Heroes of Might and Magic Community
visiting hero! Register | Today's Posts | Games | Search! | FAQ/Rules | AvatarList | MemberList | Profile


Age of Heroes Headlines:  
5 Oct 2016: Heroes VII development comes to an end.. - read more
6 Aug 2016: Troubled Heroes VII Expansion Release - read more
26 Apr 2016: Heroes VII XPack - Trial by Fire - Coming out in June! - read more
17 Apr 2016: Global Alternative Creatures MOD for H7 after 1.8 Patch! - read more
7 Mar 2016: Romero launches a Piano Sonata Album Kickstarter! - read more
19 Feb 2016: Heroes 5.5 RC6, Heroes VII patch 1.7 are out! - read more
13 Jan 2016: Horn of the Abyss 1.4 Available for Download! - read more
17 Dec 2015: Heroes 5.5 update, 1.6 out for H7 - read more
23 Nov 2015: H7 1.4 & 1.5 patches Released - read more
31 Oct 2015: First H7 patches are out, End of DoC development - read more
5 Oct 2016: Heroes VII development comes to an end.. - read more
[X] Remove Ads
LOGIN:     Username:     Password:         [ Register ]
New Server | HOMM1: info forum | HOMM2: info forum | HOMM3: info forum | HOMM4: info forum | HOMM5: info forum | MMH6: wiki forum | MMH7: wiki forum
Heroes Community > Heroes 5 - Temple of Ashan > Thread: Heroes 5 Strategy: Playing Academy Faction
Thread: Heroes 5 Strategy: Playing Academy Faction This thread is 36 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 ... 10 20 30 ... 32 33 34 35 36 · «PREV / NEXT»
Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Tastes like chicken
posted October 08, 2007 12:15 AM

Yes that's why I suggested not trying it without it.
____________
Being human is a roller coaster ride of emotions during rainstorms and sunshine, sprinkled with moments when you can almost reach the stars.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Zethor
Zethor

Tavern Dweller
posted October 08, 2007 07:32 AM

Quote:
Quote:
Second i have to choose between light and dark magic for the big battle.
I would take dark magic if my mage guild and my opponent permits it ofcourse just because it is more tricky against a might faction, nothing more. I am talking for puppet master and frenzy.


Academy is Light / Summoning oriented, though. Choosing Dark is really dependent on what you're facing, because you will need to get the level 4 and 5 spells from *their* Mage Guilds. Only viable when you're up against Haven, Inferno or Necropolis, I'd say.


Yes, Academy is Light / Summoning oriented but u have a good chance to get a worthy high level dark spell through library. Building your wizard on this chance does not seem promising, but sometimes mass slow and mass suffering can be enough when you are facing a might faction.

As you said above, dark magic is better against some factions, instead of light which you get standard benefits beside the enemy you are facing.

Mass slow and mass haste (which they are the 2 basic dark and light spells) maybe seem kinda the same but they are entirely different during the fight. When you are playing a wizard/warlock you want your hero play more often than the creatures. Since u cannot have a better initiative on your hero (empathy is a rare exception) you have to lower the enemy's creatures initiative through mass slow.
The opposite happens when you play a might faction. You want your creatures to play more often against the enemy hero (imagine playing against a warlock for example), mass haste > mass slow in this case.

Anyway you have to count several things before choosing dark above light. Maybe a mage vault or a pyramid in the map would be enough for choosing dark, even if it still has some risks.


 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Maurice
Maurice

Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
posted October 08, 2007 10:10 AM

Hmm, yes, I forgot about the library, but since it's random, it's situational. It does improve the odds somewhat, but still it's a risk in my book.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Zethor
Zethor

Tavern Dweller
posted October 08, 2007 10:58 AM

I agree it is a risk, but sometimes you have to take a risk to win .

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Velocity
Velocity


Hired Hero
posted October 08, 2007 04:33 PM

Okay so I tweaked my build a lot with Havez.

Light Magic: all the basic abilities.

Summoning Magic: Master of Conjuration, Master of Earthblood and Fire Warriors (btw are Magma dragons immune to the attack of fire elementals?)

