ! Angel, how the hell did you determinate that ? I don't have a clue as to how to test it, sorry.

20. Distance traveled by boat is always 15 tiles, and is not affected by creature speed. (Binabik the Barbarian)

TRUE. FYI : BASE distance, that is, of course. Can be much more with Navigaytion skill, spec and / or arties.

21. Efreet Sultan fire shield even works against Black Dragons. (Consis the Knight)

TRUE. FYI : And magic elements, fellow sultans, Phoenixes... It works on ANY creatures, even those immune to the normal version of Fire Shield. BUT it IS a Fire Spell : Protection from Fire (and from NO other school, contrary to Magic Arrow) DOES reduce its damage.

22. Native creatures have no movement penalty on native ground. Nomads can guide you through desert without penalties even if your army is not native. (Consis the Knight)

TRUE. FYI : Please refer to Consis' own later post for more details. All he added there is also true.

23. The Orb of Tempestuous Fire works on the Tower magic mines. (Consis the Knight)

TRUE but INCOMPLETE : The Tower magic mines are a Fire spell, an avatar of the LandMines lvl 3 spell to be more precise. Protection from fire, Expert Dispell and Advanced AntiMagic work against it, and any creature immune to either Fire Magic or lvl 3 spells will neither activate it nor take damage from it. 100% Magic Resistance and Recantler's cloak also work though, stunningly enough, the Orb of Inhibition doesn't.

May I suggest to regroup that line + line 61 + line 69 into one complete "Tower LandMines" line ?

24. All Gargoyles, Golems and Elemtals are not alive and cant be resurrected or sacrificed. (The Fire Spirit).

TRUE. FYI : Neither alive nor undead, they can't be brought back in ANY way when killed. They will neither gain the regenerating ability from the Elixir of Life nor let the Vampire Lords drain anything from them. Still, both Cure and the First Aid Tent do bring them HP points back. They are any Necro's nightmare !

25. A shipyard,marketplace and all other not upgrading buildings give 9 points more firepower to the turrets. (Xarfax the Ruthless)

Hm, this will require SOME testing !

More tomorrow (hopefully).

Legend(arily late).







Edit by angelito
Thx for the great effort making this good thread even better. +QP
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LM

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Zsa
Zsa


Famous Hero
posted March 30, 2006 03:13 AM

about 21, fire shield does not work against phoenixes or efreets or fire elem. It doesn't work against any creature that is specifically immune to fire. It however does work vs black dragons which is indeed a strange thing.

That's why i like to have inferno when i'm fighting against sultans and i don't have mass slow. Efreets and sultan efreets aren't affected by fire shields
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angelito
angelito


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
posted March 30, 2006 03:31 AM

Here is how u can test the 2 things u asked:

1. Grandelves shoot twice, even if they only have 1 shot left:
- make a hero with only 1 grandelf
- make another hero with 1 stack of Archangels and 1 stack of 1 single gremlin
- now get into a fight while controlling both sides
- Shoot on the Archangels till u have 2 shots left
- Now shoot on the gremlin (will be dead with first shot)
- Grandelf has only 1 shot left now
- next round shoot on Archangels again and watch how often he will shoot.

2. Seers artefacts will be unique
- make a map with 22 seers and let them all search for a different relic. There do exist 23 relics, here is the list:
01. Tome of Air
02. Tome of Earth
03. Tome of Fire
04. Tome of Water
05. Spellbinderīs Hat
06. Red Orb
07. Black Orb
08. SeaCaptainīs Hat
09. Boots of Levitation
10. Angel Wings
11. Endless Sack of Gold
12. Titanīs Gladius13.
13. Sentinelīs Shield
14. Titanīs Curias
15. Thunder Helmet
16. Dragon Scale Armor
17. Crown of the Dragontooth
18. Sandals of the Saint
19. Celestial Necklace of Bliss
20. Lionīs Shield of Courage
21. Sword of Judgement
22. Helm of Heavenly Enlightment
23. Boots of Polarity

Now place some (the more the better is the proof) "random level 4 artefacts" (the yellow ball with the 4 on it) on the map.
Start the game, and u will see, u will have 20 times the same artefact there, the one u left out from the seers.
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LegendMaker
LegendMaker


Promising
Famous Hero
The Metal Specialist
posted March 30, 2006 04:19 AM

@ Zsa : You're right, thank you. I tested it further : it is also true for the regular Fire Shield spell ! It hurts black dragons and magic elementals, though it doesn't hurt Efreets and Phoenixes.

