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Heroes Community > Heroes 5 - Temple of Ashan > Thread: Heroes 5 Strategy: Playing Academy Faction
Thread: Heroes 5 Strategy: Playing Academy Faction This thread is 36 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 ... 10 20 30 ... 32 33 34 35 36 · «PREV / NEXT»
FineAss
FineAss

Tavern Dweller
posted September 15, 2007 06:28 PM

yes that's true but with my like 90% magic immunity and sap magic, the opnly thing that could have changed the tides was empowered meteor shower..which means 48 mana. And my armageddon was in play, meaning -50% defence penalty..so he had to risk. Only way was emp implosion, which turned out to be somehow tricky...
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Velocity
Velocity


Hired Hero
posted October 07, 2007 02:01 PM
Edited by Velocity at 14:03, 07 Oct 2007.

Would this sound a good build? I'm playing against my friend's dwarves.

Hero: Havez

-Because of the Gremlin specialization (more dmg. and def.) and free war machines.

Light Magic: All the basic abilities (Mass haste and divine strenght).

War Machines: Ballista and triple ballista naturally.

Logistics & Leadership: More movement points and more free turns with leadership. I'm going all way up to Aura of Swiftness, these skills also  improve Golems (2 speed, they need it and positive morale bonuses apply).

Attacks: Archery naturally, 3 shooters and one is a level 7 creature. Flaming arrows to boost ballista and Frenzy to boost my gremlins' damage even further.

Mark of the Wizard and Magic mirror.

Anyway I'm bit concerned because of the runes of those blasted dwarves, can my shooters never get a chance to shoot if dwarves can get over the battlefield in one turn? Which one of the castles have better initiative overall?

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Moonlith
Moonlith


Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
If all else fails, use Fiyah!
posted October 07, 2007 02:12 PM
Edited by Moonlith at 14:14, 07 Oct 2007.

I think you're a bit screwed, actually....

Even if Gremlins do a bit more damage, it all fails under the Dwarves' high defense.

I'm not exactly an expert on Academy, but I would rely more on my magic potency than on my troops. Summoning > Phantom Forces would be very much needed against strong Dwarves. Dark Magic would be my second pick, if Frenzy is offered through the library. Although I must admit, I have a tendency of underestimating Light Magic, but I doubt +12 attack makes much difference against dwarves. And keep in mind your friend is quite likely to have Light Magic as well.

Sorcery and Enlightment are a must for Wizards in my opinion.

But I have a feeling with your current built you're fairly screwed...

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dschingi
dschingi


Famous Hero
the guy with the dragon golem
posted October 07, 2007 02:24 PM

Well Leadership, Attack and Logistics are all good skills for long games , but you only have a 2% chance to get it so you can't rely on it. For games going into month 2 I prefer to take some might skills if possible. With that and good mini artifacts you might even stand a chance against the dwarfs
In short games direct damage and summoning spells are better than most light magic spells. Puppet Master and Frenzy would be helpful anytime as long as much magic resistance is not expected (which can easily be due to dwarven luck).

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Moonlith
Moonlith


Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
If all else fails, use Fiyah!
posted October 07, 2007 02:42 PM

Ehhhh, Academy unit damage output is low, ESPECIALLY against dwarves. Expert leadership... Meh, perhaps 50% chance to get a faster turn.. Won't make much of a difference. 50% luck... Again, double weak damage... not much of a difference vs dwarves.

Logistics doesn't contribute to the actual battle. Keep in mind that Dwarves can do might better than Academy. I would sooner buff up my troops with Defense skill / defense and ini arties (since standard Dwarf damage output isn't exactly very high either...), and hope to crush them with Dark / Destructive magic while shooters add in abit of extra damage.

Aim for their high damage dealers first.

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dschingi
dschingi


Famous Hero
the guy with the dragon golem
posted October 07, 2007 02:59 PM
Edited by dschingi at 15:01, 07 Oct 2007.