War Machines & Attack: To get that great armor sundering, triple ballista thingy. Also Archery doesn't hurt?

Sorcery: To cast my spells more frequently (Summon elementals, maybe resurrection?) I picked Mana Regeneration and Arcane training, no idea which could be the third ability? Any advices?

And tell me ehich hero to pick up next time when I'm playing with Academy.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Nirual
Nirual


Famous Hero
Imbued Ballista
posted October 08, 2007 04:45 PM

Quote:
Summoning Magic: Master of Conjuration, Master of Earthblood and Fire Warriors (btw are Magma dragons immune to the attack of fire elementals?)


They aren't, the attack itself doesn't deal fire damage. They are immune to the fire shield, though
____________
In ur base killing ur doods... and raising them as undeads.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
kermit
kermit


Known Hero
Soul hunter
posted October 08, 2007 06:05 PM
Edited by kermit at 18:18, 08 Oct 2007.

I doubt you'll get an edge over your oponent by simply summoning firewariors on the battlefield.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Nirual
Nirual


Famous Hero
Imbued Ballista
posted October 08, 2007 08:16 PM

well, fire elementals are one of the better elementals you can get... actually probably the best in the long run.
Earth Elementals are slow and generally get ignored, Air Elementals are fast but frail, and Water Elementals are limited to 2-3 spell casts. Fire Elementals on the other hand have decent initiative and 50 shots.
____________
In ur base killing ur doods... and raising them as undeads.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Olo
Olo


Hired Hero
posted October 08, 2007 10:39 PM

Quote:
Okay so I tweaked my build a lot with Havez.

Light Magic: all the basic abilities.

Summoning Magic: Master of Conjuration, Master of Earthblood and Fire Warriors (btw are Magma dragons immune to the attack of fire elementals?)

War Machines & Attack: To get that great armor sundering, triple ballista thingy. Also Archery doesn't hurt?

Sorcery: To cast my spells more frequently (Summon elementals, maybe resurrection?) I picked Mana Regeneration and Arcane training, no idea which could be the third ability? Any advices?

And tell me ehich hero to pick up next time when I'm playing with Academy.


Try Razzak , he is real killer in the late game.
I see you didn`t pick up enlightenment, point for you.I don`t know why this skill is so popular and many claim that it`s a must for wizzard. Bull s**t i found it rather useless for them- you don`t need extra knowledge - your hero will have enough, +2 or +3 to spell power - is it really worth it ? I don`t say that enlightenment sucks- no,  it`s quite good skill , it works fine for warlock or necromancer (intelligence)

 

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Duncan
Duncan


Famous Hero
The Pathfinder
posted October 09, 2007 05:57 AM

Quote:
Try Razzak , he is real killer in the late game.


Or Jhora, for faster cast. With Razzak you'd also need Logistics and March of the Golems.
____________
But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
phoenixreborn
phoenixreborn


Promising
Legendary Hero
Unicorn
posted October 09, 2007 06:29 AM

Quote:
Bull s**t i found it rather useless for them- you don`t need extra knowledge - your hero will have enough, +2 or +3 to spell power - is it really worth it ? I don`t say that enlightenment sucks-


What about artificer which is influenced by knowledge?  Granted the wizard has no need of intelligence perk.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
The_Gootch
The_Gootch


Honorable
Supreme Hero
Kneel Before Me Sons of HC!!
posted October 09, 2007 06:36 AM

Quote:
Okay so I tweaked my build a lot with Havez.

Light Magic: all the basic abilities.

Summoning Magic: Master of Conjuration, Master of Earthblood and Fire Warriors (btw are Magma dragons immune to the attack of fire elementals?)

War Machines & Attack: To get that great armor sundering, triple ballista thingy. Also Archery doesn't hurt?

Sorcery: To cast my spells more frequently (Summon elementals, maybe resurrection?) I picked Mana Regeneration and Arcane training, no idea which could be the third ability? Any advices?

And tell me ehich hero to pick up next time when I'm playing with Academy.


Hmmm, Felunio's rule of thumb is that 6 skills maxed out and a few perks is better than a few skills maxed out and lots of perks.

