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Heroes Community > Other Side of the Monitor > Thread: What is Love?
Thread: What is Love? This Popular Thread is 224 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 ... 40 80 120 160 200 ... 220 221 222 223 224 · «PREV / NEXT»
fred79
fred79


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SCOURGE OF THE H-SEA
posted June 10, 2018 02:47 AM

Protip: if they wear their ballcap backwards or look like the guys from "jersey shore", they're not nice guys.

Honestly, if you want, i have all the tell-tale signs of douchebags that no self-respecting woman should ever want memorized. I could easily give you the low-down. They aren't hard to spot if you know what to look for.

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Elvin
Elvin


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What if Elvin was female?
posted June 10, 2018 05:47 AM

I have a friend that would be delighted to know
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fred79
fred79


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SCOURGE OF THE H-SEA
posted June 10, 2018 09:49 AM

Sorry to break it to you.

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted June 10, 2018 11:31 AM
Edited by Corribus at 14:41, 10 Jun 2018.

kiryu133 said:
stop saying females Fred. It's extremely dehumanizing.


That's interesting because I think "females" is a practical common nominator when various generations are debating, men under 30 tend to say "girls", later they become "women", and even later they become "ladies".

But that's not related at all to your obnoxious call, when considering your ******** signature.

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Elvin
Elvin


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What if Elvin was female?
posted June 10, 2018 11:31 AM
Edited by Elvin at 11:32, 10 Jun 2018.

@fred

See that is the thing, some people can spot the signs a lot faster. People's behaviour may change but the signs are always there. I cannot believe that there have not been any dead giveaways within a period of one or two years. There is only so much benefit of the doubt that you can give.
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kiryu133
kiryu133

Hero of Order
Highly illogical
posted June 10, 2018 01:01 PM

kookastar said:


My point with the consumerism rant is that we have become such a throw-away society that instead of fixing things we tend to throw it away and get a new one.  Commitment between partners seems to be going the same way as we focus on ourselves.

Maybe love between partners can and does exist, maybe sometimes the biological impulses are just confusing - that feeling is so strong that we assume it's love when really it isn't.  Maybe fairytale love does exist.


some people don't want to be with one person. polyamorous people exist just as some people aren't interested in romance and/or sex and it's important to acknowledge this.

kookastar said:
As for nice guys - we can't have too many of those in the world  Problem is that the bad ones often disguise themselves quite well in the beginning.


eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeyup. then there are the ones who don't realize they can't hide it.
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tSar-Ivor
tSar-Ivor


Promising
Legendary Hero
Soli deo gloria
posted June 10, 2018 01:11 PM
Edited by tSar-Ivor at 13:18, 10 Jun 2018.

As I said, it's not about whether they are nice or not per-se, all about how they make you feel, there are jackasses that you literally cannot help but like, and get on with just fine even though they shouldn't by right. Then there are perfectly chummy guys that literally irk you with everything they do. I tried to copy what this one particular guy does to see if it's his actions that piss everyone off, or is it something about him. After a solid 6 weeks I can safely conclude that it's about the person, not the actions, hearing people complain about him then me going I do the same tho don't ya dislike it, and they go 'ye but it's different'. Different? 'You're not a girl so you wouldn't get it' is the best answer I got, so need more empirical data.

In Hungary we have a saying that a liar is caught faster than a lame dog, if it doesn't feel right, then it isn't, people try to force it regardless and violate their own hearts with their ignorance and stupidity, then wonder why they feel so hollow when they're meant to be happy. Could be that people can smell and taste your fear on a psychological level, you act nice to not feel alone. I realised that the more arrogant and self assertive I become the more people seem to like me, they'll call out plenty of criticism, but the level of interraction increases substantially with a positive vibe and atmosphere. Whereas my experimental subject still reeks of fear despite months of chummying up to people, nobody likes him, from my scientific observation he's not doing anything wrong, maybe trying too hard would be my first guess, but what does that even mean?
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artu
artu


Promising
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My BS sensor is tingling again
posted June 10, 2018 01:43 PM

I think “nice guys” not getting picked by women while jackasses turn them on, is a rhetoric that has been repeated so much, people just take it for granted as a natural fact but it is more of a myth / self-fulfilling prophecy. In one of the most nationwide popular forums here, there is a thread called “why do women prefer basterds to decent guys” and it is, at tha moment, 328 pages with people rambling on and on about how they were mistreated or spreading out red pill “wisdom.”