So it affects creatures immune to ALL magic, but not creature ONLY immune to Fire Magic. Go figure...

@Angel : Wow, good ones, man ! I'll test them out tomorrow for the form (I'm already certain of what I'll find, though ).

@All : Let's face it, folks : it's NOT a mere similarity : the Sultan's special ability IS an inbuilt Fire Shield and behaves exactly like it.

Same for the Tower's so-called "moat" : it's a pre-casted Land Mines spell that equals both Expert LM with spell power 5 and Advanced LM with spell power 10.
Like both, Expert Dispell will remove it, while Advanced Dispell will "affect no one".
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Evil_Warrior
Evil_Warrior


Famous Hero
Duke of Demon
posted March 30, 2006 06:03 AM
Edited by Evil_Warrior on 29 Mar 2006

In battle, If the opposing hero's creatures that still life are only summoned elementals, then we retreat, surrender, or defeated, both our and the opposing hero will disappear from the map.

Efreet Sultans can retaliate against empty space if the attacking creatures or creature Clones killed by their fire shield.

Clone of Archangels can still rescurrect although the Archangels exhausted their spell points.

Clone of Shooters can still shoot although the Shooters get their shoot empty.

Vampire Lord's life drain still works on Gargoyles.


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Binabik
Binabik


Responsible
Legendary Hero
posted March 30, 2006 08:31 AM
Edited by Binabik on 30 Mar 2006

Thanks for the test results Legend. It's a lot of work isn't it? Now you know why I wanted a case of beer.

Quote:
03. The distance a hero travels depends on the creature's speed and artifacts at the beginning of the day, not on changes after the day starts. (Binabik the Barbarian)

TRUE. YET : terrain penalty on the other hand is counted WHEN the hero travels, so the distance a hero travels can still vary immensely depending on the creatures he gets or dumps and the terrain type he travels DURING the day. Only the "base distance" he can travel is calculated at the beginning of the turn.

To explain everything about movement can't be done in one sentence. The way it works with terrain can be a new separate line.

Quote:
06. If you cast clone and there is no space to put the clone stack, they will not appear and the original stack will disappear after the fight (Medusa Queen Shiva)

TRUE. FYI : Not "after the fight", the very next time it's the original stack's turn to move DURING the fight.

I haven't seen this many times, so my memory is vague. It seems like I've seen the cloned unit stay on the battlefield, but when their turn came, they were just skipped over. And they didn't disappear until after the fight. I'll re-word this and take out "after the fight" and leave it ambiguous *when* it happens. Has anyone else seen it happen the way I described?

Quote:
07. An "A" will get your Behemots 1 step closer, if in Tactics Phase. (Xarfax the Ruthless).

FALSE to me. Maybe it's due to our having different versions and/or some qwerty / azerty conflict ?

I use Complete also and it works for me.  You have to practice with it a little, but not much. You move the stacks forward to where you want, then hit "A" for Autocombat. It will move them forward. You have to be quick to turn off auto. Sometimes it will try to change the order also, so you have to stop it and try again. One question though, is does it make a difference what level of tactics you have?

#9  As Angelito described, it happens when the first shot kills a stack.

Quote:
11. Armor of the Damned does NOT cast disrupting ray. (Angelito the wise Wizard)

TRUE. BUT it's in the description of it in the game itself. (See screenshots).

This one is questionable for the reason you said. The map editor says Disrupting Ray, but the game says it right. I'll delete this one, so no more #11.

#12 to be re-worded.

#13 Legend, do you need expert Water to summon boats if none exist? Or does it just add Summon Boat to spellbook if you don't have it? In other words, do you gain anything with the hat if you already have the spell?

#17 I'll reword it.

Quote:
19. The Artefacts a seer ask u to bring , will be unique. (Angelito the wise Wizard)

HELP ! Angel, how the hell did you determinate that ?  I don't have a clue as to how to test it, sorry.

Angelito, are you saying the art a seer wants will appear only once on the map? Do you know if this also includes hero starting arts?

Quote:
20. Distance traveled by boat is always 15 tiles, and is not affected by creature speed. (Binabik the Barbarian)

TRUE. FYI : BASE distance, that is, of course. Can be much more with Navigaytion skill, spec and / or arties.

I'll re-word it to say "base" distance. But the important part is that creature speed doesn't matter on water.

#21 will be re-worded.

Referring to #23
Quote:
May I suggest to regroup that line + line 61 + line 69 into one complete "Tower LandMines" line ?

Actually I was planning on going the opposite way and splitting some existing lines into two separate lines. More on that later.

