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| Thread: America is corrupted |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Kayna
Supreme Hero
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posted November 07, 2015 07:11 PM |
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Edited by Kayna at 19:13, 07 Nov 2015.
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artu said:
There can be so many reasons for that, economical, it can be cheaper to smelt hundreds of thousands of metal there, why does Apple have factories in China? How does smelting metal in another country effect your opinion of this directly?
That is a very short answer of a very important part of 9 - 11. Odd, considering how your answers are often long and eloquent walls of text. And half of it is a question back at me, a sign of avoidance, an invitation to debate a strawman. I'm not talking about Apple factories in China nor is the location of the metal being smelted important. My guess is that if they wanted that metal to be smelted as quickly as possible because of some obscure reason, they would only let companies they trust do the job, and then they would ship the rest overseas, because the average American has far more reasons to investigate this than a bunch of Chinese smelters.
So you do acknowledge that all that metal was indeed shipped and smelted within a month without proper investigation. Yet, you said earlier today :
artu said:
Such things have been investigated a zillion times.
artu said:
the existing conspiracies all had been investigated sufficiently.
That's hardly sufficient to me. When there is a plane crash, how long do they investigate before they send the said plane to be smelted? And if we compare the volume of a plane to the volume of the twin towers, how long would it take to properly investigate 9 - 11 ? They didn't do so out of monetary reason, you say? 3 000 Americans dead, and they don't want to put the $ into it, when they spend more time and money on small planes crashing with 100 dead people on board? I suppose your BS sensor isn't tingling when it should.
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Elodin
Promising
Legendary Hero
Free Thinker
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posted November 07, 2015 07:29 PM |
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All governments have a certain amount ofcorruption and the more power the people allow the government to have the more corrupt the government becomes.
But 9-11was not an American plot. America has faced Islamoterrorism since we first became a nation. Islamic terror is the reason for 9-11.
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Revelation
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fred79
Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 07, 2015 07:54 PM |
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Kayna said:
artu said:
There can be so many reasons for that, economical, it can be cheaper to smelt hundreds of thousands of metal there, why does Apple have factories in China? How does smelting metal in another country effect your opinion of this directly?
That is a very short answer of a very important part of 9 - 11. Odd, considering how your answers are often long and eloquent walls of text. And half of it is a question back at me, a sign of avoidance, an invitation to debate a strawman. I'm not talking about Apple factories in China nor is the location of the metal being smelted important. My guess is that if they wanted that metal to be smelted as quickly as possible because of some obscure reason, they would only let companies they trust do the job, and then they would ship the rest overseas, because the average American has far more reasons to investigate this than a bunch of Chinese smelters.
So you do acknowledge that all that metal was indeed shipped and smelted within a month without proper investigation. Yet, you said earlier today :
artu said:
Such things have been investigated a zillion times.
artu said:
the existing conspiracies all had been investigated sufficiently.
That's hardly sufficient to me. When there is a plane crash, how long do they investigate before they send the said plane to be smelted? And if we compare the volume of a plane to the volume of the twin towers, how long would it take to properly investigate 9 - 11 ? They didn't do so out of monetary reason, you say? 3 000 Americans dead, and they don't want to put the $ into it, when they spend more time and money on small planes crashing with 100 dead people on board? I suppose your BS sensor isn't tingling when it should.
lol, he has a point, artu.
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Zenofex
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
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posted November 07, 2015 08:10 PM |
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artu said:
@Zenofex
The two claims are not symmetrical in probability, they are not even close. Not every speculation about goverments' dark secrets hold the same weight and the existing 9/11 conspiracies are very very far fetched in that regard. Operation Northwoods is not something of this magnitude and eventually, it was rejected.
I'm not claiming they are, not even claiming that the vast majority of the 9/11 conspiracy theories deserve any attention (some, like the ones asking why the government didn't do much about it when it certainly had prior information do though), just that there are no real moral obstacles before something like that. Operation Northwoods was rejected mainly because of fears of potential Soviet intervention, not because somebody saw it as monstrous to kill Americans in the name of the "greater good", i.e. the removal of the Communist threat near the US shores. This operation is known (now), hell knows how many similar plans and endeavours remain classified. My point is that these things are fully possible, not that 9/11 was necessarily one of them.
