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Lord_Woock
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Daddy Cool with a $90 smile
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posted November 06, 2007 06:57 PM |
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Um, I was never much good at history, but from what I remember from school, predestination was a calvinist thing, not lutheran.
I could be terribly and utterly wrong though.
EDIT: Wikipedia's article on lutheranism mentions predestination as well. Oh well.
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Yolk and God bless.
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My buddy's doing a webcomic and would certainly appreciate it if you checked it out!
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mvassilev
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 06, 2007 09:49 PM |
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Quote:
sad that the Holy Inquisition is no longer around here!
Do you realize what you're saying? Read out loud what you just wrote. I'm sorry, but this is very offensive. Do you know what the Inquisition did? And you're saying that it's good? The Inquisition is one of the darkest marks on Western civilization. And you like it?
And if that sentence is a joke, put  , not .
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Eccentric Opinion
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ZanJerusalem
Disgraceful
Adventuring Hero
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posted November 06, 2007 10:20 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
sad that the Holy Inquisition is no longer around here!
Do you realize what you're saying? Read out loud what you just wrote. I'm sorry, but this is very offensive. Do you know what the Inquisition did? And you're saying that it's good? The Inquisition is one of the darkest marks on Western civilization. And you like it?
And if that sentence is a joke, put , not .
The Holy Inquisition may have done a few mistakes as the fallible men they are but I see nothing wrong in protecting the One True Church from Heresy. They where and still are holy men.
I am not intending to offend anyone.
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angelito
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
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posted November 06, 2007 10:36 PM |
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Quote:
The Holy Inquisition may have done a few mistakes as the fallible men they are but I see nothing wrong in protecting the One True Church from Heresy. They where and still are holy men...
'Thou shalt not kill any living thing,' for life is given to all by God, and that which God has given, let not man taketh it away...
Doesn't sound like a holy attitude in my eyes....
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Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
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Slapzech
Adventuring Hero
that didn't vote for Kaczynski
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posted November 06, 2007 10:51 PM |
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Sacred Officium was one of the worst thing that mankind had ever created. Nearly every part of it. Their philosophy, the type of trial that it used, the so-called "proofs" the inquisitors gave to torture and to sentence to death, the way they killed the accused.
By prasing the inquisition You negate everything humanity managed to create since dark ages. Every sense of modern justice, honor, value, ethics, equity, law...
Perhaps You should actually read something OTHER than the Bible and then speak Your words about an institution which tried to ruin the freedom of intelect. Or go on just like You are now, and throw away everything science gave us in place of the religious lies.
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roy-algriffin
Supreme Hero
Chocolate ice cream zealot
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posted November 06, 2007 11:44 PM |
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.
The Holy Inquisition may have done a few mistakes as the fallible men they are but I see nothing wrong in protecting the One True Church from Heresy. They where and still are holy men.
I am not intending to offend anyone.
Im actually beggining to study a little abotu that and yes there was something wrong with what they did.
They tried to expel everyone who wasnt christian. Then when they became christian they never stopped haunting them. They would torture the people who converted until they either admitted falsely or truly that they were another religion or when they died of torture. It stands against every messege of unity and peace the world has tried to begin to have.or acceptance or tolerance.
So yes its quite bad . im pretty sure they "confiscated" dead peoples property too.I can see your not intending to offend anyone but it seems to me if you think your religion is superior you should just walk around feeling superior and leave everyone else alone.
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"Am i a demon? No im a priest of the light! THE BLOODY RED LIGHT"
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Gallow
Bad-mannered
Known Hero
Avenger
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posted November 07, 2007 12:09 AM |
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The inquisition was terrible,a lot died,they were so wrong...of course,god cant controle man´s mind,there is 2 different things religion and god(god didnt create religion,man did it) ,many things are made by the man.But im more at the side of a good believer,and not so to religion,if you have morale,honor,ethics values then you are a good person I agree with that,being sure that this not so perfect world will change to better,yes i believe.
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Daystar
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Back from the Dead
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posted November 07, 2007 03:45 AM |
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Quote:
does not recognize virgin birth
Wait, she will not accept a scientific improbability in humans? <sarcasm> BURN THE WITCH!! </sarcasm>
ZJ, have you ever seen any Vicar of Dibley? Here's a youtube link:
Linky
Also, the Inquisition was bad, period. Infact, God is bad, period. If Jesus comes again (since he is God) he should be arested for Murder, Rape, War Crimes, Arson, and a lot of other things, since that is what God should be arested for. Also, lock up the pope, since he is a terrible lawyer.
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How exactly is luck a skill?
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TitaniumAlloy
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Professional
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posted November 07, 2007 11:39 AM |
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Quote:
But im more at the side of a good believer,and not so to religion,if you have morale,honor,ethics values then you are a good person I agree with that,being sure that this not so perfect world will change to better,yes i believe.
What is someone has morals, ethical values, are a good person, are sure that this is not a perfect world and can change for the better, BUT, they believe in evolution (as you say, ape lovers), and think God is a hoax...
Are you still on their side?
Genuine question.
