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Heroes Community > Other Side of the Monitor > Thread: What is Love?
Thread: What is Love? This Popular Thread is 225 pages long: 1 30 60 90 120 ... 146 147 148 149 150 ... 180 210 225 · «PREV / NEXT»
bLiZzArdbOY
bLiZzArdbOY


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Nerf Herder
posted December 02, 2010 08:28 PM
Edited by bLiZzArdbOY at 21:25, 02 Dec 2010.

Quote:

I disagree with that. I think, this is just beside what actually is important.

It's pretty much only a question of
a) open-mindedness and
b) priorities

No one is ever a finished person. Development still happens, hopefully, and relationships are not about finding a mirror, but broaden your perspective. This means, necessarily, that while there WILL be similarities, there also will be differences.

What does that mean in practise? Take political and religious views.
Persons A and B meet and fall in love. Person A gives religious and political views a high priority: A is dedicated. B is desinterested and gives it low priority.
Is that bad? No. Open-mindedness provided, B may start delving into things, since for A it's high priority, finding a stance. Or B may not and leave this all to A. A, on the other hand, may dampen priorities, "learning" as well.
Or say both give it high priority, but their views differ. Quite. Is THAT bad? No. Not necessarily. Open-mindedness provided, they may BOTH learn from each other, BECAUSE they give themselves highest priority, simply assuming that partner may have good points and good reasons to differ.
Of course, if both just try to keep and dominate the other with their differing views, it won't work.
Also, it gets streessful if you differ too strongly too often.

You have to be able to really talk with each other and LISTEN to your partner, which amounts to BEING INTERESTED in him/her and what he/she may have to say. If that interest wanes, if you cannot surprise each other anymore, if you don't provide any kind of challenge for each other anymore, the relationship is pretty much done.
Too much similarity will just become boring, too much difference will become too much of a strain in real life.

You might say, people are sets. With two people there will be an overlap. Ideally, the overlap provides the base from which the seperate sets are explored. The overlap must be big enough to provide a solid base you can fall back to in times of trouble, strain and so on. However, the not overlapping zones must be big and fascinating anough to provide development, adventure, and stimuli for both.


From my observations of life, character change - significant character change - is an exception and not a norm. A depressing statement perhaps, but that's how I see it.

By the time a person is out of college, their nature and ideologies are established in stone and aren't going to change much. A person that was a fool in their 20s will still be a fool in their 40s, though perhaps it will be manifested in different ways. If they like sports, they always will. If they're liberal, they always will be. If they're religious, they always will be. If they want to have kids, they always will until that drive is sated. There is nothing new under the sun.

If you want to bank on having a person flexible enough to have a good relationship with you despite substantial differences of opinion, you can go for it, and perhaps it will work, but generally, relationships survive and prosper because there's a minimum amount of conflict.

And I hardly consider being similar to your partner in as many ways as possible as boring. It's like having both a romantic partner and a best friend at the same time.

Compatibility is more important than ever with the increasing rise of divorces/break-ups. There are various factors you could attribute to this rise, but all of them boil down to one reality: since the rise of female status in parts of the world, there are now two lords in the household instead of one calling the shots and the other conceding. As they say, two tigers cannot live on the same mountain ; or more specifically: two tigers cannot live on the same mountain without a great deal more planning and compatibility.
____________
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mvassilev
mvassilev


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
posted December 02, 2010 09:56 PM

Quote:
in that case, doesn't the goal become more important than the other person?
The ultimate goal is to lead a happy life, but a good relationship can be part of that. It doesn't mean that the other person is worth less - they're an essential component of it.
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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted December 02, 2010 10:12 PM

Quote:
[
From my observations of life, character change - significant character change - is an exception and not a norm.

Except that we are not talking about significant character change, but broadening of perspective and development.

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markkur
markkur


Honorable
Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
posted December 02, 2010 11:58 PM

Quote:
Quote:
100% correct. The problem is the way I typed that out is not seen in like fashion in RL and it is also focused on the essence of 'someone else' and not ourselves, so seeing what's what is not so easy.
[/quote

Quote:
I'm having a bit of trouble reading that. let's say, someone makes you feel good, but really, the other person doesn't do anything special to make you feel good, but it's just a reaction of your brain. and then, you build the image that this person makes you feel good, and sometimes worse, than no one else can make you feel that good. and then you become excessively possessive and jealous, not only that, but you become kind of disdainful toward other people because you are convinced they will never bring you as much pleasure as your chosen one.