Quote:
because it relates to corruption, obviously
Yeah, maybe, to some extent, in some context... Well, leaded gasoline also relates to corruption and has killed considerably more people than the 9/11 attacks but people don't tend to have heated discussions about things like that. The "invisible" damage done by corruption is much greater than the visible one, maybe it will be better to discuss that?
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted November 07, 2015 08:15 PM |
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Edited by artu at 20:16, 07 Nov 2015.
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@Kanya
When you said "hundreds and thousands of metal," it didnt sound like they all came from the planes, I was referring to the planted explosives part of the equation, when I said things were investigated sufficiently and they had been as you can read in the pdf I linked. That's what matters when you test how the metal got smelted. I'll look into the details about your specific questions tomorrow, I dont acknowledge, it is exactly as you say it is but I remember no contrary information either. Most probably, there is a very simple and obvious answer to this one also, since US sending something to China or India with the intention of hiding the facts sounds quite absurd as it is.
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Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost
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fred79
Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 07, 2015 08:48 PM |
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Zenofex said:
Yeah, maybe, to some extent, in some context... Well, leaded gasoline also relates to corruption and has killed considerably more people than the 9/11 attacks but people don't tend to have heated discussions about things like that. The "invisible" damage done by corruption is much greater than the visible one, maybe it will be better to discuss that?
of course it refers to corruption. there is no denying that without the risk of sounding illogical, zeno. 
i agree with the rest, of course. but i never said that 9/11 was such a big deal anyway(or has killed more than anything else. i mean, automobile/alchohol deaths alone surpass that). just a means to an end, is how i consider it. that end being 1st world countries profitting from 3rd world countries, however they can. and that's not to say that i feel bad for 3rd world countries, before anyone gets that idea. if they'd get their snow together and stop bickering among one another, they'd be in the same 1st-world bickering ranks as everyone else. or maybe not. the land isn't known for being particularly fertile, but i suspect they could fix that if they built waterways leading from a good source of water. they really have no excuse; the iraqis anyway. they are hard, dilligent workers.
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Kayna
Supreme Hero
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posted November 07, 2015 09:34 PM |
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Edited by Kayna at 21:36, 07 Nov 2015.
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On a crime scene, what do the cops do. Do you see the investigator pointing fingers and say "ok this goes to the trash, that as well, put that in the container, get all of that crap at the dump right away, then I'll investigate what happened" or do they try not to disturb anything to have as many clues as possible?
Obviously the latter. Well, if they didn't get any prior orders that is.
September eleven was one heck of a crime scene, and I've read things saying it had about 250 000 tons just in metal, and that it was sold to China for 120 $ a ton when other companies in the us was offering 160 $ per ton of steel. Instead of selling it right away, once again, in less than a month, they could've transported it somewhere to study the twists and bends and such to better understand what happened. Even if just to build more resistant towers in the future. Can always sell the steel a few years later.
I am not talking about how the metal melted upon impact, just how fast they shipped the steel away to be smelted. 9 - 11 is one of the biggest destruction of evidence in human history, and then people say "oh but you got no proof of it". Obviously.
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fred79
Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 07, 2015 09:43 PM |
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if kayna is correct(i never studied any of the details of the actual destruction or cleanup), then that is rather telling evidence that there was indeed a cover-up.
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted November 07, 2015 09:50 PM |
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Edited by artu at 21:51, 07 Nov 2015.
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Okay, for a quick note, here is what comes up first, when you Google "9 11 metal sent to China" and as I guessed, the explanation is pretty simple and it is contrary to the claim that the metal was snatched away:
Link
The link's source is FEMA (Federal Emergency Agency):
Question: Why was all the World Trade Center steel allegedly shipped off to China right after 9/11?
Best Answer:
This reminds me of that Jesse Ventura 9/11 episode where he says that all of the steel was shipped off to China while he was looking at some of it through a window at the warehouse at JFK where some of it is still stored.
You must understand that damage from high explosives/therm_te is actually so subtle that only trained experts with years of experience can detect it. That's why the Vast Conspiracy rushed all the steel off to China.
There's nobody in China smart enough to detect it.
Either that, or the Conspiracy put itself and the entire plan at the mercy of the Chinese, who are of course our best friends in the entire world and whose long-standing unquestioning support of US foreign policy made it certain that they would collaborate fully with the cover-up. Or maybe the Chinese were key players in the Conspiracy. You know, all those Zionists and Neocons over there.