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baklava
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Mostly harmless
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posted November 07, 2007 11:44 AM |
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You know, ZJ, I've read a bit, and I've noticed that the Catholic Church is actually mentioned several times in the bible - not directly, of course, but through quite accurate descriptions of its methods and purpose. The only difference is, in the bible, they don't call it "the Catholic Church", they call it "the Antichrist". 
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"Let me tell you what the blues
is. When you ain't got no
money,
you got the blues."
Howlin Wolf
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Gallow
Bad-mannered
Known Hero
Avenger
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posted November 07, 2007 12:03 PM |
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Edited by Gallow at 12:15, 07 Nov 2007.
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Quote:
What is someone has morals, ethical values, are a good person, are sure that this is not a perfect world and can change for the better, BUT, they believe in evolution (as you say, ape lovers), and think God is a hoax...
Are you still on their side?
No,not all have morals and that,pretty sure that most of the bad atheist dont,I dont believe in evolution,and yes im in their side any problem? from the PM you sent i can see your not a serious person.more info: from the european countrys,the most atheist is Czech republic Not even the 30 percent of the Czechs was declared like believing people,found it in google.
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Azagal
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Smooth Snake
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posted November 07, 2007 12:30 PM |
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Edited by Azagal at 12:48, 07 Nov 2007.
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@ Daystar
Quote:
Also, the Inquisition was bad, period. Infact, God is bad, period. If Jesus comes again (since he is God) he should be arested for Murder, Rape, War Crimes, Arson, and a lot of other things, since that is what God should be arested for. Also, lock up the pope, since he is a terrible lawyer.
ohh come on... Your intelligent right? I'm sure you'll understand that it's ridicolus what your saying... It's like Gallow said
Quote:
god didnt create religion, man did
You can't blame god for what people do in his name. People have allways used higher authorities to legalize what they did(do)... come on you can't tell me that you don't see that the catholic church used god for their own needs which have nothing to do with his... (well I can't say that for sure but come on... someone who teaches love won't wan't his children to kill themselves now would he?) You really can't blame god for what the Pope's of that time did... you understand that right?
And guys... saying that the holy inquisition was a good thing just shows how serious you should take ANYBODY who claims that... It's like promoting murder and saying that opression/killing of minorities is good.
@Baklava dude... now your generalizing... the catholic church is not the antichrist... yeah many popes and fanatic belivers who think that their way is the only "true" way claiming that everbodyelse is wrong which makes them superior to "infidels" are antichrists but NOT the catholic church... I guess you understand what I'm saying
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"All I can see is what's in front of me. And all I can do is keep moving forward" - The Heir Wielder of Names, Seeker of Thrones, King of Swords, Breaker of Infinities, Wheel Smashing Lord
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Gallow
Bad-mannered
Known Hero
Avenger
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posted November 07, 2007 12:44 PM |
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[quote It's like Gallow said
Quote:
god didnt create religion, man did
You can't blame god for what people do in his name. People have allways used higher authorities to legalize what they do... come on you can't tell me that you don't see that the catholic church used god for their own needs which have nothing to do with his... (well I can't say that for sure but come on... someone who teaches love won't wan't his children to kill themselves now would he?) You really can't blame god for what the Pope's of that time did... you understand that right?
Yep,you got the point Azagal 
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Daystar
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Back from the Dead
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posted November 07, 2007 01:14 PM |
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Murder = First Child of Egyptian houses
Rape = Mary of Nazareth
War Crimes = Blinded Enemies
Arson = Sodom
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How exactly is luck a skill?
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Spectrum
Famous Hero
Plan B
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posted November 07, 2007 04:02 PM |
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Someone has to lead the Church. Therefore, Peter gave another these keys to heaven. The one who is holding these keys right now is his latest successor, His Holiness Pope Benedict XVI.
Since when does a human have the right to say who's God's substitute and infallible?
Quote:
The false prophet Luther taught the unbiblical heresy of Sola Fide, salvation by faith alone. That is a lie, you must admit that. We need both Good Works and Baptism to be saved, for so says the bible.
Look, you don't seem to get this at all do you? Where Luther was going with the whole Sola Fide-theme was that if you've sinned, you'd be forgiven by having faith in Jesus and believing that will forgive you. Not by paying off the local priest, as you catholics suggested in the medieval times.
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I don't know if thou or ye will be saved, only God will judge.
Amen to that.
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sad that the Holy Inquisition is no longer around here!
Dude. How can you say that? The "Holy" inquisition was just not right. You can't possibly claim that is was. And you call yourself a christian. Sheesh...
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Varför är du inte Ortodox? Jag trodde att de flesta kristna Finländare var det? Vi skulle nog förstå varandra bättre då...
Nope, only about 1% of Finland's population is orthodox and about 87% are protestants.
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Aculias is like the male nipple of HC, TNT being the other one -Baklava
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roy-algriffin
Supreme Hero
Chocolate ice cream zealot
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posted November 07, 2007 06:24 PM |
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Quote:
Murder = First Child of Egyptian houses
Rape = Mary of Nazareth
War Crimes = Blinded Enemies
Arson = Sodom
Well if you were an omnipotent omnipresent and omnipowerful diety and such wouldnt you like to show off your madz skilz at some point?