Of course it's a difference. I was talking about late-game here. Magic alone will hardly win the game for you. You may use dark magic to distract the enemy and puppet can even cause a lot of damage but meanwhile you'll get slaughtered by the rune-buffed attacks if your troops don't do anything. Sure you can do without leadership/luck/attack/defense but you need a boost somewhere. Like I said the mini artifacts become important then, with a higher initiative your troops can also act first, e.g. giving your titans the chance to attack before bears etc.
EDIT: don't forget that you can build the artifact merchant and he can't... that might give you an edge.

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George
George


Adventuring Hero
Dragon Lord
posted October 07, 2007 03:05 PM

Oh yes the artifact merchant can really help. Getting an Unicorn Bow will give gremlins and titans no range penalty .
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Zethor
Zethor

Tavern Dweller
posted October 07, 2007 03:10 PM

Here my point of view on an Academy build.

I would go for 2 schools of magic in the process.

First I have to choose between destructive and summoning magic for the start so i can make my leveling more viable. Both are depending on what spells u can learn from mage guild ofcourse.
I prefer summoning skill. Fire trap and wasp swarm are nice for the start plus if u get summoning skill fast imagine what can u do with the new fire warriors skill(fire elementals in decent numbers at start?)which is extremely nice along with master of conjuration. And phoenix is always welcome!

Second i have to choose between light and dark magic for the big battle.
I would take dark magic if my mage guild and my opponent permits it ofcourse just because it is more tricky against a might faction, nothing more. I am talking for puppet master and frenzy.

The other 2 skills (5 skills are too much too aim in my opinion, i am going for 4 with all my heroes) would be nothing less than enlightenment (extra stats are always welcome especially knowledge and  spellpower) and sorcery (caster without this skill wouldnt be a "good" caster).

Thats my build for academy!

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Duncan
Duncan


Famous Hero
The Pathfinder
posted October 07, 2007 03:52 PM

Yep, it’s a bit “unnatural” for a wizard to go with might skills (war machines, attacks etc). Dwarves are already nasty against other races with their runes, let alone with poor built. I’d prefer Sorcery, Dark and Summoning to replace Machines, Attacks and Logistics.

Why not go with Nerxes if you aim for a hero with creature specialization? War machines you can always buy later (if Havez is in the tavern recruit him as your secondary hero, problem solved).
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Maurice
Maurice

Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
posted October 07, 2007 06:28 PM

Quote:
Second i have to choose between light and dark magic for the big battle.
I would take dark magic if my mage guild and my opponent permits it ofcourse just because it is more tricky against a might faction, nothing more. I am talking for puppet master and frenzy.


Academy is Light / Summoning oriented, though. Choosing Dark is really dependent on what you're facing, because you will need to get the level 4 and 5 spells from *their* Mage Guilds. Only viable when you're up against Haven, Inferno or Necropolis, I'd say.

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The_Gootch
The_Gootch


Honorable
Supreme Hero
Kneel Before Me Sons of HC!!
posted October 07, 2007 08:18 PM
Edited by The_Gootch at 20:22, 07 Oct 2007.

My buddy just loves Fortress with Helmar; won't stop playing that combo in fact.  But now he's leaning towards starting with Inga and getting her to levelled quickly to ensure he gets the right runes.

I played a game against him with Academy.  Nur vs. Helmar and I had Havez with Flaming Ballista as backup.  

Nur had Dark/Light Magic/Sorc/Enlightenment maxed out and advanced attack(great witch hut in my territory).

She had a 28 spellpower and a 33 knowledge for making artifacts courtesy of a skull of Markal.  

And she still got shredded.  He came in with defensive formation, max luck, max attack, an Enlightened Helmar.  His first spell was Mass Endurance.  Bam!  Everyone had +12 att/def.

I cast Mass Haste and got ready to annihilate him.  My 16 titans were going to kill 1 Magma Dragon!?  Surely there had to be a typo there.

Each of his shots seemed to be either lucky or high morale and with that came more runes.  Battle Raged Thanes just wrecked me.  Why? Because Fortress matches up well with Academy because Academy tends to clump its troops together to get ready for shooting matches.  Any hole in your lines and freaking Berserkers will charge in and just mollywomp your soft ranged.

I cast puppet master;  resisted.  Cast MotW on the Thanes with the intention of at least blinding them.  He responds with Magic Immunity. I surrendered with 60 magis and my tail tucked between my legs.  He had much of his army intact.  

