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Heroes Community > Heroes 6 - The New Beginning > Thread: ~ Heroes 6 - Discussion thread ~
Thread: ~ Heroes 6 - Discussion thread ~ [ This thread is 525 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 (70) 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196 197 198 199 200 201 202 203 204 205 206 207 208 209 210 211 212 213 214 215 216 217 218 219 220 221 222 223 224 225 226 227 228 229 230 231 232 233 234 235 236 237 238 239 240 241 242 243 244 245 246 247 248 249 250 251 252 253 254 255 256 257 258 259 260 261 262 263 264 265 266 267 268 269 270 271 272 273 274 275 276 277 278 279 280 281 282 283 284 285 286 287 288 289 290 291 292 293 294 295 296 297 298 299 300 301 302 303 304 305 306 307 308 309 310 311 312 313 314 315 316 317 318 319 320 321 322 323 324 325 326 327 328 329 330 331 332 333 334 335 336 337 338 339 340 341 342 343 344 345 346 347 348 349 350 351 352 353 354 355 356 357 358 359 360 361 362 363 364 365 366 367 368 369 370 371 372 373 374 375 376 377 378 379 380 381 382 383 384 385 386 387 388 389 390 391 392 393 394 395 396 397 398 399 400 401 402 403 404 405 406 407 408 409 410 411 412 413 414 415 416 417 418 419 420 421 422 423 424 425 426 427 428 429 430 431 432 433 434 435 436 437 438 439 440 441 442 443 444 445 446 447 448 449 450 451 452 453 454 455 456 457 458 459 460 461 462 463 464 465 466 467 468 469 470 471 472 473 474 475 476 477 478 479 480 481 482 483 484 485 486 487 488 489 490 491 492 493 494 495 496 497 498 499 500 501 502 503 504 505 506 507 508 509 510 511 512 513 514 515 516 517 518 519 520 521 522 523 524 525 ]
Jabanoss
Jabanoss


Promising
Legendary Hero
Property of Nightterror™
posted December 19, 2010 04:47 PM
Edited by Jabanoss at 16:48, 19 Dec 2010.

Actually a proper Unicorn should be half goat, half horse. It should have the size and body type of a horse, but beard, tail and hooves like a goat.

Ofc this is not the way they have to be, but imo it's the coolest and most classic way.


might not be the best pictures but I hope you get my message.
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"You turn me on Jaba"
- Meroe

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MattII
MattII


Legendary Hero
posted December 19, 2010 06:17 PM
Edited by MattII at 18:23, 19 Dec 2010.

Quote:
Actually a proper Unicorn should be half goat, half horse. It should have the size and body type of a horse, but beard, tail and hooves like a goat.

Ofc this is not the way they have to be, but imo it's the coolest and most classic way.
Actually not, the most classical form is:
...Ctesias who described them as wild asses, fleet of foot, having a horn a cubit and a half in length and colored white, red and black.
That was in ~398 BC. Their having a goat-like form wasn't mentioned until the middle ages.

My favourite unicorn picture is this one.

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Jabanoss
Jabanoss


Promising
Legendary Hero
Property of Nightterror™
posted December 19, 2010 06:32 PM

yeah yeah but their medieval-version is still cooler then just a "horse with horn".
That goat-like features has always been something I have associated with the Unicorn. Maybe it's just me, but they actually had those features in Heroes II & III.


Of course it is pretty much impossible to say how the first or the most classic unicorn or any creature for that matter looks, since it's always hard to know the "first" source.
Anyways cool with the colored horns that the unicorns in Ctesias version had

haha and yeah your "unicorn" is awesome
____________
"You turn me on Jaba"
- Meroe

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Frederik360
Frederik360


Adventuring Hero
Looking to the sky
posted December 19, 2010 06:36 PM

Over the years i have come to hate pretty much any human-like race/faction, that seems to be in every game these days. Could be, that it is the MMO's fault, since they always seem to include at least humans and elves and sometimes even dwarves and orcs. I really don't understand why thay have to be included each and every time, is it tradition? If so, then srew tradition. Another thing that usually gets my blood boiling is the stereotypes. Can someone explain to me, why eleves USUALLY have to be somewhat gifted in the use of magic? Or why humans are "average" in every way of either might or magic. Why Dwarves seem to be resistant to magic? Or why orcs tend to favour might over magic?

I could propably also say something about the demons, but it is not as often, that we get to play one of the evil factions/demons in any game these days. Could also be me, who is generally sick and tired of always playing as a human in every single game on either pc or console. Why is it, that game developers only think humans can empathize with other humans? Give me some sort of beast or demon to play as!