China really should have examined all that steel. They would have found all that evidence of controlled demolition and could have used that to blackmail the US government.
They really dropped the ball on that one.
On a lighter note,...
According to FEMA, more than 350,000 tons of steel were extracted from Ground Zero, taken from all seven of the buildings in the WTC complex that were destroyed and likely from St Nicholas Church and part of Fiterman Hall as well, then shipped to Fresh Kills. Once released the steel was barged or trucked to salvage yards in New Jersey where it was cut up for recycling. Four salvage yards were contracted to process the steel, then sell it. At the time there were a lot of sources critical of the movement overseas of the steel. As was explained the local steel merchants wanted no part of the material, even though it was vitually being given away. They were concerned of the emotional impact of working with the material and the consequences of claims they might make profit from such a calamity. Not to mention the steel was possibly contaminated with asbestos, PCBs, cadmium, mercury and dioxins.
The Chinese firm Baosteel purchased 50,000 tons of this recycled steel. A firm in India purchased 30,000 tons of this potentially contaminated product.
Many of the most important pieces of steel to investigators are stored in a 80,000 sq. ft. hangar at JFK airport, as referenced above.
Some of it ended up in a lot of 9/11 Memorials across the country, including one at the California State Fairgrounds in Sacramento and some at the Staten Island Botanical Garden. You can touch it and even scrape it if you like. 24 tons of it ended up in the bow of the USS New York. If they were trying to keep anybody from examining samples of it by shipping it overseas, they had a epic fail.
To non-Truthers, people who rightly saw nothing unusual in the way the buildings collapsed, the steel was just something in the way of the more important task of body recovery. To those who were storing the steel it was a nuisance that, if quickly sold, might help them offset the enormous cost of WTC site cleanup. China had thousands of construction sites desperate for steel around that time so it just made sense that a lot of it ended up there.
Only later, when delusional paranoids started saying the buildings were brought down by explosives/nukes/laser beams/fairy dust, did this removal of steel become an issue.
But since nobody back in September/October 2001 had any idea that delusional idiots in the future would come wanting to test the steel for explosives/nukes/laser beams/fairy dust it was just the expedient thing to do to get rid of it.
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Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost
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fred79
Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 07, 2015 10:33 PM |
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artu said:
But since nobody back in September/October 2001 had any idea that delusional idiots in the future would come wanting to test the steel for explosives/nukes/laser beams/fairy dust it was just the expedient thing to do to get rid of it.
delusional idiots? really?
if you are going to debate your side of the argument, artu, name calling and insults(nukes/laser beams/fairy dust? really, dude?) won't convince anyone of your point.
yes, there was a lot to clean up. but the entire area was a crime scene. a crime that was supposedly against the entire united states' people. and as kayna has pointed out, crime scene evidence is kept forever(it is never destroyed, as far as i know). why ELSE would some of the incarcerated be going free after so many years of being locked behind bars, due to dna examination? besides, people tend to hold on to things that has emotional value, anyway.
a swift reaction based on emotion was a faulty reaction(and always is); a faulty reaction that was used for a different purpose other than on the perpetrators of the crime itself.
and somehow, you still believe that the u.s. government(or any agency therein) was not at fault.
just WHY you keep basing your disbelief by using government sources(which we ALL know are for the good of the common people, RIGHT? RIGHT?! FFS.), and what could VERY WELL BE people PAID to discredit conspiracy theorists by posting outrageous claims IN THE GUISE of a conspiracy theorist(if laser beams and nukes were an actual statement; i doubt fairy dust was among those), you certainly have painted an adequate picture of those who buy whatever the people in charge of things are selling. good for you.
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Drakon-Deus
Undefeatable Hero
Qapla'
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posted November 07, 2015 11:02 PM |
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One more thing: Many of those leaders be they of small or large countries or powerful or less significant countries may BELIEVE they are doing good, but that doesn't make it so. Ceausescu and his communist dictatorship is our recent example.
