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Age of Heroes Headlines:  
5 Oct 2016: Heroes VII development comes to an end.. - read more
6 Aug 2016: Troubled Heroes VII Expansion Release - read more
26 Apr 2016: Heroes VII XPack - Trial by Fire - Coming out in June! - read more
17 Apr 2016: Global Alternative Creatures MOD for H7 after 1.8 Patch! - read more
7 Mar 2016: Romero launches a Piano Sonata Album Kickstarter! - read more
19 Feb 2016: Heroes 5.5 RC6, Heroes VII patch 1.7 are out! - read more
13 Jan 2016: Horn of the Abyss 1.4 Available for Download! - read more
17 Dec 2015: Heroes 5.5 update, 1.6 out for H7 - read more
23 Nov 2015: H7 1.4 & 1.5 patches Released - read more
31 Oct 2015: First H7 patches are out, End of DoC development - read more
5 Oct 2016: Heroes VII development comes to an end.. - read more
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Heroes Community > Heroes 7 - Falcon's Last Flight > Thread: ~ Heroes 7 - Discussion thread ~
Thread: ~ Heroes 7 - Discussion thread ~ This MEGA THREAD is 1634 pages long: 1 200 400 600 800 1000 1200 ... 1282 1283 1284 1285 1286 ... 1400 1600 1634 · «PREV / NEXT»
Bitula
Bitula


Known Hero
posted December 16, 2015 12:34 PM

magnomagus said:
Quote:
Btw, why doesnt QT pass the source to magnomagus? Then magnomagus could ask a license from UBI to make additions to H5.


QT already asked Ubisoft permission for a commercial expansion to H5 and the answer was no. I'm sure that also implies not being allowed to pass the source code to other people.


Wait, I don't get it. The whole point is that they allowed to use it for community changes. Why can't you use it then? Commerical expansion is irrelevant, I can imagine several reasons they don't want to go commerical with this. But fact is, they allowed to release community mods based on real source code (QTs AI). QT got permission to do so, and he did so. Why you think you won't get permission?

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verriker
verriker


Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
posted December 16, 2015 12:35 PM bonus applied by Elvin on 29 Feb 2016.
Edited by verriker at 12:38, 16 Dec 2015.

Bitula said:
What are you talking about?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iytKSZ9oAUw
"In addition to the extensive single-player campaign, solo maps and skirmishes let you play against the game's expert AI." - Ivan

Bitula said:
Why should Limbic hire QT.


http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=41345&PID=1321053#focus
"We all know the pain we felt upon the release of H5 (hell, it was one of the main reasons I stopped playing), and we don't want to put people through that again." - Oakwarrior

http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=40444&PID=1342442#focus
"TBS (Turn based Strat) AI is much harder to programmer than say Call of Duties AI (FPS)" - gomaki

http://www.bonddisc.com/ref/h5/diary.htm
"Those people who know a bit about this work will understand that you can't simply commission it. I am confident that a team of top programmers at Blizzard or Valve could come up with a fairly well developed non-cheating AI for any game if they put their minds to it, but developing a universal and capable AI that truly understands a strategic situation and acts according to a plan it has arrived at itself is an entirely different beast. Such a task requires vision and skills, ultimately being prepared to learn whatever it takes, on a level that only comes with true dedication. No amount of money can buy this." - Quantomas

http://www.bonddisc.com/ref/h5/diary.htm
"In crunch mode I am ten times faster than your regular programmer. Add to it the fact that I know every bit of the code whereas a team would somehow need to partition the tasks, and you can imagine how long this work would regularly take." - Quantomas

http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=37212&PID=1047724#focus
"If they approach Quantomas and he agrees to implement his work the AI will be the best in the series (and will adapt to revised gameplay and new features, no less). If the developers don't want to hire Quantomas, then they should leave their AI as it is rather than wasting valuable time trying to fix it by themselves." - Cepheus

http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=40444&PID=1342480#focus
The facts are speaking for themselves here, and they say that the game isn't well-received. That's one thing. The much more worrying thing, however, is, that you obviously didn't see it coming, even though you were warned left and right. Even about the AI and how much sense it would make to try and get Quantomas on board." - Jolly Joker

