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Ghost
Undefeatable Hero
Therefore I am
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posted March 22, 2025 01:22 PM |
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Europeans don't trust them.. Trump is a dictator or authoritarianism..
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blizzard
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Urban Legend
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posted March 22, 2025 04:48 PM |
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Prince William is in a tank in Estonia by the Russian border, with an entourage of photographers. There is zero threat of an attack.
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Ghost
Undefeatable Hero
Therefore I am
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posted March 23, 2025 12:19 PM |
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Desiccated thing, IDK if FSL translated in proper English..
So his photo hobby..
"Europeans don't trust them.. Trump is a dictator or authoritarianism.." An example freshly news told that transsexuals can't travel to US[A] or 1 cent needs to be removed.. Above the law!
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blizzard
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posted March 25, 2025 06:22 PM |
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Edited by blizzard at 18:46, 25 Mar 2025.
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JollyJoker
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posted March 25, 2025 07:58 PM |
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I think, you have to see the full picture. The full picture is this: If things end up with a smaller, but well armed and part of NATO Ukraine, considering Russia's initial goals and the fact that Sweden and Finland have joined NATO plus the cost of the war and the fact that the EU will arm themselves, this result cannot be what Russia wants.
Russia only needs to blame Ukraine loudly enough for things not advancing, then TRUMP will eventually lose patience and try to pressure Ukraine even more.
See, the question isn't whether Russia can militarily advance further. The question is how long Ukraine can fight or have the ressources to do so.
Russia has already made it clear as well, that Ukraine must not become part of NATO.
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blizzard
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posted March 25, 2025 10:59 PM |
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Edited by blizzard at 23:07, 25 Mar 2025.
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Nah.
Ukraine's military aid from Europe is going to remain strong for at least several more years.
And really, Trump just giving up on Ukraine seems unlikely to me also, because he wants to keep his favorability as high as possible. Americans are annoyed with the war being in its 3rd year but ditching Ukraine entirely would be very unpopular. They want a strong and well-armed Ukraine, which can happen either in or out of NATO. That is more than half of Republicans and almost all Democrats.
The US doesn't want Ukraine in NATO. It is too dangerous of a gamble because of the ongoing proxy war there and the fighting that has been going on long before the "war" started in full. It is too much of a loose end and will remain a loose end after any ceasefire. Active fighting with a NATO country will complicate things as far as treaty obligations. Does that mean US troops going to Ukraine? No way. Not happening.
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JollyJoker
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posted March 26, 2025 09:48 AM |
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Not so.
Trump needs a success. He will do his utmost to make it seem like he brokered some kind of peace - but Ukraine isn't prepared to accept defeat, while Russia does what I described.
There just won't be ANY useful deal except if Russia doesn't get something first - like now it's lifted sanctions, their banks getting access to Swift again. If, when that happens, the deal between Ukraine and Russia is cancelled (because "they didn't keep to it"), sanctions will still have been lifted.
See, your mistake is, in your thoughts you are already at some kind of peace. But there won't be any peace. Only to Russian conditions and those conditions will mean the end of Ukraine. Because Russia can afford to keep at it, especially now that Trump starts making concessions. He just has to wait, APPEAR to be ready to negotiate, throw the daft Americans a couple of tidbits (you know, Putin actually PRAYED for Trump after the failed assassination attempt, and gifted him with a painting; I mean, come on, between one Emperor and another that MUST show goodwill), and pick up the fruits that will fall in his lap.
And all the American hostility and disdain America shows Europe doesn't make things better. That eventual clash looming on the horizon, when they'll lock horns about tariffs, about Greenland, about basically everything, Putin just has to wait it out, until "the West" falls apart completely.
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blizzard
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posted March 26, 2025 02:13 PM |
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Again, I'm not seeing much of a connection between Greenland and tariff wars and Ukraine. Something can't fall apart if it never existed in the first place.
You don't actually need solidarity to cooperate on something. It's helpful, but it 's not necessary. How long has Turkiye been in NATO? Since 1952. Why? Mutual distrust of Russia. Turkiye plays the game of being friends with Russia but at the same time not friends with Russia.
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JollyJoker
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posted March 26, 2025 03:37 PM |
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I don't understand that last post. Until Trump US and EU acted in concert with regard to Ukraine. It would long be dead and gone otherwise.
But now not only Trump is acting alone and not only does he seem to not be on the same page anymore, he acts like he's reading a completely different book - which is supported by tariffs, Greenland and comments.
