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Heroes Community > Other Side of the Monitor > Thread: Muslims are not terrorists
Thread: Muslims are not terrorists This thread is 27 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 ... 10 20 ... 23 24 25 26 27 · «PREV / NEXT»
Neraus
Neraus


Supreme Hero
Pizza Nazi
posted June 04, 2017 09:09 PM
Edited by Neraus at 21:09, 04 Jun 2017.

Tito_Reni said:
TRUCK OF PEACE!!! OPEN BORDERS FOR ISRAEL!!!

Now I want Rare Pepes as avatars. PRAISE KEK.

REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE


Shadilay my brother!

The meme jihad continues!
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PLVTOCRATIC AND REACTIONARY DEMOCRACIES OF THE WEST
POTERE, LO SFORZO, LA PASTA

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AnkVaati
AnkVaati


Known Hero
Nighonese National Front
posted June 07, 2017 10:58 AM
Edited by AnkVaati at 11:15, 07 Jun 2017.

The Zionist pioneers were the ones who created prosperity and civilization in one of the poorest provinces of the Ottoman Empire from the late 19th century and onwards. Because of their hard work, the Arab population grew 700% before the rebirth of Israel. The "Palestinians" are not an indigenous people; they are mainly descendants of people who moved there to enjoy the prosperity created by the genius of the Jewish people as they made a garden out of the desert. Shouldn't a country belong to those whose ancestors built it up to give their children and grandchildren a future?

In fact, these so-called Palestinians are a "people" who didn't even exist before Israel retook the parts of the land of Israel that was occupied by Jordan and Egypt in 1967 - to pretend that there was an indigenous people there who were suddenly occupied. "Palestine" rather used to be a word that Zionist pioneers used to name their newspapers and stuff - although "Palestinian" actually means "intruders" in Hebrew which is kinda ironic now considering the circumstances. "Palestinians" have tried to kill Jews since long before the State of Israel. In 1929, "Palestinians" murdered 67 Jews in Hebron. Hebron is now located on the "West Bank" (Judea and Samaria), the area the Jordanian military ethnically cleansed of Jews during the Israeli Liberation War 1948, the area that the most of the outside world now thinks should be "Judenrein" forever, which it would be without the so-called settler movement.

But shouldn't part of the guilt fall on Israel anyway? Absolutely - it should fall on its reluctance to put the safety of their own people first. To say that the disputed areas "not mine, but not yours" is a communicative disaster when the other side is resolutely saying that "they are ours, period!". Sometimes there is this idea that only the most hard-line nationalists are the ones who become so-called settlers and move to the so-called West Bank. This is probably true to an extent - and it is a consequence of Israel not doing is job of creating law and order there too. Israel will never be able to give up the so-called West Bank, the consequence would be an unprotected border and that the "Palestinians" would be able shoot rockets right into the heart of Israel, which of course is exactly what they want to accomplish.

Just look at what happened to Gaza. When Israel evacuated Gaza in 2005 and forced the Jews of the area to even dig up the graves of their families, making the area ​​"Judenrein" for the first time in history, they left greenhouses in some sort of bizarre hope that the Islamist savages would begin to grow roses instead of killing Jews! It was the "hard right-wing" Likud party who did this. As a "thank you!" for Israel's goodwill, the so-called Palestinians have shelled them with rockets for over ten years now. Well placed in (sometimes UN managed) hospitals and schools, so that they could get portraid as poor victims in Western mainstream media when Israel righteously retaliates and die at the same time - the finest one can do according to their religion.

And it just goes on. Every week "Palestinian" terrorists kill Jews on their own streets, in their own country, with the "Palestinian" authority's moral and economic support behind them. Civilized, enlightened, democratically minded people, people who could have been you and me, die because the Israeli authorities are passivated by the outside world's pressure and cuddling with their savage enemies. A few years ago, the "moderately" anti-Semitic Abbas - the "Palestinian" president who hasn't allowed a election in his "country" for over 10 years - alleged that the Israelis killed a boy who was attacking Jews on the streets with knifes as many of his barbarian "countrymen" do on a regular basis. In reality, the boy was being treated at an Israeli hospital with take-away food and coffee from Starbucks, all at the expense of the Israeli taxpayer. In any of the neighbouring countries, they would probably just have shot him and no one would have cared.

Anyway... the point of all this is: people who don't want to live in western democracies with non-Muslims shouldn't be doing that. There are some people who really like the west and could be assimilated - but I agree that this is not something one can expect from a lot of people. Every person is a link between history, the present and future and a hotchpotch of things like culture, heritage, family ties, tradition, religion, values and other stuff that cannot easily be separated by each other. And yeah - that goes for modern western people as well, no matter how some will tell you otherwise... Helping people who can't stand the west to go to back to the places where their ancestors sleep beneath the earth is the only humane way of creating security and happiness for everyone involved.

