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Heroes Community > Library of Enlightenment > Thread: WCL: Welcome to new Homm3 version - T.E.!
Thread: WCL: Welcome to new Homm3 version - T.E.! This thread is 16 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 · «PREV / NEXT»
maretti
maretti


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted July 02, 2007 02:45 PM

Im willing to play a game or 2 on SOD on temps like balance, jebus, e1 and e2, true random xl. You know the rules I like, but i can accept some minor changes.

Such games could be fun but wont prove anything, might give some indication though.

About Crag Hack vs Gunnar: Imo jebus is actually a temp where Crag is clearly better than Gunnar and way better than Kyrre and Dessa.

The reson is that scouts make many of your fights so you can focus on your main making few but important fights, (which he can do quickly enough despite his weaker log) and get the xp you need from boxes. In those fights Crag will do better than Gunnar. Its not that important to run all over your area to get +1 att or def from buildings.

Besides as mentioned Gunnar will often outrun scouts, especially in the t-area you will lack the scouting and you will often wait for certain army to be build/upgraded to be able to make some fights. It dosent help you that Gunnar is ready to go on if the army he needs is not build/upgraded yet.

Futhermore Crag has a higher chance of getting the important skills pathfinding and air, and needless to say his specialty is major in the main battle.


____________
Crag rules, Orrin and Ivor suck

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_XSI_
_XSI_

Tavern Dweller
posted July 03, 2007 04:14 PM

TE nice thing

Hi all, i tried TE. 1.03f and 1.03 Q there are many changes i like and some i dislike:
First of all like SAG asked:
instalation: about 5 mins (i had WOG preinstaled)
Number of games played on TE 20+
Overall satisfaction: between 9-10
What i like best: seriously improved game interface, a lot of operation with just 1 click, like:army split, buy all, army exchange,
less pop up windows, thats all just perfect
i like crere experience, i think it makes some sense, and i agre creature who killed 20 units should be better then creature killed 2 units. I found naga bank change to gems reasonable to tower and too painfull for fortress and dungeon.
I like almost all spels system changing, found very nice to have weakness, air shield, quicksand lvl 1, and some other as well. slow lvl 2 i agree with that too.
Not important but fun change: renaming hero or town

What I dislike: its heroes clases, i would have no problem with that on wog, pretty interesting feature, but it changes a standart sod, so this should be dissabled

i dnt want to analyze TE in detais, but in general i agree with marreti in many cases, make only usefull changes, dont change insignificant ones, be carefull with things like armorer 20%, well 15% looks little, but by defence formula calculation 2% per 1 defence is smthg similar to 7-8 defence, so 20% + tazzar...well = overpowered

tax on army, i found it ridiculous, u already paid 4 exple for army building and upgrade, and for army itself, why the hell charge even more? its painfull especially on poorer maps (i like them more)

i think possibility to change some options manually is very nice thing, u can make H3 TE as much alike as SOD with best TE features, thats i thing is one of strongest sides of TE. Maybe more options could be added, like disable tax on creatures or other stuff which u could access from TE options menu, more options can cause more confusion but as well more freedom.  

The final words: TE vs SOD i would vote for TE.
____________

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angelito
angelito


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
posted July 06, 2007 10:18 AM

Thread cleaned from off topic posts.
____________
Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.

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SAG
SAG


Promising
Supreme Hero
WCL owner
posted July 06, 2007 10:58 AM
Edited by SAG at 10:59, 06 Jul 2007.

Quote:
What I dislike: its heroes clases, i would have no problem with that on wog, pretty interesting feature, but it changes a standart sod, so this should be dissabled


Few words about TE settings.
To access most settings press "WOG options" button at the start of new game. There will be 3 pages:
1) "WOGify options. Map enhancemenets"
2) Artefact and spell banning
3) TE options

However there are additional settings in TE.ini file in \DATA\ folder:
1) You can enable/disable "Additional Tax on army"
2) You can enable/disable creature experience
3) You can enable/disable any or all classes
4) You can set "Additional Start resources" (normally used to add some resources on impossible level)
5) You can set time-limit parameters
6) Wide choice of town-buildings restrictions. Can be disabled any structure in neutral/human/AI towns. E.g. you can disable level 7 buildings and POS (Portal of Summoning) in all neutral towns
7) You can set "Replace scrolls values"