Excluding artificer and its perks, you've got about 28 levels there.

Max out Havez's Artificer skill and War Machines quickly.  Attack is a hard skill to get to don't hold your breath for it.  But if you are able to attack the map with just gremlins, golems, and a ballista go ahead and invest in some war machine perks and wizard perks while you're waiting to get attack offered.  

Mark of the Wizard and Ballista should be the first 2 skills you take
If you do get attack start making your long term plans.  Charting might be helpful.

Expert Attack and perks:  6 pts.
Expert War Machines and perks:  5 points(4 if you want just Ballista and First Aid tent and not Remote Control).
Expert Artificer and perks:  4 points(Consume Artifacts is worthless)
Expert Enlightenment:  3 points.
Expert Sorcery:  3 points.

You're already level 21 and you haven't gotten a spell school yet.  For economy's sake Summoning magic is a better tact with this build.  It only requires 3 points to be highly effective.  Light Magic requires 4-5 points to maximize its potential.



 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
havenlover
havenlover


Adventuring Hero
posted October 09, 2007 07:55 AM

Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Second i have to choose between light and dark magic for the big battle.
I would take dark magic if my mage guild and my opponent permits it ofcourse just because it is more tricky against a might faction, nothing more. I am talking for puppet master and frenzy.


Academy is Light / Summoning oriented, though. Choosing Dark is really dependent on what you're facing, because you will need to get the level 4 and 5 spells from *their* Mage Guilds. Only viable when you're up against Haven, Inferno or Necropolis, I'd say.


Yes, Academy is Light / Summoning oriented but u have a good chance to get a worthy high level dark spell through library. Building your wizard on this chance does not seem promising, but sometimes mass slow and mass suffering can be enough when you are facing a might faction.

As you said above, dark magic is better against some factions, instead of light which you get standard benefits beside the enemy you are facing.

Mass slow and mass haste (which they are the 2 basic dark and light spells) maybe seem kinda the same but they are entirely different during the fight. When you are playing a wizard/warlock you want your hero play more often than the creatures. Since u cannot have a better initiative on your hero (empathy is a rare exception) you have to lower the enemy's creatures initiative through mass slow.
The opposite happens when you play a might faction. You want your creatures to play more often against the enemy hero (imagine playing against a warlock for example), mass haste > mass slow in this case.

Anyway you have to count several things before choosing dark above light. Maybe a mage vault or a pyramid in the map would be enough for choosing dark, even if it still has some risks.




summoning, dark and destructive for wizards are pretty much gambles.  summoning because thats its nature and dark and destructive because u could get owned by the random spells.

light is the safe one, but its not the creeping power that IMO wizards really want.
____________

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
R-b-t3r
R-b-t3r


Hired Hero
posted October 09, 2007 08:57 AM
Edited by R-b-t3r at 09:00, 09 Oct 2007.

Quote:

summoning, dark and destructive for wizards are pretty much gambles.  summoning because thats its nature and dark and destructive because u could get owned by the random spells.

light is the safe one, but its not the creeping power that IMO wizards really want.

No my friend, light is pretty much worthless for a wizard. Going light, means that you are going late game, and it is the last thing you should be aiming for unless you are facing necro or inferno.

Dark is better for creeping and is very effective when used in the first 10-15 levels when even a light inclined might opponent can't build up his guild to protect himself with magic immunity.(which is incidentally what Cooch should have done in the first place. Leaving dwarves unharrassed till late game with a magic faction is pure madness!!! .
That means that unless your opponent is necro, dark is the way to go. Against inferno, go for both dark and light and watch the carnage

Also summoning is good to fall back to when creeping unless you haven't got neither Fire Trap nor wasp swarm in the first 2 levels which means you are unlucky (25% chance). Summoning is not a gamble, destructive for wizard OTOH is!

