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| Thread: New (unofficial) patch for ToE / AI mod |  This thread is pages long: 1 ... 4 5 6 7 8 ... 10 20 30 40 46 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Quantomas
Responsible
Famous Hero
AI Wizard
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posted February 24, 2011 06:04 PM |
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Wizard Quantomas walks through his wizard tower and looks with a frown at the package placed at his doorstep by fellow wizard scholar Magnomagus a couple days earlier. 22 million runes! Not that the wizard knowledge crystal had problems storing all this information, but it will take weeks alone to make initial sense of it.
::Thinks kindly:: of his fellow wizard scholars Markkur, who assists him to keep his schedule managable and is an excellent expert of the land, and Cepheus, who is a brilliant researcher and gets things done with a minimum of fuss.
::He glances again at the ominous package:: ......... and makes his way to the lab.
Back in the lab important work is waiting. Research pertaining to the intelligence of creatures and heroes of the land. To make them more intelligent he needs to distill the intelligence, analyze it and understand the connections to the land. Not a task for the weak minded and there is real urgency, to make them resistant to the seventh strain of the microbust virus that has appeared lately. A many heroes have lamented over it.
::focuses the mind and forgets about all other things for the moment::
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zaio-baio
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted February 24, 2011 10:25 PM |
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Hi guys,
i really like the new AI, and all the concepts that you have about the future of the game, but i am kinda scared that you are rushing the things way too much:
1) New gameplay modes
2) New hero specialties
3) New adventure map structures with new gameplay effects
4) New skills, creature abilities, break hero level limit
5) New artifacts
6) New terrains
7) New spells and spell schools
8) New... everything, to be frank
I think that it would be better, if you first fix the balance of the game:
-some lame exploits like academy getting infinity cash and resources, or mentoring a knight/ranger
-balancing the arcane archers,crossbows and some other units
-divine vengeance - ban/change/balance
-improving some underused abilities ( like necros banishee howl, spoils of war, etc), and nerfing abilities like stormwind - -20% init and -1 speed, ot -10% init and - 2 speed, but not both damn it !
-changing some skill paths ( like being forced to get recruitment from leadership if you want empathy/retribution with some factions ) it will be 100 times better if the player can choose freely between recruitment,+250 gold a day or diplomacy and still be able to learn divine guidance and empathy - thats the real freedom
- wyngaal + some other heros just need nerfing, while others like laszlo ( who was a good deal before nerfing training btw) are now extreamly underused - it will be great if you change his ability, or give him enlightenment as a starting skill for compensation
- changing some units to be more attractive - like giving back life drain to the seraph - not 50% life drain ofcource - its way too imba, mb 10-15-20%, but thats what the players want to see, not a lvl 7 unit casting boring spells
- luck should be capped at 3/4
- starting ATB - now its 0-25%, it will be great if you reduce it to 0-10%
I think that this ^ is very important, and needs to be done, becouse who cares how good the game looks like, or whats the new content, if the whole balance is broken ?
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Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted February 25, 2011 12:22 AM |
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Edited by Fauch at 00:32, 25 Feb 2011.
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well, some of the leagues players know how to mod it and they are probably the better ones to fix the balance.
of course, there are a lots of changes that are obvious, but I see that when it comes to divine vengeance or rune of charge for example, they are just banned, which means that no one yet found a solution good enough?
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-some lame exploits like academy getting infinity cash and resources, or mentoring a knight/ranger
no idea what you mean
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-balancing the arcane archers,crossbows and some other units
for most of them it's easy, only a few of them will require some creative ideas
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-divine vengeance - ban/change/balance
there are many way to balance. make it less powerful, or more expensive, or a level 5 spell
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-improving some underused abilities ( like necros banishee howl, spoils of war, etc), and nerfing abilities like stormwind - -20% init and -1 speed, ot -10% init and - 2 speed, but not both damn it !
some of them are easy to change, but not spoils of war
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-changing some skill paths ( like being forced to get recruitment from leadership if you want empathy/retribution with some factions ) it will be 100 times better if the player can choose freely between recruitment,+250 gold a day or diplomacy and still be able to learn divine guidance and empathy - thats the real freedom
it's easy. but I wonder if it possible to add a new skill about management. in particular, having fortunate under leadership doesn't make much sense to me.
