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Heroes Community > Heroes 6 - The New Beginning > Thread: ~ Heroes 6 - Discussion thread ~
Thread: ~ Heroes 6 - Discussion thread ~ [ This thread is 525 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 (13) 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196 197 198 199 200 201 202 203 204 205 206 207 208 209 210 211 212 213 214 215 216 217 218 219 220 221 222 223 224 225 226 227 228 229 230 231 232 233 234 235 236 237 238 239 240 241 242 243 244 245 246 247 248 249 250 251 252 253 254 255 256 257 258 259 260 261 262 263 264 265 266 267 268 269 270 271 272 273 274 275 276 277 278 279 280 281 282 283 284 285 286 287 288 289 290 291 292 293 294 295 296 297 298 299 300 301 302 303 304 305 306 307 308 309 310 311 312 313 314 315 316 317 318 319 320 321 322 323 324 325 326 327 328 329 330 331 332 333 334 335 336 337 338 339 340 341 342 343 344 345 346 347 348 349 350 351 352 353 354 355 356 357 358 359 360 361 362 363 364 365 366 367 368 369 370 371 372 373 374 375 376 377 378 379 380 381 382 383 384 385 386 387 388 389 390 391 392 393 394 395 396 397 398 399 400 401 402 403 404 405 406 407 408 409 410 411 412 413 414 415 416 417 418 419 420 421 422 423 424 425 426 427 428 429 430 431 432 433 434 435 436 437 438 439 440 441 442 443 444 445 446 447 448 449 450 451 452 453 454 455 456 457 458 459 460 461 462 463 464 465 466 467 468 469 470 471 472 473 474 475 476 477 478 479 480 481 482 483 484 485 486 487 488 489 490 491 492 493 494 495 496 497 498 499 500 501 502 503 504 505 506 507 508 509 510 511 512 513 514 515 516 517 518 519 520 521 522 523 524 525 ]
Frederik360
Frederik360


Adventuring Hero
Looking to the sky
posted October 08, 2010 05:30 PM

Quote:
To give you all a bit of direction, there are two very relevant topics - fairly intertwined - that we'd really appreciate discussion on right now:

- Feedback on ideal multiplayer modes.
- Feedback on what to do during AI/opponent turns.


I'll relay anything you post on these subjects in the VIP forum.


Actually have a question, if you are allowed to answer then please do and if not then at least tell me, that you can't answer it(fully understandable). Are the campaign done? Are they done creating/envisioning the campaign? And can the community influence it?

(Don't expect Cephius to answer this)
Also have another subject for the community, which involves the so called gray areas of the heroes in the campaign. Do you think we will get to choose our allegience with the demon-brother(will we choose if he gives in to the demon lurking inside of him, will we dictate if his faction should turn more "good" or "evil" aka. focused on freedom or pillaging humans)or any of the other heroes in the campaign and their factions.

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Nelgirith
Nelgirith


Promising
Supreme Hero
posted October 08, 2010 06:00 PM
Edited by Nelgirith at 18:00, 08 Oct 2010.

Quote:
Also have another subject for the community, which involves the so called gray areas of the heroes in the campaign. Do you think we will get to choose our allegience with the demon-brother(will we choose if he gives in to the demon lurking inside of him, will we dictate if his faction should turn more "good" or "evil" aka. focused on freedom or pillaging humans)or any of the other heroes in the campaign and their factions.

I doubt we'll have any choice that impacts the storyline. H6 is supposed to set the foundations of H5's storyline and thus there's not much freedom.

From what we know about the storyline, I think that the demon that possesses Kiril is Kha-Beleth and thus, Kiril cannot "win" this fight else all of H5's story couldn't happen

Quote:
Actually have a question, if you are allowed to answer then please do and if not then at least tell me, that you can't answer it(fully understandable). Are the campaign done? Are they done creating/envisioning the campaign? And can the community influence it?


