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Heroes Community > Other Side of the Monitor > Thread: Politics in the U.S.
Thread: Politics in the U.S. This Popular Thread is 102 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 ... 20 40 60 80 ... 98 99 100 101 102 · «PREV
Neraus
Neraus


Promising
Legendary Hero
Pizza Nazi
posted October 10, 2019 02:42 PM

Wasn't really responding to that remark in particular nor to you tho, it's obviously one of those off the cuff remarks that make you sound like a giant idiot, it comments itself.

It's like if I went to an ANPI meeting in Milan and said "Thank God the Americans liberated Italy", they'd probably chase me out, since the partisans did most of the work during that time.
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verriker
verriker


Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
posted October 10, 2019 03:46 PM

Minion said:
But please respond to the topic of Kurds and Normandy. Which was my ONLY point in the previous post.


long live the great communist party of China, may this autumn's sorghum harvest be bountiful cheers lol
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Minion
Minion


Legendary Hero
posted October 11, 2019 12:34 AM

Neraus said:
To be fair, no one obliges the US to act as the policeman of the world, it is the neighbouring countries that should be the first to offer and give aid, besides, the Syrians have an ally, Russia, so why shouldn't we let their allies help them?



OK, lets back up a little. The Kurds were pivotal in fighting against ISIS, allied with USA. The rally BIG BAD of last decade.  Why is it now suddenly the problem of their neighbours? Why didn't USA leave ISIS to others if this is their world view?

Lets continue :
Quote:
Isn't it a bit hypocritical to first blame the US for destabilizing the region with their nation building efforts, their military campaigns and outright obstructionism of other military forces officially acting as peacekeepers and then blame the US for sending their troops home?


Send home? They don't send the troops home, only away from North Syria to the South Syria. Apparently you have misread the news. What excuse do you have for some 50 american troops of being relocationed from North Syria to South? So now Turkey can bomb North Syria perhaps?

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted October 11, 2019 01:22 AM

Trump was underlining this article but as usual didn't bother to stress the context so the remark about Normandy sounds dumb. In the article things are more coherent, basically we live now in a sharing interests world, the kurds never helped anyone outside their own interests - in any war before, so there is no reason for payback.

The bottom thing is, no matter how western nations set up their help, it always end in disaster. Also irony is, Europeans are criticizing Trump for his turnabout, while they wouldn't move a finger because Erdogan then will unleash migrants pour into what has no longer any protective borders, that is EU.
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Minion
Minion


Legendary Hero
posted October 11, 2019 01:25 AM

Salamandre said:
the kurds did nothing for us, in any war before, why should we help them.


Fighting ISIS doesn't count? 11,000 Kurds died.

You are quite literally alone in this view that Kurds did nothing. Oh no, you don't have a personal view, you just parrot what Trump says.

Well the "two of you" are alone.

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted October 11, 2019 01:33 AM

The claim about "they fought ISIS with us" isn't really valid (the article points to it). They would have fought ISIS anyway because it threatened directly their land.
Here we talk about people getting involved out of their own interest, for example as USA did in Normandy (well, kinda but this will be for another debate).

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Minion
Minion


Legendary Hero
posted October 11, 2019 01:35 AM

So you are saying USA had no self interest in Normandy? They did it because "they are the good guys?"

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted October 11, 2019 01:39 AM

No, I implied that is more complex (ofc if Germany had won all Europe, then USA would have been quite threatened) but looking from some distance, yes, they came to help when there was not direct threat to their own interests. At least soldiers thought that way, those who died.

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Minion
Minion


Legendary Hero
posted October 11, 2019 01:50 AM

Soldiers don't make the decicion to go into war. Administrations do.

Lets jst wait for the scandal when we find out that Trump pulled the troops in exchange for getting a building permit for Trump Tower in Istanbul. He is the most corrupt politician I have ever seen, I can't for the life of me understand why people lie on his behalf to the extent as they do. What makes these people so fanatical?

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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted October 11, 2019 09:12 AM

Whom did the jews fight to help "us"?

