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RaZmuShaDoW
Known Hero
The Sync Bug Hunter
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posted September 18, 2006 02:54 PM |
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Quote:
Dungeon is also very powerfull. Insane damage, black dragons, elemental chains, destructive magic. What else do you need?
Counterspell > dungeon magic and there is magic mirror, too. Only black dragon and blood furies pose a threat, dungeons range unit sucks. So basically if you try to rush your dragons and blood furies to my line of troops you get totally slaughtered by my walkers and other range units, 7 vs. 2 you do the math. You could try to teleport your other slow units to my line as well, but they probably never get their turns.
1. Counterspell doesn't work on area damage spells (`half of Destructive Magic)
2. Dark Riders will move even faster then Black Dragons - the damage they do on first hit is insane.
3. Dungeon shooters sucks - I agree. But think of Blood Furies as a shooters too. Because they do not leave their initial positions at least player wants that.
4. Then using Teleport Assoult unit gets a boost to his initiative - Hydras move exactly after teloportation.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted September 18, 2006 03:37 PM |
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Quote:
Counterspell > dungeon magic and there is magic mirror, too.
1. Counterspell doesn't work on area damage spells (`half of Destructive Magic)
2. Dark Riders will move even faster then Black Dragons - the damage they do on first hit is insane.
3. Dungeon shooters sucks - I agree. But think of Blood Furies as a shooters too. Because they do not leave their initial positions at least player wants that.
4. Then using Teleport Assoult unit gets a boost to his initiative - Hydras move exactly after teloportation.
Counterspell works against all magic cast whether by enemy hero or creature(only magic mirror has a chance of redirecting a single-target spell) which makes it easy for a shadow witch to dirupt counter spell while the hero waits to cast.Note that since destructive costs have increased even a wizard may have a problem if he has cast a few summoning spells(increased cost too) since he pays double the mana of the countered spell.
Grim raiders may not play first(0-25% initiative adjustment for all creatures) and if they do and charge,unless they have reinforcements they are dead dino meat.Also where they will attack matters a lot since they may prevent you from casting an aoe spell as meteor shower or even a chain lightning.If they don't play first they may be blocked or cursed.
Shooters aren't that bad but they are not pure shooters to judge them likewise.Assasins aren't very damaging but their poison can hurt high tier creatures.Matriarchs are good for their spells:confusion for a slow tough melee stack or ranged,slow for high in creatures,righteous might for raiders/hydras/furies/dragons(unupgraded).Shooting is a bonus,plus they stay around to keep attacking.
I used to think so too but getting teleport assault is not a priority for dungeon.If it was not anymore due to 1.3 changes(need for intelligence,warlock's luck stacking with emp spells,sorcery/destructive a must anyway).
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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RaZmuShaDoW
Known Hero
The Sync Bug Hunter
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posted September 18, 2006 03:52 PM |
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Quote:
Counterspell works against all magic cast whether by enemy hero or creature(only magic mirror has a chance of redirecting a single-target spell) which makes it easy for a shadow witch to dirupt counter spell while the hero waits to cast.Note that since destructive costs have increased even a wizard may have a problem if he has cast a few summoning spells(increased cost too) since he pays double the mana of the countered spell.
Grim raiders may not play first(0-25% initiative adjustment for all creatures) and if they do and charge,unless they have reinforcements they are dead dino meat.Also where they will attack matters a lot since they may prevent you from casting an aoe spell as meteor shower or even a chain lightning.If they don't play first they may be blocked or cursed.
Shooters aren't that bad but they are not pure shooters to judge them likewise.Assasins aren't very damaging but their poison can hurt high tier creatures.Matriarchs are good for their spells:confusion for a slow tough melee stack or ranged,slow for high in creatures,righteous might for raiders/hydras/furies/dragons(unupgraded).Shooting is a bonus,plus they stay around to keep attacking.
I used to think so too but getting teleport assault is not a priority for dungeon.If it was not anymore due to 1.3 changes(need for intelligence,warlock's luck stacking with emp spells,sorcery/destructive a must anyway).
