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| Thread: Which map type do you prefer? |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Mocara
Famous Hero
what?
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posted May 28, 2001 04:18 PM |
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It is a terrific map.
Detailed the way only a master player could.
I will play it with you guys.
We just need one more.
Hurry back Maxym =)
-Mocara
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Maxym
Known Hero
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posted May 30, 2001 10:59 PM |
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I will do my best Moc! But don't wait for me i am sure it will be possible to play it 1v1 
Cool sounds like there are really cool maps out there, all you need to do to find them is to whine abouth the ones heavily in use now  So far i have heard 7 lakes, beltway and this one.
I love 7 lakes although i think i have stumbled onto a good strategy there and hence my initial wins. Btw have you played more games there? how did they go?
But before 7 lakes i used to play BfP a lot. I thinknit is a great map with a perfect balance between open and close and a lot of mechanisms for late game balance, like golem factories, libraries and undeground relics. I havn't used them a lot but when i had to it meant thart the game was really hardfought and a lot of fun. I would still recommend that map to anyone.
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
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posted May 31, 2001 08:37 PM |
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I love BFP also!
Maxym, you should go and download the New updated version of BFP2. It has alot of neat kewl changes. All the desert terrain in middle is now faster terrain and the garrison are easier to break, so as to make for a faster more realistic game. Plus some sub gate portals in middle to make scout wars more spontaneous and abundant. Over all the new update is much better. You should sheck it out.
Jinxer
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Defreni
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted June 01, 2001 04:26 PM |
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Hehee Jinxer, ur sure right about the updated version of bfp2. Great fun  ))
One thing though, after u took out all the desert, why is there still a scholar to teach path just before what used to be a dry and tough middle?? J/K
Well looking forward to my revenge, lol. Or at least another great and fun game
Defreni
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jb239
Famous Hero
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posted June 01, 2001 10:52 PM |
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You gotta ask urself...
Why are the same 5-10 maps always listed on topic when there possibly is 100+ maps on TOH?
even more odd is its mostly B*tching about the maps...of course not all maps on toh are good, and sure I made some of them, but you would think people would open their horizons as to which maps they played...and if they did we prolly would see less complaining.
1 reason for complaining is playing a map 20 times, and knowin it so well u discover little flaws, and if u lose cause of them odds are u begin to dislike the map or complain about it esp when u loved it for many of ur first games on it...
and finally I can openly admit I dont really make many maps anymore, unless its an updated sequel because plain and simple, people rarely try new maps out, maybe cause fear of losin points thinkin other person knows map better? who knows....but sure if you dont play a variety, this kind of posts occur.
doh..1 last comment, really..this goes to Salamandre. remember when u made the Quest originally and it was posted on Allied Conquest? Remember u asked to have your name removed from creator because no one would play it with you? just was reminded of it now, but that probably why new maps are rarely tried..fear of losin points or just losin. But believe me, not all think this way...but takes 2 to decide ona map, and 1 person open to change, and other not tells u which map gonna be played.
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I will not lose.
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ironmlh
Known Hero
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posted June 02, 2001 02:06 AM |
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maps - Blind
I will play a blind map with anyone who wants too, those are my favorite by far. But no one ever wants to play these so-called obscure maps because they think i am lying to them or something, or like JB said. Afraid of losing pts or losin. Well i play for fun, and having TOH ladder is nice, but if i lose, i lose. And then move onto the next game. Anyone for a blind map? I have played 85+ toh games and not a single map more than 3 times. THats why i am now forced to play random maps, no one will play a blind map.
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Phantom1500
Adventuring Hero
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posted June 02, 2001 08:15 PM |
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I think JB makes a really good point there. The problem are not the maps, the problem is that TOH has many people who play one map so much that one little flaw shows up somewhere on it. With the skill of many players here and their knowledge of the map, this one little flaw turns into what pretty much decides the game. Then after all that people complain about how the map sucks and blame it on the mapmaker, which I think is completely absurd. I think that people should stop complaining and if they want the perfect map, someone should just go out and make it. But when you start complaining about the tiniest differences between red and blue on a particular map, maybe it's a hint that you should just stop playing it.
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Darkmyth_Miura
Adventuring Hero
£ï£DmAn Go to Hell
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posted June 03, 2001 08:34 AM |
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Yeah, closed maps are better. NO FREAKIN CHEATERS AND HACKERS AND OTHER CRAP. A blubbo?
