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Doomforge
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posted July 16, 2007 01:24 PM |
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but angelito, the dream had nothing to do with God and does not proove anything.
Dreaming about team winning world cup.. yeah, that may happen. You know when the world cup is played, you know which teams participate, you know their strength.. so the possibility exists that you will "dream the winner". If you think about something a lot, it often appears in your dreams, that's a well-known fact.
But dreaming about someone's death and farewell in such manner EXACTLY when it occurs, when you never thought about that... umm.
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TitaniumAlloy
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posted July 16, 2007 01:28 PM |
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I can see where Doomforge is coming from.
But then thats like using Tarot cards, Horoscopes or that nutcase book The Secret to prove mysticism or god or whatever.
Unfortunately it doesn't work that way 
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John says to live above hell.
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mvassilev
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posted July 20, 2007 01:02 AM |
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By the way... to everyone who believes in a merciful God.
God killed Job's servants for nothing. Nothing indicates that they were bad sinners. He just wanted to test Job, and the means justified the ends, didn't they? He could just arbitrarily kill a whole bunch of people to test one person.
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TitaniumAlloy
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posted July 20, 2007 02:13 PM |
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dude god did loads of stuff that anyone even thinking about doing today should be locked up.
he's a power-hungry, murderous control freak, but that was in the old testament, the part of the bible that doesn't really count, not the part that speaks in metaphors, of course. that's the new testament. 
but ever seems to gloss over the part of the story where god asks abraham to kill isaac.
it seems to be fine that it was just a test.
but a test of what? to see whether abraham was willing to commit a sin and perform infanticide? he was going to kill his own son, in the name of a god which commands him to do so. nevermind the fact that it was all a test. doesn't this sicken anyone else?
what if he did it and it was a test not of faith but a test to see if one of his followers would sin, in which case Abraham failed, proving himself as the ultimate believer to be ultimately immoral.
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John says to live above hell.
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mvassilev
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posted July 20, 2007 03:03 PM |
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God was testing Abraham to see if he was actually stupid enough to sacrifice his son for his religion. And Abraham was indeed stupid enough.
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Doomforge
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posted July 20, 2007 04:07 PM |
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Job's part is a mystery to me, most of the facts seem to point that it is a mix of fairy tale and an earlier part of Bible (because God and most importantly Satan are entirely different in that other parts of the Bible). it is a weak point of Bible indeed, and won't even try to argue because it's a fact.
About Abraham, actually it shows God's mercy.. literally, God wants us to be able to sacrifice everything for him, yet never ultimately demands such sacrifices.. because he's merciful.  yes, I see it as a metaphor.
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mvassilev
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posted July 20, 2007 04:44 PM |
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Typical. Every time an atheist finds a flaw in the Bible, the believers rush in and say "It's a metaphor! It can't be taken literally!"
Sigh...
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Doomforge
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posted July 20, 2007 06:56 PM |
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Your answer is also typical. You guys say it all the time
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TitaniumAlloy
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posted July 22, 2007 04:20 AM |
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Quote:
Give me one good reason why someone wouldn't be able to live 900 years? If you lived in a world with a 3 foot thick protective water barrier preventing all harmful radiation from entering, then what would exist to cause the body harm? The world back when people lived 900 years is different then it is now. We also have evidence for the barriers existance. Radiation can't go past 3 feet of water. It is also recorded as having existed.
You're also generalizing and sterotyping people, which in the past has caused genocide. Christians tend to question and doubt as much as you do when it comes to the Bibles teachings.
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Give me one good reason why someone wouldn't be able to live 900 years?
Maybe just because our cells become older and "get out of order"?
Do you know why they get older and out of order?
LOL
ok I'm sorry I missed this one while I was away but I'll respond to it now.
Shadey, you call yourself a biologist yet you don't understand why without advanced technology, someone can't live to 900 years?
Even if they were in a secure environment like you proposed they are still subject to aging and hence death.
They become older and out of order because the mitochondria are involved in such a high energy output that they are subject to mutation, which will eventually render them useless, which is the primary source of aging... Not all the shielding in the world could protect you from that.
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John says to live above hell.
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Korejora
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posted July 22, 2007 11:40 AM |
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I thought the primary source of aging was the Hayflick limit, because eventually cells lose their ability to function properly since they run out of telomere to ditch.
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That's the best part. 