Yeah by writing Counterspell I ment Magic Miror - thanks for correcting 
Grim Riders. If talking about final battle you must attack with them ASAP. Because if they don't there probobly wont't be second chanse. In most of cases.
Lucks stacks with Empowered spells!? HureY!!! My dream came true!
But that again puts me into long debates with myself named "What skills should Warlock take"... :/
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted September 18, 2006 04:00 PM |
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You are not the only one Warlocks have many essential skills to choose from.There is more to it than generic casting meteor shower all over the place,even more now it got nerfed.
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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hellwitch
Known Hero
Skeleton Ruler
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posted September 18, 2006 05:01 PM |
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good shooters with low hp like sylvan's sucks for final battle because they die early on(usualy from a hero magic) . In my opinion quantity is most important so i vote for Necro
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sylvian_prince
Hired Hero
the ranged hanter
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posted September 18, 2006 05:21 PM |
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helvich is right! my vote goes to necro.... but sylvian shooters not suck! i.e sylvian shooters will easily slay the necro shooters! (unless necro hase 2-3 towns and gets 18 liches in a week)
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Ambidext
Adventuring Hero
Wandering knight
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posted September 19, 2006 05:30 AM |
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I've been a fan of the elves since HoMM 3, after they removed all the sexism in HoMM 2. I've only played Haven and Sylvan so far, but I'll just vote for Sylvan first 'cause I got faith in it. =p
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PhoenixReborn
Promising
Legendary Hero
Unicorn
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posted September 19, 2006 05:35 AM |
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Big map? Small map? Difficulty level? Nival map? Fan map? Resource heavy/light?
These should theoretically make a difference.
If I had to pick in a bind I'd go with Ranger/Sylvan.
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Bask in the light of my glorious shining unicorn.
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cantaresg
Known Hero
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posted September 19, 2006 12:23 PM |
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Academy anytime. I am more of a magic user so to me Academy suits best to my playing style. with the new patch, few can outlast a wizard in the number of spells he can cast (esp with archmages and arcane training).
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grobblewobble
Tavern Dweller
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posted September 19, 2006 02:12 PM |
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Quote:
So my vote goes to sylvan , cause i dont think the skill of the knights is worth something ... only usefull for getting more archers ... you will say that on big maps where you have lots of money and castles you can use it to get paladins , but instead of that , you can use the money to build a second or third town , and in the end it's pretty much the same snow
Huh? I can hardly believe you're saying this, after convincing everybody of Haven's superiority in an endless thread. How can you say you "don't think the skill of the knights is worth something"? "Only for getting more archers", you say. How is getting more archers not good? I just don't get it.
I seriously think the knight's training skill is easily the best of the special skills, especially when combined with Dougal. YOU have convinced me. You're the one who's shown what ridiculous numbers of marksmen you can get with training. Training is a bit similar to necromancy, except that necromancy is at least balanced by the weakness of the skeleton archer as a unit (and there's no hero specializing in them, either).
Normally, the weekly growth of your creatures is a limiting factor to the growth of your army. For haven it's not! You can buy almost unlimited amounts of archers, at reasonable price. That makes it the best faction.
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TowerLord
Promising
Supreme Hero
Hero of Good, Slayer of Evil
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posted September 19, 2006 02:22 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
So my vote goes to sylvan , cause i dont think the skill of the knights is worth something ... only usefull for getting more archers ... you will say that on big maps where you have lots of money and castles you can use it to get paladins , but instead of that , you can use the money to build a second or third town , and in the end it's pretty much the same snow
Huh? I can hardly believe you're saying this, after convincing everybody of Haven's superiority in an endless thread. How can you say you "don't think the skill of the knights is worth something"? "Only for getting more archers", you say. How is getting more archers not good? I just don't get it.
I seriously think the knight's training skill is easily the best of the special skills, especially when combined with Dougal. YOU have convinced me. You're the one who's shown what ridiculous numbers of marksmen you can get with training. Training is a bit similar to necromancy, except that necromancy is at least balanced by the weakness of the skeleton archer as a unit (and there's no hero specializing in them, either).