As I said above, imo, the story is set in stone. They will listen to the community about gameplay suggestion, but not about the story.

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Frederik360
Frederik360


Adventuring Hero
Looking to the sky
posted October 08, 2010 06:05 PM

Quote:
Quote:
Also have another subject for the community, which involves the so called gray areas of the heroes in the campaign. Do you think we will get to choose our allegience with the demon-brother(will we choose if he gives in to the demon lurking inside of him, will we dictate if his faction should turn more "good" or "evil" aka. focused on freedom or pillaging humans)or any of the other heroes in the campaign and their factions.

I doubt we'll have any choice that impacts the storyline. H6 is supposed to set the foundations of H5's storyline and thus there's not much freedom.

From what we know about the storyline, I think that the demon that possesses Kiril is Kha-Beleth and thus, Kiril cannot "win" this fight else all of H5's story couldn't happen

Quote:
Actually have a question, if you are allowed to answer then please do and if not then at least tell me, that you can't answer it(fully understandable). Are the campaign done? Are they done creating/envisioning the campaign? And can the community influence it?


As I said above, imo, the story is set in stone. They will listen to the community about gameplay suggestion, but not about the story.


Wasn't talking about the overall/general story, which dictates future events. I was referring to smaller parts of the story like subordinate heroes(like raelag and shadyah or Freyda and duncan or something like that), possible side quests or anything that could be a part of the story.

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MrDragon
MrDragon


Supreme Hero
Eats people with Ketchup
posted October 08, 2010 06:26 PM

The story is not as set in stone as you might think.
There is a crazy amount of things that can happen in one year, let alone 400.
We know of just a handful of things that have/are going to happen around the time of the campaign.
Also, history might not have been recorded in it's entirety or entirely objectively.

My bet is that Kiril isn't "evil" anyway.
As I said, my bet is a shades of gray, people will be fighting for their own, justifiable reasons, that their motivations and objectives might clash is what will provide conflict.
We don't need a good vs evil setup.
In fact, let it be so ambiguous that you, as a player, will formulate your own opinion about it, rather then telling us what to think.
Gaming is an interactive medium, let use exploit this, let us make our own choices and formulate our own thoughts on who deserves to win.

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MattII
MattII


Supreme Hero
posted October 08, 2010 07:16 PM

Actually, since the release date is set for March 2011 we have inside of 6 months, which isn't enough time to properly rewrite the story.

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MrDragon
MrDragon


Supreme Hero
Eats people with Ketchup
posted October 08, 2010 07:26 PM
Edited by MrDragon at 19:29, 08 Oct 2010.

I wasn't referring to that, I was referring to the fact that we shouldn't make to many assumptions on the story as the time-line is not very detailed.
I mean that in "game time", in 1 year, a truckload of stuff can happen.

I'm not suggesting that they have not finalized the actual plot of the game's story, that would be silly.
I'm hoping and guessing that the story they have now written for HoMMVI isn't so black and white but more dynamic, certainly with the family motif, betrayal and secrecy they have hinted at, it seems like it.

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Markkur
Markkur


Responsible
Supreme Hero
H5's Map-Making Die-Hard
posted October 08, 2010 07:32 PM

Quote:
Yeah, Markkur, I agree on the morale bonus being over-done in the adventure map.  When I make a map I'm very careful not to add too many of those.

I remember a major multiplayer fight I had against my friend.  He had gotten two of the rings that give -2 luck each.  As a result my army effectively was halved b/c I got bad luck everytime.  It really bugged me that 2 rings could cut my army in half.  The same went for morale and initiative, they were overpowered.  I like the idea of morale & luck, but they need to be fixed.


Just think if he had the Cloak and Skull to boot. He would have just killed you while you sipped on a coke

I like to use that initive hero Raeleg and nab some speed rings Is iniative going away in 6?

