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Kimarous
Supreme Hero
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posted October 09, 2014 12:05 AM |
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DarkLord said:
Inferno H5 vs Inferno H6
whats better?
Can't really say for gameplay, but aesthetically, H6. Only thing that needs changing in my opinion is elimination of those stupid-looking organic walls.
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DarkLord
Supreme Hero
Fear me..
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posted October 09, 2014 12:14 AM |
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Edited by DarkLord at 00:17, 09 Oct 2014.
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Kimarous said:
DarkLord said:
Inferno H5 vs Inferno H6
whats better?
Can't really say for gameplay, but aesthetically, H6. Only thing that needs changing in my opinion is elimination of those stupid-looking organic walls.
i liked Inferno in H5
and hated in H6
thats why inferno in H7 is not an option for me (i believe it will be more similar to H6 direction)
however i liked Stronghold a lot in H6, too bad the game was poor
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dark_magician
Tavern Dweller
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posted October 09, 2014 12:49 AM |
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well first of all I am new to this community and dont know exactly how I have to send replies, though hope this works
that said, voted for dungeon due to lore issues, I mean since eclipse is over and such, what would demons do on ashan right now?
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xerox
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
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posted October 09, 2014 12:57 AM |
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I hate the sort of organic approach they took with H6.
My favourite looking Inferno is the imperial-looking H3 Inferno.
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cleglaw
Famous Hero
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posted October 09, 2014 01:01 AM |
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Edited by cleglaw at 01:02, 09 Oct 2014.
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dark_magician said:
well first of all I am new to this community and dont know exactly how I have to send replies, though hope this works
that said, voted for dungeon due to lore issues, I mean since eclipse is over and such, what would demons do on ashan right now?
"Marzhin93 October 08, 2014 17:31:31
Important reminder: if Inferno wins, the Inferno campaign will NOT be about a Bloodmoon Eclipse invasion, but won't be set solely in Sheogh either 
Speaking about Bloodmoon Eclipses, there's actually one in the real world TODAY! Could it be a sign from Urgash?  "
a fresh, new point of view for inferno in game, something different and cool waiting us. nobody knows what will it be, its kind of a suprise. if you like inferno, you should change your vote. story was all time about blood eclipses, this is inferno's first chance to acctualy have something interesting.
about replying someone: on the bottom of every massage you can see "quote reply" you can post like me if you click it.
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RMZ1989
Supreme Hero
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posted October 09, 2014 01:55 AM |
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Edited by RMZ1989 at 01:56, 09 Oct 2014.
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DarkLord said:
Kimarous said:
DarkLord said:
Inferno H5 vs Inferno H6
whats better?
Can't really say for gameplay, but aesthetically, H6. Only thing that needs changing in my opinion is elimination of those stupid-looking organic walls.
i liked Inferno in H5
and hated in H6
thats why inferno in H7 is not an option for me (i believe it will be more similar to H6 direction)
however i liked Stronghold a lot in H6, too bad the game was poor
I liked Inferno in all three games(H3, H5 and H6, H4 doesn't count), but they had their good and bad sides.
The thing I dislike in H3 Inferno is that most of them are just humanoids. They are a lot closer to some possessed Cultists/Heretics than to the real Demons, or at least how I picture Demons in my head.
H5 Inferno was the best for me, great units, liked their models as well, their abilities and their playstyle. The game itself did look a bit cartoony in comparison to the H6 and H3, but I like it anyway.
H6 Inferno was a bit new, and some units were ok while some are quite stereotypical. Pit Lords were just amazing, Breeders were cool and unique but other units such as Demented, Ravagers and Tormentors were not that interesting to me when it comes down to their look. They were also too much red for my taste, but I liked their brutal approach, at least more brutal than in previous games.
Overall, I like H5 Inferno the most, but that also has something to do with the game(since H5 was my favorite in the series by far). Not just units, but heroes, skill wheel of the Demon Lord, some special abilities, gating, alternative upgrades etc.