Not only isn't there any solidarity, there isn't any cooperation either.
But the main thing here is that Putin just have to lean back and watch. Trump is doing a fine job doing Putin's work.
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blizzard
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posted March 26, 2025 03:54 PM |
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Edited by blizzard at 16:05, 26 Mar 2025.
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Ukraine is still being supported, no?
Trump would have to break from his own party if he actually wanted to let go of Ukraine entirely. The business with annexing Greenland and Canada - which is just ridiculous - is supported by fewer than 1 in 5. That represents the loyalist crowd who would support Trump if he walked into a press conference naked.
You need to differentiate between things that Trump says with what is happening, IRL. Also, Trump has to blame Ukraine for stuff otherwise the only other option is to blame himself, which is not something he does, like, literally ever. I can't think of a single occasion where he's held himself accountable, and I try to be fair with people, including with Trump. This is the same person who has never officially conceded the 2020 election. He lies constantly. But, if Ukraine fell to Russia, there is no way he would be able to spin it and say that it wasn't his fault. He would try and it wouldn't work very well. He can't abandon Ukraine.
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JollyJoker
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posted March 26, 2025 05:17 PM |
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He already did. And the European part of NATO as well. Allies need to be trustworthy and reliable. Trump isn't. Everyone over here - and that includes Canada - is preparing for a future without the US as an ally.
The only thing Trump did so far is weakening Ukraine's position, and that's akin to helping Russia. You could say it's treason.
That doesn't mean peace talks would be wrong. But it makes no sense to weaken the position of the guys you support before you negotiate on their behalf.
And make no mistake: Should Ukraine be lost, Trump will blame Ukraine and Europe (like he already does).
I mean, didn't you still not realize that Trump couldn't care less about what the population thinks? He's always right, isn't he. Or do you really think the majority of the population wants all the cuts in education, science and health that's going on? The attacks on the judicial power? The language control like in 1984? Social media control for people coming into the US to see whether they said a wrong word? Threatening universities and the media?
Can you imagine someone coming up with a TV show like the L Word in the current climate? I mean, Trump is actively COPYING Putin at this time, isn't he?
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blizzard
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posted March 26, 2025 07:13 PM |
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Edited by blizzard at 19:30, 26 Mar 2025.
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Aid was paused for like 2.4 seconds.
Yes, JJ, there is in fact popular support for many of the things Trump is doing, including cuts to science and education and such. Also, not all Americans are on board with democracy and democratic principles. Sometimes it is more of a mascot than a reality. As in, they wave the stars and stripes around while simultaneously being 100% fine with the idea of jailing a political opponent without a conviction. That is not such an uncommon sentiment.
This is something you are hung up about. People like Trump and Putin do enjoy popular support for many of the things they do, but you're convinced that they don't, and the population is just confused or not at all getting what they vote for. There is a lot of skepticism towards government programs in the USA, and this has been an ongoing reality on and off since the 18th century. Many/most of the people who migrated to North America were specifically people who were skeptical towards their government for different reasons; towards the church or the state or both. It was all one in the same thing back then. This includes millions of Germans. The USA is not Germany. It is a different place and the values are not identical. And same thing for Russia in other ways (not on government spending). Many Russians are in fact on board with expanding their borders in Ukraine, and they do genuinely support Putin, at least in certain areas.
Now, Trump's statements related to Greenland and Canada are actually extremely unpopular. Leaving Ukraine to the wolves would also be highly unpopular, and yes, Trump genuinely does care about performance in upcoming elections (like 2026). People's voting behavior in midterms is directly tied to the president.
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JollyJoker
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posted March 26, 2025 08:37 PM |
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I don't think so. People are just MISINFORMED - and victims of propaganda, part of which is just repetition of misinformation by parents or in school, which obviously depends on the state people go to school, the money parents pay for the priviledge or whether they are in some way "home-schooled". We had that discussion already. Propaganda works.
It's obvious that people often make bad choices. For example, Americans lead the obesity staatistics for grown-ups in the world. 67.5 of the grown-up population in the US is overweight, the most of all OECD countries. That's just one example of Americans seeming to listen to the wrong people when it comes to lifestyle.
You might say, people WANT to eat tons junk food and do everything by car, avoiding exercise, and that it's their choice, but I would say that they are just MISINFORMED. They get exposed to ads all the time, their parents have taken them McD's a lot and no one ever told them that this crap is harmful when you do too much of it (as basically everything is).