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æ磣€ðÆ /3iTc(-)http://www.bbhacks.com
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Mocara
Famous Hero
what?
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posted June 03, 2001 08:39 AM |
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Or maybe...
Or maybe this could be looked upon as a way to improve the map.
I have played 7 lakes a lot lately and Frank and I started noticing some minor edits it needed.
Remember Phantom you mentioned Gem should be in prison on that map? Great suggestion.
Someone once said "Art is never finished, only abandoned.". Well maps are art and they have to be an ever evolving process and maybe sometimes abandoned.
-Mocara
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deth8
Promising
Known Hero
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posted June 04, 2001 04:22 AM |
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Quote:
Yeah, closed maps are better. NO FREAKIN CHEATERS AND HACKERS AND OTHER CRAP. A blubbo?
I don't understand the connection to why closed maps are better, and the connection to cheaters or hackers? Additionally what fun is it to win if you have to resort to cheating anyhow? Seems like it is basically admission of an inferior player to me. Maybe an inferior ego?
Guess there won't be a response the the cheating question unless a map editor would like to comment. Hmm...guess realistically the cheating is all due to not wanting to lose some points and has nothing to do with enjoying the game maybe? Heck, I dunno...
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Darkmyth_Miura
Adventuring Hero
£ï£DmAn Go to Hell
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posted June 06, 2001 08:02 AM |
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Quote:
Quote:
Yeah, closed maps are better. NO FREAKIN CHEATERS AND HACKERS AND OTHER CRAP. A blubbo?
I don't understand the connection to why closed maps are better, and the connection to cheaters or hackers? Additionally what fun is it to win if you have to resort to cheating anyhow? Seems like it is basically admission of an inferior player to me. Maybe an inferior ego?
Guess there won't be a response the the cheating question unless a map editor would like to comment. Hmm...guess realistically the cheating is all due to not wanting to lose some points and has nothing to do with enjoying the game maybe? Heck, I dunno...
Inferior player my ass. I have all HOMM series and have been playing for a LONG LONG time. I have beaten all the campaigns, including the expansion (campaigns are fun). I just know that when you are playing on a closed map (it was that way in Heroes 2, I have to check in Heroes 3), u can't cheat or hack (other way of cheating). I just don't like cheaters
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æ磣€ðÆ /3iTc(-)http://www.bbhacks.com
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Darkmyth_Miura
Adventuring Hero
£ï£DmAn Go to Hell
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posted June 06, 2001 08:04 AM |
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And who said I resorted to cheating? I never used cheats once when I seriously playing.
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æ磣€ðÆ /3iTc(-)http://www.bbhacks.com
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Maxym
Known Hero
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posted June 15, 2001 01:50 AM |
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Noooo!!! Not you too Moc...
don't ban anything on 7 lakes. It might need some editing and such but not an outright ban.
Sure Gem is a neat draw, but so is any of the diplo heroes or 4ths. Also having any of them doesn't guarantee a win since AI plays such a big role in influencing how the map will unfold. And i would prefer to be able to get summmon boat in guilds as a method of limiting Gem's advantage rather then banning her. It might screw up the balance though, hmm... I am not sure anymore.
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Mocara
Famous Hero
what?
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posted June 15, 2001 10:38 AM |
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7 Mistakes
Here is what needs to change on 7 Lakes.
1) Gem needs to be in prison on the middle island guarded by 7 Angels.
This way you could get her but it would be hard and noone gets her on the draw.
Another point of tension on the map is always good.
2) Orange needs to be inferno also.
Red takes purple every time and on 200% efreet will be built for him so he gets devils where as the other colors can only take orange to counter and necro does not stand up to inferno ( I know newbies will argue how dominant necro is and how much inferno sucks but it's rediculous...speed kills )
3) Alter of Sacrifice needs to be added.
4) Relics need to be removed for obvious reasons. Earthbook or spellbinders hat unbalances a wonderfully balanced map.
5) Green needs 2 chest moved to where he can reach them both on day1 (for 200% games).
6) Green can't dock to the west til day 4 because of trees...needs to be a break in the trees.