These are primary reason to why i like War Wind. 4 races, none of them human, elves, dwarves or orcs. You can even find the full game free for download by using google, it may be old but the style and nice sprites make it totally worth the google search.      

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Elvin
Elvin

Hero of Order
Stillness within Movement
posted December 19, 2010 06:52 PM

This sounds pretty good.. Unfortunately I prefer turn over real time based.

I believe it's about avoiding to alienate the fans. A few creatures swapping sides was never a big deal but the series has established some 'core' factions and fan favourites which are not easy to just dismiss.
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MattII
MattII


Legendary Hero
posted December 19, 2010 06:58 PM
Edited by MattII at 19:06, 19 Dec 2010.

Quote:
yeah yeah but their medieval-version is still cooler then just a "horse with horn".
Yeah right, you know most of that 'horse with a horn' artwork is from the middle ages right?
Quote:
Of course it is pretty much impossible to say how the first or the most classic unicorn or any creature for that matter looks, since it's always hard to know the "first" source.
Well Ctesias was the first 'western' author to actually mention it, so I guess we can use that. Of course the 'horse with a horn' was quickly dismissed by Aristotle, who described:
...two one-horned animals, the oryx (a kind of antelope) and the so-called "Indian ass".
Pliny the Elder mentions:
...the oryx and an Indian ox (perhaps a rhinoceros) as one-horned beasts, as well as "a very fierce animal called the monoceros which has the head of the stag, the feet of the elephant, and the tail of the boar, while the rest of the body is like that of the horse; it makes a deep lowing noise, and has a single black horn, which projects from the middle of its forehead, two cubits in length.

Those classical authors sure had some imagination.
Quote:
Over the years i have come to hate pretty much any human-like race/faction, that seems to be in every game these days. Could be, that it is the MMO's fault, since they always seem to include at least humans and elves and sometimes even dwarves and orcs. I really don't understand why thay have to be included each and every time, is it tradition? If so, then srew tradition. Another thing that usually gets my blood boiling is the stereotypes. Can someone explain to me, why eleves USUALLY have to be somewhat gifted in the use of magic? Or why humans are "average" in every way of either might or magic. Why Dwarves seem to be resistant to magic? Or why orcs tend to favour might over magic?

I could propably also say something about the demons, but it is not as often, that we get to play one of the evil factions/demons in any game these days. Could also be me, who is generally sick and tired of always playing as a human in every single game on either pc or console. Why is it, that game developers only think humans can empathize with other humans? Give me some sort of beast or demon to play as!
Well in our case I think it has a lot to do with artefacts, selecting a bunch of humanoids allow them to use a single 'rag doll' for artefact placement rather than having to develop a 'rag doll' for each race, which would play hell with the balance. I completely agree with you though, lots of nearly human races gets tiring very quickly.

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Dynamos
Dynamos

Tavern Dweller
posted December 19, 2010 07:11 PM

Don't get me started on demons. Red with sharp bits! (ok, that was a bit of an exaggeration...)
Still, if we're talking about terrain and factions, I think it might be interesting to see what happened if you switched the terrain of factions. How would demons look like if Sheogh was a green forest? How would elves look (and what creatures would they associate with) if they lived in a volcanic environment? I think it might be an interesting twist to keep the faction philosophy, but throw them in a different environment.

I note that all the Necropolis upgrades have some sort of added hairpiece, made of obsidian (I think). Does that mean Necromancy works like wireless, and you need a better antenna to control upgraded creatures? Is that what Holy Word does? Block the reception?

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Jabanoss
Jabanoss


Promising
Legendary Hero
Property of Nightterror™
posted December 19, 2010 07:19 PM
Edited by Jabanoss at 19:22, 19 Dec 2010.

Quote:
Yeah right, you know most of that 'horse with a horn' artwork is from the middle ages right?

Orly? Just search Medieval Unicorn on google and you will find that nearly all of the unicorns you find have goat features. (yes awesome detective skills I know)
(and plz note that I referring to medieval-art not Baroque or something like that.)
____________
"You turn me on Jaba"
- Meroe

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MattII
MattII


Legendary Hero
posted December 19, 2010 07:45 PM

Quote:
Orly? Just search Medieval Unicorn on google and you will find that nearly all of the unicorns you find have goat features. (yes awesome detective skills I know)
(and plz note that I referring to medieval-art not Baroque or something like that.)
And just what would you count as 'goat features'? All the ones I saw had long legs (like a horse) and flowing manes (like a horse).

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Orfinn
Orfinn


Supreme Hero
Werewolf Duke
posted December 19, 2010 09:05 PM

Quote:
That I strongly disbelieve. Almost everyone wants to be a sexy slender elven assassin or something, males included.

And god no more elf variations, I hate them with passion.