Two objections here:
1- Men are not divided into two such as nice guys and jackasses, in most of the cases, everybody is a bit of both to various degrees under various circumstances. Keep in mind almost every one thinks of themselves as a good guy at the core.

2- Saying nice guys are not picked by women and expecting to be some “chick magnet” only because you think you are a decent person are two very different things. Expecting to be good at relationships only because you are not a scumbag is kind of like expecting to be good at playing the guitar or engineering because you are “a nice guy.” And if you think “being nice” is the turn off, then probably the turn off is you being capable of only coming up with such a short-sighted and cliche diognosis. Women are not repelled by “nice.” There is a pretty good chance that Brad Pitt is a nice person and if he is, I’m sure no women ever dumped him for it. Just like you didnt dump any girl for being nice but them being nice people wasnt your ground setting to pick them out or continue the relationship either. So, if you want everything to work out in a snap, only because you are a good person, then good luck with that because relationships or even one-night stands take a little more than that.

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tSar-Ivor
tSar-Ivor


Promising
Legendary Hero
Soli deo gloria
posted June 10, 2018 02:12 PM

We're using pretty subjective terms here, jackass can be interpreted in many ways, so can what constitutes as "nice". For instance a "nice guy" can be a bigger jackass then one who is open about it, since it could be perceived (and that's really the key how are you being perceived, or how does your environment reflect back to you, are you truly honest?).

Then we get down to layers, a person can be 'nice' in one situation then a jackass the next, but again this is how his or her environment perceives it, you can try to be nice and your kindness seen with suspicion. So it can be how the individuals around you react to your actions, or inaction. Over time the truth always comes out, as in who you really are.

For me, I decided to just cut loose and wear my emotions on my sleeve, give as much as I like and take the same, ask when I feel it's right to, demand when it feels right. The more I allow myself to be governed by instinct rather than analysis and theoretical paradigms the more happier I seem to be (though I still make approrpriate risk analysis, or look at cost/gain this is no longer has the influence that it once did).

Love and life is a dance, you're dance to be specific and your own music, allowing cultural norms, or others to dictate to you what either of those should be is only for the weak that are too lazy or too cowardly to do it for themselves, able minded people should never surrender to an external regimen.
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Zenofex
Zenofex


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Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
posted June 10, 2018 04:44 PM

artu said:
I think “nice guys” not getting picked by women while jackasses turn them on, is a rhetoric that has been repeated so much, people just take it for granted as a natural fact but it is more of a myth / self-fulfilling prophecy. In one of the most nationwide popular forums here, there is a thread called “why do women prefer basterds to decent guys” and it is, at tha moment, 328 pages with people rambling on and on about how they were mistreated or spreading out red pill “wisdom.”

Two objections here:
1- Men are not divided into two such as nice guys and jackasses, in most of the cases, everybody is a bit of both to various degrees under various circumstances. Keep in mind almost every one thinks of themselves as a good guy at the core.

2- Saying nice guys are not picked by women and expecting to be some “chick magnet” only because you think you are a decent person are two very different things. Expecting to be good at relationships only because you are not a scumbag is kind of like expecting to be good at playing the guitar or engineering because you are “a nice guy.” And if you think “being nice” is the turn off, then probably the turn off is you being capable of only coming up with such a short-sighted and cliche diognosis. Women are not repelled by “nice.” There is a pretty good chance that Brad Pitt is a nice person and if he is, I’m sure no women ever dumped him for it. Just like you didnt dump any girl for being nice but them being nice people wasnt your ground setting to pick them out or continue the relationship either. So, if you want everything to work out in a snap, only because you are a good person, then good luck with that because relationships or even one-night stands take a little more than that.