I would really love to see something close to H5 lineup being implemented in H7.
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Give a man a mask, and he'll
become his true self.
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted October 09, 2014 07:24 AM |
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The question is, whether the Inferno makes sense as a faction in HoMM 7, and that's something I don't see. It doesn't matter whether someone pulls a rabbit out of a hat that allows Inferno to be played against at least some of the other factions in a non-eclipse-related setting, the question is whether the "current" Inferno has a place to be played regularly in the standard game within the constraints of the role they have in that time.
And the answer to that question is no.
It's a destructive force like a plague and should be left out of the picture until that changes.
And don't get me wrong here, I've been a sucker for that faction as soon as I had tried the new H3 factions Inferno and Fortress - and there wasn't a problem with HoMM 5 either, INTRODUCING them this way, but the unfortunate idea of coming up with prequels all the time now instead of focusing on advancing and promoting the story into something different makes the Inferno redundant.
That's, by the way, one reason why I'm so pissed about the fact that this game will be a prequel yet again.
It doesn't feel like a new HoMM game somehow.
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ChrisD1
Supreme Hero
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posted October 09, 2014 09:54 AM |
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Edited by ChrisD1 at 09:55, 09 Oct 2014.
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RMZ1989 said:
I would really love to see something close to H5 lineup being implemented in H7.
Avonu is extremely sure that they will re-use H6 artwork so we will have to take his word for it and vote for dungeon instead.(NOT!)
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted October 09, 2014 10:02 AM |
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Edited by Stevie at 10:06, 09 Oct 2014.
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Haha, that was such a biased answer coming from such a biased person. Like, really biased and not even a shred of analysis or anything, just "the question is ... and the answer is no". Wow, so compelling I almost yawned.
Quote:
The question is, whether the Inferno makes sense as a faction in HoMM 7, and that's something I don't see.
Well, the devs see it, a big chunk of the fanbase sees it, I see it... So my guess is that the problem with you.
Quote:
It doesn't matter whether someone pulls a rabbit out of a hat that allows Inferno to be played against at least some of the other factions in a non-eclipse-related setting, the question is whether the "current" Inferno has a place to be played regularly in the standard game within the constraints of the role they have in that time.
It certainly mattered when there was no explanation for Demons in Ashan. Now that we know of at least 1 or 2 explanations, it doesn't matter anymore. And just by the construction of the phrase, "it doesn't matter that they fixed the constraints, it matters if it can be played within those constrains". What? Self serving statements by pointing to a "problem" that has already been fixed.
Quote:
And the answer to that question is no.
And the answer to that question is yes. Inferno has a place in the game. Just like every other faction from the total of 9.
Quote:
It's a destructive force like a plague and should be left out of the picture until that changes.
It's a destructive force like any other faction in the game if you really think about it. The nature of their destruction is different, their motives for destruction are different - but how do you want that to change, as you have claimed you don't like it, if you don't give it the chance to? And especially that we know for a fact that they will have a different approach and story in the absence of an Eclipse? Maybe you didn't even read the part about how they value their own existence too from the blog entry? If you think that they turn berserk mode immediately after they set foot in Ashan, then that just shows us all what a terrible knowledge about demons you have.
Quote:
And don't get me wrong here, I've been a sucker for that faction as soon as I had tried the new H3 factions Inferno and Fortress - and there wasn't a problem with HoMM 5 either, INTRODUCING them this way, but the unfortunate idea of coming up with prequels all the time now instead of focusing on advancing and promoting the story into something different makes the Inferno redundant.
So why is it the faction's fault? That's just story writing entirely and you could say that in the case of every faction if you happened to not like its story, but you just wanted to single out Inferno didn't you? It's not a problem with Inferno per se, it's a lore problem at best.
Quote:
That's, by the way, one reason why I'm so pissed about the fact that this game will be a prequel yet again.
It doesn't feel like a new HoMM game somehow.
