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Heroes Community > Heroes 5 - Temple of Ashan > Thread: Best faction in the game (post TotE)
Thread: Best faction in the game (post TotE) This thread is 19 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 · «PREV / NEXT»
sdfx
sdfx


Famous Hero
posted November 08, 2007 08:34 PM

But attacking give a fixed(It's a very bad idea IMO) 100(or +150). It's just not good enough - IMO, +rage from striking should be dependant on how strong was the hit. Then, bloodfire would be much more useful. For now, it just gives to little and bloodfire mainly makes the loss of rage much faster.

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unixmage
unixmage


Known Hero
Demon Slayer
posted November 08, 2007 08:58 PM

So most of the time bloodfire is a bad idea. There are better ways of quickly gaining rage points such as single goblins and warcries.
I wish necromancers had ways of replenishing a limited number dark points other then waiting for the next week. The % of enemy creatures raised as undead is useless since you run out of dark points to raise rather than number of enemies you killed. I'm hoping there will be a HOMM VI and necropolis gets a proper overhaul.

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Cleave
Cleave


Promising
Famous Hero
Raging Blood
posted November 09, 2007 11:46 AM bonus applied.
Edited by Cleave at 11:49, 09 Nov 2007.

Quote:
But attacking give a fixed(It's a very bad idea IMO) 100(or +150). It's just not good enough - IMO, +rage from striking should be dependant on how strong was the hit. Then, bloodfire would be much more useful. For now, it just gives to little and bloodfire mainly makes the loss of rage much faster.


Since you win and lose 150% you don't have any disadvantadge...

A stack of slayers perform a melee attack, they get 100 points or 150 with bloodfire. Let's say they get hit and lose 80 points or 120 points with bloodfire, that leaves them with 20 or 30 blood rage points. Now if a friendly stack gets butchered they get an extra 30 or 45 points for a total of respectively 50 or 75 points.

What I'm trying to say is that you lose more points with bloodfire but you also win more points. Since it goes both ways bloodfire is not overpowered, its main advantage is that it allows your troops to reach higher rage levels sooner.

Let's go back to my example, let's say our hero has memory of our blood and bloodfire, at the start of the battle his/her troops would have between 75 and 150 rage points bringing the troops nearer to blood rage level 1 (and its bonuses).

If you have both Ultimate Blood Rage and bloodfire some of your troops may already start the fight at blood rage level 1.

IMO bloodfire is not a vital perk but it's not a liability. If you can have it with Ultimate Blood Rage it will work wonders. With Absolute Rage and Bloodfire you'd start at least at blood rage level 2 (level 3 with Ultimate Blood Rage!) this would not be possible without bloodfire.

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Nirual
Nirual


Famous Hero
Imbued Ballista
posted November 09, 2007 12:14 PM

Quote:
I wish necromancers had ways of replenishing a limited number dark points other then waiting for the next week. The % of enemy creatures raised as undead is useless since you run out of dark points to raise rather than number of enemies you killed. I'm hoping there will be a HOMM VI and necropolis gets a proper overhaul.


You're saying getting a bunch of extra creatures per week for free is a bad thing? Maybe they should lower the percentages so you can't spend your entire pool on one stack of neutrals, and make it harder to spend it entirely on the kind of creatures you actually want.
Truth be told, I do think the system needs some more tweaking, but the limitation makes sense, just like the limitation they made for Training.
____________
In ur base killing ur doods... and raising them as undeads.

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Legendary_hero
Legendary_hero


Known Hero
Stronghold Warchief
posted November 09, 2007 12:19 PM

You have a point @Nirual but i have noticed also that high tier creature's take too much dark energy but that's probably just the balance of the game and i like it the way it is

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Nemira
Nemira


Adventuring Hero
posted November 09, 2007 06:28 PM

In ashes and sand tote version, with 2 castles and 3 heroes with expert necromancy I had a bit over 600 DE points. I recall highest tier 7 I could rise was ~3 dragons. Given their stats and how hard is to make the building and upgrade it as well.... I think is not overpowered at all.

-Nemi

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Legendary_hero
Legendary_hero


Known Hero
Stronghold Warchief
posted November 09, 2007 08:18 PM

Well i think it's balanced and BTW do Dark energy increase when you have more than one Necromancer i haven't tryed that yet

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Cleave
Cleave


Promising
Famous Hero
Raging Blood
posted November 09, 2007 08:26 PM

Quote:
Well i think it's balanced and BTW do Dark energy increase when you have more than one Necromancer i haven't tryed that yet


It does but the most important factor is the number of necro towns and of pillar of bones built.