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted November 07, 2015 11:02 PM |
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The name calling is in the quote. I didnt bother to edit it. And the inventory of the metal by FEMA is not exactly CIA covering classified material, is it? The question was simple and specific, so is the answer, why should I assume FEMA lies, because there is subtle and various evidence in every piece of smelted metal? Approaching this like "but how do we trust FEMA?" is exactly the mindset that I object to, in every step of the conspiracy, another participant joins the sinister network! And why, because an irrational claim, that tons of metal which was somehow crucial evidence was shipped away was proposed in the first place which wasnt so. It's a blind circle. Any journalist can interview the local merchants who rejected the metal to check such ordinary facts, is the explanation beyond our reach to investigate, no. So, where's the problem?
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Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost
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fred79
Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 07, 2015 11:16 PM |
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Edited by fred79 at 23:18, 07 Nov 2015.
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artu said:
The name calling is in the quote. I didnt bother to edit it.
i can see why you left it in. you may well get away with it, being that it's "just a quote from someone else". if you leave it and it remains unedited by a mod, you will be setting a precedent for anyone to add insults to the opposing side of an argument by quoting outside sources.
artu said:
And the inventory of the metal by FEMA is not exactly CIA covering classified material, is it? The question was simple and specific, so is the answer, why should I assume FEMA lies, because there is subtle and various evidence in every piece of smelted metal? Approaching this like "but how do we trust FEMA?" is exactly the mindset that I object to, in every step of the conspiracy, another participant joins the sinister network! And why, because an irrational claim, that tons of metal which was somehow crucial evidence was shipped away was proposed in the first place which wasnt so. It's a blind circle. Any journalist can interview the local merchants who rejected the metal to check such ordinary facts, is the explanation beyond our reach to investigate, no. So, where's the problem?
FEMA? you mean the GOVERNMENT AGENCY that failed on a massive scale during the New Orleans catastrophe, because they care? LOL. like i said, you quoting anything put out by a government agency only helps to ridicule your stance on this matter, specifically.
what's the problem? lol, hypothetical scenario, artu: something horrible happens in iraq, to the iraqi people. it can be reasoned that saddam had something to do with it, or even allowed it to happen. after the atrocity, saddam uses the iraqi people and lies to them about danger coming from another country, and sends poor people to die over there, "for the cause". later, it is found out that he lied about the danger coming from that country, and he denies that he even lied in the first place.
should the iraqi people find their information in an agency that backs saddam? why or why not?
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted November 07, 2015 11:32 PM |
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Edited by artu at 23:33, 07 Nov 2015.
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Dude, we are talking about tons of rubble, and as you can read yourself, many many pieces of it is/was still in your country for anyone who wishes to do a research. What was the question, it implied smelted steel had to be shipped off immediately because of some probable hidden plot in the manner of wiping off fingerprints. Turns out it wasnt. You can not claim something, then when it turns out fake or a disinformative half-truth, jumpstart to ask about how can we ever be sure it is so. Ask the conspiracy theorists about where did they get their information about metal being snatched away, then.
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Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost
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fred79
Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 07, 2015 11:47 PM |
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Edited by fred79 at 00:40, 08 Nov 2015.
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i'm not one to believe the hype, artu. i formulate my own opinions based on what they put out on t.v. for the masses. like i said, if someone wants to find information to back whatever side they're on regarding anything, they can find it. if you can find information that contradicts something, what is the use of ANY information that is put out for the masses?
and, you didn't answer my question, regarding the hypothetical scenario. i'm trying to show you just why people believe in a conspiracy in the first place.
all the evidence i need, is from the countless actions of my government and it's agencies(even the corporate, banking, and other business agencies), against the american people. are you seriously telling me that your government is actively involved in caring for you and everyone else not affiliated with actual power in your country? someone who reads as much as you, and seemingly intelligent as yourself, strikes me as quite the opposite. or maybe you're only taking this stance because you are afraid for your own freedom? i realize that Turkey isn't exactly user-friendly. just how into monitoring the populace are they over there? because here, we are surrounded; but we can still have a voice. because we are still carrying guns.
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i hope you didn't take offense to that, artu(judging by your silence). it wasn't intended as an insult; i'm only trying to comprehend why you seem to think that any government agency has the common man in it's best interest.
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Kayna
Supreme Hero
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posted November 08, 2015 02:55 AM |
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Edited by Kayna at 03:05, 08 Nov 2015.
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Even with a long post for an answer, you still seem to evade my point. My point is HOW FAST they got rid of it + smelted it. I don't care about your smelted memorials ; an investigator wants to inspect the weapon of a crime, not a gun that is now smelted into a pot.
artu said:
Many of the most important pieces of steel to investigators are stored in a 80,000 sq. ft. hangar at JFK airport, as referenced above.