Incidentally, I agree, but I'm not opposed to it just because it's a prequel. There's nothing that makes me think that prequels are automatically bad, that's ridiculous. What I might be concerned about is its writer, but with Marzhin, Xavier and the others from Limbic which have proven themselves before, with H6 expansion packs and MMX, I don't see why I should be worried.
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cleglaw
Famous Hero
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posted October 09, 2014 10:47 AM |
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Edited by cleglaw at 10:47, 09 Oct 2014.
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@stevie
agreed with every word.
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted October 09, 2014 11:12 AM |
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Little Stevie on the hunt again.Stevie said:
Haha, that was such a biased answer coming from such a biased person. Like, really biased and not even a shred of analysis or anything, just "the question is ... and the answer is no". Wow, so compelling I almost yawned.
And that's of course a compelling reason for a really long answer. Which is why
Quote:
Quote:
The question is, whether the Inferno makes sense as a faction in HoMM 7, and that's something I don't see.
Well, the devs see it, a big chunk of the fanbase sees it, I see it... So my guess is that the problem with you.
I think, when it comes to "sense" I trust myself more than you OR the fanbase.
Another example:
Quote:
Quote:
It doesn't matter whether someone pulls a rabbit out of a hat that allows Inferno to be played against at least some of the other factions in a non-eclipse-related setting, the question is whether the "current" Inferno has a place to be played regularly in the standard game within the constraints of the role they have in that time.
It certainly mattered when there was no explanation for Demons in Ashan. Now that we know of at least 1 or 2 explanations, it doesn't matter anymore. And just by the construction of the phrase, "it doesn't matter that they fixed the constraints, it matters if it can be played within those constrains". What? Self serving statements by pointing to a "problem" that has already been fixed.
If "consuming large quantities of Dragonblood Crystals" is one of the two rabbits they pulled out of their hats is "fixing a problem" for you, then "sense" seems indeed be missing: wouldn't you say, that THIS explanation would mean, that IF you start to play an Inferno town (on Ashan) - that is, regular play - you'd need to "consume" (that is, WASTE) a lot of Crystals, playing? In game terms, this might mean a lot of things, but the most simple would be a Crystal resource need for EVERY SINGLE BUILDING (and a hefty one at that).
Of course, you COULD make Inferno work on that assumption - for example, by making them insanely Crystal-expensive, but also insanely powerful (that might even be interesting), so - logically - Inferno would basically be unable to get very far on a crystal-poor map, but get to strength on a crystal-rich map - but in this setting, this would obviously be EXPANSION material, since the faction would be inherently - but also logically - IMBA; not, that a 500 HP Archdemon costing 50 Crystals to build and 5 to hire wouldn't be a lot more fun than your regular run-of-the-mill mindless destruction freak show you seem to be so fond of.
The other explanation would be that "a Wizard calls them thereby losing his soul" - so every time you play Inferno, you were actually called by a - incredibly stupid - Wizard? Fun-tastic.
And excuse me, if I don't fall for that:Quote:
And especially that we know for a fact that they will have a different approach and story in the absence of an Eclipse? Maybe you didn't even read the part about how they value their own existence too from the blog entry? If you think that they turn berserk mode immediately after they set foot in Ashan, then that just shows us all what a terrible knowledge about demons you have.
A campaign "not exclusively taking place in Sheogh", isn't actually that reassuring.
Also, there is little trick called "respawning" - which is only fair considering things like Resurrection, spider venom, Necromancy and all that fancy stuff. Don't you remember the little rhyme one of Kiril's nice Succubus playthings had for him? "Roll the dice of destiny as if you cannot die. Leave your fate to Urgash the day your luck runs dry." It's all just a turn of Urgash's wheel of fortune...
Quote:
I don't see why I should be worried.
What? Me worry? There is always HoMM 5 RPE to play - or HoMM 3 or AoW 3 or Disciples 2 OR...