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Legendary_hero
Legendary_hero


Known Hero
Stronghold Warchief
posted November 09, 2007 08:30 PM

It does but the most important factor is the number of necro towns and of pillar of bones built.
Yes they are the most important, if you have 4 towns with pilars +600 dark energy(150each) that's quite a few points.

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unixmage
unixmage


Known Hero
Demon Slayer
posted November 09, 2007 08:57 PM

While buying a new necro hero gives you a whopping 1 dark point.

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roy-algriffin
roy-algriffin


Supreme Hero
Chocolate ice cream zealot
posted November 09, 2007 09:02 PM

Were talking about +60 points or so at expert necromancy and level 20 for a secondary hero.
Not bad at all considering mentioring.
____________
"Am i a demon? No im a priest of the light! THE BLOODY RED LIGHT"

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Nirual
Nirual


Famous Hero
Imbued Ballista
posted November 10, 2007 12:22 AM
Edited by Nirual at 00:30, 10 Nov 2007.

Quote:
While buying a new necro hero gives you a whopping 1 dark point.


Well, buying level one necromancers isn't very effective indeed, as they only give one DE point per necromancy level. The hero needs to be at least level 7 to give a noticable contribution. However, this isn't as hard to achieve given Necropolis good access to Enlightement.

Apart from that, the most important factors are the basic pool (200), the amount of pillar's you have, and the level of your main hero (a Level 22 necromancer provides 158 DE points at Expert, more than a Pillar).

Given the limit's for the Pillars, mentoring necromancers might actually be pretty viable. The hero in the example could mentor them to Level 14, which means 65 DE with Expert Necromancy.
I just wonder where that leads with 2 or more Necropolis players on the same map.
____________
In ur base killing ur doods... and raising them as undeads.

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mercedes_j_h
mercedes_j_h


Hired Hero
The fire is strong!
posted January 18, 2008 04:09 PM

I wonder where it leads too but when you have a Necro hero on level 28 and expert Necromancer then you get 10 more Dark Energy pionts per week that is nice.
____________
If you look in the sky you will see a Red Dragon but he is not the most powerful.
The Bigest Dragon is on the Ground called Lava Dragon.

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nickkkk
nickkkk


Known Hero
Necro fan since 1988
posted January 26, 2008 08:03 AM

I voted for necropolis because it still is the best town since homm3. Remember that in heroes 3 you can transform every army into skeletons, but now you can transform the army in the same tier as they are. To me that sounds great.
P.S.- leeches rule the archery world.
But close the necro I like academy, because it constantly brings an interesting lineup since homm2. Titans, Rakshas, geenies and mages are devastating. HMM..... perhaps that is why I never could get enough attack on my academy hero. Because If I would have I would destroy everything on the map.
And now in tote the stronghold faction left a good impresion. Cyclop very powerfull creature, very resistant, paokai very helpful, and shamans are killing machines. I didn't like that you can't dispel the negative magic, once a hero put 5 dark spells on me and I couldn't do much damage. Lucky me I had luck, or else I would have died.

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mercedes_j_h
mercedes_j_h


Hired Hero
The fire is strong!
posted January 26, 2008 11:23 PM

Yeah but I don't think The Cyclop are so good (Cyclod and Untammed Cyclop) because of there wepon in there hands be cause it killed all my pokai 3 times.
____________
If you look in the sky you will see a Red Dragon but he is not the most powerful.
The Bigest Dragon is on the Ground called Lava Dragon.

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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
posted January 26, 2008 11:26 PM

That's what placement and tactics are for.
____________
H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb

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mercedes_j_h
mercedes_j_h


Hired Hero
The fire is strong!
posted January 29, 2008 07:52 PM

Yeah but when for example my Wyverns attack they is on one spot and then when Cyclops attack they hit the Wyverns too, when you hold on a enemy you see in yellow what creature that will be hited and when my Cyclops attack only the Enemy is yellow but he hit my Wyverns instead. Why I don't know.
____________
If you look in the sky you will see a Red Dragon but he is not the most powerful.
The Bigest Dragon is on the Ground called Lava Dragon.

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alcibiades
alcibiades


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
posted January 29, 2008 09:15 PM

Quote:
Yeah but when for example my Wyverns attack they is on one spot and then when Cyclops attack they hit the Wyverns too, when you hold on a enemy you see in yellow what creature that will be hited and when my Cyclops attack only the Enemy is yellow but he hit my Wyverns instead. Why I don't know.


Rule of thumb with Cyclops is: He will ALWAYS hit as many creatures as possible, no matter alignment. Thus, you will have to attack from an angle that excludes hitting the Wyvern, otherwise he will hit both.
____________
What will happen now?