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Sub_Zero
Sub_Zero


Adventuring Hero
posted July 13, 2007 03:33 AM

having played some more games on TE, i have to admit that having slow as a second level spell is not as bad as i thought it may be. with mage guild-rebuilding i've actually started to like it.
i have also gotten used to all the other changes.

the only thing i still don't like is armorer beeing 20%, i just think it it to good.....

also, i was wondering if it is possible to make dirt native ground for  dungeon? they still don't get speed on dirt wich they start on if you plat without underground

also....in some of my games my heroes have gotten some kind of titles that i don't know what is
my tazar got the rank: basic warrior, or similar, whila sheeva got the rank: extra speedy....what does these titles do? thanks in advance

btw, if you play singleplayer, the computers creatures will receive experience even if you have changed 1=2 to 1=0 and 2=50 to 2=0 under Upkeep and experience in TE.ini

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dimis
dimis


Responsible
Supreme Hero
Digitally signed by FoG
posted July 13, 2007 11:04 AM
Edited by dimis at 11:09, 13 Jul 2007.

The manual is your friend

Quote:
the only thing i still don't like is armorer beeing 20%, i just think it it to good.....
I think it is so simple as the following. Suppose attacker and defender have same amount of Attack and Defense respectively. Moreover, attacker has offense and defender has expert armorer.

Multiplier in Complete Version:
Bas. Offense: 0.935
Adv. Offense: 1.020
Exp. Offense: 1.105
Multiplier in Tournament Version:
Bas. Offense: 0.880
Adv. Offense: 0.960
Exp. Offense: 1.040

In other words, if both heroes have their skills at expert level, the attacker is still the one who is favored (almost like +1 Attack). On the other hand, if the attacker does not have offense at expert level, he won't  be favored. I think it is simple as that. Btw., I think another common misunderstanding can occur from creature experience. The point is that creatures gain health and defense with more experience ==> More difficult to die. Note also, that by default AI's creatures do not gain experience ==> easier battles.


Quote:
also, i was wondering if it is possible to make dirt native ground for  dungeon? they still don't get speed on dirt wich they start on if you plat without underground
I want to see this thing too or preferably underground terrain in their starting area.

Quote:
also....in some of my games my heroes have gotten some kind of titles that i don't know what is
my tazar got the rank: basic warrior, or similar, whila sheeva got the rank: extra speedy....what does these titles do? thanks in advance
You can try downloading the Manual that is provided by SAG. You will find out pretty much anything you like there. For example, basic warrior adds +1 to your Attack/Defense if you have Offense,Armorer,Archery and Resistance and at least one is at basic level. If all are >= advanced level (one of them is not expert), then you become advanced warrior --> +3 Attack/Defense. Finally, if all are at expert level you get a +6 bonus on your Attack and Defense.

____________
The empty set

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Sub_Zero
Sub_Zero


Adventuring Hero
posted July 13, 2007 06:05 PM

i guess it depends on the situation. however, most people pick attack over defense from schrines when they fight the map, and in final battle it is more likely that both heroes have more attack than defense. the total damage even out at +4 attack, everything over 4 favours armorer....

oh, and also....armorer reduces damage from archery


i didn't manage to download the manual, i wouldn't have asked than.thanks for answers

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SAG
SAG


Promising
Supreme Hero
WCL owner
posted July 14, 2007 07:53 PM

IMPORTANT MESSAGE!
After TE installation game shortcut is still set to h3wog.exe.
In case if you try to launch game with h3wog.exe then you will see errors like "ERM error #?".
Always launch h3te.exe !

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Azja
Azja

Tavern Dweller
posted July 25, 2007 12:19 AM

will TE change the language version of my homm3 to english?

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SAG
SAG


Promising
Supreme Hero
WCL owner
posted July 26, 2007 08:48 AM

Quote:
will TE change the language version of my homm3 to english?

TE is available in English and in Russian languages. When you switch back to SOD/Complete - your original language settings will be restored.

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angelito
angelito


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
posted July 31, 2007 01:25 PM

Thread cleaned from discussion about tournament Heroes.by vs WCL. These posts were moved to the tournament thread itself here.
____________
Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.

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Balamut
Balamut


Adventuring Hero
posted July 31, 2007 03:13 PM
Edited by Balamut at 15:48, 31 Jul 2007.

Let me somehow describe what it is like - TE game on our rules.