Do You Pass the Israel Test?
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Geny
Geny


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Elvin's backside
posted June 07, 2017 12:09 PM

Kinda going off-topic here...
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geny is a meanie - fred79

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Stevie
Stevie


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
posted June 07, 2017 12:56 PM

Not entirely off-topic, and still a very good reply from AnkVaati that sheds more light on his affirmation from before. I was kinda expecting something from you too, Geny. Weren't you living in Israel?
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Guide to a Great Heroes Game
The Young Traveler

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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted June 07, 2017 03:09 PM
Edited by artu at 15:12, 07 Jun 2017.

Geny did actually, with a personal message saying I was correct on both observations. What's above is one-dimensional propaganda, "murderous savages" on one side and "righteous jews with nothing but good intent" on the other, yet somehow, still getting all the pressure from the world! (That would be for constantly violating international law but that part is conveniently overlooked.) The irony is, the reason he sees the other party as savages is because most of them are as conservative as he is. So he is kind of what he complains about: a small-minded, borderline racist who believes identity is fate, not something we build and his identity is luckily the flawless one somehow.

AnkVaati, you say "every person is a link between history, the present and future and a hotchpotch of things like culture, heritage, family ties, tradition, religion, values and other stuff that cannot easily be separated by each other." Sounds cool but that is not exactly accurate, every person is indeed a sum of himself/herself and his/her surroundings. But the surroundings such as tradition, religion, values are transformed by that very history itself, the conditions mold these and new reasoning from individuals bring new tradition. Your hunter-gatherer ancestors were animists, your tribal ancestors were pagans, your farmer ancestors were hardcore monotheists and your recent urban ancestors were most probably secular, law abiding citizens. They all had values and norms shaped by such realities. 400 years ago, Jews were oppressed much more by Christians, so much that they actually ran away to a Muslim empire (Ottomans) for shelter. 500 years from now, there wont be any religious Jewish-Muslim conflict because those religions themselves will be less influential to the point of insignificant, that's already happening among the educated anyway. How fast and less problematic it is going to happen depends on how constipated are people like you about their ideological shortcomings.    
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I sincerely hope they get ass cancer - fred

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Kayna
Kayna


Supreme Hero
posted June 07, 2017 03:11 PM

Yeah, why would Muslims do such attacks? All we tried to do was help them with democracy. Mental illnesses and Islam really explains all the troubled people in the world.

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Geny
Geny


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Elvin's backside
posted June 07, 2017 05:05 PM

Stevie said:
Not entirely off-topic, and still a very good reply from AnkVaati that sheds more light on his affirmation from before. I was kinda expecting something from you too, Geny. Weren't you living in Israel?

Still am.
The reason I stayed out and later called it off-topic, is because the Israeli-Palestinian problem is a very specific case, with a lot of debate and controversy about it. So I knew that once it picks up speed everyone would jump in and it would be hard to bring the thread back to its root, which is Islamic terrorism in general.
In fact, I once created a threadspecifically not to let the issue spill out and derail other threads. I'll be there if you need me.
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geny is a meanie - fred79

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted June 07, 2017 07:02 PM

artu said:
500 years from now, there wont be any religious Jewish-Muslim conflict because those religions themselves will be less influential to the point of insignificant, that's already happening among the educated anyway.


I adore when artu comes with progressive's crystal ball and predicts ... exactly the opposite of what reality taught us in the last ~30 years. Facts. Remember when sociologist affirmed with such fanatic conviction that immigration will be good? Sure, it was good for immigrants, especially Muslims, but people having to support them are borderline going berserk now, educated or not. There was a poll this year where a majority of Europeans agreed further Muslim immigration should be prohibited, entirely. This is where we are. What you hear in the news isn't what exactly is going,in the reality.

Islam is spreading, Christianity and Judaism are dying. By 2030 muslims will make one quarter of the global population. Also the fact that we keep provoking and humiliating them, in their own countries, creates such hate that we will be no safe nowhere, given that in our stupidity we agreed to  welcome the same people we bombed the hell out from, just yesterday.