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InfernoX880
InfernoX880


Promising
Famous Hero
posted January 30, 2008 02:59 AM bonus applied.

The best faction in the game...well I'll just have to go throught a short briefing. But if you're looking for a spoiler, my essay will conclude with Dungeon recieving the most praise.

Beginning with Haven, though it has a nice line-up, the inadequancy of magic makes it somewhat less useful. Still, Knowledge can be upped through artifacts and external factors. Spellpower is less crucial, since you'll probably go with Light Magic, and most spells their have only their duration determined by Spellpower. And since by the late game all you'll be doing is casting, because the hero attack isn't exactly powerful when your enemy has a good 15 Tier 7s in some cases, you don't really have reason for Spellpower. This is furthered by the Divine Vengeance spell, which hardly needs Speelpower to boast tremendous power in its still unbalanced version. The tremendous amounts of defense is also nice, unless you are playing a decent player who is potentially a magic user and understands how to use spells.

Inferno boasts a similar but different situation to Haven, believing in Dark Magic and Attack rather than the two polar opposites. So the tactic is likewise the exact opposite. A nice line-up, includes a few creatures that are quite good in all parts of the game, for example the Firebreathers are great for strategically taking down plenty of enemy units. Once again the lack of Knowledge can be a problem, but this will be compensated for with high Spellpowers and abilities such as Excruciating Strike will make a normal hero attack worthwhile.

Academy has a different tactic altogether. If it wasn't for the somewhat poor line-up, it would be great. The Djinns are a debated unit, but here is a simple fact, in the late game they will not survive long. If your enemy has a Paladin (Haven), Nightmare (Inferno), Grim Raider (Dungeon), Thane (Dwarves), Unicorns (Sylvan), Wyverns (Orcs), with Necro being an exception, those Djinns are going down quickly. The AI has a strange tendancy to hate Djinns, though even one or two of their spell casting abilitiy help out. The Viziers boast a more potent ability. The grand use of magic by Wizards helps out a lot, especially since they don't really need Spellpower if they are taking Summoning Magic. Take spells like Arcane Armor, Conjure Phoenix, and Phantom Forces, all of which can be replaced by draining a small part of your ridiculous mana pool. The Titans are nice, but not as impressive due to the fact that many units have higher initiative and it will quickly be put to close combat, though even then Call Lightning ability helps out.

Necro is very powerful, but expensive buildings make it questionable. The mass cumulation of mercury is a near impossible task, and as such Necro struggles at a larger duration. If you managed to get lucky though, Necro is essentially a Warlock who spams Dark Magic. Not too grand, but at least a Necromancers has things to do other than attack or cast spells, like actually use his abilities.

Sylvan is very powerful is you can manage to survive ith plenty of units. The Hunters put you a step ahead of any faction at the point when you get them. From then on, you can get Elders who can be sperated to inflict mass Lightning Bolt damage. Unicorns continue a powerful trend, and Treants are buff units capable of taking heavy damage. Only the Dragons are somehwat below average, but they have high initative, speed and a breath ability to quickly inflict high damage. Though Rangers do not gain Spellpower, the abilitiy ti Imbue shots makes their arrows fairly powerful and when the Avenger ability is properly used, it can likewise inflict massive damage.

Fortress has a difficult early to mid game transition. The shortage of Crystals compares to the Necros mercury crisis, only difference being that Dwarves don't get Necromancy to compensate for their loss. They get an ability that drains them of the little resources they do have. Thye also lack Logistics. You'll need some luck to unleash the true powerf ot the Dwarves without being crushed first.

Orcs are decent, but the buildings drain resources like mad. Fortunatey, you don't need much to overcome your enemy. Just a Triple Flaming Ballista, and a method of acquiring quick BP. This isn't too difficult via Warcries, abilities and that one building in your town. If you can quickly accumulate 300 BP, watch your enemies cower before you. Unless they outnumber you 3 to 1.

Now for the grand finale. Dungeon. Why? The Stalkers make for the greatest creepers that are presnet so early in the game. This is followed by the Furies and a time of free resource spending, where you can use what you have to buy what you want, that is a Mage Guild to further your creeping capabilities with a powerful Eldrich Arrow, a Town Hall to prepare for your upcoming debts, and eventually the mighty Hydras. You don't need Minotaurs. so you save some gold when you need saving. A win win. Additionally, the Tier 6 isn't so expensive and is powerful even when non-upgraded. Overall an excellent faction.

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Ceres
Ceres


Supreme Hero
and sweetness
posted January 30, 2008 03:05 AM

I voted:

Dungeon baby!
____________
And when the stars fall, I
will lie awake. You're my
shooting star.


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