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Heroes Community > Library of Enlightenment > Thread: Strongest Town & Weakest Town in HOMM3
Thread: Strongest Town & Weakest Town in HOMM3 This thread is 34 pages long: 1 10 20 ... 27 28 29 30 31 ... 34 · «PREV / NEXT»
Anil
Anil


Known Hero
posted June 10, 2016 02:41 AM
Edited by Anil at 02:43, 10 Jun 2016.

I like play with Conflux (Fiur) or Necropolis (Isra) in Big map, I very rarely play with other towns. Your question is very map depends but if i have Conflux, first day i upgrade pixies and I find wood-ore resources. If my tavern have gold specialty or estate skill hero, i get him/her. I always prefer golds from treasuries at first. I prefer this ranking; Town Hall-Mage Guild-Marketplace-Blacksmith-Cith Hall-Citadel-Castle-Town Hall-Resource Silo-lvl2 dwellling-lvl3 dwelling lvl4 dwelling lvl5 dwellinh and pyre. Probably i build pyre in 5.th week.After I build artifact merchant and i look for Boots of speed, Gloves, combine artifact parts.

I think might heroes are better than magic heroes in large maps. But I am not a big fan planeswalkers. But looks like Fiur is best planeswalker. I look for good might heroes (Tazar,Kyre,Crag Hack,Gunnar,Orrin) in my tavern first two week.
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Ebonheart
Ebonheart


Famous Hero
Rush the rush
posted June 10, 2016 08:47 AM
Edited by Ebonheart at 08:48, 10 Jun 2016.

You see Anil, this is why your rankings are so different compared to many others' here on the HC forums, because you are still just doing singleplayer games, and those are 100% different compared to multiplayer. Also if you only play with Conflux and Necropolis, the 2 banned towns, then your view of the other towns will be incomplete.

Your game lasts for 5+ weeks. But a classic online game on a Jebus L/XL map lasts only 2 weeks and 6 days - 4 weeks and 4 days. You also demonstrate the classic rookie move, building town hall, city hall and capitol, marketplace etc. In online games, you never ever do this.
It is good that you look for might heroes but during day 1 you should have 6-8 Heroes on the map total. There's nothing wrong with being new and anyone who slams on you here for that is nothing but pathetic, because we were all noobs at one point in time.

Let's compare your game to how I do on a XL map with Tower. In this example I will be generous and have a barbarian in the tavern, one 7 dwelling on the map along with some 1st dwells and have 2nd dwelling pre-built, I also pretend you do not have any losses vs the map or that you visit any Hives/Conservatories.

Week 1:
Day 1: Build Magi guild. Hire 5-7 Heroes.
Day 2: Build Golem Factory. (Start moving a Hero to the city)
Day 3: Build Mage Tower. (Buy the troops, move a 2nd hero to city)
Day 4: Build Golden Pavilion. (Buy troops, chain the Nagas and Magi to main)
Day 5: Build Altar of Wishes. (Move a hero to town, prepare a chain)
Day 6: Build Cloud Temple. (Buy the giant, move it to the main)
Day 7: Build Citadel.
Week 1 summary: I should have 1 giant, 2 nagas, 4 magi and a stack of gremlins in your army.

Week 2:
Day 1: Upgrade Cloud Temple. (chain giants home, upgrade em. (req trading post)
Day 2: Upgrade Altar of Wishes. (Buy some Master genies)
Day 3: Upgrade Workshop.
Day 4: Upgrade Golden Pavilion. (If you have the right skills, a decent army strength - Push for the treassure zone)
Day 5: Upgrade Golem Factory. (if going for high magic, build magi guild lv 2)
Day 6: Build Castle. (Or Magi Guild 3)
Day 7: Build Library. (Or Magi Guild 4)

Week 2 summary: I should have 5 Titans, 5 Naga Queens, 10 Magi and about 220 Master Gremlins.

Week 3
Day 1: Upgrade Mage Tower. (Or buy Library/Magi Guild 5). Clear a Utopia for gold, use Gargoyles as bait. Buyout troops.
Day 2: Keep digging in the treassure zone.
Day 3: Keep on digging.
Day 4. Your foe just showed up, end battle.
The army should consist of: 8 Titans, 9 Naga Queens, 18 Magi, 300+ Master Gremlins, 27 Iron Golems and some Master Genies.

This example does not provide you with the details on how to do hero-chaining, how to use the troops etc. But it does give you a new perspective of how long a game lasts and how the armies look like.
I suggest you look at some player videos from eg Maretti. See how he plays and notice what he does differently, you will learn a lot.