Not sure why you involve the relationship here. Assuming that one can come up with a universally usable definitation of "nice" (or "bad" for that matter) I doubt that there are any decent statistics on how many women are attracted to "nice guys" as opposed to how many are fond of "bad guys" but the core word here is attracted, not "in relationship". How someone looks hardly has something to do with how "nice" or "bad" he is as well, although there's a chance that winning the genetic lottery at birth will make you more arrogant later on because you basically get for free or with little effort what others work hard(er) to obtain. My personal impression is that, when it comes to one night stands or very short and shallow relationships, women (a generalization of course but still) find "bad guys" preferable because they are in some way extraordinary compared to the others which translates as "adventure" for them. A spice for their everyday life, if you like. In serious relationships however - if they have some experience and if they want such in the first place of course - "bad guys" bite the dust. The thing is, there are some naive, inexperienced or simply stupid girls/women who would prefer the "bad guy" over the "nice" one for relationships as well, hoping that they can cultivate the bad qualities into good or at least tolerable ones and keep what they like unchanged but of course that (almost) never works.

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kiryu133
kiryu133

Hero of Order
Highly illogical
posted June 10, 2018 06:23 PM

The truth is really simple: "nice guys" are entitled, misogynistic creeps who expects to be given a relationship for being kind and they get extremely jealous when that doesn't work.

newsflash: women are people, not vending machines. you can't give them gifts or kindness and just expect to get sex in return. That's not how relationships work (and if it does it's a very toxic one). It's a view that treats women not as people or equals.

and on the subject of the people they say are bad: usually not bad. That's not to say there are bad men who get into relationships (or bad women for that matter) but as kooka said above, bad people can be very good at hiding that they're bad and once you're in an abusive or manipulative relationship it can be very hard to get out.

And on the subject of what women like: eh, it's all personal preference but it's hard to miss that society shapes these in particular ways. For example it's not surprising that a lot of queer people are into the dark goth aesthetic and dominating personalities: we've been subjected to queer-coded villains like that for AGES. Of course that's gonna have an effect!


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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted June 10, 2018 07:07 PM

Zenofex said:

Two objections here:
1- Men are not divided into two such as nice guys and jackasses, in most of the cases, everybody is a bit of both to various degrees under various circumstances.


You are right, but also what such discussions conflate is bad guys and bad-ass guys. Then the definitions of "bad guy" and "nice guy" are too broad, you could think that a skilled guy who affirms his masculinity, is arrogant and merciless with people he doesn't need, is "bad guy", while women will think he is a "bad ass", worth taming because he strives for the top and won't give up on unimportant details. On the other side, a "nice guy" isn't necessarily the one who is polite and attentional vs women - that thing bad ass guys usually do too because they know it is a valuable tool, but the guy who constantly gets contradicted and leaves at it, the one who tries to please everyone but eventually ends at the bottom of social hierarchy and will start complaining how unfair the world is.

In general bad-ass guys are more interesting because they have a more flexible behavior - in both directions - and also because they tend to have dominating and protecting charisma, to which women strongly are attracted to. Of course women are human, but they also are easier emotionally impressed so guys displaying their talents without hesitation will get what they want most of times.

This isn't a 100% thumb rule, there are guys which are introvert and timid and can get any women they want, anyway what's funny is that you will find entire forums, heated and totally surrealist debates on "how to pick girls" but never on "how to pick guys", which shows quite well who has the real power.

My preferred Mel Gibson movie is "what women want". I think it resumes rather well how simple the thing is but becomes such complicated because we constantly raise "act nice" barriers.
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Zenofex
Zenofex


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Kreegan-atheist
posted June 10, 2018 07:11 PM
Edited by Zenofex at 19:12, 10 Jun 2018.

Quote:
The truth is really simple: "nice guys" are entitled, misogynistic creeps who expects to be given a relationship for being kind and they get extremely jealous when that doesn't work.

newsflash: women are people, not vending machines. you can't give them gifts or kindness and just expect to get sex in return. That's not how relationships work (and if it does it's a very toxic one). It's a view that treats women not as people or equals.

and on the subject of the people they say are bad: usually not bad. That's not to say there are bad men who get into relationships (or bad women for that matter) but as kooka said above, bad people can be very good at hiding that they're bad and once you're in an abusive or manipulative relationship it can be very hard to get out.