Among all that rubble of a post, this is the only quote that actually answers ( partially ) my concern. Now, here's the thing ; since they got everything smelted in freaking 30 days, how did they even manage to find the proper steel beams to investigate in such a short delay? Let me guess. They take a sample of the debris and discard the rest. Like an investigator charged with investigating a crime scene ; the crime scene is a house, but he only inspect one room.
Can always remove a few pieces here and there if tests indicate traces of odd substances like termite.
http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/groundzero/cleanup.html
The important quote :
The discovery of the existence of intact pieces of the Twin Towers' columns would appear to be good news for independent investigators who would like to test samples of steel. However, the locations of these pieces within the towers suggests a reason they were allowed to be preserved. The large core column sections stood on the Towers' foundations, seven stories below street level, and the perimeter column trees were from the lobby level, just above street level. Only these lower sections of the Towers were spared the blasting that shredded the steel frames down to about their fourth stories. This is evident from the facts that 18 people survived in the lower reaches of the North Tower's core, and fragments of the perimeter walls of each Tower remained standing.
an extra fun quote :
Highly Sensitive Garbage
Given that the people in charge considered the steel garbage, useless to any investigation in this age of computer simulations, they certainly took pains to make sure it didn't end up anywhere other than a smelting furnace. They installed GPS locater devices on each of the trucks that was carrying loads away from Ground Zero, at a cost of $1000 each. The securitysolutions.com website has an article on the tracking system with this passage.
Ninety-nine percent of the drivers were extremely driven to do their jobs. But there were big concerns, because the loads consisted of highly sensitive material. One driver, for example, took an extended lunch break of an hour and a half. There was nothing criminal about that, but he was dismissed.
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fred79
Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 08, 2015 03:23 AM |
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@ kayna: not trying to nit-pick, but you keep spelling "thermite" termite. termite is a creature, not something that can be used to melt steel. if there are termites like that, i really don't want to snowing meet them.
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted November 08, 2015 07:34 AM |
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Edited by artu at 07:35, 08 Nov 2015.
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@fred
My silence was simply because I went to sleep, your conspiracies never end, do they
You seem to be avoiding the situation, here. This is not about trusting the governments always have common people's interest, what kind of a lame generalization is that. There was a claim that they got rid of the rubble as if it was dangerous evidence, the claim stands unsupported, there is no contradicting information or story showing something went down differently than how FEMA puts it, there is no existing alternative to what you refuse to believe. You heard this conspiracy yesterday and turns out it was based on rumors because some of the steel eventually did end up in China and India, but not in the manner of snatching it away.
@kanya
It wasnt that fast and as the quote says, it's understandable that their priority was body removal. Besides, the most important part in the quote is this, in those first months, the conspiracy theories didn't exist, I remember those days, nobody was questioning the existence of the planes and when you dont question the planes, you really wont feel the need to investigate for explosives in every piece of rubble, will you? You are trying to catch your own tail here. Samples are reachable, China is not a place you'd want to get rid of evidence in the first place and nobody saw the rubble as a potential conspiracy prover back in the first few months of the incident, simply because such theories were not there, yet.
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Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost
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fred79
Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 08, 2015 08:20 AM |
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artu said:
@fred
My silence was simply because I went to sleep, your conspiracies never end, do they
You seem to be avoiding the situation, here. This is not about trusting the governments always have common people's interest, what kind of a lame generalization is that. There was a claim that they got rid of the rubble as if it was dangerous evidence, the claim stands unsupported, there is no contradicting information or story showing something went down differently than how FEMA puts it, there is no existing alternative to what you refuse to believe. You heard this conspiracy yesterday and turns out it was based on rumors because some of the steel eventually did end up in China and India, but not in the manner of snatching it away.
i'm not avoiding anything, merely trying to show you where i'm coming from. if a group of people(in this case, the u.s. government and whoever else was involved in profitting from 9/11) prove themselves to repeatedly use and abuse civilians like cannon-fodder, and they have the means to do some terrible snow, then i don't see why they wouldn't DO some terrible snow, especially if they could PROFIT from it, and even better, BLAME SOMEONE ELSE.
