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Heroes Community > Heroes 5 - Temple of Ashan > Thread: Heroes 5 Strategy: Playing Necropolis Faction
Thread: Heroes 5 Strategy: Playing Necropolis Faction [ This thread is 13 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 (8) 9 10 11 12 13 ]
Lumpor
Lumpor


Adventuring Hero
posted July 01, 2009 08:19 AM

the reason to that is that you can only have 6 traits per hero, including the racial one.

So if a necromancer for example has expert necromancy, advanced luck, expert dark magic, basic enlightment, expert defence and advanced sorcery, he can not get another one, because he has filled his six slots.

Then you can also get three abilities per trait (if you have expert in that trait). If you get the factions ultimate ability, the racial trait has 4 abilities, but that's the limit.

You start with 3 "points" at level 1 (you either get advanced racial trait and an ability, advanced racial and basic in another trait, basic racial and another advanced trait, basic racial and basic another trait and an ability, or basic racial and two basic other traits).

6 expert traits and 18 abilities + an ultimate ability are together 37 "points". You start with 3 "points" so basically you need to level 34 times, taking you to level 35, and that is the maximum level where you get a skill choice.

The skill wheel lies when it says you get ultimate in your racial trait by level. You get it from an artifact (pendant of mastery) , so you never get a choice to get ultimate in your racial when levelling up. When you check ultimate for example necromancy, the skill wheel says you've levelled up but that's a lie
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Elvin
Elvin

Hero of Order
Stillness within Movement
posted July 01, 2009 08:20 AM
Edited by Elvin at 08:21, 01 Jul 2009.

To get full skills you need 6 skills in racial and 6 x 5 skills so 36. Most heroes start with 2 skills so a little less, you an still get levels just no more skills.

For every level of the skill you can pick a corresponding ability. For instance with basic dark you may pick one dark ability, say one of the three masteries. If you have advanced you can pick two at most and three at expert. But if you have picked the three masteries(curses, mind, pain) there are no more slots for other dark abilities, you must prioritize what you want.

Edit: Seconded
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FC_URBAN
FC_URBAN

Tavern Dweller
posted July 01, 2009 10:34 AM
Edited by FC_URBAN at 10:36, 01 Jul 2009.

Ok now i get how it works, thx Lumpor and Elvin, it helped a lot.

btw great necropolis guide you have made Elvin
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Elvin
Elvin

Hero of Order
Stillness within Movement
posted July 01, 2009 11:16 AM

Feel free to ask whenever you have any questions
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FC_URBAN
FC_URBAN

Tavern Dweller
posted July 02, 2009 05:53 AM

I'm on a really poor map, with no chests, and deadly armies guarding all mines besides wood and ore. Deadly armies containing mostly elementals or undeads like mummys. The only way from my ground is a bridge guarded by a phoenix. free learning stones takes me to level 4

My vampire can't life drain, and i get no raise after battles. Anyone got any tips how to beat those guards without losing almost whole army, or just sit in town and wait for weeks to get better troops.


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Elvin
Elvin

Hero of Order
Stillness within Movement
posted July 02, 2009 06:00 AM

Sounds like a badly balanced map. Those that have very hard creeping are often a matter of luck in how fast you can clear them and with what losses.
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Nirual
Nirual


Famous Hero
Imbued Ballista
posted July 09, 2009 10:43 AM
Edited by Nirual at 10:52, 09 Jul 2009.

Especially sounds like a map heavily biased against undeads. No faction has it worse against predominantly elemental/undead enemies. Unless you play as Markhal but that's cheating

Quote:
Light Magic for Necro


Divine Vengance can also be pretty lethal considering your forces are weak but many. Ressurection and Word of Light are the only spells of no use to a Necromancer (Regeneration at least is great for your Phoenix).
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Lumpor
Lumpor


Adventuring Hero
posted July 10, 2009 04:03 AM

Actually with divine vengeance isn't too important how many creatures you've killed. After killing 100 tier ones, you need to kill 9900 more just to increase the damage tenfold.

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Nirual
Nirual


Famous Hero
Imbued Ballista
posted July 10, 2009 09:26 AM

Doesn't change the fact that DV deals more damage the more creatures the target has killed. There is quite a difference in the spell effect between killing 50 Assasins and 200 Skeleton Archers. The high spellpower of Necromancers doesn't hurt either, of course.
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FC_URBAN
FC_URBAN

Tavern Dweller
posted July 29, 2009 11:33 AM
Edited by FC_URBAN at 11:33, 29 Jul 2009.

