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Orfinn
Supreme Hero
Werewolf Duke
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posted July 11, 2007 01:52 PM |
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And orcs are NEUTRAL. They just attack they who threatens them and have their own vision on how to live on. They hate dragon gods and demons which also makes them neutral.
Maybe they could come along with the Oceanic town proposal I saw here somwhere, they hate dragon gods to, i guess also the demons.
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted July 11, 2007 03:46 PM |
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The Orcs are not neutral. Neutral means taking no sides in a conflict. Orcs do take a side, their own side, which is against everybody else. If Orcs mix themselves into any conflict, they wil be hostile to everybody except other Orcs(Though we aren't even sure about that).
Neutral does not equal neither good nor evil. It's just like the Dwarves, who are neither good nor evil but are not neutral as they have sided against the Demons and the Dark Elves on several occasions.
Also nobody has everstated that Orcs hate the Dragon Gods. They have stopped worshipping the Dragon Gods during the Orc Crusades. And seeing that only Elrath is worshipped in Haven and in Academy no gods are worshipped, this might well mean that Orcs only stopped worshipping Elrath.
For all we know, the Orcs have started Dragonworship again in the 450 years that passed between the Orc Crusades and Isabels War(HOMMV). Evidence to this is Dark Messiah, where the Orcs guard the Temple which is dedicated to Asha which contains the Skull of Shadows. Also when trying to kill Sareth, Orcs shout "Human is going to meat his Dragon."
Lastly, the Oceanos town has absolutley 0% chance of making it into an official game, just as any other fan-creation original as it may be. Mods may appear, but it will never be considered cannon.
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Vote El Presidente! Or Else!
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emilsn
Legendary Hero
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posted July 11, 2007 04:36 PM |
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Orcs guard the temple of the Spider goddess - because their is the skull of shadow (which i think they will get a quest to do in this Campaign) - They are suppose to keep everyone away from it(they do not succeed - DM) . They obey no dragon. They just protect a temple because of the Skull of Shadow (uhh)...
They are neutral, always were, always gonna be and will always conquer!!
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Don't walk behind me; I may not
lead. Don't walk in front of me;
I may not follow. Just walk
beside me and be my friend.
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Azagal
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Smooth Snake
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posted July 11, 2007 06:13 PM |
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Quote:
The Orcs are not neutral. Neutral means taking no sides in a conflict. Orcs do take a side, their own side, which is against everybody else.
They have stopped worshipping the Dragon Gods during the Orc Crusades. And seeing that only Elrath is worshipped in Haven and in Academy no gods are worshipped, this might well mean that Orcs only stopped worshipping Elrath.
1. your right. The orcs can i no way be neutral as they allways will take their own side and they trust no one (play DM and you'll find out)
2.I can't follow your logic. Just because their "ancestors" worshipped Elrath it doesn't mean that they would do that too. Then they could aswell worship Urgash because their other half is demon.
I understand that they were raised or rather "produced" by the wizard and they wouldn't want any of their creatures to worship Urgash. But then again the Wizards don't worship any Dragon so why would they teach their man-demon-offsprings to worship Elrath? Just because one of their "ingredients" did it? That doesn't make sense to me. Or is it stated anywhere that the Orcs worshiped a particular God before the Orc Crusades? Then i wonder how they came to do that.
pardon my spelling
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted July 11, 2007 08:35 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
The Orcs are not neutral. Neutral means taking no sides in a conflict. Orcs do take a side, their own side, which is against everybody else.
They have stopped worshipping the Dragon Gods during the Orc Crusades. And seeing that only Elrath is worshipped in Haven and in Academy no gods are worshipped, this might well mean that Orcs only stopped worshipping Elrath.
1. your right. The orcs can i no way be neutral as they allways will take their own side and they trust no one (play DM and you'll find out)
2.I can't follow your logic. Just because their "ancestors" worshipped Elrath it doesn't mean that they would do that too. Then they could aswell worship Urgash because their other half is demon.
