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Celfious
Promising
Legendary Hero
From earth
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posted September 21, 2007 05:11 PM |
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Edited by Celfious at 17:15, 21 Sep 2007.
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Quote:
and you want ppl to remember things that happened to their distinctive ancestors 2k years ago?
By word of mouth, such miricles would have been passed down.. Why only 400 years or so after Jesus died, when the bible was technicly made by king James, people would have told their children, read this story! Your family is a real part of it.
Firey skies
Seas parting
A guy swallowed by a fish lives to tell the tale
Moses works magic -through God of course
ect
I bet there are people who know they are related to ceaser unless his liniage is broken.
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What are you up to
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted September 21, 2007 05:32 PM |
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Quote:
By word of mouth, such miricles would have been passed down..
And so it was, in form of religion you see today.
So many ppl claimed they were Gods or God's children. Why there is nothing left of their claims, and Jesus still stands strong?  Think about it.
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Celfious
Promising
Legendary Hero
From earth
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posted September 21, 2007 05:44 PM |
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Edited by Celfious at 17:45, 21 Sep 2007.
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But that is by faith. We have no witnesses, only believers.
I see your point though.
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baklava
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Mostly harmless
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posted September 21, 2007 06:24 PM |
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Quote:
So many ppl claimed they were Gods or God's children. Why there is nothing left of their claims, and Jesus still stands strong?
Let's be realistic here.
That's because the Church has systematically vanquished anybody and anything with a different opinion. Always did.
And even besides that, there are still those like Buddha, Mohammad, Hinduistic gods and many more - mostly in the east where the Church's power did not work.
Jesus doesn't stand strong my friend. The almost entire point of Jesus was crippled and diminished through organized religion. People failed to grasp Jesus's preach of peace and love (even those that understood him drowned in the shadows of those who didn't).
What stands strong is the Church, which burned people who objected them, waged wars, instituted harsh laws which they themselves neglected, shunned everybody of different convictions, and ruled with an iron fist through more than a millennium, bringing mankind in a position of ignorance and sorrow so dark that it has no match in written history, utterly defiling the name and idea of Christ. THAT is what stands strong. Jesus himself, in the eyes of the mass, became a pale shadow in favour of his torturing device, turned into something to hang on the wall or around your neck in a desperate attempt to avoid ending up in a huge pool of lava.
____________
"Let me tell you what the blues
is. When you ain't got no
money,
you got the blues."
Howlin Wolf
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted September 21, 2007 07:43 PM |
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Sadly, I have to agree, although Jesus is not church-only.. he's considered an unique individual in the majority of "bigger" religions; Though they don't consider him as a God, they have still a special place for him, either as a prophet, or as a great yogi.
But in church, yeah. He's nothing more than another santa claus, which is restored for 20 mins from the oblivion at christmas and forgotten immediately another day.
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JoonasTo
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
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posted September 21, 2007 10:00 PM |
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roy-algriffin
Supreme Hero
Chocolate ice cream zealot
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posted September 21, 2007 10:39 PM |
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Well why noone mentions it? jews have been displaced (pretty much historical fact rather then the bible here) many times. At least one major point was when the romans came to conquer isreal and ended up moving everyone around and forcing everyone to be pagan
I doubt they liked the whole moses etc story
But on the whole its just generations going on and on and on. 2000 years is 80 generations isnt it? you only need one missing link in the chain
And at that if you stood on a box on the street and said "MY XXXXFATHER MET JESUS" would anyone believe you?
____________
"Am i a demon? No im a priest of the light! THE BLOODY RED LIGHT"
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baklava
Honorable
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Mostly harmless
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posted September 21, 2007 10:54 PM |
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Quote:
and forcing everyone to be pagan
Actually the Jewish were allowed to have their own religious community in Israel in the Roman empire. They even had their own courts of law and many other institutions, it's just that all of it was overseered by the Romans.
As much as I dislike Romans I must say that they tolerated all religions as long as they weren't considered a threat to the Empire.
____________
"Let me tell you what the blues
is. When you ain't got no
money,
you got the blues."
Howlin Wolf
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Corribus
Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
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posted September 21, 2007 11:09 PM |
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Quote:
Actually the Jewish were allowed to have their own religious community in Israel in the Roman empire. They even had their own courts of law and many other institutions, it's just that all of it was overseered by the Romans.
Well yeah, the Romans treated the Jews great, if you ignore little events like the bloody massacres that took place during the Jewish-Roman wars of Emperors Vespasian and Titus.
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baklava
Honorable
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posted September 21, 2007 11:28 PM |
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Quote:
Well yeah, the Romans treated the Jews great, if you ignore little events like the bloody massacres that took place during the Jewish-Roman wars of Emperors Vespasian and Titus.
Sigh. Am I talking in Chinese backwards riddles or something? Cause that would be the only rational explanation as to why people constantly fail to understand what I'm saying.