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Anil
Anil


Known Hero
posted June 10, 2016 04:53 PM

My ranking isn't very different than other Heroes players. I read a lot of subject about of town ranking. Only a few players believe that Conflux is best town. Some players believe Tower,Necropolis,Castle or Dungeon is best town. Best town or towns aren't certain. But i think Conflux and Castle easily the best. Necropolis is overrated i think, Castle can so easy crush to Necropolis. Castle have amazing damage-attack potential + Morale + Resurrection + 2 shooter + More fast Town + Bless/Prayer etc. In normally all towns are doomed to lose agains Castle (except Conflux)
But %95 players believe (also i agree) Stronghold, Fortress and Inferno on bottom tier. Stronghold's low level troops are very weak. Need a lot of crystal, slow town, poor magic poor defense.

Yes I have never tried play with people but I'am sure my town rating list.

How can you uprage Clod temple and buy 5-7 hero without capitol? You need plenty of gem and gold.

Which heroes do you prefer for each town?

Do you try always same tactic?

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted June 10, 2016 05:28 PM

Anil said:
How can you uprage Clod temple and buy 5-7 hero without capitol? You need plenty of gem and gold.


The discussion about capitol yes/no is old as the world. First it was JJ guide which says to buy capitol as soon, for all factions. Of course, multiplayer reality shows that he was dead wrong on almost all aspects, especially about buying capitol. Best defense is attack, maps usually have tons of gold behind monsters, fighting those monsters both levels up your hero and gives you the gold. To fight them you need to constantly produce creatures and be very offensive towards the map.

There is simply no time for capitol in the usual 3 weeks and we're done game.

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Ebonheart
Ebonheart


Famous Hero
Rush the rush
posted June 10, 2016 05:45 PM
Edited by Ebonheart at 20:05, 10 Jun 2016.

Anil said:
My ranking isn't very different than other Heroes players. I read a lot of subject about of town ranking. Only a few players believe that Conflux is best town. Some players believe Tower,Necropolis,Castle or Dungeon is best town. Best town or towns aren't certain. But i think Conflux and Castle easily the best.
Remember that the majority of the single players have never really tried a real multiplayer game, and just like you, their views will be invalid multiplayer wise and if you were to fight any multiplayer experienced person, you would be stomped into the ground.
Anil said:
Necropolis is overrated i think, Castle can so easy crush to Necropolis. Castle have amazing damage-attack potential + Morale + Resurrection + 2 shooter + More fast Town + Bless/Prayer etc. In normally all towns are doomed to lose agains Castle (except Conflux).
The sheer power of Necropolis lies in Necromancy and Vampire Lords/Dread Knights. 1000 Skeletons in W3 is nothing to scoff at.
Anil said:
But %95 players believe (also i agree) Stronghold, Fortress and Inferno on bottom tier. Stronghold's low level troops are very weak. Need a lot of crystal, slow town, poor magic poor defense.
And 95% of those 95% have never even played a multiplayer match. I assure you, ANY town is good vs the AI in a singleplayer game. Stronghold is a very lethal town because of its immense damage potential, and sure goblins and orcs may not be the best, but in a online game they are used fodder or replaced by wyverns/angels anyway.
Anil said:
Yes I have never tried play with people but I'am sure my town rating list.
That is obvious Anil and you are entitled to think and rank towns as you wish personally, but be careful giving advice or ranking for multiplayer, so be sure to state that you only play single player.
Anil said:
How can you uprage Clod temple and buy 5-7 hero without capitol? You need plenty of gem and gold. Which heroes do you prefer for each town? Do you try always same tactic?

Tactics wary between players. My tactic is not based on upgrading to Titans Day 1 Week 2, but rather explore and clean the map in a very agressive manner the first week. This leaves me with plenty of gold and gems needed for the building. In many games, a trading post will remove the need for a gem mine. So unless the map is really hard, I will always have 2-5 titans (depending on map dwelling) in the early days of week 2.

The only "pure tactic" I have is this: Never ever upgrade the Workshop during week 1. It is a very common thing players do believing it will allow them to clear the map better, but the opposite happens. Because Master Gremlins suffers hand to hand penalty, which means offense loses its value and also means less damage since few heroes come with Archery or gets it offered early. By letting Gremlins be Gremlins, they have a full melee damage potential + it means 1 giant/citadel during week 1.

As for heroes, the tactic is always the same no matter what town you play - Attack > Anything else. Which means Barberians and Overlords are your best friends. More attack = More damage, and more damage = less units needed / greater scaling, the more units you have. Not to mention less losses.
Edit: Like Salamandre said, you NEVER EVER buy Capitol. The only time you ever buy Town Hall would be in a 2nd town and given that you have captured it early.