Make that Map great Mike80D!
____________
My H5 Maps

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Elvin
Elvin

Hero of Order
Stillness within Movement
posted October 08, 2010 07:40 PM

Initiative isn't going away but it is returning back to H4 mechanics. Higher initiative plays first but it won't let you play more often than those with less initiative.
____________
Then what's your excuse for that
steady stream of mindless
pollution that you call talking,
Edwin?

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Markkur
Markkur


Responsible
Supreme Hero
H5's Map-Making Die-Hard
posted October 08, 2010 07:54 PM

Quote:
To give you all a bit of direction, there are two very relevant topics - fairly intertwined - that we'd really appreciate discussion on right now:

- Feedback on ideal multiplayer modes.
- Feedback on what to do during AI/opponent turns.


I'll relay anything you post on these subjects in the VIP forum.


As to the first I've no clue. With the trouble I've had with the A.I. turns on the largemaps(that's what I want to play everytime pretty much) I can't imagine how folks could play on-line. But maybe that's the key.  Real-players make a big difference. That's been my trick in discovering large-map play, is I play most of the factions to cut down on the A.I. time.

I second some of the ideas already shared concerning the A.I. lag-time. Here's a thought I had the other day. Might be a load of bull. It seems the A.I. is switching its course of action 'each turn'. I see an AI hero run this way, next turn it runs back the other way and sometimes back and forth for a week. What if on the first day of the week, the A.I made a 'route-plan' as to what that A.I. faction's strategy is going to be for say, the next week. At least that might give one long turn to endure but  with several rapid ones between the next A.I. plan-check to come. I am probably way off base but you asked

A question for you. Does the A.I. still have that 3 set A.I. strategy (fighter,explorer,builder) approach that HoMM3 did? I mention this because it is a real drag making an elaborate map and having the A.I stuck on rush! You have to defeat the A.I on its terms and you've barely seen the map!

Thank you and all others in asking for feedback.



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My H5 Maps

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Markkur
Markkur


Responsible
Supreme Hero
H5's Map-Making Die-Hard
posted October 08, 2010 08:01 PM

Quote:
Initiative isn't going away but it is returning back to H4 mechanics. Higher initiative plays first but it won't let you play more often than those with less initiative.


That seems more balanced. Then that sounds like 'empathy' or what ever its called is gone. Or is it?


____________
My H5 Maps

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lucky_dwarf
lucky_dwarf


Promising
Supreme Hero
MY LIFE FOR THE DWARVES
posted October 08, 2010 08:21 PM
Edited by lucky_dwarf at 20:22, 08 Oct 2010.

Quote:
To give you all a bit of direction, there are two very relevant topics - fairly intertwined - that we'd really appreciate discussion on right now:

- Feedback on ideal multiplayer modes.
- Feedback on what to do during AI/opponent turns.


I'll relay anything you post on these subjects in the VIP forum.


I like the idea of planing things while your opponents turn, and I think that it would be cool if you could do things like recruit the unit while its the other players turn and have put them on hold until your turn begins so you could cut out a big chunk of turn right out of your own.

And also, don't force the player to watch the heroes moving on the screen. Make a mini-map alert that pops up and shows you where the enemy hero has appeared, and make it so that if you can both see it in the town view(or kingdom view) and be able to click on the alert and take you directly to the enemy hero.

By the way, my favorite multi-player modes, in any game, are defend the something, capture the flag and bring it your base, and sometimes resource collecting modes.

Ways you could adapt it to Heroes:

-Town defense maps, I believe Agreals Trial did this well.

-Capture the flag, instead of capturing a town, you simply have to go to an area that is one turn away from the enemy town, and enter an area, then leave it, thus gaining the "flag". You must then deliver this flag to your home town, while the enemy tries and recapture it, or take your own flag.

The concept of the map is that you would require to split your forces evenly, to both defend the flag and capture the opponents, because if you simply go ahead with all your troops and all out assault the enemy, you are leaving your town open to assault by any kind of hero to come and capture it. There would need to be a Fog of war system in place though, as the other players would immediately see a hero waiting in ambush, or a hero coming to capture a flag.