Wood elves, dark elves, night elves, blood elves, deep elves, sea elves, winter elves, high elves, low elves, ****-if-i-know-elves...


I kinda agree. Too MANY variations. Why shouldnt humans, elves, orcs be divided just the same? It would be a headache like this I guess..

Dark (african-afro american) humans, Light (light pink/brown) humans, Tan (latin) humans, Tropic (asian) humans, Red (native americans) humans

Same with dwarves. Red Dwarves, White Dwarves, Brown Dwarves

See where Im going?

And why are there only WHITE humans in the Knight factions?

*facepalms*

Im not sure if the Dark Elves in H5 are more genetic diverse from the Sylvan elves. But so far as I see it they just have another skin tone/color. Or was it that they got a paler tan and red eyes due to living underground for a while and/or be influenced by the dragon god of Darkness?
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Yaeliccc
Yaeliccc


Known Hero
Undead, but warm and fuzzy
posted December 19, 2010 11:07 PM

Quote:
Quote:
That I strongly disbelieve. Almost everyone wants to be a sexy slender elven assassin or something, males included.

And god no more elf variations, I hate them with passion.

Wood elves, dark elves, night elves, blood elves, deep elves, sea elves, winter elves, high elves, low elves, ****-if-i-know-elves...


I kinda agree. Too MANY variations. Why shouldnt humans, elves, orcs be divided just the same? It would be a headache like this I guess..

Dark (african-afro american) humans, Light (light pink/brown) humans, Tan (latin) humans, Tropic (asian) humans, Red (native americans) humans

Same with dwarves. Red Dwarves, White Dwarves, Brown Dwarves

See where Im going?

And why are there only WHITE humans in the Knight factions?

*facepalms*

Im not sure if the Dark Elves in H5 are more genetic diverse from the Sylvan elves. But so far as I see it they just have another skin tone/color. Or was it that they got a paler tan and red eyes due to living underground for a while and/or be influenced by the dragon god of Darkness?


1. knights existed only in europe during middle ages, there werent any non white knights LOL
2. creators of the game are white, they make the game in their image its not that hard to understand that, did u not notice what are the main names of the heroes ? all sound slavic to me
3. im pretty sure 99.3% of the ppl wouldnt mind if knights faction didnt even exist
4. elves are a nice faction, the sooner u accept that the sooner your life goes back to being peachy LOL

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MattII
MattII


Legendary Hero
posted December 19, 2010 11:56 PM

3. I know I wouldn't.
4. Elves are as tired and threadbare as almost every other town that's ever featured in the series (except Fortress in H3, and most of the Dungeons).

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grow
grow


Adventuring Hero
posted December 20, 2010 01:37 AM

probably the biggest complaint i had with H5 is playing a map thats large or bigger.  the waiting time for the AI players to take their turns was ridiculous, this is basically why i havent played it like i do H2.  just takes too damn long to play unless its a small map.  I hope H6 has made that more efficient.
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nothing is predictable
grow me

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alcibiades
alcibiades

Hero of Order
and Light
posted December 20, 2010 02:36 AM

Wow, we sure are a hard crowd to please! One day there is a minor revolt because Sylvan faction is dropped, the next day people almost step on each other to get first in line to throw dirt on anything even resembling elves.

And for all the people who are so eager to throw away all the old factions, I must admit I don't think you'd actually like it if UbiHole went overboard and made all-new factions and threw away any resemblence to the old game. The old H3 Forge incident comes to mind.

Quote:
I kinda agree. Too MANY variations. Why shouldnt humans, elves, orcs be divided just the same? It would be a headache like this I guess..

Dark (african-afro american) humans, Light (light pink/brown) humans, Tan (latin) humans, Tropic (asian) humans, Red (native americans) humans

Same with dwarves. Red Dwarves, White Dwarves, Brown Dwarves

See where Im going?

And why are there only WHITE humans in the Knight factions?

*facepalms*

Im not sure if the Dark Elves in H5 are more genetic diverse from the Sylvan elves. But so far as I see it they just have another skin tone/color. Or was it that they got a paler tan and red eyes due to living underground for a while and/or be influenced by the dragon god of Darkness?

I agree that the white "Dark" Elves from H5 made no sense. If they wanted an evil underground elven faction, then make them proper drows, that would be much more cool. But I reckon Wizards OTC has some sort of copyright on the drow name, don't know how it would be with the look without having the actual name in.

Same with Humans, the should have made the mages look like Dracon from H3 AB, which would actually suite their arabian/desert setting.

Obviously, they could have made two Dwarven factions also, but then again, given that they are cutting down in the number of factions, it's probably unlikely to have them do that.
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Heroes 7 - News overview | Heroes 7 - Discussion thread

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Jabanoss
Jabanoss


Promising
Legendary Hero
Property of Nightterror™
posted December 20, 2010 03:11 AM
Edited by Jabanoss at 03:12, 20 Dec 2010.