Bitula said:
And again, why do you think QT can or even wants to work for limbic?


http://www.bonddisc.com/ref/h5/ai.htm
Our AI components are available for licensing. What you get is a proven AI to drive your game in a short time frame." - Quantomas

http://www.bonddisc.com/ref/h5/diary.htm
"There is the hope that we can get development studios interested in using our AI. We can offer a very fast, highly optimized and truly advanced AI that can be used to drive games in a short time frame of a couple months. This is equally true for existing ones as newly developed games." - Quantomas

Bitula said:
I am not even sure he is in Germany.


http://www.celestialheavens.com/forum/2/14124?p=343924#p343924
"And yes, the information provided at Quantomas' website is pretty technical stuff indeed. Which isn't surprising taking into account that the Heroes V AI mod is developed by a German computer expert who has lots of experience in providing different AI tools and models for taking the AI development for H5 into the next level. In fact Quantomas will be producing a full fledged AI of his own for use in games other than Heroes V as well." - Yurian Stonebow

Bitula said:
The only thing which would make sense, if QT himself applied for the job. Did he? I think, he didnít.


http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=36851&PID=1036919#focus
"There were many chances for the producer of H6 to get me on board but apparently they just chose the stance that their contractor will do it. I always felt that this is totally foolhardy to have H6 developed by an unproven developer (their previous titles were at best B) and not having a reasonable control of the production process. Normally you need a good producer, an excellent lead programmer and for a TBS of this complexity a world class AI programmer. The worst thing for me is really to see that my professional assessment of the situation has been proven entirely correct. It's like a bizarre joke, to have been right and see a completely undesirable result for all come to pass." - Quantomas

http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=36851&PID=1037007#focus
"Erwan on the other hand completely ignored what we had. Technically, all it required was an Ok and to set the patching process in motion. ... Ubisoft and the Heroes franchise only stand to gain from this, I didn't ask them for money, only for a license." - Quantomas

http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=35526&PID=1009811#focus
"We did make an attempt to have Quantomas' patch integrated in H6 but unfortunately the typical conglomerate bureaucracy got in the way (which is no discredit to the Ubisofter working on the game whom I approached, who gave me their time and was extremely receptive to the idea). I'm not willing to forsake the game or anything because the release AI has deficiencies, but it is certainly a major pity that we couldn't push its strategic potential to the limit from the get-go." - Cepheus

http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=36851&PID=1036149#focus
"The fact that Quantomas is practically shunned by Ubisoft says everything for its dysfunctionality in one respect or another, doubly so since he possesses the vision to elevate HoMM as well as the skills. When a person with the rights to one of the best gaming AI processes in modern times falls out of the sky and knocks on your window, tells you he can implement it in a week and asks only pittance or a license in return..." - Cepheus

Bitula said:
And I donít think he rewrited his AI from scratch, please quote where he is claiming it.


http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=34594
"This AI mod is a full rewrite of the AI inspired by the spirit of H3 and the chess computer program Fritz that has proven that a computer AI can be a match for world champions." - Quantomas

http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=34594&PID=928685#focus
"It's a completely rewritten AI. It implements its own ultrafast pathfinder and as such is capable of evaluating magnitudes in order more possible paths the AI heroes can take. It has technically a lookahead depth of seven days (turns), compared to something like three days for the original one." - Quantomas

http://www.bonddisc.com/ref/h5/ai.htm
"This part of the project is a full rewrite of the AI inspired by the spirit of H3. It is meant to give the strategic gameplay of H5 a boost by playing against dedicated AI opponents who know the ropes. This AI does not cheat, on higher difficulty levels the only advantage it has is the lower starting resources for the player." - Quantomas

http://www.bonddisc.com/ref/h5/diary.htm
"You might have noted that I never confirmed that I have access to the original sources. We have to respect that it is Ubisoft's property, and that they make the rules. ... Regarding the AI source things are different and that is where the benefit for me is. Of course I have full access to the AI source code because I developed it." - Quantomas

Bitula said:
A license from UBI to make additions to H5.


http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=40444&pagenumber=1283
"lol" - Verriker
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magnomagus
magnomagus


Honorable
Legendary Hero
modding wizard
posted December 16, 2015 12:39 PM

@Bitula: Qt wanted to start a new indie project to add new factions and campaigns, so i think he only had permission to improve the AI and small gamemechanics fixes.