how you see me as being so simple for making this easy connection, i see you being simple for NOT making it. if someone has the means to do something, and their intent has proven repeatedly to be other than genuine and righteous, then WHAT stops them from doing that something?
think about what hitler accomplished, and HOW. one man, and not a group of people, or different agencies(before his own agencies). just ONE man, back in the 30's and 40's. now, fast forward to today. how far has this kind of power advanced among agencies, countries, or leaders? do you honestly believe that they haven't been working to PERFECT that level of influence?
i cannot believe that anyone would turn a deaf ear to the awful possibilities of people in power. has everyone forgotten what people(and agencies, be they government or otherwise) have done throughout history to get what they want? does nearly EVERYONE forget all the bullsnow that goes on day to day in their own countries? billions of tax dollars wasted every year? hundreds of thousands of politicians who do virtually NOTHING, and take your tax dollars anyway, and give themselves raises and pizza parties, fly private jets, drive expensive cars, and countless other wastes, ALL ON YOUR TAX DOLLARS?
please, for the love of god, remind me again how people in CHARGE of you, who CONTROL you, have YOUR best interests in mind? just WHAT have they done for you, specifically, in your ENTIRE LIFE? not your country's military, THEM. the politicians. the agencies. the list goes on and on, of what these people do, and HOW THEY CONTINUE TO SCREW YOU OVER until you are DEAD.
try, just for a second, to understand my point. the specifics do not matter, in any of these asinine arguments. no matter what anyone says, they are GRASPING AT STRAWS, when arguing FOR what is said by ANY leader or agency that controls the populace. i mean, what the goddamn snow? the more i argue with people, the more i think they're living so deep in the fantasy that is so-called "RIGHTEOUS and ORDERLY" society, that they can't see when they are being LIED TO, every single snowing day of their lives. and what's worse, is that when the liars are CAUGHT, nobody seems to really care. they put their fingers in their ears and go "la la la la la, i'm in my bubble, and reality doesn't touch me. society is great, our leaders are great, i have everything i want..."
and you only have to sell your souls for it. your dignity. your integrity. your common sense. reality.
even IF 9/11 was perpetrated by actual foreign terrorists, then why were the u.s. government and it's agencies ALLOWED by the american people(and the world who cooperated and involved themselves) to profit off of it, by LYING TO THE AMERICAN PEOPLE AND THE WORLD OF COMMON PEOPLE to get them behind starting a war that killed so many innocents, and not even STARTING WITH THE PEOPLE WHO WERE CLAIMED TO CAUSE IT? how many of these types of events will it take(ffs, there were so many in just this ONE EVENT), for people to stop going "la la la la la la la... they're not lying to us, or if they did, it's because they HAD to, and they ONLY have our good interests in mind, those angelic souls, la la la la la..."?
i am very, very disappointed. there is NO excuse to be so goddamn BLIND. the bosses in charge during the last bush administration, from the government to every government agency, were the WORST we've seen in decades, maybe even EVER. and on t.v., i see people cheering bush. it's enough to make me want to put a gun in my mouth and paint the walls with my brains.
i could rant for days about this. i'll stop for the moment. i've been repeating myself to deaf ears like this for years now. somehow, i never learn; because i never stop trying to point out what's WRONG. and i never will, goddamn it. 
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Kayna
Supreme Hero
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posted November 08, 2015 02:11 PM |
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Of course nobody was thinking about conspiracy theories back then. It's why the destruction of evidence on such a large scale worked.
artu said:
It wasnt that fast
So you finally addressed my point. With this. Alright *shrug*. It's my belief that everyone is biased to a certain degree ( me included ), some more than others, but I admit I'm a bit baffled as of why a guy from Turkey is so focused on defending the US' official version. I can see many things in your post, like the quality of your posts dramatically decreasing when talking about 9 - 11 by filling them with tons of joke quotes, by not directly answering someone's point of view like with that melt-smelt confusion or by filtering the worse of someone's sentence, like when you quote Stevie's BBC report of building 7 being down before it was down but none of his his other, more valid points.
This drop in quality of your posts is simply not there when you talk about any other subject than 9 - 11. Logical arguments aside, what do you feel when you think of 9 - 11 ? What drives you to defend the US' official version every chance you get? I'm curious but you don't have to answer that question if you don't want. I'm just trying to understand the context here of a guy from Turkey.
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