As for Israel, there is nothing to discuss. Until Israel returns the lands he took by force and oppression, it will remain a terrorist state in many peoples views. You can not steal someone's property and then play the victim when he retaliates.  
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Tito_Reni
Tito_Reni


Bad-mannered
Adventuring Hero
posted June 07, 2017 07:15 PM

I have some dank fake news for you, goys guys:

CNN caught staging FAKE NEWS scene

Remember the Aleppo kid?
"Omran's father complained that he had been used as "propaganda""
The guy who took the photo is a terrorist
Moar shieeet

And remember, guys, support Israel, who wants open borders for us but not for them, since we are in more need of a religion of peace.
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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted June 07, 2017 07:28 PM

And I love how you see everything through your reaction to recent Muslim immigration in France, Sal. Yes, in the short term (such as 50 years or so), it's unlikely that Muslim societies will be as secular as the Western ones but I wasn't talking about 50 years now, was I. The fading out of agricultural theistic traditions is sociologically inevitable in the long-term. It's like not being able to foresee specific earthquakes but being able to foresee the tectonic movement of continents in the long term, not exactly crystal ball stuff. Even on short term, if I were to give Turkey as an example, despite the constant religious propaganda from the Erdogan government, we have like triple the amount of non-religious people we had 20 years ago. Internet is a major factor, it's becoming less possible to convince people with objectivity that such myths are the universal truth for obvious reasons. The future may not be some progressive heaven, I don't claim that but Abrahamic religions, just like thousands of form of faith before them, are products of their time and they have a life-span. And the countdown has been here since the Enlightenment.

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted June 07, 2017 07:53 PM

France immigration is indeed a fail, but I won't accuse a whole religion based only on our integration politics, which are far from optimal. I mean, look around what is going, every country which opened its borders to such immigration is facing today terrible challenges to its core values. Giving examples from the past, where societies were extremely nationalistic and closed is not so relevant, imo. Yes, people were persecuted by the past, but now is like we have to pay some redemption thus any attempt to criticize the new growing mixtures is censured before it could create any decent dialog. This will lead to civil war and I don't see how 50 or 500 years will make the difference.

People want homogeneous societies but the growing economical disparities between continents or countries will make it impossible, as long as the lack of borders and way too generous welfare policies are inviting the others.

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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted June 07, 2017 08:11 PM

I think that's way too pessimistic, even in your own link, you have information such as "“opposition to immigration is especially intense among retired, older age cohorts while those aged below 30 are notably less opposed” and “of those with secondary level qualifications, 59 percent opposed further Muslim immigration. By contrast, less than half of all degree holders (48 percent) supported further migration curbs.”

But all of this is quite beside the point because I wasn't talking about European immigrants in the first place. Immigrants are always more sensitive about their cultural heritage and because of the political situation in the Middle East, Muslims feel especially cornered and threatened, so their identity becomes a matter of pride for them. 500 years from now, the world wont be reliant on fossil fuels of the Middle East, the political conjuncture will be much different, we can't know what it will be but we can be sure it will be something totally different without the fight over resources. So, the countries that produce those immigrants will have a very different social setting to begin with.

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bloodsucker
bloodsucker


Supreme Hero
posted June 07, 2017 08:12 PM

Salamandre said:
As for Israel, there is nothing to discuss. Until Israel returns the lands he took by force and oppression, it will remain a terrorist state in many peoples views. You can not steal someone's property and then play the victim when he retaliates.  
This is my exact point of view about Israel. About muslims, it doesn't matter if they are pro-war activist or the most peacefull guys in the world, they believe in something that is intrinsically bad (religion) and have a bunch of other values associated to it (women role in society comes to mind) I don't want to see reinforced where I live, so I also support the banning of all emigration from muslim countries to Europe.

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Zenofex
Zenofex


Responsible
Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
posted June 07, 2017 09:48 PM

Quote:
So, the countries that produce those immigrants will have a very different social setting to begin with.
Still maybe not so drastically different, taking into account that there are some stable characteristics of each society which can survive for centuries, even millennia. You can trace some characteristics of China's or India's contemporary societies back to the BC times - with different names and sometimes form but the same substance. Also, history does not necessarily move toward "progress", especially not toward what the current upholders of the status quo (the liberal democracies, still) perceive as progress. Technological progress is more of less linear but social - not so much. In 500 years you may end up with exactly the same Middle East as today or with a completely different one but it's certainly not clear what "will" happen.

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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted June 07, 2017 10:56 PM
Edited by artu at 22:59, 07 Jun 2017.