7) There really isn't a 7th problem but in trying to keep with the theme I will say 7 is I should be able to go through a portal and pop up on the map Hourglass, build my stats and return back through the lith and attack my opponent on 7 Lakes. It's time to think outside the box a bit =)
-Mocara
"So long and thanks for all the fish." - The Parting words of the dolphin race before they departed a doomed earth (Douglas Adams)
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Defreni
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted June 15, 2001 07:17 PM |
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LOL Mocara ;)
Well just wanted to comment the quotation from Douglas Adams u used, great stuff 
Defreni
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted June 15, 2001 10:30 PM |
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I agree with all changes you propose Moc, except altair of sacrifice. It helps too much good heros, and I always complain that in ToH maps/games heros as warlocks, beastmasters etc. are never used. Besides this, I think that on seven lakes it's preferable to grow slowly in stats, basic fights are much more interesting that devastating ones.Game more intense.
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Era II mods and utilities
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maxym
Known Hero
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posted June 18, 2001 07:40 AM |
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Agree on all counts Moc, except...
removing the relics.
they are well guarded as it is and you have an option of going after your opponent early and thus take them out of the game.
Sal i think has a point too, although i never given much tought to good/evil imbalance. I am sure its better without it.
BTW I am back in town for a week (WOOO HOOO) do you mind making a 7 lakes with those changes so we can playtest it?
I knew i just chanced upon a way to exploit a map inbalance with red. But another way to avoid it would be to play green vs blue. Lets make sure we don't turn it into a mirror map
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"What is life? Work followed by television."
"1985" Anthony Burgess
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted June 19, 2001 04:19 AM |
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And, after reading Yawacko post on "tactics" thread, I don't agree with the portal to Hourglass. Too dangerous, considering that there you will have to fight Pandora. I want you safe for seven lakes, so forget it.
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Era II mods and utilities
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rychenroller
Promising
Supreme Hero
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posted June 19, 2001 04:32 PM |
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Templates....
In scenario description, it will tell you what template was used by the generator to build the random map. For example, The "ring" template is an open random, with quite a few towns and plenty of resources, the "dragons" template is also open, but ridiculously so, with mines unguarded as well as borders unguarded. The "2SM4d" template unfailingly gives every town a level 7 dwelling nearby, while the 6MMld template is extremely tight with many blockages. If these could be chosen before map creation it would be great, but this is not able to be done. My suggestion is (and if you are willing to do the research) is to not use a couple of these, as they can cause the unbalances many people complain about in randoms
Just a thought
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Ichon
Responsible
Famous Hero
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posted June 21, 2001 12:08 AM |
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Edits for 7 Lakes
1) Gem needs to be in prison on the middle island guarded by 7 Angels.-
I don't like that idea, I think it's nice to include her, why not ban 4th if you ban her? I never had any trouble making tons of boats on that map, so many spare resources. I usually build 6-7 boats the first week(unless 200%- then I usually only manage 2-3 extra). I played once and had 6 towns early week 2...no need to ban Gem.
2)Another point of tension on the map is always good.
I agree totally there- I think more portal stones would help with that, all going to the middle or outer edges, yet connected to 1 central hub with 4 entrances based on compass guarded by strong monsters- as in, 'Unicorns!' from Homm2.
2) Orange needs to be inferno also.
Yes, or else make Purple stronghold, and orange fortress oo both stronghold or fortress, with 1 more gold mine each and also day 1 event giving them resources to build faster. I think that encourages more people to choose a might town which I think leads to more interesting encounters between scout heroes.
( I know newbies will argue how dominant necro is and how much inferno sucks but it's rediculous...speed kills )
Well, Inferno is my favorite town- but I do still think Necro is the most chances for totally dominant town the longer a game lasts, 7 Lakes is very good Necro map. So many level 1 buildings on the map- I could see a week 3 necro army having around 1,000 skellies easily.
3) Alter of Sacrifice needs to be added.
I think so... I have used Necro with a good/light hero- the only reason not to possibly is no necromancy, but to play Necro with full strength you really need 2-3 reavers(that is what I call secondary heroes built with expert necromancy and some v-lords to go around harvesting skeletons).
4) Relics need to be removed for obvious reasons. Earthbook or spellbinders hat unbalances a wonderfully balanced map.
Yes, d-door and t-portal on this map is devastating if your opponent lacks it. I also don't even like the idea of both sides getting it though that is usually my prefered solution because then you can't play might towns as well, so much mana needed to t-portal or d-door around the map.
5) Green needs 2 chest moved to where he can reach them both on day1 (for 200% games).
Hmm... I'd rather one chest and maybe add a mill or something else, perhaps event.
6) Green can't dock to the west til day 4 because of trees...needs to be a break in the trees.
Yes, that is really helpful for blue that green takes so much time to reach him.
7) Add garrisons to all the neutral towns in the middle. So that scouts can't walk in and take them.
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