I noticed a strange thing with naadirs soulhunter, sometimes ghosts pops up from killed stacks with the same amount as hero level, and sometimes the amount is equal to how many I killed in last blow.
Maybe a bug?  
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Elvin
Elvin

Hero of Order
Stillness within Movement
posted July 29, 2009 12:06 PM

Maybe the stacks had less units than your level? Can't raise more ghosts than the original stack's numbers.
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Nirual
Nirual


Famous Hero
Imbued Ballista
posted July 29, 2009 02:13 PM

You can't get more ghosts than what the original stack size was, and never more than the hero level.

In other words, you get the original size or the size equal to his level, whichever number is lower.
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fiur
fiur


Promising
Supreme Hero
Map Creator
posted July 30, 2009 08:20 AM

Elvin:
Quote:
Maybe the stacks had less units than your level? Can't raise more ghosts than the original stack's numbers.



Nirual:
Quote:
You can't get more ghosts than what the original stack size was, and never more than the hero level.

In other words, you get the original size or the size equal to his level, whichever number is lower.



Not that I like to spam but could someone please tell me the different in those replies...
(I could'nt resist to comment....
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FC_URBAN
FC_URBAN

Tavern Dweller
posted July 30, 2009 11:34 AM

Ok, that most be it, thx.
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GreatSopp
GreatSopp

Tavern Dweller
posted August 25, 2009 11:57 AM
Edited by GreatSopp at 12:07, 25 Aug 2009.

The Dark Lord Mentorer

Hey, my first day on this forum.

This probably is a well-known tactic, but here I am explaining it anyways...

WARNING: This article may cause you to pawn your opponent in the next battle.

IMO Mentoring is *perfect* for necromancer! I'll keep it short and just give 2 reasons:

1/ Mentor all your other necromancers (supportheros) for massive amounts of DE points. Necro creeps well (esp. since when im necro i like to start with Kaspar) and even on heroic can they get to lvl 20+ really fast. Lets say at about lvl 21-22, u can mentor supportheros to lvl 14. This means that every necromancer you got earn 65 extra DE a week for you. So if you got like 5, thats 65*5= 325 extra DE. Handy, I must say. And this get even better if mentor has higher lvls, I mean, if you got a mentorer, well... then its almost worthwhile to *NOT* rush with necro and actually build up your mainhero for a change (necro is imo a rush-tribe)! With those DE-bonuses, you can raise significantly more while creeping a week longer or so.

2/ Harassing. The Dark Mentorer children can invade (with a few ghosts (7 is best, splitted, remember chain lightning takes 4 targets)) your human rival territory taking mines and/or even lesser heroes! This is MUCH more powerful than you think. What is so perfect here is the necro naturally high spellpower! Those heroes can even sacrify themselves on enemy mainhero (the mainhero will probably waste a lot of turns hunting them down), and take out a lot of unit cuz of the high spellpower gained throu mentoring. Note: Keep in mind the only really effetive counter is armaggedon-heroes! I think its definitively worth the 7 ghosts, becuz they make your hero last a lot longer, esp. vs. armies with fast shorters ect... How effective this is, is however greatly dependent on opponent race/skills (best vs slow initiative like Haven, Stronghold, and yes... other Necromancers actually). What makes this tac esp. strong vs Haven is the fact that Haven heroes rarely take/get Destruction magic. And if your enemy lack mass/AoE spells your hero may easily last 2 or even 3 turn of blastingly deadly destrution!

If possible these heroes should pick some real dammaging skills (Destruction feels natural) and if possible Swift Mind (Logistic is imo REALLY good on supportheros anyways, the only "bad" is u need the Eagle Eye (basic enlightenment) in addition to scouting, so its not that easy to get). If its possible that your hero can cast more than 1 spell, like when you are facing Haven, Sorcery is really nice to get of obvious reasons!

  ---Sidenote: Harassing really take me back to homm3, when buying  lvl 1 - heroes to suicide on enemy heroes with spell was a much more common thing. Here though, harassing is really ineffective ith low-level heroes, but everything kinda depends on curcumstances. I like that.

This tac can be used with a lot of variations, but I feel loads of DE point + harassing is its core.