Quote:
25. A shipyard,marketplace and all other not upgrading buildings give 9 points more firepower to the turrets. (Xarfax the Ruthless)

Hm, this will require SOME testing !

I already tested it. In another thread Xarfax referred to an earlier test I posted. I'll have to dig up my old post for details on damage, but the way he worded it isn't quite right. Every new building adds to main tower damage. APPROXIMATELY every second building adds to lower tower damage, so lower towers are about half damage of main tower.

Edit: The actual tower damage was modified in the latest list. Here's my original test results. http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=7114&pagenumber=9
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Binabik
Binabik


Responsible
Legendary Hero
posted March 30, 2006 10:36 AM

Since Xarfax asked me to take over on this, and I accepted, that makes me the new dictator.  Unless he wants his job back.

I'd like to cap the tavern rumors at 100, maybe even less. They will be re-worded in a non-technical tavern style. That list will be decided soon after the testing is done and debated.

A second list will be made for the ongoing thread, but won't go in the tavern. As long as people keep comming up with ideas, the list will continue to grow. The same rules apply as before. They should be short one sentence statements of fact.

Also, as Xarfax stated in his first post, the statements don't have to be some obscure thing for advanced players. It can also be newbie stuff, as long as it's not in the manual.

Here's the last list of 105 that Xarfax posted, with the latest modifications and deletions. Also some rewording to make things more clear, or to correct some English and spelling errors. More will be added later, including some that were skipped the first time through.


Tested
1. Cavaliers/Champions "charging" bonus does NOT work on Pikemen/Halberdiers. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
2. Use space bar to re-visit locations without moving away and back again. (example: 2-way teleport) (Consis the Knight)
3. If there is no terrain penalty, the distance a hero travels depends on the creature's speed and artifacts at the beginning of the day, not on changes after the day starts. (Binabik the Barbarian)
4. Fights inside a mine (gold, crystal, abandoned-trogs) will have subterranean battle terrain. (Consis the Knight)
5. Neutral or AI-controlled Harpy Hags often fly next to shooters, especially balistas or catapults, without attacking them. (Lord Zx the Zx)
6. If you cast clone and there is no space to put the clone stack, they will not appear and
the original stack will disappear. (Medusa Queen Shiva)
7. Using the "A" key (autocombat) during the tactics phase will move the stacks one step further. (Xarfax the Ruthless).
8. Balistas have endless shots. (Angelito the wise Wizard)
9. Even if they only have 1 shot left at the start, Marksmen and Grandelves can shoot twice in a round. (Angelito the wise Wizard)
10. Even if u cant see it, the Ammocart works in utopias. (Angelito the wise Wizard)
11 Deleted
12. The badge of courage also makes your troops immune to all mind spells such as blind, hypnotize and sorrow. (Mike the Angel)
13. With the Sea Captain`s Hat u can summon boats out of nowhere, if you are skilled in Water. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
14. Mastergenies cast with spellpower 5 on advanced level. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
15. Creatures in external dwellings still grow on plague months. (Mike the Angel)
16. Faerie Dragons cast with spellpower 5 on advanced level. (Angelito the wise Wizard)
17. Townportal doesnīt work while hero is in a boat, but Dimension Door will move you to another water location. (Angelito the wise Wizard)
18. If you have a tome or a spell scroll u can cast high level spells without Wisdom. (Angelito the wise Wizard)
19. The Artifacts a seer ask you to bring, will only show up once on the map (no duplicates). (Angelito the wise Wizard)
20. Distance traveled by boat is not affected by creature speed, and will be 15 tiles unless you have Navigation or artifacts. (Binabik the Barbarian)
21. Efreet Sultan fire shield even works against Black Dragons. (Consis the Knight)
22. Native creatures have no movement penalty on native ground. Nomads can guide you through desert without penalties even if your army is not native. (Consis the Knight)
23. The Orb of Tempestuous Fire works on the Tower magic mines. (Consis the Knight)
24. All Gargoyles, Golems and Elemtals are not alive and cant be resurrected or sacrificed. (The Fire Spirit).
25. All new, non-upgrade buildings give 2-3 additional damage to the main tower and approximately half that to lower towers. (Xarfax the Ruthless)