I understand that they were raised or rather "produced" by the wizard and they wouldn't want any of their creatures to worship Urgash. But then again the Wizards don't worship any Dragon so why would they teach their man-demon-offsprings to worship Elrath? Just because one of their "ingredients" did it? That doesn't make sense to me. Or is it stated anywhere that the Orcs worshiped a particular God before the Orc Crusades? Then i wonder how they came to do that.
pardon my spelling
OK, I'll try to explain.
The Orcs were created by the Wizards. The Wizards do not worship any gods, therefor they will not enforce worhsip. After the First War of the Eclipse(The second Demon War), the Orcs are setlled in the Seven Cities and in The Holy Falcon Empire. The Holy Falcon Empire worships Elrath. We can safly assume that they were as forcefull in their religion as the Griffin Empire is now and that they have forced the worship of Elrath onto the Orcs.
The Orcs were most probably forced to worship Elrath during their time in the Falcon lands.
So in 467 YSD the Orcs rebel. They throw of the Shackles of Slavery and declare themselves free. The Orcs reject their masters(Wizards and Knights) and their Dragon Gods. This means that they denounce the Gods of their Masters, which is only Elrath.
After the Orc Crusades are ended, people loose track of the Orcs. During that time they might have or have not started to worship a different Dragon God. But knowing their hatred for the Knights they will most probably not worship Elrath, the Patron of their former Slavelords.
As for the other Dragon Gods there is a possibility that the Orcs may have started to worship them.
As I tried to explain, the Orcs do not deny the existance of the Gods. I will now list the remaining Dragon Gods and will try to give an explaination why the Orcs may or may not worship them. (Myth of creationCheck here for the descriptions of the gods. )
Asha:
The Goddes of Order. As stated: Ahsa does not favor any mortal races and is not worshipped directly. This will most probably apply to the Orcs as well. However, in Dark Messiah, the Orcs guard one of here temples to keep the Skull of Shadows safe. One might ask why Orcs of all creatures would guard this mighty Artefact. Thinking about this, the Orcs are the Perfect guards: They have no knowledge of Magic and cannot use the Skull themselves and they will not allow anyone near the Temple, for they hate every race that might seek the Artefact. Asha will have chosen the Orcs to do this for sake of the World, not in favor of the Orcs.
Urgash:
The God of Chaos. As stated: Urgash is the creator of the Demons. Orcs hate the Demons just as much as they hate the Humans. Therefor the Orcs are not probable to worship the God of one of their enemies.
Arkath:
The God of Fire. As stated: Arkath is a furious, ill-tempered and hot-headed. In this the Orcs resemble the God. Also being the God of those who struggle, Arkath might seem the Perfect god for the Orcs, were it not that he is the Patron of the Dwarves.
This said, Arkath may show some favor towards the Orcs, but not above the Dwarves.
Sylath:
The God of Air. As stated: Sylath doesn't get allong with the other Gods at times and Sylath is popular with the Barbarian Tribes. The Barbarian Tribes might refer to the Orcs. Also the Orcs do not get along well with others and in this resemble Sylath.
Malassa:
The Goddes of Shadow. As stated: Malassa is very unpredictable. This could mean that she sometimes could help the Orcs to further her own goals. However Orcs are not very trusting and Malassa is fickle and dangerous even for her own worshippers. Given this, Orcs are not likely to trust Malassa.
Sylanna:
The Goddes of Earth. As stated: Sylanna is a peacemaker. Orcs on the otherhand are not realy the peaceable sort. So Orcs wroshipping a God of peace would seem contradictory.
Shalassa:
The Goddes of Water. As stated: Shalassa is a diplomat. And again Orcs are not ones to resort to diplomacy to solve their disputes. So again Orcs worshipping Shalassa would seem contradictory.
Concluding:
Of the 8 possible Gods, Sylath would seem the most Probable, with Arkath who resembles the Orcs more as a close second.