For reasons I can only guess, maybe Ubisoft feared to much competition from H5 for H6/H7 to be successful.
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kiryu133
kiryu133


Responsible
Legendary Hero
Highly illogical
posted December 16, 2015 12:43 PM

Goddamn it, verriker, you got that snow on standby or something?!

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EnergyZ
EnergyZ


Legendary Hero
President of MM Wiki
posted December 16, 2015 12:51 PM

Oooh, flashbacks.

But yes, there is little to argue here, the evidence is clearly presented.

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Stevie
Stevie


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
posted December 16, 2015 12:54 PM
Edited by Stevie at 12:55, 16 Dec 2015.

Informed people know. Uninformed people doubt.

Seriously Bitula, if you try finding yet more excuses to cast a shadow of doubt on what represents common knowledge even after Encyclopedia Verrikera exposed to you all the relevant links and quotes, then surely you must be incredibly biased or worse, promoting someone's agenda.
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EnergyZ
EnergyZ


Legendary Hero
President of MM Wiki
posted December 16, 2015 12:59 PM

magnomagus said:

For reasons I can only guess, maybe Ubisoft feared to much competition from H5 for H6/H7 to be successful.


But Heroes V is already well-received, Heroes VI and VII aren't that well. It wouldn't just make sense to make a sequel (or prequel, considering the timeline) that is just inferior. Unless it is a game only for devs' amusment, right?
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Bitula
Bitula


Known Hero
posted December 16, 2015 01:01 PM

verriker said:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iytKSZ9oAUw
"In addition to the extensive single-player campaign, solo maps and skirmishes let you play against the game's expert AI." - Ivan



OK. Thanks for the info (some answered my questions). But why should Limbic hire QT was not a historical or moral question, but a pragmatic one. So if you would have a quote where Limbic offered QT a job through UBI or QT applied for a job at Limbic and they rejected, that would answer my question.

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ChrisD1
ChrisD1


Supreme Hero
posted December 16, 2015 01:06 PM

poor bitula... give it up, you are going to regret the minutes you wasted on your replies. it's a shame..
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Bitula
Bitula


Known Hero
posted December 16, 2015 01:12 PM

magnomagus said:
@Bitula: Qt wanted to start a new indie project to add new factions and campaigns, so i think he only had permission to improve the AI and small gamemechanics fixes.

For reasons I can only guess, maybe Ubisoft feared to much competition from H5 for H6/H7 to be successful.


Ah OK. It is clear this way. But if QT started to compete with UBI on commerical level it's no wonder he was not welcome in UBI projects. Didn't know this info. Last time he was just looking for volunteers on his website.

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fuChris
fuChris


Promising
Supreme Hero
Master to the Speed of Light
posted December 16, 2015 02:05 PM

Bitula said:
Ah OK. It is clear this way. But if QT started to compete with UBI on commerical level it's no wonder he was not welcome in UBI projects.

That is the same reasoning as Ubi not wanting to use the Unreal engine because Epic Games is also a competitor. Unreal Tournament is sooo much like HoMM. Not.
A miriad of future TBS games could make use of such an adaptive AI, the fact that Ubi pigheadedly refuses to make use of such opportunities to hire the best(for cheap as well) speaks volumes of the management of this series.