Untested
26. Artillery and Archery do increase the damage of a balista. Offense does not. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
27. The orb of vulnerabily does not negate the resistance of the unicorns. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
28. Magic Plains affect all creatures spells too. Except the dragon fly dispel (Consis the Knight)
29. Familiars special can add spellpoints above the Heros maximum (Consis the Knight)
30. If u have a spellscroll u can cast mapspells like air view, earth view, town portal, fly, dimension door and visions even without a spellbook. (Maretti the Black Dragon)
31. Scorpicore's paralyze is a lvl4 magic ability. (a Zsa).
32. Ghost's Dragon aging attack behaves like a lvl 5 spell. (a Zsa)
33. Solmyrs special has almost no effect if casted on Level 7 creatures. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
34. The Ancients Behemots special does only work in the moment they hit. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
35. If u place a Silver Pegasi in front of a berserked Green Dragon, the berserked Green Dragon wont move any longer. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
36. Creature spells doesnt work on cursed ground, even if Level 1 spells. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
37. Native Land gives +1 speed, +1 attack and +1 defense to native creatures, but gives no moral or luck bonuses. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
38. One Archangel ressurects 100 Healthpoints, one Pit Lord summones 50 Healthpoints. (Rioting Tigris)
39. When the attacker places an unit in front of the castle gate and that unit gets killed, the gate will forever remain shut until it gets destroyed by the catapult. (Rioting Tigris)
40. A trading post offers the same trading ratio as 5 marketplaces. (Rioting Tigris)

Tested
41. Deleted
42. If you wait with Faerie Dragons, their spell may change. (King Vlaad IV. the Impaler)
43. Harpies attacking dendroids will get bound to ground forever, after they have returned to their original position. (a greek god)

Check out 43 more. What if dendroids move or are killed?