To avoid camping, the mode would also need for the flag to have a buffer zone that pushes out the hero the flag belongs too.

The player needs to build and upgrade his town, capture mines(that are in no area of control), and gather resources as usual, but has to do so with secondary heroes. This mode would throw off the direction the game is going by de-empasizing the importance of secondary heroes, but since its for a side mode, it doesn't matter.

-I also would like to make a mode where the AoC plays a central role. You have to collect X number of crystallized dragon bloods, or some other resource. Those resources, instead of being put in an unreachable bank, to put them into attackable store houses, which when attacked destroys the resources in the store house, and transfers 50-60% of them to the enemy.

The reason i like CDB better is because it adds a layer of strategy. You can choose to make the really expensive unit to help you in upcoming fights and defend your store houses(which puts you behind, because you now have less crystal then your opponent) or to stock up on crystal and try to win by simply out resourcing the enemy, which can always put the player at a disadvantage because his store houses could be raided if the enemy sacrificed some of his CBD to buy a really good unit to break down any defenses the enemy puts next to his store houses.

Some modes might require modified tech trees, and costs to make them cheaper or more expensive as the mode calls for it. Also, a tool would be needed by the community to create their own building costs, so that any future modes could be created and used at the discretion of the players.
____________
L and D are too far
away from eachother to be a
simple typo. -Keksimaton

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Gibblets
Gibblets


Adventuring Hero
Spontaneously Coherent Typist
posted October 08, 2010 11:32 PM

Quote:
To give you all a bit of direction, there are two very relevant topics - fairly intertwined - that we'd really appreciate discussion on right now:

- Feedback on ideal multiplayer modes.
- Feedback on what to do during AI/opponent turns.


I'll relay anything you post on these subjects in the VIP forum.




As for Multiplayer modes, I've only really played Hot Seat through all of the Heroes iterations(never having 6 hours to sit down on the internet straight). However, a sound to signify when it's your turn again on long maps would be nice. Because as I see it, the HoMM series is a great game to multitask with. Be it doing some reading, or some housework. So I wouldn't like to have to always be at the screen for MM:H6. Be it playing some mini game to earn some extra bucks or anything else that may negatively impact the game experience if I choose not to participate in it.

However being able to review details of your towns/kingdom/heroes is a great idea as it allows the more RPG oriented players to focus on skill trees and plan how they want to build their towns without slowing down the pace of the game. This could all take place within the context of a Tavern. Where you could chat with other players in the game (maybe make it an allies only chat option that would allow more strategising), trade resources like a marketplace, review unlocked media in the game(cut scenes, storyline, faction/hero bios, or just read up on a more robust rumour system then has been seen in previous versions). We could also have an info system in the Tavern much like in C&C3 where they had descriptions of events in the past, small plot holes explained, unit bios. Or maybe just the ability to watch your allies turn take place through their eyes.

There could also be a smaller version of the Duel mode in HoMM5 where you can pick a neutral hero currently in the Tavern waiting to be purchased, to battle against another inactive player. For one it wouldn't give away any info on your heroes (skills or stat point distribution) and secondly it would allow you try out a hero you've never used before but were thinking of buying for the current game.


I would really enjoy a seperate multiplayer mode that would work like a world domination, and could function as an extra campaign system that would be randomly generated each time it was played from the beginning. It could add a lot to the single player experience, and extend the product life. While also putting the RMG (hopefully *crosses fingers*) to good use. Even if it played like the DoW Dark Crusade campaign system where you could fortify territories and armies and build up heroes with special artifacts.


Anyways, those are just some ideas to make Heroes 6 the best game I've ever played.