Which is just an example. One person's misinformed choice is another person's cash cow. Or eay to power. The cards are marked in this game, because a lot of people have a prime interest in things keeping like they are - or becoming the way they were again.
I mean, this is only the start. If the difference between US states continues to grow the way they do, it will become difficult to keep things together.
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Salamandre
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posted March 26, 2025 08:45 PM |
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Well, I read as anyone else the headlines "Trump cuts funds for education, at some universities", but when you go further and try to get what's about, is different of what the biased narrative tries to push and I wish we, in Europe, would have the guts of doing same.
I am all for taxpayer money going into education, but when the university becomes the war-field of political activists, with students blocking access to classes and such, you have to deliver a strong message, and economic privation always wins over ideology. Schools and universities are for general instruction, or some, if not most, became too much of a wishful thinking factory.
As for treason accusations, is just preposterous. Ukraine is not an US ally. Biden took a risky strategy, hurt the russians via proxy, using Ukrainian lives, then when he realized this is not going anywhere, he left the burden for Trump. Who always said this war wouldn't ever start, with him in office.
Putting an end to the war before Ukraine gets entirely swallowed is the right decision, but how to explain this to people who were feed during 3 years with BS like one million dead russians, economy in ruins, Putin has cancer and his people will revolt. For them, is just a matter of time until Russia collapse, so of course Trump should send even more.
All the strategy was based on false information and sheer propaganda, thus failed.
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blizzard
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posted March 26, 2025 08:49 PM |
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I agree the treason statement is ridiculous. The US isn't at war with Russia and never has been. People occasionally need reminded of this little detail.
You could just accuse pretty much anybody of "treason" with such a loose definition.
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Salamandre
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posted March 26, 2025 09:36 PM |
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Factually, it is Biden who blew NordStream, in which several contractors were German and this IS treason against allies, could also be fined as act of war, terrorist attack and such. Yet, everyone seems to experience Alzheimer when it comes into discussion, mind blowing.
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JollyJoker
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posted March 26, 2025 09:39 PM |
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I don't mean Trump's private grudge with Columbia University.
I mean this.
It can be called treason when you CLAIM to just want to facilitate peace talks and negotiations, but do everything to weaken the position of the party who's side you are supposedly on. It's actually been sabotaging everything that has been achieved for a lot of lives and money.
And it might also be called treason against everyone else supporting them, because it single-handedly undermines everyone else's efforts, as if they were simply not there or hadn't done anything at all.
And Trump says a lot in the course of one day, and he also does a lot, but whether the things he says and does are true and good things is very highly debatable.
And it's pretty rich to say with such a loose definition you could accuse everyone of treason - it's exactly what Trump does.
If peace for peace's sake is such a great thing - why then is resistance against oppression so highly rated, both in history and culture?
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blizzard
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posted March 26, 2025 09:41 PM |
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Biden didn't blow up Nordstream.
This forum.
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blizzard
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posted March 26, 2025 09:44 PM |
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Edited by blizzard at 21:55, 26 Mar 2025.
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JollyJoker said:
If peace for peace's sake is such a great thing - why then is resistance against oppression so highly rated, both in history and culture?
Because it makes good novels and even better movies.
And peace makes ****ty novels and non-existent movies.
Nobody would watch Gladiator if it was about a bunch of Roman diplomats drinking tea with the Greeks.
Ex-general with murdered family dueling the emperor in the coliseum? There you go. Savage and awesome.
And then, 200 years from now in post-apocolypse US, the summer blockbuster of Zelensky fighting Russians with a shotgun.
300. Half-naked Spartans killing a gazillion Persians.
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Salamandre
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posted March 26, 2025 09:55 PM |
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@JJ
yeah, but notice how you define : "the position of the party who's side you are supposedly on"
The deep state mined the first Trump mandate, by pushing over and over a false narrative about collusion with Russia. On the other side, Zelensky did support Biden's campaign and also refused to give Trump documents about Hunter Biden possible felonies in Ukraine, when asked. Affair also covered and buried under total censure by the FBI and social platforms.
You know the old saying : the enemy of my enemy is my friend. Logically, Trump has tons of reasons to be on Putin's side, given both were the target of a well orchestrated vendetta. It goes exactly as in European medias, we keep saying China is a dictatorial state, the bad guys, and on the other side we wonder why they go hand in hand with Russia. Basic sociology.
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