  Writing a kinda bad/chaotic here I see, sry about that.
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The Dark Lord returns
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PS: As enlightenment is 8%, you will ofc not end up with a Dark Mentorer every game. Depend your gamestyle on what skills your able to get (attack(8%) w/battle frenzy and destruction sounds like you want to try to attack your opponend almost asap, pick your path carefully). This post is simply to claim for those who maybe didnt know; Mentorer *IS* a very good choice for Necromancer, and if you get a Dark Mentorer in a game... well... sit back and consider your options, cuz you have a lot you can do...

PS2: And for those without skillwheel: you'll need Exp. Enlightenment + Intelligence + Scholar to get Mentoring
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Kispagat
Kispagat


Famous Hero
posted August 25, 2009 12:56 PM
Edited by Kispagat at 12:58, 25 Aug 2009.

Quote:

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The Dark Lord returns
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I appreciate your enthusiasm, and dont loose it, but mentored kamikazes are certainly dishonorable way to beat your human opponent in toh games.

If you play relatively long maps, mentoring might worth when you cant rush your opponent, but when final takes place on week 4-5 even 900 DE does not worth to get some useless skill in final like mentoring.

Ps. Swift mind + dark/destructive + last stand + 14 ghosts is the ultra brutal way to do so

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Nirual
Nirual


Famous Hero
Imbued Ballista
posted August 25, 2009 05:46 PM

Quote:
What makes this tac esp. strong vs Haven is the fact that Haven heroes rarely take/get Destruction magic. And if your enemy lack mass/AoE spells your hero may easily last 2 or even 3 turn of blastingly deadly destrution!



While that is true they are also very likely to get Light Magic and a good chance to get Word of Light, the best counter to 1 stack ghosts there is.
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Elvin
Elvin

Hero of Order
Stillness within Movement
posted August 25, 2009 06:46 PM

Heya GreatSopp, welcome Actually mentored necro kamikazes are not nearly as awesome as warlock kamikazes, with a few stalkers they have imbalance bred in their bones. But yeah if you try that in multi nobody will ever play you again Or they'll start using 'dirty' tricks too. Of course there are people that enjoy such games, each harassing the other but for the most part they are frowned upon.

Mentoring for extra de can be pretty nifty in long maps where you cannot rush.
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GreatSopp
GreatSopp

Tavern Dweller
posted August 26, 2009 06:03 AM
Edited by Elvin at 06:43, 26 Aug 2009.

Quote:
I appreciate your enthusiasm, and dont loose it, but mentored kamikazes are certainly dishonorable way to beat your human opponent in toh games.


Oh, didnt know that. I have never played a toh (?) game, and only played like 3-4 multiplayer games, so I havent used this tac yet. Nice to know such thing, cuz myself wouldnt have considered that a cheat...

Talking about cheats...
http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=18021&pagenumber=15
... here is one I just found thats really bad.

Quote:
While that is true they are also very likely to get Light Magic and a good chance to get Word of Light, the best counter to 1 stack ghosts there is.


You're so right ofc. It didnt cross my mind.

Quote:
Heya GreatSopp, welcome Actually mentored necro kamikazes are not nearly as awesome as warlock kamikazes, with a few stalkers they have imbalance bred in their bones.


I'll have to take your word for it, sounds good, though I wont use it.

Btw if its not allowed to use mentorered heroes against opponent... well... then I cant really see any point in going for mentoring, or is there (except maybe for estates and some free gold/units, depending on fraction)?
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Elvin
Elvin

Hero of Order
Stillness within Movement
posted August 26, 2009 06:43 AM

It depends on mutual agreemement, unless your opponent forbids the use of mentored kamikazes it's fair game. But mentoring has many uses.

For instance you can get a few mentored defenders for the towns you capture, creeping in remote places, scout harassing, taking towns If the opponent has lvl 1 heroes he'd need his main to keep them in check while you can attack him from different directions with a few heroes.

Others is changing your tactics. In a map where you get around lvl 25 that has a few level up trees your mentored hero would be JUST a few levels lower than your main. So you can choose a good creeping hero and switch to a better hero for final battle. Or even pick another class, for instance academy can create mini arties for its units and then mentor a knight to lead them. That is a crazy combination if you add minies to the knight's stats.

As you mentioned there's free army. For instance if you lvl up a few rangers for battle commander you get a nice dancer reinforcement, barbarians can use this for defend us all etc. Then runemages can lvl up Inga to learn free runes from her..
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