Quote:
And just what would you count as 'goat features'? All the ones I saw had long legs (like a horse) and flowing manes (like a horse).

Sorry I didn't mean it that way, The things I meant where what I first mentioned that "Unicorn should be half goat, half horse. It should have the size and body type of a horse, but beard, tail and hooves like a goat." which they had in those pictures, in other words more then just a horse with horn.(imo at least)
I guess my first pictures where kinda misleading regarding how I meant for them to look.


Regarding the Elf rage; In order the make the elven factions really interesting in my opinion they need to make them more unique and diverse both against each other, but also towards Haven and the dwarfs.
I want the Sylvan to be vicious and hostile, that they keep to themselves and their woods with their creatures. They should rarely bother working with outsiders unless greater things threatens, like a lunar eclipse.
The dark elves on the other hand should be made less evil and integrate more beasts of the underground into their faction. The thing I mean with less evil is they should be more willing to work with others since they know what it is to be outsiders. As a visual difference to the other elves I think it would be really cool if you could really see their dark side, As if they were consumed by shadows. Darkness in their eyes and magic all around them.
____________
"You turn me on Jaba"
- Meroe

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bixie
bixie


Promising
Legendary Hero
my common sense is tingling!
posted December 20, 2010 03:27 AM

the thing is... erm, I find the whole idea of the change in skin colour because they are evil just a tiny bit...

well, if you think about it, both dark elves and wood elves are still the same race, elves (who are all bast@rds and anyone who likes them should eat all their man cards), so really, there is no need, biologically, for them to change skin colour. if anything, lighter skin colour is more prevalent in places with little sunlight.

besides, "turning darker skin colour when I go evil"... kind of... erm...



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Love, Laugh, Learn, Live.

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Jabanoss
Jabanoss


Promising
Legendary Hero
Property of Nightterror™
posted December 20, 2010 03:32 AM

Yup I agree completely, therefore I want them to have their own kind of unique clothes that are much different the the Sylvan elves.(However it shouldn't be kinky leather clothes T_T)

And since they are in a pact with the Faceless and their dark magic, the Dark Elves should really show that in an awesome way, imo.
____________
"You turn me on Jaba"
- Meroe

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War-overlord
War-overlord


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
posted December 20, 2010 04:08 AM

Quote:
Same with Humans, the should have made the mages look like Dracon from H3 AB, which would actually suite their arabian/desert setting.


Well, the majority of the Acadmey Heroes in HoMMV is rather tanned, especially the older ones.
I agree that they should all be, that would indeed fit their desert better.
____________
"And then she dumped my @ss and I was like, Time to fill the void with Snickers." -Jesse Cox

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Zenofex
Zenofex


Responsible
Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
posted December 20, 2010 04:11 AM
Edited by Zenofex at 04:12, 20 Dec 2010.

The main problem of the humans, elves and dwarves and to some extent - the orcs, is that they are taken straight from Tolkien with next to no remodelling. This happens over and over again and very few writers/designers seem to have sufficient imagination and knowledge to make changes (Tolkien didn't invent anything himself, he just ransacked some North/Western European mythologies and combined them with Christian dramas). People just grow tired of it (including me). Elves - OK. Tree-hugging arrogant smart@sses - hell no! And so on.

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Lokheit
Lokheit


Adventuring Hero
posted December 20, 2010 04:42 AM

HoMM 5 Dark Elves are more based on warhammer dark elves (druchii) than in forgotten realms or D&D drows. This is why they have white skin, and are acompained by Hydras and Black Dragons. The lizard rider is common for both druchii and drow and the minotaur only appears for drow (at least in Drizzt books they served as guardians), but in HoMM 5 you can find some other similitudes with warhammer (for example, ghosts in stacks of 3 and some designs) so I think this is why they are white-skinned.

In fact I've been finding the last 2 heroes games inspired in other games. While I see heroes 5 having light inspiration on warhammer, I think that heroes 4 have heavy inspiration on Magic the Gathering (Town distribution: Knights and Clerics (white) Nature and beasts (green) Chaos (red) Death and inferno (Black) Mages and Artificiers (blue)), they even are allied with the adjacent colour the same way than in magic, and the wheel is put in the same order, and you can find on their armies creatures that you could find on a magic card of the same colour. The only difference is that the non-colored faction is a barbarian faction instead of an artifact based faction.

At first I though that with 5 factions, this would be the case again for Heroes 6, but the inclusion of stronghold and the fact of that the last faction is supposed to be a brand new one is proving it wrong.

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