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- wyngaal + some other heros just need nerfing, while others like laszlo ( who was a good deal before nerfing training btw) are now extreamly underused - it will be great if you change his ability, or give him enlightenment as a starting skill for compensation
I think wyngaal can be easily nerfed. for laszlo, it is more complicated
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- changing some units to be more attractive - like giving back life drain to the seraph - not 50% life drain ofcource - its way too imba, mb 10-15-20%, but thats what the players want to see, not a lvl 7 unit casting boring spells
it is going to be 50% anyway, unless you nerf vampires too.
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- luck should be capped at 3/4
why? you can reduce damage dealt by a lucky strike. like only +50% ?
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- starting ATB - now its 0-25%, it will be great if you reduce it to 0-10%
I have no idea if you can do that
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magnomagus
Admirable
Legendary Hero
modding wizard
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posted February 25, 2011 05:47 PM |
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I agree with Zaio-baio you have to look out not try to fix things that aren't broken or modify things just for the pleasure of modifying.
At the same time, most of the balance problems have been dealt with in RPE addons, the H5 tournament edition and Duel Tourney maps. So there is not much need for another balance overhaul. Some of the hard-coded things like the starting ATB might still be interesting
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MMH5.5 Downloads | MMH5.5 Translations | MMH5.5 FAQ
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Gnoll_Mage
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted February 25, 2011 11:33 PM |
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And presumably we can now do that, given the level of exe modification Quantomas has introduced.
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atheist
Hired Hero
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posted February 26, 2011 03:02 AM |
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This AI mod is a full rewrite of the AI inspired by the spirit of H3 and the chess computer program Fritz that has proven that a computer AI can be a match for world champions.
Seriously dude, Fritz! lolwut! match for world champions? maybe 10 years ago.
Try houdini 15a, HOUDINI is THE SH!T Beats the crap out of RybkaIV too  Trust me
Stay cool, I'm just improving on the strategy here. Thanks and Good job for creating this! I can't wait to try it! But ditch Fritz, it's old stuff
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Quantomas
Responsible
Famous Hero
AI Wizard
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posted February 26, 2011 09:30 AM |
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::Wizard Quantomas comes out of his lab to check on a historical reference::
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Historically, the crown goes to the first who makes an advancement. Deep Fritz was the proof, the matches against Kramnik, Kasparov and Kasimdzhanov (world champions) the real test (source: www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fritz_(chess)). Surely, there are better chess engines now. But then, I ditched playing chess a long time ago because it took way too much time. I also believe that the future of strategy games lies in computer games like Heroes, where you have a much richer world with strategic landscapes and features board games just cannot offer. If we have an AI, that is as formidable as Fritz (or better ones for that matter), we have a game that people can marvel at. There are many good Heroes players who can rightfully claim to be veteran strategists, but if we have an AI that outwits them and shows what is possible on a map, artful strategies they didn't see before, we will have something to behold.
Ok, guys, I am doing some serious coding and my reply to the design threads will follow after that. Good points and I have a response, but that has to wait for the time being.
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::Wizard Quantomas goes back into the lab::
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undead_assault
Adventuring Hero
Armageddoning
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posted February 26, 2011 11:09 AM |
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hmmm, quick question:
@Wizard Quantomas, are you planning to develop gameplay/tweak skills/balancing the game beside improving the Super AI of yours?
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Cepheus
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Far-flung Keeper
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posted February 26, 2011 02:42 PM |
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Quote:
Ok, guys, I am doing some serious coding and my reply to the design threads will follow after that. Good points and I have a response, but that has to wait for the time being.
And all the best of luck (and morale  ) to your heroic efforts 
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"Those who forget their history are inevitably doomed to repeat it." —Proverb, Might and Magic VIII
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markkur
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
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posted February 26, 2011 04:43 PM |
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Quote:
Wizard Quantomas walks through his wizard tower and looks with a frown at the package placed at his doorstep by fellow wizard scholar Magnomagus a couple days earlier. 22 million runes! Not that the wizard knowledge crystal had problems storing all this information, but it will take weeks alone to make initial sense of it.
::He glances again at the ominous package:: ......... and makes his way to the lab.
Not a task for the weak minded and there is real urgency, to make them resistant to the seventh strain of the microbust virus that has appeared lately.
Ok, my eyes are watered and my sides hurt, I laughed so much. The underlined are perfect. Should have known the stubborn dwarves were responsible for the file structure. And, "7th-strain" well describes my malady. 