That's pretty much what I meant, except maybe the last line. The point is and we agree, in that what we think we have...is hard to know for sure for various reasons. And that leads me back to the "in-spite of" Love. Because "knowing you hosed something up" and still getting the same from the one your with, is <IMO> a fairly clear sign that you have something really good going on. Until then , like you have well-said, what you think is happening and what is really going on can be quite different. Most of your analogy rang true with me, because my first love I did guard like gold, and my jealousy finally turned everything into concrete.
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"Do your own research"

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selcy
selcy


Famous Hero
posted December 03, 2010 12:12 AM

In one word with the right person "AMAZING"

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Fauch
Fauch


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
posted December 03, 2010 12:42 AM

oh, there is something I forgot, isn't JJ quite old?
maybe he is retired and many of his friends too?

then that might explain why he believes most people are open-minded. retired people have enough time to do what they want and even time left to care about other people.

but 20 years old people? most of them seem only concerned with earning money and having fun. once they have finished working, they have better to do than opening themselves to other people, they need to have fun. the problem is many people are too busy doing things they don't enjoy (working) and trying to look respectable in society, they are so focused on torturing themself to comply to the system, the society, that they can barely open themselves to other people.

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madshj
madshj


Famous Hero
Minotaur Lord
posted December 03, 2010 08:49 AM

Yesterday, the period in my life, in whioh I had been most happy, ended.. The girl of my life, left my side..
It had been 5 fantastic months with her.. We had so much together, experienced so much together, to mention a thing, she was the first girl I ever slept with, and the one girl I loved more than anything and would have done anything for, the girl whom I loved more than life itself..
So what happened? would one ask himself. Well.. Lately, she's been seeming strange/sad, however she said it was nothing, and in the start I tossed it off as being nothing. 2-3 weeks passed, still the same.. then last saturday night I finally got it out of her.. She didn't love me anymore.. Apparemtly she lost the love feelings for me.. "I don't love you as I have done :i" she wrote..
I begged her to stay, begged her to think of all the things that we had together, all the times that we had been together. She said she would think about it for a couple of days, and said we should not write to each other in that period, to see if she missed me.
Well.. In that time period, lasting from saturday to yesterday, I had a maximum of 8 hours of sleep totally. I had barely been eating or drinking anything, and broke down often. Yesterday evening was the worst day in my entire life. The evening she wrote: I can't stand it anymore. I didn't miss you as a girlfriend misses her boyfriend.

I broke down completely, luckily I was able to cry out on my parents's shoulders.. Thoughts about everything her and I had done together, whirled around in my head, making tears come to my eyes every few minutes. Tonight I had zero sleep, I've been crying my eyes out, haven't been able to find rest..

I can't believe I'm never going to hold her or kiss her anymore ;( I'm so completely crushed.. And she said it wasn't me, it was her.. Yet, how does one just stop loving..?

What is love..?

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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted December 03, 2010 09:10 AM

Fauch, no, I'm not retired. No, I don't think that most people are open-minded.

But, you know, the essence of love is a continuing interest in a person. It has something t do with fascination. You don't love a person because of a specific detail, but because the person as a whole is something special for you.
If that's not the case, you don't love.
So, if the sex is great, but you can live without much talk because you don't find anything interesting to talk about - it's not love. If you talk endlessly about this and that and something else (and enjoy it), but you ar somewhat not really interested in his or her body (even though you are sexually active) it's not love.
If it IS love you WILL want to spend time with him/her. You will want to do things together. Simple things, like preparing a meal or play a game, complicated things like prepare a role-playing evening with friends or talk about god, the communist party, the revolution, nuclear power or the aliens. You have an interest in his or her thoughts, and you will take them seriously and into consideration. If it IS love, you will learn and profit from each other and develop WITH each other.

Those (serious) relationships who fail after a time, say 10, 15 years of marriage, do it because at some point the mutual development stopped. Instead both develop WITHOUT the other, but fail to communicate the important stuff.
That means, the relationship slows down - it's not keeping pace with personal development anymore and gets behind so-to-speak.
So, in these cases, 15 years into marriage, the relationship may be frozen at 5 years into it. Partners see and treat themselves the way they used to at that time, a couple of years ago, while SEPARATELY, each for themselves, is of course living in the present.

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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted December 03, 2010 09:13 AM

Quote:
Yesterday, the period in my life, in whioh I had been most happy, ended.. The girl of my life, left my side..
It had been 5 fantastic months with her.. We had so much together, experienced so much together, to mention a thing, she was the first girl I ever slept with, and the one girl I loved more than anything and would have done anything for, the girl whom I loved more than life itself..
So what happened? would one ask himself. Well.. Lately, she's been seeming strange/sad, however she said it was nothing, and in the start I tossed it off as being nothing. 2-3 weeks passed, still the same.. then last saturday night I finally got it out of her.. She didn't love me anymore.. Apparemtly she lost the love feelings for me.. "I don't love you as I have done :i" she wrote..
I begged her to stay, begged her to think of all the things that we had together, all the times that we had been together. She said she would think about it for a couple of days, and said we should not write to each other in that period, to see if she missed me.
Well.. In that time period, lasting from saturday to yesterday, I had a maximum of 8 hours of sleep totally. I had barely been eating or drinking anything, and broke down often. Yesterday evening was the worst day in my entire life. The evening she wrote: I can't stand it anymore. I didn't miss you as a girlfriend misses her boyfriend.