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TitaniumAlloy
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posted July 22, 2007 11:45 AM |
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Maybe I misused the word 'primary', I was trying to point out that it's not just external influences.
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John says to live above hell.
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Doomforge
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posted July 22, 2007 12:36 PM |
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Also, there are many evidences that we bear the "death gene" that forcefully ends our lives at certain point.. which is, if I recall correctly, 120 years. Nothing to worry about since it's extremely unlikely that we'll live that long anyway. It's the same mechanism that causes leaves to fall from the tree although technically they are alive and still useful.So even if the cells could keep their reproducing speed (and reproducing accuracy, since it's the major problem..), we would still die at certain point. Bah.
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TitaniumAlloy
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posted July 22, 2007 12:39 PM |
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that sucks. whats the point of that gene... 
maybe it's gods time limit on the world where he goes
"alright, you must be hacking, get your *** up here it's game over"
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John says to live above hell.
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mvassilev
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posted July 22, 2007 07:25 PM |
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Shadey
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posted July 22, 2007 07:47 PM |
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Quote:
Also, there are many evidences that we bear the "death gene" that forcefully ends our lives at certain point.. which is, if I recall correctly, 120 years. Nothing to worry about since it's extremely unlikely that we'll live that long anyway. It's the same mechanism that causes leaves to fall from the tree although technically they are alive and still useful.So even if the cells could keep their reproducing speed (and reproducing accuracy, since it's the major problem..), we would still die at certain point. Bah.
Genesis 6
The Flood
1 When men began to increase in number on the earth and daughters were born to them, 2 the sons of God saw that the daughters of men were beautiful, and they married any of them they chose. 3 Then the LORD said, "My Spirit will not contend with [a] man forever, for he is mortal ; his days will be a hundred and twenty years."
I don't think Moses knew about the death gene when he wrote Genesis.
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antipaladin
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posted July 22, 2007 09:08 PM |
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I think that if god was almighty,then god did,and send the same passage to moses.
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types in obscure english
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mvassilev
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posted July 22, 2007 10:38 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
Also, there are many evidences that we bear the "death gene" that forcefully ends our lives at certain point.. which is, if I recall correctly, 120 years. Nothing to worry about since it's extremely unlikely that we'll live that long anyway. It's the same mechanism that causes leaves to fall from the tree although technically they are alive and still useful.So even if the cells could keep their reproducing speed (and reproducing accuracy, since it's the major problem..), we would still die at certain point. Bah.
Genesis 6
The Flood
1 When men began to increase in number on the earth and daughters were born to them, 2 the sons of God saw that the daughters of men were beautiful, and they married any of them they chose. 3 Then the LORD said, "My Spirit will not contend with [a] man forever, for he is mortal ; his days will be a hundred and twenty years."
I don't think Moses knew about the death gene when he wrote Genesis.
A far more likely explanation is that at that time people already knew that people did not survive long past a hundred years, and he put an extra 20 years on there to be safe.
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ZombieLord
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that wants your brainz...
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posted July 22, 2007 10:54 PM |
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A far more likely explanation is that at that time people already knew that people did not survive long past a hundred years, and he put an extra 20 years on there to be safe.
Yeah right, he guessed exactly 20...
Anyway, aren't you the one with 'proofs' and 100% accuracies? What you said there is your thinking, which is not 100% accurate.
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TitaniumAlloy
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posted July 23, 2007 09:43 AM |
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Quote:
Genesis 6
The Flood
1 When men began to increase in number on the earth and daughters were born to them, 2 the sons of God saw that the daughters of men were beautiful, and they married any of them they chose. 3 Then the LORD said, "My Spirit will not contend with [a] man forever, for he is mortal ; his days will be a hundred and twenty years."
I don't think Moses knew about the death gene when he wrote Genesis.
So NOW you agree with it. Make up your mind, 120 or 900? You can't just pick and choose what suits where.
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mvassilev
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posted July 23, 2007 03:33 PM |
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Quote:
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A far more likely explanation is that at that time people already knew that people did not survive long past a hundred years, and he put an extra 20 years on there to be safe.
Yeah right, he guessed exactly 20...
Anyway, aren't you the one with 'proofs' and 100% accuracies? What you said there is your thinking, which is not 100% accurate.
Well, I'm sure that the death gene doesn't kill people at exactly 120 either, and it varies between people. Some it might kill at 117, some at 123 (even though no one has lived to 123 yet), et cetera. 120 is just an estimate.
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