And i really can't understand why you consider dark such a risk. Dark has a 50% chance of popping up with library in 4th and 5th levels. Actually the chance of dark not appearing in 4 and 5 level is 25% which is not such a big gamble. Also in maps with utopias or mage vaults or Pyramids, going dark is even less a risk.
Also consider that you can use mass slow or mass suffering in great effectiveness against AI and player alike and you will surely have dark spells in the guild at levels 1-3.
____________

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Tastes like chicken
posted October 09, 2007 11:25 AM

Quote:
No my friend, light is pretty much worthless for a wizard. Going light, means that you are going late game, and it is the last thing you should be aiming for unless you are facing necro or inferno.

I beg to differ. You can't rush others in all maps, you may have to face the opponent on week 4 or 5. Motw + resurrection and mass buffs are also effective vs sylvan and haven with supress light for the latter.
____________
Being human is a roller coaster ride of emotions during rainstorms and sunshine, sprinkled with moments when you can almost reach the stars.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
R-b-t3r
R-b-t3r


Hired Hero
posted October 09, 2007 11:39 AM

Quote:
Quote:
No my friend, light is pretty much worthless for a wizard. Going light, means that you are going late game, and it is the last thing you should be aiming for unless you are facing necro or inferno.

I beg to differ. You can't rush others in all maps, you may have to face the opponent on week 4 or 5. Motw + resurrection and mass buffs are also effective vs sylvan and haven with supress light for the latter.

By the time you have cast your buffs sylvan and heaven units will already be upon you. Also in a situation that you have both played your buffs, your hero becomes ineffective because he acts at init 10  whereas all other creatures with expert mass haste will act at a faster rate. That leaves you to 2 mass castings, propably 3 till the game is decided. Then what?
Motw+Ressurection is workable only if you can deal damage in the meantime to play the attrition game, and against a might faction you won't. Palas kill your stacks "one shot". Sylvan will have first blood before your buffs get going and that means heavy loses that mass buffs or resurrection can't refund.
____________

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
kermit
kermit


Known Hero
Soul hunter
posted October 09, 2007 12:20 PM
Edited by kermit at 12:22, 09 Oct 2007.

honestly I don't think heaven player will have that many paladins by week 4 or even 5 to make them unstoppable killers... magic should have the edge there. Besides if you have a +12 defense on academy troops they're tough to take down even with 20 paladins Ofcourse it depends on the player but I doubt mught can do that much damage mid game. I will agree with you that academy lacks in damage dealers at this point, so ther army won't be too shiny, but I guess the point will be to buff your troops to survive long enough and to deal damage with magic.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
R-b-t3r
R-b-t3r


Hired Hero
posted October 09, 2007 12:32 PM
Edited by R-b-t3r at 12:33, 09 Oct 2007.

Quote:
but I guess the point will be to buff your troops to survive long enough and to deal damage with magic.

That is what i 'm saying all along. Light only helps you survive, it doesn't help you win. You need another school to help you win through the fight.
For example Playing a mass dark (and a puppet or motw frenzy next) at that point where he can't cleanse effectively, will give you the game.
Also i wouldn't count on haven not having 45+ paladins when i attack him week 5
At that point you won't have an effective army to face him and light doesn't change that one bit.

____________

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Tastes like chicken
posted October 09, 2007 01:16 PM

I mentioned that because I never take just one magic type and I always have sorcery.
____________
Being human is a roller coaster ride of emotions during rainstorms and sunshine, sprinkled with moments when you can almost reach the stars.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
R-b-t3r
R-b-t3r


Hired Hero
posted October 09, 2007 01:25 PM

Quote:
I mentioned that because I never take just one magic type and I always have sorcery.

I am absolutely certain that you will have sorcery and another school by then.

I am simply pointing out that in order to make the most out of your caster, it is essential to calm down the battle (in other words mass slow, mass suffering) to take advantage of the abilities of the caster hero. In a situation where both players have played mass haste OTOH, your caster has less time to cast and stats become more important than spells.
IMHO dark magic is more in principle to the caster style that the wizard emphasizes, than light magic.
____________

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Jump To: « Prev Thread . . . Next Thread » This thread is 36 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 ... 10 20 30 ... 32 33 34 35 36 · «PREV / NEXT»
Post New Poll    Post New Topic    Post New Reply

Page compiled in 0.1056 seconds