I made a statement about religion, not war times. Romans were always brutal to those they defeat at war (look what they did to Gauls, Carthageneans etc). It was their way. That's why I dislike them.
I just brought up the fact that the Jewish had an organized religious community under Roman rule and that the Romans tolerated it as long as it didn't shake their authority.
____________
"Let me tell you what the blues
is. When you ain't got no
money,
you got the blues."
Howlin Wolf
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Gil-galad
Known Hero
High King of Noldor
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posted September 22, 2007 07:59 PM |
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The romans elimineted any religious group or cult that ignored or openly talked against them. The jews were a peacefull minority in their huge empire and posed no big threat. What I have come to think about however is that from after the roman empire to the end of world war 2 the jews were pursuited and discriminated by everyone ESPECIALLY the christian europeians. Why? The only difference is that the jews did not belive in Jesus. So what? I'm a christian and have completly NOTHING agains jews. Even today we see that the christian countries, including my own, dislike the jews and Israel. Why? The romans did not..... It seems like it was only after the founding of the church that jews became a disliked people. That is something I'm not very proud of.
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baklava
Honorable
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Mostly harmless
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posted September 23, 2007 11:56 AM |
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Yes, that is shameful for us all. But antisemitism doesn't have much to do with christianity.
You see, it appeared only after the Jews started spreading throughout Europe. Jewish people, mostly capable and hard-working, started populating and becoming considerable minorities in almost all of the European countries. The masters of those lands saw them as a threat to their stability, and thus they (more or less openly) tried to rid themselves of Jews, and other large minorities (perhaps the best medieval example is Spain - where queen Isabella used the Inquisition for openly banishing all Semites - both Jewish and Muslim - from Spain).
Hitler was just a culmination of that centuries-long campaign of antisemitism in Europe.
But that's not the case just with Jews; as I mentioned, Muslims were banished with them from Spain, not to mention American genocide over the natives, Turkish over the Armenians, etc.
So the leaders convince the people that a national minority is evil and thus begins banishment and slaughter. The Balkans during the 90s are a perfect example for that.
____________
"Let me tell you what the blues
is. When you ain't got no
money,
you got the blues."
Howlin Wolf
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Celfious
Promising
Legendary Hero
From earth
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posted September 25, 2007 05:38 PM |
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Edited by Celfious at 17:43, 25 Sep 2007.
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Who cares if they are good or bad religions. I just want to know if they are real or not. Then I'll care if its right or bad.
I have beliefs which amount to the start of a religion, but there are some limitations to knowledge.
So it admiting for itself that it does not know, admits to be one who knows what they do not know.
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roy-algriffin
Supreme Hero
Chocolate ice cream zealot
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posted September 26, 2007 01:13 AM |
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Personally ive always wondered a little about (if eveloution applies) what genetic value there is in religion, is it just a manifestation of human creativity? Is it something thats really given to us by some diety? is it something strong in the past thats weak now? Or is there really a genetic use for wasting your time making up gods?
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"Am i a demon? No im a priest of the light! THE BLOODY RED LIGHT"
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Corribus
Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
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posted September 26, 2007 04:04 PM |
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Religion was a necessary step for the evolution of society. But at this point it's pretty obselete.
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Celfious
Promising
Legendary Hero
From earth
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posted September 26, 2007 08:27 PM |
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So when we die, are we forever nothing? Or do we go somewhere?
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russ
Promising
Supreme Hero
blah, blah, blah
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posted September 27, 2007 05:43 PM |
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Quote my friend:
Does the god belive in himself? Does he need to?
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Celfious
Promising
Legendary Hero
From earth
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posted September 28, 2007 02:29 AM |
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Edited by Celfious at 02:31, 28 Sep 2007.
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I see your point russ, but I dont need to believe if myself is real or not. The very feeling that I am, is enough proof to me that I am, what or who I am cannot be clear in grand philosophies.
So I would think God see's it in that light, except he may know a lot about himself and everything else... If of course, there is a god.
I came to a funny realization. That something had to originate by some devine magic, the big bang theory, or God himself (Theres other possibilitieis too).
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Celfious
Promising
Legendary Hero
From earth
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posted October 02, 2007 10:11 PM |
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In my life, the important thing is I believe in something. Even though I have some things figured out, and some things not figured out, I have peace of mind knowing ultimately I'm a good guy and I believe in some type of power, even if its god or space aliens.
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TitaniumAlloy
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posted October 06, 2007 05:18 PM |
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Therefore you are deist and not theist, believing that there is no supernatural figure who is concerned with our thoughts or what we do behind closed doors
And this thread isn't about a particular religion, it is about believing in god.
If it were about religion we might be sitting here hanging on Confucianism or Buddhism, but it's perfectly possible to be both religious in that sense and entirely atheist.
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John says to live above hell.
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