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MeKick
MeKick


Hired Hero
posted June 10, 2016 08:02 PM

Anil said:
Necropolis is overrated i think


lol

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Anil
Anil


Known Hero
posted June 10, 2016 09:03 PM

Ok 1000 skeleton is good but your skeletons have low hp and immune to elixir of life also vulnerable to implosion and archers? This town is slow opposition will almost always get first attack with faster units. Also very weak lvl 2, lvl 3 and lvl 7 ? You have only 1 shooter. You have very big trouble till Vampire Lords and this unit is pretty weak against Tower and Conflux no morale, no bless etc. Necropolis have a lot of disadvantage.


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Ebonheart
Ebonheart


Famous Hero
Rush the rush
posted June 10, 2016 09:25 PM
Edited by Ebonheart at 21:27, 10 Jun 2016.

Anil said:
Ok 1000 skeleton is good but your skeletons have low hp and immune to elixir of life also vulnerable to implosion and archers?
Elixir of life will never come into play. If Archers focus the skeletons it will be 50% less dmg 1st round and if they do focus skeletons then that means the VLs and DKs are safe. Implosion is deadly but, but there are many ways to prevent it or take advantage of the used cast.
Anil said:
This town is slow opposition will almost always get first attack with faster units.
By that logic, Tower and Stronghold would suck, yet they do more than fine. Having the first strike can in many cases be problematic.
Anil said:
Also very weak lvl 2, lvl 3 and lvl 7 ? You have only 1 shooter.
Lv 2 and 3 are converted to skeletons and Wyverns from Hives and Angels from conservatories will take their places. Ghost Dragons are weak, but not useless and the aging is annoying for your enemy when it procs.
Anil said:
You have very big trouble till Vampire Lords and this unit is pretty weak against Tower and Conflux no morale, no bless etc. Necropolis have a lot of disadvantage.
Tower and Conflux are the best towns apart from Necropolis itself, to fight Necropolis. No morale can be bad, but also very good, sure they cannot be blessed, but then again immunity to blind, berserk etc trumphs it.
Once again Anil, you do not play multiplayer so your view of Necropolis is as it is, but there is a reason for why Conflux/Necropolis are banned and until you play online or vs someone who has adapted to multiplayer, you will never understand this.

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Anil
Anil


Known Hero
posted June 12, 2016 02:27 PM
Edited by Anil at 14:53, 12 Jun 2016.

I wonder what is town rating according to the game producers?

I think convert to lvl 2 to skeleton is good idea If your main hero is Galthran. Otherwise not good because zombies are more expensive than skeletons and zombies have good hp.
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Ebonheart
Ebonheart


Famous Hero
Rush the rush
posted June 12, 2016 04:00 PM

Anil said:
I wonder what is town rating according to the game producers?I think convert to lvl 2 to skeleton is good idea If your main hero is Galthran. Otherwise not good because zombies are more expensive than skeletons and zombies have good hp.

Less thinking, more study of my example / Jebus. >.<

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HeymlicH
HeymlicH


Known Hero
posted June 13, 2016 03:03 AM

Ebonheart said:

Week 1:
Day 1: Build Magi guild. Hire 5-7 Heroes.

...

Week 2:
Day 1: Upgrade Cloud Temple. (chain giants home, upgrade em. (req trading post)
Day 2: Upgrade Altar of Wishes. (Buy some Master genies)
Day 3: Upgrade Workshop.
...



That's why easy difficulty sucks - it completely ruins the economy part of the game. Just build a dwelling every day and buy out everything. If you play on imposible, such a build order will be impossible. You would most likely upgrade your gremlins D1, and you will get l7 end of W2 (if you are lucky).

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MeKick
MeKick


Hired Hero
posted June 15, 2016 04:19 AM

HeymlicH said:
Ebonheart said:

Week 1:
Day 1: Build Magi guild. Hire 5-7 Heroes.

...

Week 2:
Day 1: Upgrade Cloud Temple. (chain giants home, upgrade em. (req trading post)
Day 2: Upgrade Altar of Wishes. (Buy some Master genies)
Day 3: Upgrade Workshop.
...



That's why easy difficulty sucks - it completely ruins the economy part of the game. Just build a dwelling every day and buy out everything. If you play on imposible, such a build order will be impossible. You would most likely upgrade your gremlins D1, and you will get l7 end of W2 (if you are lucky).


But Ebonheart was not referring to Easy difficulty at all. As Ebonheart established from the very beginning of his comment, he was speaking in the context of multiplayer -- specifically, on the very popular (and very rich) Jebus Cross template. As it so happens, 160% tends to be the typical difficulty for PvP matches as well and so, from his example, I am led to believe that he was not trying to reference Impossible difficulty.

By my understanding, the point Ebonheart was trying to emphasize was that you would be hard-pressed to find a genuinely skilled Heroes III player who regularly plays multiplayer and attempts to rush Capitol. To do so is to lose enormous tempo on the first week and is one big recipe for disaster in multiplayer.