I had a double build going and quickly raised another army, this time with Havez as the main.  

Bottom line is Havez and Flaming Arrows owns.  Nothing is more helpful to crack open those freaking dwarves than ignoring enemy defense.  I also got lucky w/ remote control and took control of his ballista(he hadn't seen that trick before).  Got a double lucky shot on is skirmishers and wiped out 150 of them in 2 shots.  Because of that battle I competely reconsidered the possibilities with ballista.

Don't believe the stereotypes that this town does this well and only this well.  Razak with Leadership and Artificial Glory will make for a splendid might Wizard for the Academy.

One more thing.  I totally believe that dark magic is the wrong tact against the dwarves.  Summoning is a better route and for the love of god, don't let your opponent come to a battle with 5s in morale/luck if you can.  I have no doubt the devlopers noticed this fatal flaw with academy and thus developed the Djinn Vizier to help out.  I'll take it any day over the Sultan.


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Velocity
Velocity


Hired Hero
posted October 07, 2007 08:47 PM

Hmm interesting points yes but I for once took Destruction magic with my Wizard and found it useless. It was a late game and I did like 200 damage with a lightning bolt?! Geez Destruction spells just didn't show up in my mage guild and I suppose Dark won't either.

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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Tastes like chicken
posted October 07, 2007 09:09 PM

Nice one Gootch Two ballistas with flaming arrows are fun
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Maurice
Maurice

Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
posted October 07, 2007 09:29 PM
Edited by Maurice at 21:31, 07 Oct 2007.

Quote:
Hmm interesting points yes but I for once took Destruction magic with my Wizard and found it useless. It was a late game and I did like 200 damage with a lightning bolt?! Geez Destruction spells just didn't show up in my mage guild and I suppose Dark won't either.


As I indicated above, Academy is Light and Summoning oriented. As such, your level 4 and 5 spells in the Mage Guild will always be a Light and a Summoning spell. You won't get Destructive or Dark spells above level 3.

Creature spells depend on stack size of the casting creatures, but on a logarithmic scale or so - I don't know the exact details. As such, the larger your stack, the more you need to add to effectively increase the damage output. After a certain amount in the stack, it's better to switch to standard ranged attacks instead of casting damaging spells. Also, if you have spare slots in your army, split the caster stacks so you have more stacks casting. The overall damage will be larger that way.

Edit: By the way, I always found Lightning Bolt to be highly useless, unless you have the Stunning perk for them. You're better off casting Frost Bolt or Eldritch Arrow, if you don't want to use an AoE spell: they're cheaper in cost and do (a lot) more damage.

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The_Gootch
The_Gootch


Honorable
Supreme Hero
Kneel Before Me Sons of HC!!
posted October 07, 2007 09:41 PM

Wizards get a potential Destructive boost with Warlock's luck in the ToTE.  Greatest use I see right now for Destructive is Master of Flames and Armageddon with your resistance mini-artifacts.  Slicing enemy defense in half is pretty helpful.  Also, going with theorycraft right now, because they'll be more inclined to advance on Academy because of Academy's range superiority, their troops should take even more damage.
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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Tastes like chicken
posted October 07, 2007 09:47 PM

ONLY with fire resistance perk which is thankfully easy to get from light. Yes you can decrease enemy defense but that also cuts yours in half.
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The_Gootch
The_Gootch


Honorable
Supreme Hero
Kneel Before Me Sons of HC!!
posted October 07, 2007 10:11 PM

...thanks for clearing that up before I tried it.
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Nirual
Nirual


Famous Hero
Imbued Ballista
posted October 07, 2007 10:45 PM

by the way, does the Remote Control also target the ammo cart? And if, does the attack for ranged bonus stack in that case?
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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Tastes like chicken
posted October 07, 2007 11:07 PM

Yes it can target any of the three randomly Not sure about the bonuses though.
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dschingi
dschingi


Famous Hero
the guy with the dragon golem
posted October 07, 2007 11:48 PM

I thought fire resistance does make you immune to the master of fire effect ?

@Maurice
You can get dark&destructive spells with the library...

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