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ChrisD1
Supreme Hero
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posted October 09, 2014 11:15 AM |
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in the end everyone will like what they will like. but every once in a while you can be a little less... persistent and try to see the other person's point of view. even i partially agreed with war overlord on minotaurs although it's the last thing i want to see in dungeon, even more than black dragons to be honest.
but let me guess your opinion is superior in some way... oh well..
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cleglaw
Famous Hero
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posted October 09, 2014 11:49 AM |
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Edited by cleglaw at 11:52, 09 Oct 2014.
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-Of course, you COULD make Inferno work on that assumption - for example, by making them insanely Crystal-expensive, but also insanely powerful (that might even be interesting), so - logically - Inferno would basically be unable to get very far on a crystal-poor map, but get to strength on a crystal-rich map - but in this setting, this would obviously be EXPANSION material, since the faction would be inherently - but also logically - IMBA; not, that a 500 HP Archdemon costing 50 Crystals to build and 5 to hire wouldn't be a lot more fun than your regular run-of-the-mill mindless destruction freak show you seem to be so fond of.
-resulting in zero unit loss in every battle.
-incredibly stupid - Wizard?
-need to comment on this?
-A campaign "not exclusively taking place in Sheogh", isn't actually that reassuring.
Also, there is little trick called "respawning" - which is only fair considering things like Resurrection, spider venom, Necromancy and all that fancy stuff. Don't you remember the little rhyme one of Kiril's nice Succubus playthings had for him? "Roll the dice of destiny as if you cannot die. Leave your fate to Urgash the day your luck runs dry." It's all just a turn of Urgash's wheel of fortune...
-powerful demons can preserve their souls and stay in ashan, by various ways, like for example consuming crystals. even this can create a cool story. somehow evertime i see some counter-arguements on inferno's story topic, they are usually lack some imagination.
you dont need to act like a fanatic guy. give it rest with this inferno-hate.
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted October 09, 2014 11:49 AM |
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Quote:
I think, when it comes to "sense" I trust myself more than you OR the fanbase.
Oh, you can trust whatever you want, and you even have a point at that. But add the devs that gave us Inferno as a relevant faction for voting, and you can flush that point down the toilet. Be honest, it's just your preference and not an obviously better choice.
Quote:
If "consuming large quantities of Dragonblood Crystals" is one of the two rabbits they pulled out of their hats is "fixing a problem" for you, then "sense" seems indeed be missing: wouldn't you say, that THIS explanation would mean, that IF you start to play an Inferno town (on Ashan) - that is, regular play - you'd need to "consume" (that is, WASTE) a lot of Crystals, playing? In game terms, this might mean a lot of things, but the most simple would be a Crystal resource need for EVERY SINGLE BUILDING (and a hefty one at that).
Of course, you COULD make Inferno work on that assumption - for example, by making them insanely Crystal-expensive, but also insanely powerful (that might even be interesting), so - logically - Inferno would basically be unable to get very far on a crystal-poor map, but get to strength on a crystal-rich map - but in this setting, this would obviously be EXPANSION material, since the faction would be inherently - but also logically - IMBA; not, that a 500 HP Archdemon costing 50 Crystals to build and 5 to hire wouldn't be a lot more fun than your regular run-of-the-mill mindless destruction freak show you seem to be so fond of.
The other explanation would be that "a Wizard calls them thereby losing his soul" - so every time you play Inferno, you were actually called by a - incredibly stupid - Wizard? Fun-tastic.
There is no need to restrict gameplay like that. Absolutely no reason for it. The lore is there to offer you an understanding of why you can find demons in Ashan in the absence of an Eclipse. There is no necessity to be implemented as an in-game mechanic too. Even more so when that mechanic would be totally ridiculous.
And no, the second way I had in mind was with Void ripples that can undo magic and reality. But I get it that you wouldn't know that, at least not from the blog description, because that would requires some amount of time invested in playing M&M games...
Quote:
A campaign "not exclusively taking place in Sheogh", isn't actually that reassuring.