Having said that, I am also very sure that Ebonheart is aware of the resource struggles in 200% difficulty, but that is not the main focus of his explanation.

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Ebonheart
Ebonheart


Famous Hero
Rush the rush
posted June 15, 2016 08:04 AM
Edited by Ebonheart at 08:05, 15 Jun 2016.

HeymlicH said:
That's why easy difficulty sucks - it completely ruins the economy part of the game. Just build a dwelling every day and buy out everything. If you play on imposible, such a build order will be impossible. You would most likely upgrade your gremlins D1, and you will get l7 end of W2 (if you are lucky).

The difficulty I always play with on Jebus is 130-160% - some cases it is 200%. And I assure you, building like this on impossible is nowhere near impossible, one just tend to get the titans during M1W2D4 instead of M1W1D1/D2.
Mekick said:
But Ebonheart was not referring to Easy difficulty at all. As Ebonheart established from the very beginning of his comment, he was speaking in the context of multiplayer -- specifically, on the very popular (and very rich) Jebus Cross template. As it so happens, 160% tends to be the typical difficulty for PvP matches as well and so, from his example, I am led to believe that he was not trying to reference Impossible difficulty.

Correct, and the difficulty depends on what the rules for the game will be.
Mekick said:
By my understanding, the point Ebonheart was trying to emphasize was that you would be hard-pressed to find a genuinely skilled Heroes III player who regularly plays multiplayer and attempts to rush Capitol. To do so is to lose enormous tempo on the first week and is one big recipe for disaster in multiplayer.
True, although facing off vs a capitol builder tends to mean game over from the start.
Mekick said:
Having said that, I am also very sure that Ebonheart is aware of the resource struggles in 200% difficulty, but that is not the main focus of his explanation.
The resource struggle comes during the first days since you need to aquire at least 5-6 heroes ASAP, which means a heavy gold search. But after that is achieved, it runs on as usual, at least for me.

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Anil
Anil


Known Hero
posted June 21, 2016 12:31 AM

That's my fun rating;

1) Conflux
2) Necropolis
3) Inferno
4) Dungeon
5) Castle
6) Rampart
7) Fortress
8) Stronghold
9) Tower
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Ebonheart
Ebonheart


Famous Hero
Rush the rush
posted June 21, 2016 08:55 AM

Here's my fun rating.
1. WoW vanilla
2. WoW TBC
3. Heroes 3
4. Halo & GoW
5. Golden sun.

No really Anil, start to practise and you will probably discover more fun since you will grow as a player.

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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Supreme Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted June 21, 2016 11:27 AM

Boo!, Ebonheart likes WoW more than Heroes 3.

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Ebonheart
Ebonheart


Famous Hero
Rush the rush
posted June 21, 2016 11:44 AM

phoenix4ever said:
Boo!, Ebonheart likes WoW more than Heroes 3.

^^

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Anil
Anil


Known Hero
posted June 26, 2016 06:38 PM

I like TripleA, Heroes III, Age Of Empires II, Chess.
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Heroes_player
Heroes_player


Known Hero
posted July 03, 2016 04:26 PM

I think Castle is the strongest because every creature in the town is useful which is rare thing among every towns. Just think about Zombies in Necropolis or Dwarved in Rampart. Castle has no such waste units meaning it uses every units effectively! And the weakest is Inferno which is kinda of sad because I liked its evil theme. Yeah I know that Efreets and Arch Devils are awesome and OP but before you get them you just have useless units. I mean that in early game every town has its units or tactics to win first battles without losses. Castle has marksmen, Rampart has  Grand Elves, Tower has chainglight, Stronghold has Rocs, Fortress has Wyverns, Dungeon has Harpy Hags, Necro has Vampires... Inferno? Good luck with imps and gogs, LOL


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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Supreme Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted July 04, 2016 01:27 PM
Edited by phoenix4ever at 13:43, 04 Jul 2016.

The dragons of Rampart and Dungeon all have a big problem with their spell immunities: If enemy has Orb of Vulnerability he can blind or berserk them and you can do nothing about it, except if you have mass dispel. Potentially you could get your strongest stack blinded for 50 rounds, while your other units get destroyed, then finally the enemy will gang up on your dragons and you will fall.

I also think it's a big disadvantage for Stronghold and Fortress with Mage Guild 3, meaning no resurrection or town portal. Especially witches that gets a lot of power and knowledge can't use it for much.
And yes I know you can just take over another town, but that won't work as a scout or town defender and the other towns could have good spells way before Stronghold and Fortress.  It's also why I rate both towns low, even though I love especially Fortress.

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