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Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted February 26, 2011 05:49 PM |
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though, not everyone wants to play against an AI that would even crush world champions
there's a great margin between an AI letting you win and an unbeatable one
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alex32bittt
Tavern Dweller
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posted February 27, 2011 11:59 AM |
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Hi Quantomas! That's very impressive what you are going to to with Heroes 5. I tried to play with yours new A.I. and I think: he's very fast, smart and really aggressive! And I really like this! Thanks a lot for your work.
But may I tell some dose of critique:
1.sometimes I noticed that AI behaves strangely. He didn't move all of his heroes during a week or so. They come alive only with the beginning of a new week.
2.AI didn't captured empty castles and run past of them. But on the next turn he returns and captured them. I think castle should be a goal number one for AI.
3.AI insufficiently protects new captured castles. Also as I can see AI didn't trying to discourage his castles when other players captured them.
4.game speed slows down after a few weeks, because preparation for the move increases markedly.
5.On what principle AI selected the next region on the map for research in debug mode? Sometimes I think that this process unpredictable...
6.A couple of times I have noticed that AI stops in front of the portal and stood before him in a few turns or a whole week.At the same time, on the other side of the portal there was nobody, who could block his path. That's very strange...
7.Could you explain,please, what tactics AI committed when he pumps several heroes? As I can see AI is pumping all the heroes at the same time without singling out the main. I think this when I see how several heroes try to pick up resources. When the first hero finished his turn and pick up some resources and chest. Then other hero picked up the remaining resources,among which were chests of gold.
Sorry for my English and good luck with your work!
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Lord_Immortal
Famous Hero
DoR Dev Team
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posted February 27, 2011 04:44 PM |
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First of all,congratukations for the mod Quantomas.I haven't currently installed ToTE but I really like the idea
Quote:
Hi guys,
I think that it would be better, if you first fix the balance of the game:
-some lame exploits like academy getting infinity cash and resources, or mentoring a knight/ranger
-balancing the arcane archers,crossbows and some other units
-divine vengeance - ban/change/balance
-improving some underused abilities ( like necros banishee howl, spoils of war, etc), and nerfing abilities like stormwind - -20% init and -1 speed, ot -10% init and - 2 speed, but not both damn it !
-changing some skill paths ( like being forced to get recruitment from leadership if you want empathy/retribution with some factions ) it will be 100 times better if the player can choose freely between recruitment,+250 gold a day or diplomacy and still be able to learn divine guidance and empathy - thats the real freedom
- wyngaal + some other heros just need nerfing, while others like laszlo ( who was a good deal before nerfing training btw) are now extreamly underused - it will be great if you change his ability, or give him enlightenment as a starting skill for compensation
- changing some units to be more attractive - like giving back life drain to the seraph - not 50% life drain ofcource - its way too imba, mb 10-15-20%, but thats what the players want to see, not a lvl 7 unit casting boring spells
- luck should be capped at 3/4
- starting ATB - now its 0-25%, it will be great if you reduce it to 0-10%
I think that this ^ is very important, and needs to be done, becouse who cares how good the game looks like, or whats the new content, if the whole balance is broken ?
I think that we let things as they are zaio-baio,beacause sometimes,its overpowering that makes the game interesting,not just balance,besides,we should think an alternative way to balance things,not just subtracting stats.As for underpowered abilities/skills:
Banshee Howl-is quite strong when playing Deirdre and increasing its effect would simply overpower Deirdre.To balance things then,we would be forced to lower "Banshee" speciality effect,rendering it useless.
Spoils of War-never got that and I don't know what it does.
Soulhunter-Yes,Naadir's Souldrinker skill is quite weak,even for higher levels,and it needs re-coding.
Dark Energy-On my opinion,Dark Energy should be totally removed(Necro Creatures are quite weak themselves).
Infantry Commander-I agree.
Quote:
1) New gameplay modes
2) New hero specialties
3) New adventure map structures with new gameplay effects
4) New skills, creature abilities, break hero level limit
5) New artifacts
6) New terrains
7) New spells and spell schools
8) New... everything, to be frank
Quite ambitious...New Towns too???? Cos' if so,I've got a general idea how to do something "similiar".