I broke down completely, luckily I was able to cry out on my parents's shoulders.. Thoughts about everything her and I had done together, whirled around in my head, making tears come to my eyes every few minutes. Tonight I had zero sleep, I've been crying my eyes out, haven't been able to find rest..

I can't believe I'm never going to hold her or kiss her anymore ;( I'm so completely crushed.. And she said it wasn't me, it was her.. Yet, how does one just stop loving..?

What is love..?


See it this way: It's a kind of withdrawal. It will take some time to come over the worst, but when you are, you will take an interest in other girls again, and you will see that there IS life and love after her.

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JoonasTo
JoonasTo


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
posted December 03, 2010 10:35 AM

Wounds heal and memories fade.
Applies to first loves too.

Give it time and enjoy all the free time you have now.
____________
DON'T BE A NOOB, JOIN A.D.V.E.N.T.U.R.E.

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Fauch
Fauch


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
posted December 03, 2010 11:12 AM

Quote:
So what happened? would one ask himself. Well.. Lately, she's been seeming strange/sad, however she said it was nothing, and in the start I tossed it off as being nothing. 2-3 weeks passed, still the same.. then last saturday night I finally got it out of her.. She didn't love me anymore..

it's not just serious, but she was probably young. if she loved you, she would have told you what the problem was. why wouldn't she trust you?

Quote:
I can't stand it anymore. I didn't miss you as a girlfriend misses her boyfriend.

and why should a girlfriend miss his boyfriend? I mean, you do not lose sleep over not seeing your friends for a few days, and you are still happy to meet with them.

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Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted December 03, 2010 11:40 AM

Quote:
and why should a girlfriend miss his boyfriend? I mean, you do not lose sleep over not seeing your friends for a few days, and you are still happy to meet with them.


Because friend and girlfriend is two completely different things. People that don't see a difference just shouldn't enter relationships with people that do. (to avoid hurting them).
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We reached to the stars and everything is now ours

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Fauch
Fauch


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
posted December 03, 2010 01:23 PM

is there something to do with jealousy?

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Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted December 03, 2010 01:48 PM

No. It's that you don't love your friends. If you have no romantic feelings towards the person you're in relationship with, it would be only fair not to be in relationship with her (in other words, not to fool her into thinking you do) if she's a different kind of person than you.

If she's the same, you may as well be happy together considering each other "just friends".
____________
We reached to the stars and everything is now ours

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Fauch
Fauch


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Undefeatable Hero
posted December 03, 2010 02:53 PM

it doesn't seem to make much sense, according to what I think love is. it implies being able to trust and talk without fear to each other. I don't know what being romantic has to do with it.

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Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted December 03, 2010 03:55 PM
Edited by Doomforge at 15:57, 03 Dec 2010.

Quote:
according to what I think love is. .


Point is, a person with a different viewpoint on that matter won't be happy with you. They'll want to be someone special to you, more than "just a good friend who can trust". Because people usually have a lot of people they can trust and talk without fear, and want their partner to be more than that "mundane" thing. And you won't be able to grant that.

So, it would be best for you to find a person who thinks like you in that department.
____________
We reached to the stars and everything is now ours

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Fauch
Fauch


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Undefeatable Hero
posted December 03, 2010 07:08 PM
Edited by Fauch at 19:14, 03 Dec 2010.

really? then why do so many people lie to that special person?

Quote:
Point is, a person with a different viewpoint on that matter won't be happy with you. They'll want to be someone special to you, more than "just a good friend who can trust".

but then, they are unhappy, not because we have different points of view, but just because they are egoist. I don't think love is about feeding the egoism of the other person.

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mvassilev
mvassilev


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
posted December 03, 2010 10:20 PM

Quote:
then why do so many people lie to that special person?
Clearly, because that "special" person isn't that special to them.

And love is all about mutual egoism.
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Eccentric Opinion

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Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted December 03, 2010 11:13 PM

Quote:
Clearly, because that "special" person isn't that special to them.




Fauch

Quote:
I don't think


Keyword quoted.

That's your point of view. That's how you see/understand love.

Someone who has another definition will most likely not be happy with your approach.
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We reached to the stars and everything is now ours

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selcy
selcy


Famous Hero
posted December 04, 2010 12:24 AM

To me true love is unconditional - you can't say you love them because they love you or you love them cos they make you feel special or you love them cos they buy you gifts. Love is a mixture of everything companionship, happiness, patience, understanding a good relationship has give and take and most of all compromise as theres no room for selfishness it just wont work and you also need more than just sex  

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