And on the subject of what women like: eh, it's all personal preference but it's hard to miss that society shapes these in particular ways. For example it's not surprising that a lot of queer people are into the dark goth aesthetic and dominating personalities: we've been subjected to queer-coded villains like that for AGES. Of course that's gonna have an effect!

I'm getting the impression (again) that you have no idea what you are talking about and are just venting frustration masked as kindergarten sermons. That "nice guy" you describe exists only in your head.

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Elvin
Elvin


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What if Elvin was female?
posted June 10, 2018 08:11 PM

For me, when I hear nice guys I get the mental image of the friendzoned guy here. Someone who is gentle, polite and means well but lacks that little extra something to push things through.
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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted June 10, 2018 08:52 PM

Salamandre said:
Anyway what's funny is that you will find entire forums, heated and totally surrealist debates on "how to pick girls" but never on "how to pick guys", which shows quite well who has the real power.

Not exactly, my mother used to buy a lot of women magazines such as Vogue, Bazaar, Marie Claire etc and back in my early teens, I used to scroll through them a lot, and not only because of the hot model pictures, there were interesting articles in them, too. There were lots of content in them about how to impress men, of course, the rhetoric was rather “how to be the one that gets picked” than “how to pick,” or “how to keep them interested” but it’s pretty much the same motive at the core: how to impress the opposite sex. It’s easy to guess there are many women forums with similar content in today’s internet.
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Salamandre
Salamandre


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Wog refugee
posted June 10, 2018 09:08 PM

artu said:
the rhetoric was rather “how to be the one that gets picked” than “how to pick,” or “how to keep them interested” but it’s pretty much the same motive at the core


I disagree, it is a core difference. Women magazines teach women how to be/last attractive, how to delay aging effects, how to dress, how to smell but not so much what to say and how to actually arouse men, because let's face it, that behavior is very natural to them, they know the rules (translate: men are easy to trigger). A man will not look much at a woman power, social status, if she is ambitious, in short he will not project in the future, he wants what he sees, now. While women (not girls, women) tend to watch - and pick - a man as a life insurance, thus they need more time to tame what they will get.
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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted June 10, 2018 09:50 PM

You are turning a nuance into a very sharp distinction. It is true women care about social status more and men are usually triggered much faster by looks. But especially after a certain age, men also care a lot about the endurance of a relationship when they are seeking long-term partners and it’s a very unfair exaggeration to say women seek “life insurance” in men if we are talking about the ones with economic independence.
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fred79
fred79


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SCOURGE OF THE H-SEA
posted June 11, 2018 02:23 AM

No it's not. I couldn't count the times i've known females to use men for what they can give them(money for rent/payments/stuff, a place to live, etc), while guy's main interest is in sex and companionship soley. There are exceptions to those rules, of course. But the overwhelming evidence i've seen points to the more generalized themes. While "progressives" argue against reality in an attempt to appear less sexist, people with their heads screwed on straight are merely observing reality and reporting on it.

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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted June 11, 2018 03:48 AM
Edited by artu at 04:05, 11 Jun 2018.

You live in conservative, rural Southern U.S. where traditional gender roles are pretty much still preserved, 90 percent of Turkey is also like that but such roles are not set in stone and “progressives” arent daydreaming about that. This is more about social class than culture anyway, it becomes very different when majority of women also have degrees, white collar professions, money saved enough for a lifetime. I can also observe what you observe but I can observe other circles, too. Don’t make the mistake of thinking your social reality is the only reality of the entire species.
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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


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posted June 11, 2018 08:41 AM

You guys realize that you come across as a generaliting, categorizing bunch of pub philosophers stringing together one platitude after the other, do you?

Why don't you just speak for yourself instead of jamming sizable parts of humanity into pretty small desk drawers?

Sorry for my French.


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