Those "characteristics" that you speak of are not about normative details tough, for instance you can vaguely say things like Chinese culture values patience and they are less individualistic in their goals compared to Nordic people or that Mediterrenian culture is easy and relaxed etc but if you happen to think that people in China or India live their daily lives like they do in 1840 or even 1940 or that their literalism about their own religions still stays the same despite those changes, that would be a great mistake. (We are less aware of their transformations since they are comparatively introvert, reading world literature is a great way to overcome that.) Such an assumption would be not much different than people thinking that everybody in the Balkans are peasants in farms and they are all devoted Orthodox Christians, Living in Bulgaria, you'd know better but how many foregniers would take the time to know that? You can say there are significantly more conservative people in the Balkans compared to its Western neighbors that were industrialized earlier but to think your generation and your grandfathers were the same, that would be a mistake.

Also, progressive was Sal's definition of my words, not my own. Do I see the fading out of Abrahamic religions as progress, I certainly do so. But I'm not referring to a deterministic line of straight progress each passing century or something like that, remember it was me who brought up that some anthropologists think that hunter gatherers were happier than farmers. Once you go farming though, hunter gatherer norms and values cant stay there forever, they wont be dropped over a generation but they will transform one way or the other. It's the same with agricultural religions. No dogma that produces normative set of rules can withstand social evolution, at first it adapts to it (secularism, seperation of church and state etc) and when the gap widens, it becomes less and less relevant, until it transforms into mythology. In the age of mass media, not even the most hardcore Muslim would try to defend that presenting human figures is forbidden for example, we had them in the 50's, now they are extinct.
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I sincerely hope they get ass cancer - fred

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fred79
fred79


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
SCOURGE OF THE H-SEA
posted June 07, 2017 11:26 PM

off-topic/

Tito_Reni said:
CNN caught staging FAKE NEWS scene

Remember the Aleppo kid?
"Omran's father complained that he had been used as "propaganda""
The guy who took the photo is a terrorist
Moar


thanks for posting these. and, you should stay low key(less cuss words, no modified cuss words, etc). the way you post(summer 4chan style), is sure to draw plenty of negative attention from the mods. i'd rather you stay so that hc doesn't permanently slip into a blue-pilled coma. now that someone is posting links to stuff i and others have been bringing up repeatedly(which, frankly, i've always been too impatient to bother posting just to convince people arguing with me here), hc can get a glimpse of all the "tin-foil hat conspiracies" i and others have had our sanity's questioned for pointing out.

i'd really like to see those people who always argue "but all conspiracies are tin-foil hat stuff" even begin to attempt to argue against what those videos show, and what is shown so clear-cut; about the manipulated "news" that people so take for granted(which keeps happening over and over again, if anyone else here is paying attention).

what makes me laugh, is i first caught on that cnn wasn't to be trusted, when that was all we were allowed to watch in the t.o.c. in iraq. it's since then that i've developed an ever-growing distrust of mass media, and have watched how they deliberately manipulate media in order to gain the trust, and the will, of the public at large. and now, over a decade later, after ALL THAT HAS BEEN SHOWN TO BE MANIPULATED(there is a ton of stuff like this all over the internet, which shows clearly what has been manipulated, and by whom), people STILL argue that media manipulation is just "tin-foil hat conspiracy stuff".


(sorry friends, i felt compelled to post. i'm really trying to fight even visiting hc, but i continually find myself drawn here. probably out of habit. anyway, back to being gone.)

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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted June 07, 2017 11:48 PM

I don't understand your excitement fred. There is a small group of protesters, a media crew, (probably more than one crew from various networks) one journalist organizes the protesters to get a better shot of the protest. Arguably, the most you can say is their involvement is unethical and as journalists they shouldn't interfere at all, as a principle. Everything is happening openly right in the middle of a street in London, nobody's trying to hide what they're doing, what do you happen to believe, is the big deal here? It's not like they staged the thing out of the blue using fake protesters.
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I sincerely hope they get ass cancer - fred

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fred79
fred79


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
SCOURGE OF THE H-SEA
posted June 07, 2017 11:55 PM

you should watch ALL the videos, artu. and if you did, and still want to argue; then that will serve to show the newcomer just WHY i never bothered posting links to anything.

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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted June 08, 2017 12:07 AM

Lol fred. The newcomer doesn't seem like someone I'd give a rat's ass about what he thinks.

This is something already viral, btw:
Link

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I sincerely hope they get ass cancer - fred

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verriker
verriker


Honorable
Legendary Hero
The Catch Erwin Erwin The Rye
posted June 08, 2017 12:20 AM

fred mate welcome back mate (I did know that you would be back in a couple of weeks lol) but bear in mind that if you are sincerely tying your politics and worldview to 4chan with their blue pills and all of that I think your credibility will go down because that site is very one track mind and unreliable (putting it in the kindest terms) lol
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