First of all it's time limit. In TE you can manage your time setting very precisely. Chess timer is a great thing. You have time reserve, for example half an hour. Every turn you add to it, say, 6 minutes. And every turn you can move your heroes, plan your strategy or doing whatever you want until all your time reserve is empty. So there isn't now any "i was making chain with 8 heroes and 5 battles, but suddenly turn is over, my main stand without army and was defeated". Now you can't worry about time in single turn. Of course you have to look after your time reserve, but it's more convinient. And your opponent see not only how much time he has, but your time reserve as well. So he can say    - aha, my opponents turn was long, but he will have to move faster in his next turns.

Ah, and one important thing - having such chess timer we came to not stopping timer during battles. Just include average battle time in timer settings. Different players play with different speed. But in serious tournaments we have common settings: 3000 sec starting time reserve, and 400 sec is added every turn. So, for example, 3-weeks are lasted not more than 6 hours and 20 minutes. That is maximum time. In practise one week of game usually takes little more than hour of real time.

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Balamut
Balamut


Adventuring Hero
posted July 31, 2007 03:35 PM
Edited by Balamut at 16:18, 31 Jul 2007.

Starting towns and heroes.

I can just say that slightly we are turning towards playing random towns and not only in ordinary games, but in serios tournaments. That  means we agreed that in TE on our templates starting towns are almost equal.
Now look at starting heroes. 5%-specialists have now strong competition with monster-specialists. Monster specialization gives now not only speed, attack and defence. But health and growth number as well. Else starting heroes are coming with full three stacks, so choosing monster specs is good way to form good starting army.

Usually played for:
Castle - Valeska, Turys
Rampart - Ivor, Kyrre, Mephala
Stronghold - Tyraxor, Jabarcas, Crag Hack
Inferno - Marius, Ignat, Kalh
Fortress - Vystan, Tazar, Alkin

classes.

Most players when first looked at classes said - Why are those classes needed? There is warrior class, that consists from good skills and give you +6 attack +6 defence. Other classes are for nothing and wouldn't be useful. Than they play 10-20-30 games and what i can see?
They try to collect warrior class of course, but don't give to it much attention. Instead they hardly try to collect classes for not main heroes. These classes realy bring new features in game playing. Though they were thinked up by fix map players, they are useful in random templates too.

Army experience.

Usually, those who don't like stack experience have such arguments: It was made to fight neutrals easier, so it is help for bad players and would give them extra chances. No, first of all, army experience gives us else one direction in strategy. At second, it neutralize somehow angels from kons and wyverns from hives - you got them later and they are less experienced, means have less characteristics. And at third, now final battles results depends not only on high level units. 150 troglbytes could be more danger than 6 angels.

Magic.
It was very good job done - to balance all magic schools. Earth and air were overpowered, fire was less than average and water was for nothing. Now all is good. If you want to move really fast - DD is in water. To easy control your towns required town portal, that is in fire magic now. And earth with air stayed quite important for battles.
I don't care now if i am suggested to take water or fire - i know that all magic schools would be useful. In our games main hero without mass slow is normal situation.

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angelito
angelito


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
posted July 31, 2007 07:36 PM

I have a question refering to the heroes with creature speciality. You mentioned something like "higher weekly growth". This works when this hero is in my army? Or only if he/she has highest level of all my heroes?
Because I could just buy this creature specialist as scout...higher growth...but still won't use him as main....
____________
Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.

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CmapuK
CmapuK


posted July 31, 2007 08:03 PM

Quote:
I have a question refering to the heroes with creature speciality. You mentioned something like "higher weekly growth". This works when this hero is in my army? Or only if he/she has highest level of all my heroes?
Because I could just buy this creature specialist as scout...higher growth...but still won't use him as main....


The hero must be at least 7 level to get growth bonus.

Quote:
Army experience.


I want to add:

4. Now low level dwellings are adjusted. Wolf rider dwelling can be really great, greater as pit fiend dwelling or wyvern.

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Balamut
Balamut


Adventuring Hero
posted August 01, 2007 10:07 AM
Edited by Balamut at 12:42, 01 Aug 2007.