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Vote El Presidente! Or Else!
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Azagal
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Smooth Snake
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posted July 11, 2007 08:57 PM |
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Thank you for making this clear but i still don't see how the orcs would ever have worshiped Elrath. It is very likely that the Griffin Empire forced them to worship Elrath as you said but what would they do?? They could force them to go to "church" and doing all the stuff you would have to do in order to appear religious but i don't think that a orc would ever accept any Faith that is forced onto them.
I also think your right when you say that the Orcs do not deny the existance of the Gods. But that doens't mean you have to worship one in the first place.
I asume that the Orcs had no Dragon while they lived in slavery (not counting Elrath since they were FORCED to belive in him, they did chose to belive in him) and first came to worship a particular Dragon after the Orc Crusades.
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PhoenixReborn
Promising
Legendary Hero
Unicorn
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posted July 13, 2007 04:40 AM |
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Hey I'm not sure if anyone caught it but there has been unofficial confirmation that you will be able to sell artifacts in ToTE.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted July 13, 2007 08:58 AM |
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Edited by Elvin at 13:58, 13 Jul 2007.
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I have been in possession of 4-5 duplicate artifacts at most in battle for honor. I kept getting the same from chests dammit 
This aside there have been some new pics from evilp  Not much you can discern but at least it's better than nothing!
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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Daystar
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Back from the Dead
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posted July 13, 2007 02:52 PM |
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First Pic: I see a cyclops, and a lot of other units. One of them is really dark in hue, possibly a warlord/upgrade?
Second Pic: Cyclops again, and Shamans have horns definitley. If memory serves, they were just pointy in the other picture, now they are really curved.
Third Pic: You can't really do much with this one, except see that the main parameters are attack + defense
4th: OH gods, not MORE renegades!!!!!
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How exactly is luck a skill?
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Geny
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
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posted July 13, 2007 03:36 PM |
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Quote:
Third Pic: You can't really do much with this one, except see that the main parameters are attack + defense
And that he has mana. That means that Battle Cries will probably work just like magic (as expected).
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DON'T BE A NOOB, JOIN A.D.V.E.N.T.U.R.E.
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted July 13, 2007 04:50 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
Third Pic: You can't really do much with this one, except see that the main parameters are attack + defense
And that he has mana. That means that Battle Cries will probably work just like magic (as expected).
You can also deduce that this is one of the Campaign Heroes. This because the Avatar-picture looks exactly like the ingame-hero.
Well that, or that Heroes are all going to have a unique appearance. (I must say I doubt that though.)
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Vote El Presidente! Or Else!
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evilp
Promising
Known Hero
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posted July 13, 2007 04:55 PM |
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Edited by evilp at 09:51, 29 Jul 2007.
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yes ,not more renegades
Blood angel can't Life Drain , but can cast Righteous Might and DIVINE VENGEANCE
Zealot can't cast blind..but can cast Righteous Might and Cleansing
Enforcer change name to Brute
...Rainbow dragon change to Sapphire Dragon
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Deathy
Known Hero
Angels Galore
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posted July 14, 2007 05:24 PM |
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in my opinion, battle griffins can never be made good with how their ability currently works. for it to work well, they would need to be slower and tankier, but griffins aren't meant to be like that, they are suppose to be fast frontline attackers.
so in my opinion, Nival should change that ability completely, into something more suitable for a fast unit. or maybe they could switch abilities between battle griffin and vindicator  griffins get cleave and vindicators get battle frenzy. atleast the abilities would suit both units well then.
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Haven player.
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Daystar
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Back from the Dead
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posted July 15, 2007 01:51 AM |
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Edited by Daystar at 02:02, 15 Jul 2007.
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except the brutes and zealots, I'm fine w/ what they look like.
EDIT: Oh my goddess, I found this on Celestial just now:
Quote:
One of the former Nival employees, posted in his LJ about staff reduction that took place in the company not so long ago. From his words, he (scriptwriter) and whole design department were fired. The reason is "shortage of money".