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Xerox
Xerox


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
posted October 09, 2010 06:03 AM

Wait, so they changed their minds about completly removing initative then? Good, it adds a lot of strategy but yes it is ridiculous when one creature gets to act 2-3 times in a row without Morale proccing.

- Feedback on ideal multiplayer modes.
* LAN is important, look how many people cried about Starcraft 2 being unplayable because of no LAN or something (I don't know why).
* As for more interesting multiplayer modes I would suggest things such as:

Adventure Mode: In this mode, the players do not get any towns but will instead need to use objects on the adventure map. To win you need to capture the only town and hold it for a week or kill all the enemy heroes (there would be modified taverns etc so you would not be able to camp dwellings etc).

Last Man Standing: You have a month on you to build the strongest army. After a month has past, you are teleported to a location where all other heroes are. It uses a ladder system so it is impossible for someone that does not fight any other hero but the single weakened hero in the end that has defeated all others.

Rescourse War: In this mode you have to capture 4 Control Areas that are spread out evenly across the map and hold them for perhaps two weeks.

Capture the Banner: Capture the flag comes to Heroes. Each of the town has a banner. The player that brings all the banners to his town wins or when all other players are dead.

- What to do during the enemy's turns.

I think you should be able to check your town, hero and other things like that which does not involve fighting, moving or spending rescourses.

____________
Over himself, over his own body and
mind, the individual is sovereign.
- John Stuart Mill

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Kenishi
Kenishi


Known Hero
passed out drunk in Tavern's
posted October 09, 2010 07:23 AM
Edited by Kenishi at 07:25, 09 Oct 2010.

    Multiplayer … this aria is not known to me, I’ve played mostly in Hot Seat or solo but as Xerox put it :

“- What to do during the enemy's turns.
I think you should be able to check your town, hero and other things like that which does not involve fighting, moving or spending resources.” , couldn`t be more true.

But reading through all the other post there have been some good ones, spending to much time during your turn would earn the enemy gold/resources could be a mode or better put a option to enable when hosting a game.

     Basically I don’t want to enumerate all the things that people thought of but I have the following wish for this new installment:

Better A.I and should really be fixed the glitches of H5, I mean a L or XL map with 8 PC was a hell on it`s own to play, I mean waiting 5-10 minutes till your turn comes …. and all that do to a buggy path finding or pore memory optimization.

Like I said before not  a forte area in multiplayer but a Login profile like Blizzard has with Starcraft2, where it shows the games you played and won or lost, and matchmaking I mean a meeting between a hardened player and a beginner would result in a painful experience for the beginner and lack of challenge to the other.

Guess one could go further and create competitions using duel heroes, in which you have a battle between 2 opponents that have chosen the equipment and army in a given limit, and try to use the best strategy to achieve victory.

And that is about all that I can come up with, if anything else pops in I`ll be sure to write it.

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Markkur
Markkur


Responsible
Supreme Hero
H5's Map-Making Die-Hard
posted October 09, 2010 02:23 PM

Quote:
There could also be a smaller version of the Duel mode in HoMM5 where you can pick a neutral hero currently in the Tavern waiting to be purchased, to battle against another inactive player. For one it wouldn't give away any info on your heroes (skills or stat point distribution) and secondly it would allow you try out a hero you've never used before but were thinking of buying for the current game.quote]

I like that basic idea. What if you could make and watch the two heroes available in the tavern 'battle'.? To then be able to 'reserve the winner' and later have a hero with some starting experience?




____________
My H5 Maps

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Cepheus
Cepheus


Honorable
Legendary Hero
Far-flung Keeper
posted October 09, 2010 03:56 PM
Edited by Cepheus at 15:58, 09 Oct 2010.

Thanks a lot for all your posts on the subjects so far. I'll be doing things like this in future since it's way easier to collect feedback when there's direction provided for it. To Mike80D: These aren't so much questions as topics; an investigation into what is wanted.