This is all nonsense. Human interests have no relevance in this. All propaganda and lies. It's about interests, period, and the Kurds have nothing of interest, are nothing and can offer nothing, so they can go to hell.
They are a losing side, because they will either be herded into some kind of reservation like the native Americans, killed or marked terrorists.
And Trump plays the Pilate.

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted October 11, 2019 10:09 AM
Edited by Salamandre at 10:26, 11 Oct 2019.

Jews are a very good example, mind you. They are majorly over represented at the top of power generating structures, politics, banking, weaponry, business, and all this in a couple of powerful nations, precisely those who send help to Israel. Again, national interests.

But Merkel can take the lead and show Pilate how Jesus on high heels is back, I don't mind.

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CountBezuhoff
CountBezuhoff


Famous Hero
Master of the merchant's guild
posted October 11, 2019 10:29 AM

Minion said:
Neraus said:
...



OK, lets back up a little. The Kurds were pivotal in fighting against ISIS, allied with USA. The rally BIG BAD of last decade.  Why is it now suddenly the problem of their neighbours? Why didn't USA leave ISIS to others if this is their world view?

Lets continue :
Quote:
...


Send home? They don't send the troops home, only away from North Syria to the South Syria. Apparently you have misread the news. What excuse do you have for some 50 american troops of being relocationed from North Syria to South? So now Turkey can bomb North Syria perhaps?



I believe he was being sarcastic.

The Count
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Neraus
Neraus


Promising
Legendary Hero
Pizza Nazi
posted October 11, 2019 11:06 AM

Minion said:

You are quite literally alone in this view that Kurds did nothing. Oh no, you don't have a personal view, you just parrot what Trump says.

Well the "two of you" are alone.



You know, one thing is saying no one is forcing the US to operate in the region, and one thing is saying that Kurds did nothing.
My bad that I misread the news, the way it was framed it seemed as if the US was withdrawing, and in a way I welcome it, we've been asking them to just leave the Middle East alone for a while now.

If you noticed something my criticism was pointed towards those who blame the US instead of taking action against... I don't know, the next dictator next door to Europe that invaded a foreign country to oppress a minority of their own country.
If we are sanctioning Russia for Crimea and their support of Ukrainian separatists, why aren't we doing the same to another warmonger that has already bloodied his hands?
We shouldn't let us be blackmailed by an upstart, he wants to flood the EU with migrants if we intervene? Block. Them. If he wants to use them as hostages we have much more leverage for punitive measures. Caving in now is like a new Munich deal, ironic that an Italian is telling you this.

If you're noticing I'm asking to help the Kurds.
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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted October 11, 2019 06:33 PM

Politicians owe one thing only, and that is protection and care about the citizens who elected them, period.

I am not against smart and long term aids for backward countries, like proposing education, hospitals and infrastructures, but its time for western nations to keep military at home and let everyone untangle their own destiny. Whatever is militarily done, it invariably ends in disaster, then people affected leave, ironically for the same countries which snowed their homeland, then daily poison the life of those who they first supplicated to come and help.

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blob2
blob2


Legendary Hero
Blob-Ohmos the Second
posted October 11, 2019 06:34 PM

Turns out allies and politics work like AI players in games in style of Civilization.

You hard press for an alliance, and when you finally do one and an enemy AI attacks you, you allies literally do nothing or wait until you bleed out to do sth

You can anylyze USA's interest however you want, but that doesn't change the fact that they literally left their ALLY, Kurds, to fend for themselves, which is apparent be the immidiate agression from Turkey.

One of the long-term consequence is the revival of ISIS, because Kurds will focus on their northern defence now.

Well, does it even matter for big ol' States? ISIS is a byproduct of USA's mingling in the Middle East in the first place...

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OmegaDestroyer
OmegaDestroyer

Hero of Order
Fox or Chicken?
posted October 11, 2019 08:11 PM

blob2 said:
Turns out allies and politics work like AI players in games in style of Civilization.


You'll pay for that.

(OmegaDestroyer Denounces You.)
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