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Heroes Community > Heroes 7 - Falcon's Last Flight > Thread: Should Ashan be scraped?
Thread: Should Ashan be scraped? This thread is 42 pages long: 1 10 ... 20 21 22 23 24 ... 30 40 42 · «PREV / NEXT»
markkur
markkur


Responsible
Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
posted April 03, 2015 04:38 PM

Elvin said:
That's just sad. That the system promotes this kind of behaviour or the fact that anyone would consider cheating as part of any means necessary.


I'm a serious skeptic these days and probably too much so but my interest in the details died immediately with the faction voting. Time will tell but knowing how strong (and differently) folks feel about their "favored factions" to see four factions (supposedly)up for grabs, pointed to nasty arguments from the onset.

I said "supposedly" because what company in their right mind would ask part of their loyal fan-base to quarrel and LOSE?

I could be wrong but the whole voting thing seemed to me, plain old "advertising" to generate any sort of attention possible. Btw, I expect both the loser-factions to show in future releases.

Since I've bothered to say anything at all I might as well add that I'm only looking forward to trying the mechanics of the next game and just settling for whatever the game looks like, etc. I'm one of the oddballs I guess, because I preferred H2,3 and 5 but wanted something grander than all of them combined. With the "favored-world" division I guess that is not possible. But I could care less...give me an awesome game first and then explain it the best you can and leave it be.

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alcibiades
alcibiades


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
posted April 03, 2015 10:01 PM

Sligneris said:
I was talking about the more recent situation. I mean, have you seen ChaosAvatar lately? Or Jeremiah for that matter?

No, these two are now completely gone, but when Galaad becomes one of the blog's problems, he has hardly any right to complain about its atmosphere.

I think the discussion about what members act in what way on another forum than this is sufficiantly off topic and sufficiantly personal subjects also to not be discussed here, so please leave this topic off and return to discussing the game.
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Sligneris
Sligneris


Supreme Hero
posted April 03, 2015 10:14 PM

Yup, I feel so to. I thought it was strange of Galaad to bring up Shadow Council in the first place.

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GenyaArikado
GenyaArikado


Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
posted April 03, 2015 10:16 PM

Why dont you go and say that at the H7 thread aka "What is a creative director"?

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Galaad
Galaad

Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
posted April 03, 2015 10:35 PM

Sligneris said:
Yup, I feel so to. I thought it was strange of Galaad to bring up Shadow Council in the first place.

It is not strange at all. It is IMO the reasonable explanation of the mess which is going around this game development process, I could have brought up the SC in this thread without replying to you, and I noticed I didn't quote you properly, so I've edited it to avoid anymore confusion. And I was kind enough trying to reply you on the off-topic situation.

I have always thought Ashan is responsible for all that is wrong with the franchise. As I link it to business and marketing, but maybe you could actually take the time to read my posts before jumping to conclusion.

I would appreciate it if you could stop mentioning my name in your posts, thank you.
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Minion
Minion


Legendary Hero
posted April 03, 2015 10:38 PM

You know Galaad is mad when he adds "thank you" to his post
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Kimarous
Kimarous


Supreme Hero
posted April 04, 2015 02:49 AM
Edited by Kimarous at 02:50, 04 Apr 2015.

What really rustles me about the Heroes community is this mentality of "the way things should be". That Necropolis "should" be this, that lich "should" be this, that the whole setting "should" be this. He was handed a franchise in a tattered state and, rather than wasting his time trying to scramble together multiple people from across the globe in the hopes that they might make make a coherent enough whole to pick up things from where they left off, they went the logical route and rebooted with their own interpretation. What many of you guys want is completely unreasonable. I dare say it, that's how I'd describe this entire community: unreasonable. At times I wonder if Ashan might have done better if Heroes had started out with that setting to begin with, but I get the impression that you guys would be gnashing your teeth at every atypical creative direction they'd take anyways. To snow with creativity, right?

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verriker
verriker


Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
posted April 04, 2015 03:55 AM

Kimarous said:
What really rustles me about the Heroes community is this mentality of "the way things should be". That Necropolis "should" be this, that lich "should" be this, that the whole setting "should" be this. He was handed a franchise in a tattered state and, rather than wasting his time trying to scramble together multiple people from across the globe in the hopes that they might make make a coherent enough whole to pick up things from where they left off, they went the logical route and rebooted with their own interpretation. What many of you guys want is completely unreasonable. I dare say it, that's how I'd describe this entire community: unreasonable. At times I wonder if Ashan might have done better if Heroes had started out with that setting to begin with, but I get the impression that you guys would be gnashing your teeth at every atypical creative direction they'd take anyways. To snow with creativity, right?