44. Armorer skill and air shield increase the damage you receive from the castle's towers, instead of reducing. (Black Eyed Russ).
45. Without a Tavern u cant see what is in an outside garrison. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
46. Catapults are immune to implosion but not to magic arrow and other damage spells. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
47. A hero without creatures will disappear as soon as he gots attacked. (Angelito the wise Wizard)
48. Balistics and First Aid specialists never start with level 2 creatures, regardless of whether they actually have the war machine or not. (Angelito the wise Wizard)
49. Each Mighty Gorgon in a stack has a 10% of Death stare, but Death stare only happens 1 time per 10 Mighty Gorgons. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
50. If you are wearing the Angelic Alliance and the Red Orb is present in battle, Expert Prayer will still be cast. (Lord Kru)
51. Even with slower creatures, Balistics will let you cast first in a siege, unless your opponent has the artillery skill. (Black Eyed Russ)
52. Dig a hole at the coast and no boat can land there. (King Vlaad IV. the Impaler)
53. Hypnotized Hydras will only attack your opponents creatures, even if your creatures stand next to them. (Black Eyed Russ)
54. Shooters standing next to a hypnhotized or berserked Creature of your army, will still be able to shoot. (Black Eyed Russ)
55. Scholars and Witch Huts can give Secondary Skills a Hero Class normally cant have. (The Legendary Skel).
56. Dragons and Hydras will be turned into Bonedragons by the skel transformer, Skeletons Warriors, Bone and Ghost Dragons into Skeletons. (The Legendary Skel)
57. If all your slots are full with other creatures you cant raise Skeletons. If you have Skeleton Warriors, you will get 2/3 Skeleton Warriors of the original amount. (The Legendary Skel)
58. Deleted
59. Mages make casting easier even if they are already dead. Pegasi makes it harder to cast even if they are already dead. (The Legendary Skel).
60. Once you filled your mana to maximum, you can remove knowledge artifacts without losing mana. (The Legendary Skel)
61. Expert Dispell will remove the Tower's magic mines. (The Legendary Skel)
62. With expert Water, Remove Obstacle can detect landmines and quicksand by hovering then canceling the spell without actually casting it. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
63. With Remove Obstackles you can destroy landmines, magic mines, fire wall and force fields. But you cant remove Walls or obstacles that cross the field. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
64. If you fly you dont get penalties but the roads will still make you faster. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
65. Damage done by Catapult is 0, 1 or 2 and is only influenced by Balistics, not Attack, Archery skill, etc. Walls have 2 damage points. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
66. "Hot" type of moats make 90 damage, the others only 70. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
67. You take only damage when you go into or stay in a moat. Not when you leave it. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
68. There is no way to avoid moat damage..no magic, immunity or resistance. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
69. Magic mines dont work if you have 100% resistance, immunity or the recanters cloak with you. But they still explode if you have the red orb. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
70. Best way to shoot a wall down is to target the adjacted turret. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
71. Loynis' special gives an additional +3 speed to Lvl1-2, +2 speed to Lvl3-4, +1 speed to Lvl5-6 and no speed to Lvl7. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
72. Magic Arrow belongs to all magic schools and any magic orb will increase its damage. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
73. Terek's special gives an additional +3 speed to Lvl1-2, +2 speed to Lvl3-4, +1 speed to Lvl5-6 and no speed to Lvl7. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
74. Ghost Dragons can make Utopia Dragons freeze by negative moral, as they are already mixed alignments. (Andi the Angelslayer).
75. Duplicate Legion artifacts give only one bonus per hero, but if you split them between a visiting and garrisoned hero it doubles the effect. (Master Djive)
76. If Thorgrim has 100% resistance only dispel works on his creatures. (Hero Commando)
77. Each Diplomany Level lets you enter the Library 2 Levels earlier. (Haile the Jugger)
78. If you attack a special building, but turn down the fight, you can see the guard size by right clicking on it. (Andi the Angelslayer).
79. Health arties help to increase demon farming. (Devil Destro)
80. Berzerked Dendroids bind each other forever. (a WubTreant)
81. Sieging Creatures can't open the Gate Door, same as hypnothized creatures cant. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
82. If the Dendroid Soldiers stack is too strong, you can unbind your troups by teleporting them away. (Xarfax the Ruthless)
83. Earthquake randomly does up to 1 damage per walls, but only hits a wall only 1 time per cast (the Legendary Skel).
84. Unlike Clones, Summoned Creatures wont diasappear on the battlefield when all allied creatures are dead. (the Legendary Skel)
85. You can use the specialities of cloned or hyphnotized creatures. (the Legendary Skel).
86. Mass dispelled Mass countrstrike will still work if attacked in the same round. (Conan the Barbar).
87. Windmills give all types of resources except wood and gold. (King Vlaad IV).
88. If you don’t win a fight having the Grail in the backpack, the Grail is lost forever (King Vlaad IV).
89. Once cast, Disrupting Ray cannot be removed with Cure, Dispell or Antimagic, but Antimagic will prevent it from being cast. (King Vlaad IV).
90. Magogs Fireball is not Magic, so there is no Immunity or Resistance against it. (Super Evil Sonic Eye).
91. Creatures in a moat take 10% extra damage if attacked.(Binabik the Barbarian)
92. Wondering creatures grow by 10% per week. If a pack turns into lots you can expect 20 to 21 creatures. (Binabik the Barbarian)
93. You can have more then 3 positive or negative Moral Bonus, but the net effect max out at 3.(a Zsa)
94. Deleted
95. Hypnotize takes away all creature and art immunities. (Xarfax the Ruthless).
96. If you cast a negative area spell, check if the creature is blue outlined, otherwise the spell doesn’t work. (Xarfax the Ruthless).
97. Rogues in your army is the equivalent of a permanent vision spell with 1 spell power and an expert school of magic. (a Zsa)
98. Anti-Magic is effective against the special abilities of zombie, unicorn, thunderbird, and mummy, but not against efreet, dendroid, ghost dragon, medusa, scorpicore, basilisk and monarch.(Binabik the Barbarian)
99. Archangels, Archdevils and Ghostdragons influence Moral or Luck on the battlefield even after they are dead. (the Legendary Skel)
100. Spirit of oppression sets any morale to zero if it's positive. But if it is negative, it has no effect, you will still have negative morale! (Sharpshooter Csarmi).
101. On the beach noone is native. (Consis the Knight)
102. Even stone gazed creatures can get morale. (Dimis)
103. A battle in the underground always takes place on the subterranean terrain, no matter what terrain shows on the adventure map. (King Vlaad IV. the Impaler)
104. Siege battles are always fought on the town's native terrain (even if the siege takes place in the underground!). (King Vlaad IV. the Impaler)
105. If the attacker’s Attack skill is lower than defender's Defense skill, then damage is reduced by 2,5% per point of difference not 2%. (Sharpshooter Csarmi and Dimis)

Keep'em comming people. And if your favorite one from earlier in the thread didn't make the list, let me know.
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angelito
angelito


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
posted March 30, 2006 03:18 PM

No.2 is in the manual (Sod manual, page 10)
No.68 is not completely true. As stated, all units which have the ability to cast a spell, can cast while they are placed in the moat and donīt recieve damage. Same counts for their clones.

About the artefacts searched by a seer. Yes, this counts for ALL artefacts. The artie a hero starts with is randomly chosen AFTER the map is done and all seers are placed. This is how u can "disable" some artefacts in fixed maps. You just place some seers huts AND the refering arties (for example all tomes, angel wings etc..) besides, that way u can prevent utopias from giving game breaking relics as reward.
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