Quote:
"I dont know how they will finish second add-on with orcs, there is still a lot of work that needs to be done"
Also (and again from his words) the PR department was reduced just before them.
link: (russian)
http://fuzin.livejournal.com/26222.html
If this is the case, then we are deeply skewed.
Or not.
If they are closed down, then couldn't we do things for them?
(If you don't like reading my speeches, stop now)
---------------------
We have an incredible community here, one that has been going on for ages.
We've been behind incredible things. Great discussions, beautiful artworks and scenarioes, powerful mods, deep discussions about the Mythology of Ashan, the History of Aexoth, the Mechanics of Erathia, etc.
But, in my opinon, most importantly, we have people who can do things. Alc can make graphs, charts, and spreadsheets teaming with stats and numbers and formulae. Radar can organize. Vokial can mod. I can do 3DCG. Other people can do other incredible things with the little that we have to work with. We can photoshop, program, write, read, do a million things. None of us can really make a whole video game on our own, but we can all make a bit of it. If Nival can't, then it's up to us. If all I'd be doing is a few 3D models and an idea or two for the campaign, then so be it.
The best part is, we don't rely on money. We get a bit from advertising, but none of us would loose money if Tribes of the East flops, would we? Nothing but time, and a lot of us would spend that time playing the game if we wern't working, and if we don't work then we don't play, simple as that, and we have to wait for years before VI comes out, and everything has to start over. We lose the universe.
Ashan is an incredible place, an incredible world, even if it's not written by shakespeare, painted by da Vinci, or programed by Will Wright.
So, if Nival falls, then we are the ones that have to rise.
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How exactly is luck a skill?
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evilp
Promising
Known Hero
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posted July 15, 2007 02:09 AM |
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted July 15, 2007 11:08 AM |
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Some more pics :)
About Nival my feelings are mixed. They have not done their job as they should and seemed to have more flaws than benefits but lately things were improving and TotE seems a most ambitious title that can prove they are indeed capable. Still one thing:
Let them make TotE with no interference and afterwards I don't really care. Now IF they have also been working on H6 it could get messy but we'll see in time.
____________
H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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Azagal
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Smooth Snake
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posted July 15, 2007 11:11 AM |
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Edited by Azagal at 11:23, 15 Jul 2007.
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dam... i love the set bonus!! but homer is right how does it now which tier 7...? I guess it will just give you the standard tier 7 which you then can upgradeŽ. allthough that would be anoying since you allways would have to go to your castle to upgrade it or maybe you can chose which tier 7 you would like to get.
yeeeah... imagine a dwarf army with 300hp 45def magma dragons which becomse stronger each day...niiice
btw. look at all the other new items the hero has... is that not a new typ of "Tome of xy Magic"? the thing with the bubles?
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted July 15, 2007 11:23 AM |
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I just noticed that...THE ARTIFACTS ARE NOT COMBINED TOGETHER BUT JUST GIVE A BONUS??
Sigh I can't help but be disappointed. Unless you can assemble/disassemble with the right click as in SoD. Not the typical Nival sloppy work again...
____________
H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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Azagal
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Smooth Snake
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posted July 15, 2007 11:28 AM |
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hm?? sure they are combined together. you only get the bonus if you have all 8 no? sorry prehaps i didn't understand you right
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted July 15, 2007 11:38 AM |
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We know from previously (the information on the Dwarven combination set) that the artifacts will provide partial bonuses already when some of them are present, and that the bonus will be greater, the more artifacts of the set is present. Thus, they will not be completely similar to previous combination sets.
We see several combinations in the backpack. Not only something that looks like a combined Tome, but also two rings, a giant sword (Angelic Alliance returned?), something that looks like a Cornucopia but might also be a Battle Horn, something that looks decidedly like a Sar Issus thing (far left) and the odd Freyda for leaf clover!?
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What will happen now?
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