burn Ashan in flames mate, the complaints are reasonable because it was a silly decision, unnecessarily creating even more work for an overburdened team in the middle of a project which resulted in a completely confused, incoherent mess nobody is able to defend, and still hasn't yielded anything too special in successive games according to the poll here

for Erwin to not bother his arse to look into the options for doing right by 20 years of continuity was simply lazy and/or opportunistic, he jumped into the director's seat when asked without even checking whether more qualified individuals out there may be interested, just conveniently assumed they wouldn't

said it himself, even knowing there were fans out there with encyclopedic minds and potential contacts such as Chris Vanover, Jen Bullard, Terry Ray, Tim Lang who worked at Nival and was actively pitching games in the old universe lol, he still made the call to junk everything,

basically he's turned Might and Magic into his own vanity project, and I have no sympathy for that so forgive me if I rustle you lol

Ashan wasn't the setting Heroes started with and never would have been, JVC conceived the Heroes formula and the worlds he built for it were Enroth and Axeoth, so with no question of that ever even happening, you might as well ask what if humanity had evolved on Pluto instead of Earth lol
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Kimarous
Kimarous


Supreme Hero
posted April 04, 2015 08:07 AM

verriker said:
burn Ashan in flames mate, the complaints are reasonable because it was a silly decision, unnecessarily creating even more work for an overburdened team in the middle of a project which resulted in a completely confused, incoherent mess nobody is able to defend

As if the old universe was any more coherent.

I'm done with this idiocy. Snow the Heroes community. I'm leaving for good this time.

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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
What if Elvin was female?
posted April 04, 2015 10:30 AM

It's not that simple kimarous. When you take over a franchise you should also know its community or at least make an effort to reach them. This is your target after all, you want them to like it enough that they buy it. I think it is clear enough that the ubi creative team did not know their community all that well and that is what is causing the complaints. Fans will always complain as you can't please everyone but we are talking about some really messed up decisions here.

For me it's as simple as that - The more people you disappoint, the more things you did wrong.
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Kimarous
Kimarous


Supreme Hero
posted April 04, 2015 10:55 AM - penalty applied by Elvin on 04 Apr 2015.
Edited by Kimarous at 10:56, 04 Apr 2015.

Elvin said:
It's not that simple kimarous.

For me it's as simple as that - The more people you disappoint, the more things you did wrong.

> Claims it's not simple (what "it" is, I don't know)
> Explains simplistic reason to justify dislike

Look, I'm leaving. Don't reply. I hate this entire community and I'm leaving for good - I have enough stress in my life without the frustration of this cesspit of hypocrites, whiners, and hate-mongers.

Good riddance to the lot of you.

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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
What if Elvin was female?
posted April 04, 2015 12:12 PM

What is simplistic is calling the community what you did for complaining. Many complaints are valid and I consider it ubisoft's responsibility for failing to see whatthey did. Or did not do. This is a series with a legacy that has often been overlooked and people have developed certain expectations and standards over the years. So seeing the community as a bunch of self-entitled whiners is only a small part of the greater picture.

It would have been a different matter if ubi created the same games under a different series. But what it comes down to is that decisions that divide the community are bad for their community as well as their pockets.
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Greenlore
Greenlore


Known Hero
posted April 04, 2015 12:57 PM

Overall this forum is just a small part of the community.

I mean just look at the poll results for the lich and vampire designs.

Here on this forum the undead sorceror got the most votes(he even got more than half of the votes) because he looks the most like the classic lich from the other heroes games,but in the official poll the undead sorceror got the least votes,in fact that undead priest who got the least votes on this forum got the most votes in the official poll.

Even better I've seen people arguing that the undead priest should be in HVII because of the religious aspects of the H7 necropolis,so while people on this forum complain all day,many others have no problem with the ashan version of H7 and actually wanted the developers to go more into that direction.


Vampire was also a lot more even in the official poll than it was here,where the blood monster got 70% of the votes.

In the end I get the impression that the people who are so strictly against ashan are simply a very Vocal minority of the overall fanbase.

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Sandro400
Sandro400


Promising
Supreme Hero
Shadow of Death
posted April 04, 2015 01:17 PM

Here we go - one more sane and reasonable man on these forums. Good
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lokdron
lokdron


Famous Hero
posted April 04, 2015 01:22 PM
Edited by lokdron at 13:23, 04 Apr 2015.

I have to slightly agree with Kim here Elvin its the reason why I started to post less on this forum.

Heck green is somewhat on the mark since when I go around the net quite a lot of people like HV a lot hell Marzhin said he was surprised when fans tell him they liked H6.

I think this forum underestimate how many people like Ashan the various votes on the main website kinda proves it in my opinion. So I agree with Green.