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"Am i a demon? No im a priest of the light! THE BLOODY RED LIGHT"
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ZanJerusalem
Disgraceful
Adventuring Hero
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posted November 07, 2007 07:09 PM |
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'Thou shalt not kill
A more correct translation of Exodus 20:13 would be: “You shall not murder.” (NKJV, NIV)
Wars and Executions are not murder.
Quote:
Perhaps You should actually read something OTHER than the Bible and then speak Your words about an institution which tried to ruin the freedom of intelect. Or go on just like You are now, and throw away everything science gave us in place of the religious lies.
The Holy Inquisition still exists. It is not, and has never been perfect, and inquisitors have done many mistakes and suffered from some corruption and plots, just like any other authority.
That said, I have nothing against an inquisition that protects the Church from heresy. Like, when the luciferian occultist Cathar cult infested large parts of Europe, notably Southern France, the Holy Inquisition prevented this plague of heresy to spread further and actively fought it in Italy and in the Netherlands. Brave men became Crusaders and destroyed this evil zoophile cult. What protected the protestant part of Europe in the early 19:th century when Neo-gnostic ideas began to spread again? Nothing of course, and Gnosticism and atheism spread, even among the rulers of Europe and the protestant “churches” where weakened. Thank Luther for that.
I’m a friend of science. Creationistic science.
Quote:
They tried to expel everyone who wasnt christian. Then when they became christian they never stopped haunting them. They would torture the people who converted until they either admitted falsely or truly that they were another religion or when they died of torture. It stands against every messege of unity and peace the world has tried to begin to have.or acceptance or tolerance.
You are taking about the horrible acts made by corrupted inquisitors in Spain? Even if they claimed they did those things for God, they served the devil by torturing innocents. This is a perfect example why Protestants Sola Fie idea does not work, as by that logic, these mass murderers would come to heaven because they believe in Jesus Christ, while an infidel who deserved Heaven more than the Inquisitor would come to hell. This is of course, totally unbiblical.
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You know, ZJ, I've read a bit, and I've noticed that the Catholic Church is actually mentioned several times in the bible - not directly, of course, but through quite accurate descriptions of its methods and purpose. The only difference is, in the bible, they don't call it "the Catholic Church", they call it "the Antichrist".
This is without question Old calendarian Eastern-Orthodox propaganda. I’m pretty sure that we are experiencing the true Antichrist right now, with capitalism and its greed, bad morale, no ethics, fortification, exploiting the poor and such.
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Murder = First Child of Egyptian houses
Rape = Mary of Nazareth
War Crimes = Blinded Enemies
Arson = Sodom
God is like an MI6 agent, he has the right to do those things.
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Since when does a human have the right to say who's God's substitute and infallible?
Well, Jesus said so. Matthew 16:18-19 as I already told you.
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Look, you don't seem to get this at all do you? Where Luther was going with the whole Sola Fide-theme was that if you've sinned, you'd be forgiven by having faith in Jesus and believing that will forgive you. Not by paying off the local priest, as you catholics suggested in the medieval times.
Sola Fide is Latin and means: “Faith Alone”; that we are saved by faith alone, a false and unbiblical doctrine. Paul told us that we would be forgiven if we confessed our sins to each other.
Indulgences are deeply misunderstood. You always have to make some form of penance when you have committed a mortal sin. (“avlaus”) Paying was a way of penance, it was abolished in the Tridentine council because His Holiness was afraid that local bishops and priests could misuse it.
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Dude. How can you say that? The "Holy" inquisition was just not right. You can't possibly claim that is was. And you call yourself a christian. Sheesh...
It was and is right, through it has done some mistakes in the past.
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Nope, only about 1% of Finland's population is orthodox and about 87% are protestants.
 I thought they where more. The Greek Christians are not very heretical, their main problem is their schism with Rome.
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angelito
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
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posted November 07, 2007 07:30 PM |
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Quote:
God is like an MI6 agent, he has the right to do those things.
This statement shows pretty obviously you are making fun out of us all and don't mean anything serious you are writing here.
Therefore this is the last post from me towards you in this thread.
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Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
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ZanJerusalem
Disgraceful
Adventuring Hero
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posted November 07, 2007 07:37 PM |
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Quote:
This statement shows pretty obviously you are making fun out of us all and don't mean anything serious you are writing here.
No, I am not making fun of you. I am serious here, and I tried to explain God's rights for you, sorry if it doesn't make any sense.
He toold me that God broke Earthly laws, so why can't I say he doesn't?
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JoonasTo
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
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posted November 07, 2007 07:51 PM |
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Killing in war isn't murder it's just killing or even self-defence(if you don't do it you will be executed yourself) but execution is murder no matter how you look at it. It is a planned kill thus murder. It may be more tolerable than your usual murder but it is a murder none the less. When it comes to execution or death penalty it just might be the only choice in extreme circumstances(war anyone?). Even then it is murder.
Didn't Luther found "Thou shalt be saved by Faith alone." from the Bible?
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DON'T BE A NOOB, JOIN A.D.V.E.N.T.U.R.E.
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