Also, there is little trick called "respawning" - which is only fair considering things like Resurrection, spider venom, Necromancy and all that fancy stuff. Don't you remember the little rhyme one of Kiril's nice Succubus playthings had for him? "Roll the dice of destiny as if you cannot die. Leave your fate to Urgash the day your luck runs dry." It's all just a turn of Urgash's wheel of fortune...
It's actually very reassuring, by any stretch of the imagination. It was one of the main arguments against Inferno, but, not surprisingly, those voices don't remember anything about that now that it's been publicly denied.
And yes, I do remember that, but I also see the description on the website. Which do you chose to value more is entirely up to you. I see a lot more substance in what it's said there than in the personal worldview of some minions.
Quote:
What? Me worry? There is always HoMM 5 RPE to play - or HoMM 3 or AoW 3 or Disciples 2 OR...
Well, figured as much. Leave things to those who actually care about Heroes, if that's the amount of commitment you're investing into it.
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DarkLord
Supreme Hero
Fear me..
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posted October 09, 2014 11:50 AM |
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you guys realize that majority of inferno campaign will still take place in Sheogh right?
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted October 09, 2014 11:51 AM |
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DarkLord said:
you guys realize that majority of inferno campaign will still take place in Sheogh right?
Prove it.
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Avonu
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Embracing light and darkness
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posted October 09, 2014 11:53 AM |
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Edited by Avonu at 11:56, 09 Oct 2014.
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ChrisD1 said:
Avonu is extremely sure that they will re-use H6 artwork so we will have to take his word for it and vote for dungeon instead.(NOT!)
I think you have some problems with reading. 
I didn't post any words about artwork. My issue is with reusing in-game H6 models with different skins in H7 and here you have queote why:
Quote:
Another character sheet for Ubisofts upcoming "Heroes of Might & Magic VII". The dimensions may look a little off, as the developers wanted to keep the original 'bones' from the earlier game, so new walk, run and fight cycles weren't required to be created all over again.
All Inferno voters post artworks from Duel of Champions. These are nice and I really would like to see them in H7.
But you don't relize or you don't want to accept that H7 will reuse as much resources as it can from H6 to savemoney. That is why Inferno or Dungeon or even Haven will use models (with different skins) from previous game.
There is no much chance to get new, awasome creatures from DoC, if they can't be done by converting H6 templates. And H6 Inferno design was... not so good.
cleglaw said:
story was all time about blood eclipses, this is inferno's first chance to acctualy have something interesting.
I think you should play Clash of Heroes.
____________
"When someone desires information, they come to me."
"Details are everything."
Pipiru piru piru pipiru pi!
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Avirosb
Promising
Legendary Hero
No longer on vacation
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posted October 09, 2014 11:56 AM |
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I don't see where else it would take place unless there are farfetched magic planes where their chronic life imprsmint don't affect them.
Don't they need vast tons of Magic Fuel(R) to keep a presence in Ashan?
The army upkeep costs would be astronomical.
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted October 09, 2014 11:57 AM |
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Edited by Stevie at 11:58, 09 Oct 2014.
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Quote:
All Inferno voters post artworks from Duel of Champions. These are nice and I really would like to see them in H7.
But you don't relize or you don't want to accept that H7 will reuse as much resources as it can from H6 to savemoney. That is why Inferno or Dungeon or even Haven will use models (with different skins) from previous game.
There is no much chance to get new, awasome creatures from DoC, if they can't be done by converting H6 templates. And H6 Inferno design was... not so good.
Dungeon has the same problem.
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DarkLord
Supreme Hero
Fear me..
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posted October 09, 2014 12:00 PM |
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Edited by DarkLord at 12:04, 09 Oct 2014.
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aslo keep in mind that unit models will be reused
(same as for haven)
meaning a lot of same creatures from Heroes6
for both dungeon and inferno
> assassin, beholder, fury, minotaur, faceless, manticore, black dragon
> maniac, cerberus, succubus, breeder, tormentor, juggernaut, pit lord
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