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Zombi_Wizzard
Zombi_Wizzard


Famous Hero
posted April 04, 2015 01:45 PM

@Elvin:

If Ubi would create same games with diferent title, a lot of people would complain how it rips off HoMM, since gameplay is almost identical. And if that would happen, you are in situation where HoMM does not exist anymore, but this new game replaces it. Let's call it for example ... Heroes of Ashan.

Now my question to you - Would you buy and play Heroes of Ashan (that is identical to HoMM 7), if HoMM series does not exist anymore?  If the answer is yes, then why? and if the answer is no ... then why buy HoMM 7?

"But HoMM series would not die - another company would buy it, and continue it's legacy, and ..." NO. That would not happen, or atleast the chances are prety slim. Here is why. Ubisoft created Heroes of Ashan, and would not want another company to copy it's gameplay. The gameplay would need to be quite diferent, as it's the gameplay that determines the game. Second thing to consider. Would another company besides Ubisoft even be interasted? And if so which one ... let's see... EA?! Would you trust HoMM series to EA? I wouldn't. As much as you hate Ashan ... remember that it can always be worse.
Aha, what about small indie company? Well they would create tablet version or facebook version of HoMM. Good luck.

But still ... what about if they do a game and alter the gameplay enough to be similar to HoMM, witouth actualy being HoMM? Disciples? Endless Legend? Warlock: Master of Arcane? Age of Wonders?  Erador? King's Bounty? yea ... those exist, and some are prety darn good. There's no reason HoMM to exist anymore. Simple as that.

And what would (old) HoMM fans do if the HoMM 4 would be the last in the series? Well ... play HoMM 1-4 or move on to play another game. The exact same choices they we have now. Noone is obliged to buy Ubisoft titles. It's also not exactly a secret, that Ubi titles are based on Ashan, and that old universe is ... how to gently put it ... DEAD! So why bother with new one?

So in short, there's not realy much of a diference if you call new game HoMM 7, or something else, the same options of playing or not playing are open to you. If another company would buy HoMM series it's as likely that it would be even worse, than it is that it would be better, provided any company would be willing to buy it at all. You are fan of Enroth? Well good, I'm a fan of Dirty Harry ... we are both in the same boat - those are the things of the past, and are not here anymore. Besides ... this question has already been answered, by UBI itself ... This is not Heroes of Might and Magic 7 AT ALL. It's Might and Magic: Heroes 7. It's diferent title. So there you go.

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Sligneris
Sligneris


Supreme Hero
posted April 04, 2015 01:50 PM

Frankly, Kimarous simply said aloud what I was thinking for a looong time. I even considered leaving this community for this reason as well, which I only didn't do because of some discussions related precisely to Ashan, like in the lore thread.

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War-overlord
War-overlord


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
posted April 04, 2015 02:09 PM

Sligneris said:
Frankly, Kimarous simply said aloud what I was thinking for a looong time. I even considered leaving this community for this reason as well, which I only didn't do because of some discussions related precisely to Ashan, like in the lore thread.

Same here. Having a few friends around stopped me, yet.
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ChrisD1
ChrisD1


Supreme Hero
posted April 04, 2015 02:18 PM

wow you got to kimarous guys... this community acts like it's THE HEROES COMMUNITY.  no room for a different opinion, or even partial dislike about "all-that-is-holy-heroesIII". and that's why i post less now too.
the numbers of fans in this page (also old fans) is way way way way way way way way way less than the fans that ubisoft is trying to attract, so they can actually take this game to the mainstream.
to achieve that of course they have to get on with today's trends.

how is that so difficult to grasp?
it's sad i know, but persons much younger than us are now the hot target group. they have to appeal to their sense of taste first. marketing yo...
as for the topic i think ashan is wrongfully connected to the H6 fiasco.
where are all the threads about no retaliation, or death cloud?  heroes' specializations? remember them? when they were not generic?
or crearure unique passives? where is all the rant about that?
but yeah lets obstruct devs by asking trivial stuff over time.even if the litch looked like lindsay lohan,i wouldn't mind if it had the death cloud ability.

you people have to understand smth: let ashan take its course. it will go away much much faster. don't interfere with aesthetics and lore. you are making it worse. less coherent.

ashan could be something new. why obstruct its course with old stuff(always talking about presentation)? you are making it so much worse trying to fit in stuff that don't fit because it reminds you good times in the 90s!!(looking at you dungeon line up).

don't lets us be a joke of a gaming community, driving away normal people and raising the ranks of  galaad or extremely stubborn people here. i enjoy heroes iii too(gonna play right now) but i welcome new things. lets focus to the gameplay please.

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verriker
verriker


Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
posted April 04, 2015 02:27 PM

jeez, I don't know why some of you guys get yourselves so angry and frustrated over my posts, after all they're just opinions
by all means, more power to those of you who do enjoy Ashan, you should be enjoying its time in the limelight while it lasts lol
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