Anyways, the next game will probably be a chinese developed pay-to-win MMO so there is no need to invest in any kind of AI at this point. Besides the already existing one ofc.
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Bitula
Bitula


Known Hero
posted December 16, 2015 02:37 PM

fuChris said:
Bitula said:
Ah OK. It is clear this way. But if QT started to compete with UBI on commerical level it's no wonder he was not welcome in UBI projects.

That is the same reasoning as Ubi not wanting to use the Unreal engine because Epic Games is also a competitor. Unreal Tournament is sooo much like HoMM. Not.
A miriad of future TBS games could make use of such an adaptive AI, the fact that Ubi pigheadedly refuses to make use of such opportunities to hire the best(for cheap as well) speaks volumes of the management of this series.

Anyways, the next game will probably be a chinese developed pay-to-win MMO so there is no need to invest in any kind of AI at this point. Besides the already existing one ofc.


No, I mean the indie project, not his AI product. Btw, I understand him, he didn't have any other choice, because there were no professional volunteers on his website. People don't want to work for free. I volunteered but later stepped back partially because he didn't allow to access the source (informally. lol) and later because he declared that he will abandoned H5 for his own project.

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imid
imid


Hired Hero
posted December 16, 2015 02:39 PM
Edited by imid at 20:50, 16 Dec 2015.

Bitula said:
magnomagus said:
@Bitula: Qt wanted to start a new indie project to add new factions and campaigns, so i think he only had permission to improve the AI and small gamemechanics fixes.

For reasons I can only guess, maybe Ubisoft feared to much competition from H5 for H6/H7 to be successful.


Ah OK. It is clear this way. But if QT started to compete with UBI on commerical level it's no wonder he was not welcome in UBI projects. Didn't know this info. Last time he was just looking for volunteers on his website. [/

Ubilimbic  had all the conditions to provide the best game, QT and his AI + the community+ VIP...

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magnomagus
magnomagus


Honorable
Legendary Hero
modding wizard
posted December 16, 2015 03:01 PM

Quote:
   magnomagus said:
   For reasons I can only guess, maybe Ubisoft feared to much competition from H5 for H6/H7 to be successful.


But Heroes V is already well-received, Heroes VI and VII aren't that well. It wouldn't just make sense to make a sequel (or prequel, considering the timeline) that is just inferior. Unless it is a game only for devs' amusment, right?


Well, it is harder to make a superior sequel if the prequel is constantly being made better. Considering that Quantomas wanted to make a 3rd H5 expansion pack.
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Sleeping_Sun
Sleeping_Sun


Promising
Famous Hero
Townscreen Architect
posted December 16, 2015 03:04 PM

imid said:
Ubilimbic  had all the conditions to provide the best game, QT and his AI + the community+ VIP...Im really upset with these limbic morons with negative IQ.
Please refrain yourself from insulting others. Insults won't accomplish anything...

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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
What if Elvin was female?
posted December 16, 2015 03:26 PM

imid said:
Bitula, whata...f is wrong with you? Ubilimbic  had all the conditions to provide the best game, QT and his AI + the community+ VIP...Im really upset with these limbic morons with negative IQ.

I'll have to ask that you remove the insulting part, it is against the code of conduct.
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LukaOo
LukaOo


Hired Hero
posted December 16, 2015 04:13 PM
Edited by LukaOo at 16:15, 16 Dec 2015.

Quote:
Limbic Entertainment is seeking a talented and experienced Senior Unreal Programmer (m/f) for an unannounced Unreal 4 project.
http://www.limbic-entertainment.de/en/jobs/senior-programmer

Will it H8?

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Stevie
Stevie


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
posted December 16, 2015 04:18 PM
Edited by Stevie at 16:19, 16 Dec 2015.

It will not H8. Not while this derelict H7 is still around.
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Avirosb
Avirosb


Promising
Legendary Hero
No longer on vacation
posted December 16, 2015 05:18 PM

Dark Messiah of Might and Magic 2 Tournament

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EnergyZ
EnergyZ


Legendary Hero
President of MM Wiki
posted December 16, 2015 06:42 PM

The way Ubi's going around, they will dismiss the company and hire a new one. Again.

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