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markkur
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
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posted March 07, 2011 04:10 PM |
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Edited by markkur at 16:16, 07 Mar 2011.
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A note to all interested in this work...from "Q"
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I am currently on a coding run, technically refactoring 30,000+ lines of C++ source code for the AI alone to run in two separate processes; and also fixing reported issues and upgrading features here and there, laying the groundwork for the RPE mod, unlimited creatures and other things.
Normally, you need an entire team for this to work probably six months and more. But what good would it do to be a wizard if we can't do stuff faster? 90 % done I would say, status green."
A reminder to all;
One of the things that our Wizard faces in this project is being only one-person while receiving all forms of "needed" communication from HC. Please be as "concise" as possible when posting, knowing that it will have to be "Q" that addresses each topic. Also, remember this will be a slow process at times.
One other note; Please post your "Design-ideas" in "Q's design thread". http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=34729
Please take no offence, this is merely an effort to keep his visits here at HC as efficient as possible since his lab-work on this project is already so time-consuming.
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atheist
Hired Hero
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posted March 09, 2011 04:52 PM |
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Now that I tested this I can say it's clearly better than normal AI.
But let me sum up some faulty behaviour of the AI that I've encountered, maybe something could be done.
Game is Key to Victory, Heroic.
1) kamikaze attacks, reckless attitude.
A level 14 Vittorio/Haven (blue) breaches my area in start of week 3 and attacks my level 9 Dirael/Sylvan (red). It turns out that by doing this he ensured that both of us lose the game. Green's main was in his area preparing to attack him, and Yellow was near, coming for me. From blue's perspective, defeating 1 player is useless if then he loses the game too. AI should try to adopt strategy that increses chances it will be the sole winner, thus he should not make kamikaze attacks like this. I mean, he DID force my main to flee, but he also lost his all army, and then, his hero. Instead, it was in his best interest to go back and defend from Green.
2) No troop unstacking in combat, no retreat when it is clear Main will die.
Vittorio forces Dirael to retreat (his ballista made the difference for him), but he has 19 conscripts left. I attack him with secondary hero with 7 stacks x1 sprites. In battle he puts all his 19 conscripts in 1 stack, and then I used Wasp Swarm to kill them. To my surprise, when it is clear that he will die, he chooses to die instead of retreating. I'm almost sure that Normal AI would have fleed. Maybe his ballista made him evaluate the position wrongfully? He could have easily won this if he had split his troops into 7 stacks.
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fiur
Promising
Supreme Hero
Map Creator
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posted March 10, 2011 01:20 PM |
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Yesterday I was looking forward to test this new mod in a multiplayer game (my best friend comes over now and then to play Heroes 5). But something must be wrong..... 
Cause the turns took forever...
(and yes I did delete all other mods in the mod folder...)
and combat suffer from the same fate.... in between each move on the atb bare it took atleast 30 sec....
could U help me out here....
(puters.... XP SP3 vrs. 7 64 bit...)
Spec... no probs at all (ram GPU etc...)
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Quantomas
Responsible
Famous Hero
AI Wizard
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posted March 10, 2011 06:05 PM |
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::Wizard Quantomas comes out of his lab to answer a hero knocking on the door to his wizard tower::
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A bit of patience please.  Win7 compatibility comes with the next patch upgrade. I am fairly confident that the separation of the H5 Game and AI processes will make the app much more robust and faster to boot. Multiplayer tests should not commence before this step is complete.
That the AI is a bit too aggressive at times will be resolved with the strategic end stage (which is missing so far). I have a design and plan to implement it in the next upgrade. Things should get exciting then. 
Still lots of work to do. Dealing with blocked regions currently.
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::Wizard Quantomas goes back into the lab::
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Proxeeus
Hired Hero
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posted March 10, 2011 07:26 PM |
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Awesome news, can't wait
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undead_assault
Adventuring Hero
Armageddoning
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posted March 11, 2011 02:52 AM |
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hmmm, this AI Mod is making me unpatient just like Heroes VI.
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atheist
Hired Hero
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posted March 11, 2011 08:44 PM |
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By the way I forgot to mention that sometimes some visual glitches start occuring. The game icons and graphics get distorted in a pretty bad way. It's very strange. I can provide screenshots if necessary. I never had these glitches before so it must be the mod. Usually it happens when I enter the castle. Then I must exit and re-enter a few times before thing get back to normal.
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