On the subject of enemy turns, a possibility some of us suggested was including a lite version of ArcoMage (the wildly addictive minigame from Might and Magic VII and VIII) in between turns - though that was a more far-fetched example - and obviously we demanded the option to play in windowed mode. Most of us want simultaneous turns as well, but I don't know what their status is in H6.

Regarding multiplayer modes, we agreed that Ghost Mode was a waste of development time in H5, and think especially that a way, way stronger Duel Mode (like Elvin's duel map for H5) should be one of the pivotal inclusions.

Quote:
Actually have a question, if you are allowed to answer then please do and if not then at least tell me, that you can't answer it(fully understandable). Are the campaign done? Are they done creating/envisioning the campaign? And can the community influence it?


I believe the general story is already decided and I imagine a lot of the campaign is already developed by now. That doesn't mean it can't still be influenced, but you'd be shooting in the dark since they really don't want to spoil any of it

Quote:
A question for you. Does the A.I. still have that 3 set A.I. strategy (fighter,explorer,builder) approach that HoMM3 did? I mention this because it is a real drag making an elaborate map and having the A.I stuck on rush! You have to defeat the A.I on its terms and you've barely seen the map!


We have no idea about this to be honest.
____________
"Those who forget their history are inevitably doomed to repeat it." —Proverb, Might and Magic VIII

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LordGodric
LordGodric


Known Hero
The Griffin Rider
posted October 09, 2010 05:12 PM
Edited by LordGodric at 17:14, 09 Oct 2010.

- What to do during the enemy's turns.

well, at first i would like the AI turns dont take that long, when unseen, like it does, sometimes in XL maps...
I like the ideia about looking your kingdom, this makes you able to plan you next moves and gets your going faster when your new turn starts.
Of course, it must have an option that if the enemy is seen you choose if you want ot not to see wath hes doing
I also ithink it would be good have mini-games, and arcomage would be great!
but could be more than one, couldn't it be? I mean, some time ago, i remember a topic here about minigames in the taverns. Simple minigames, like some flash games we play - very simple games.
And you could have a game for each faction - doens meaning you can't play the minigame of other faction if you want,
for example:
-tic-tac-toe for Heaven -a simple game for simple peasents
-a snake (cellfone) like game (the snakes eat something and get bigger) for Inferno - a very evil-chaotic-demoniac-bloody-draconic-snake
-'darts' for Sylvan - or archery, much better!- (if its the 4th faction)
-Draughts for academy -a more 'intelectual' game- (it itsnt sylvan...)
-dominos for necro -with each stone/tile being bone-shaped
something like this


Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I sometimes think about how much pressure the developer of Heroes VI is. You know, with:
1. The Successfully Flawless King's Bounty and the 2 expansions on the loose

Flawless ? That's a joke, right ? King Bounty's story is about as bad as H5's one and looks like a game for 6 years old kids. The game has no tactical interest either. It's all about getting as many dragons as you can and destroy everything with your pet and AE spells.



Yes, compare to Heroes V initial release? I experienced even a single player campaign quest bugs and everything? King's bounty IS flawless, not perfect as for you said the story and stuff, but playability and bugs, it IS flawless. As for many dragons, I think we have different style of playing.



Agreed, KB is a very good game, as for the story, its simple, ok but it gets the simplicity of the original kings bounty, i liked that nostalgic bit -even i didnt played the original -
the cartoonish graphic are good to me, i realy like that style, it makes the game have that atmosphere of 'fairy tale'
I desagree about tactical interest... of course if you only uses dragons and destructive spells, i imagine it becomes very boring, in fact;
I think we have different style of playing ˛

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WhiteRider
WhiteRider


Known Hero
death walks with me
posted October 09, 2010 06:11 PM

Sorry that I am not interested in the Chepheus questions, I just want to add something about King's Bounty.