Necromancy.
Necropolis is very different from other towns. Due to hordes of low-level monsters on templates we preffer to play, there was nothing special in having half a thousand skeletos at the end of second week. And another strong feature of necropolis is upgraded vampires. Not hard upgrade which gives you a perfect tool for collecting you bone friends

We tried to manage overpowerness of necropolis in two ways.
First way was to ban building necromancy amplifiers. So necromants have 10% skelets less after each battle. And vampires can't be upgraded, so there isn't any easy skelets collecting. Else we make rule - not to take  adv.necromancy by necro-specialists, unless it would be no choise. And else one rule was that playing necropolis player has to start with random hero.
We played this way for year or two, but necropolis looked very unstable and was rarely taken in games. So we try another way to balance it. In current TE version you can switch on necro-patch. This will remove necromancy skill from your game. All necro-heroes will be without this skill and they never get it. Upgraded vampires returned to our games and  i must say that without necromancy Necropolis looks quite balanced .
But I, personaly, miss necromancy skill, though i think for tournaments necro-patch is very good solution.

Conflux

With this town it was simply. Phoenixes growth was decreased, settings for 1st level monsters upgrade was hardened a lot. Now you usually can't afford to upgrade pixies during first week, and later they are not such disbalance. Some of our players think conflux is very good, some that it lack of good 3-5 level creatures. As for me, there isn't any "good" or "bad" town in TE. When playing conflux usually these heroes are taken as main: Monere, Kalt or, rarely, Grindan.


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Devangle1984
Devangle1984


Known Hero
I am the Dark Vader
posted August 01, 2007 12:34 PM
Edited by Devangle1984 at 12:36, 01 Aug 2007.

Is there any other changes to necropolis, as in change in resource and gold needs to build buildings.Specially for the lvl 5-7 buildings? Necropolis is a bit weak without the skeliton extra, then again too powerful with it he he. But if it is easier to build for example like lvl7 without the lvl 5 requirment, then i think will be more balance for that town.
____________

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Balamut
Balamut


Adventuring Hero
posted August 01, 2007 12:57 PM

Quote:
Is there any other changes to necropolis, as in change in resource and gold needs to build buildings.Specially for the lvl 5-7 buildings? Necropolis is a bit weak without the skeliton extra, then again too powerful with it he he. But if it is easier to build for example like lvl7 without the lvl 5 requirment, then i think will be more balance for that town.

May be necropolis without necromancy is weak in SOD, but in TE there is an army experience. Low level troops, such as skeletons, level-up more quickly than high-level units. And necropolis buildings are already one of cheapest. Only leaches require 10 sulphur, that means you have to find just one sulphur resource, when playing 160% difficulty.

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Balamut
Balamut


Adventuring Hero
posted August 01, 2007 01:14 PM

Bank.
Bank was thinked up as a tool that balances "last percent".
For example. You want to build 6-level dwelling in castle during first week. You scout all your territory, fight all what can be fighted and at seventh day realize that you lack of just single wood . Just because it's random and you were given minimal number of wood, when picked up resources. Lack of just one resource will draw you to building unnecessary building (stables in 1st week). But Bank allow you to correct such minor bad luck . You will take 1 wood in bank, build your champions and win the game. However, before taking something in bank you should think twice. I see may be dozen games, where bank debt was reason for loss.

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CmapuK
CmapuK


posted August 01, 2007 01:39 PM
Edited by CmapuK at 13:41, 01 Aug 2007.

Quote:
Is there any other changes to necropolis, as in change in resource and gold needs to build buildings.Specially for the lvl 5-7 buildings? Necropolis is a bit weak without the skeliton extra, then again too powerful with it he he. But if it is easier to build for example like lvl7 without the lvl 5 requirment, then i think will be more balance for that town.


A little bit more about necro patch.

- Though necromancy is disabled, the start of necropolis is improved. Galthran and skeleton upgrade is a 110+ skeleton warriors with advance armor and 6-7 speed at 111. Almost Shakti
- The other thing, is rather actual for our templates is that 8 sulfur needs to build liches, instead of 10.
- At many average and poor of resourse templates, vamplords with their dwelling are almost cheating. 10-12 vamplords can defeat a maximum griffin conservatory or very hard guards, and with their dwelling becomes very powerful. So necropatch displaces vampdwellings by peasant dwellings.

My opinion about necropatch:

- it returns necropolis in game as interesting, new, and strong as all other towns.
- necropatch was created not long ago (spring), and some parameters can be slightly updated (skeletons starting numbers, vampdwelling displacement).
- I like it

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