Quote:
Quote:
I sometimes think about how much pressure the developer of Heroes VI is. You know, with:
1. The Successfully Flawless King's Bounty and the 2 expansions on the loose

Flawless ? That's a joke, right ? King Bounty's story is about as bad as H5's one and looks like a game for 6 years old kids. The game has no tactical interest either. It's all about getting as many dragons as you can and destroy everything with your pet and AE spells.



KB story is as simple as all RPG stories: saving the world and while doing that helping all other humans/elves/dwarves/beings with their issues. Lots of secondary quests that keep your attention all the time.
I just finished an impossible warrior "orcs on the marsh" campaign with no loss (not a single unit killed from ~300 battles) and I didn't have a single 5th level dragon or 5th level unit in my army (this is the equivalent of champion or 7th tier units like in HoMM series). Warriors as you should know cant use devastating spells so this is newbie point of view (many dragons plus strong spells plus pet abilities).

KB is perfectly balanced with the use of the leadership value meaning the spellcasters have less army but balance this with spells, warriors have bigger armies but not very strong damage spells etc. Tactics is something you must use and know if you want to beat the game with no losses. And the tactics depend not on the army but on the hero class - warriors use tank units and spells like haste, stone skin, divine armor, target, phantom etc. Paladins are in the middle with a balance between might and magic, healing and resurrecting a lot and mages don't depend on their units so much but on spells (and they can even cast twice per round). What gives me much satisfaction with this game is that all units are very different one from another with unique abilities and skills. Something I am looking forward to see in H6.

Only people that haven't even scratched the surface of what KB can offer can speak like this about it. For me KB has much more re-playability than Heroes 5 because it looks better (directly speaking H5 is ugly and not because I like cartoon pictures but because in KB the devs have polished every detail in the design creating very beautiful), KB has much more interesting spells, battle tactics and units. The only bad thing about KB is that it is too much time consuming

I too think that Black Hole and Ubisoft have to learn a lot from Katauri and their KB.

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LordGodric
LordGodric


Known Hero
The Griffin Rider
posted October 09, 2010 06:36 PM

Quote:

KB is perfectly balanced with the use of the leadership value meaning the spellcasters have less army but balance this with spells.

all units are very different one from another with unique abilities and skills. Something I am looking forward to see in H6.

KB has interesting spells, battle tactics and units.

I too think that Black Hole and Ubisoft have to learn a lot from Katauri and their KB.


totally agreed.

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Agent_00_BLeRD
Agent_00_BLeRD


Adventuring Hero
posted October 09, 2010 08:03 PM

Speaking of KB, I found it really impressive how fluid most combat animations were. Compare the horseman's charge in KB to the charging creatures in Heroes series. Not only did the horseman automatically make the best use of his charging ability. If it was standing next to an opponent, and had say...10 movement, it would walk back 5 steps, turn around and charge the next 5. In heroes, you practically only get the charging bonus when closing in on the enemy or switching to a new target. And it doesn't look like a proper charge either; the champion runs, stops and strikes. They improved it a lot in Heroes 5 but KB still does it better. And not only for the horseman, almost every creature in KB combines the last movement step into its attack animation. While not ground breakingly important, it gives a very refined and polished feel to the game.

And regarding refined and polished feel, I read up there in the first post about 2D animated town screens. That is something like Heroes 3, right? Because Heroes 3 produced the best combination of beauty and practicality in its town screens, IMO. The towns looked natural (not the "random building stacked here" look of H4) and yet you knew where everything was. The 3D town screen in H5 was breathtaking (especially Haven and Academy) but not practical. After a while, you just used the menus to perform actions and didn't even give a second look to the amazing artwork which I felt was a real shame.

The one thing that would make me jump for joy is an in-game description of the terms that are used for unknown creature numbers. I hate having to look up online every time I encounter a "horde" or a "throng" or a "pack" or "pairs" or "bakers' dozens"...Indicating the range they are supposed to represent would be very much appreciated. I found a mod for H5 that does it but it didn't work in TOE.

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