Normally, the weekly growth of your creatures is a limiting factor to the growth of your army. For haven it's not! You can buy almost unlimited amounts of archers, at reasonable price. That makes it the best faction.
that was a very early post from me, I probably didn't even get to play multiplayer at that time ... after crushing sylvan with haven I totally changed my oppinion . I started an entire thread about Haven superiority in here  ...http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=18776&pagenumber=1.
I still think Haven's skill is useless, and I always keep it at basic level ! The only good thing about it, is trainning paesants to archers  , which can be done by a secondary hero too!
And of course , my vote goes to Haven now ... but back then, when I took my first steps in H5 , just by looking at the creature stats, and building costs, not paying attention to growth, and no multi ... Sylvan just seemed better on the paper!
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grobblewobble
Tavern Dweller
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posted September 19, 2006 02:42 PM |
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Oops, sorry, I didn't realize this was such an old post. My apolologies.
I am a bit disappointed at the faction unbalance. Like many people here I'm a big fan of HoMM I, II and III, so I was expecting quite a lot of V. Well, I like the new skill system, but the rest of the game is unfortunately very ill-balanced, I feel. Insanely high recource requirements for tier level 7, coupled with weak creatures.. and they introduced this monstrosity called "training".. ugh. Makes the Advanced Town Portal issue seem like a relatively harmless, minor balance issue. And what were they thinking with Klaus? Is his damage bonus a bug, or is it on purpose? Not to mention Deleb.
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PhoenixReborn
Promising
Legendary Hero
Unicorn
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posted September 19, 2006 03:34 PM |
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Quote:
Oops, sorry, I didn't realize this was such an old post. My apolologies.
I am a bit disappointed at the faction unbalance. Like many people here I'm a big fan of HoMM I, II and III, so I was expecting quite a lot of V. Well, I like the new skill system, but the rest of the game is unfortunately very ill-balanced, I feel. Insanely high recource requirements for tier level 7, coupled with weak creatures.. and they introduced this monstrosity called "training".. ugh. Makes the Advanced Town Portal issue seem like a relatively harmless, minor balance issue. And what were they thinking with Klaus? Is his damage bonus a bug, or is it on purpose? Not to mention Deleb.
Did you update to patch 1.3? And you don't think Klaus was balanced or at least made weaker...also, I should be quite bored if I always used the same heroes...inferno has many good heroes.
1.3 also allows you get to level 7 earlier so they are a little more mighty.
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Bask in the light of my glorious shining unicorn.
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Ambidext
Adventuring Hero
Wandering knight
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posted September 19, 2006 03:47 PM |
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Why don't you all stop arguing which is stronger? You can give all the technical details but nothing is more accurate than the real game. Just 1v1 direct IP and fight it out. =]
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diablo-jr
Adventuring Hero
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posted September 19, 2006 04:38 PM |
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I have always loved the necropolis char.Right from the start of heroes2 all the way up to heroes5.It has to do with the ability to
grow a nice sized army that never has to worry about being happy.they just fight and if you lose some you can just grow more by beating living creatures.and there good use of dark magics make it a hole lot more fun to.
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good hunting
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Ambidext
Adventuring Hero
Wandering knight
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posted September 20, 2006 09:08 AM |
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Edited by Ambidext at 09:14, 20 Sep 2006.
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Well diablos, I've always felt that the Necro was too extreme. I loved it so much in H2 and H4 that I wouldn't use it under normal circumstances... it's too powerful compared to the rest. As for H3, it sucked so much I dared not use it. The only worthwhile creatures were the Dread Knights and Vampire Lords. Without them, the Necropolis is trash.
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grobblewobble
Tavern Dweller
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posted September 20, 2006 11:01 AM |
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Quote:
Did you update to patch 1.3? And you don't think Klaus was balanced or at least made weaker...also, I should be quite bored if I always used the same heroes...inferno has many good heroes.
1.3 also allows you get to level 7 earlier so they are a little more mighty.
Ok, I didnt check Klaus in 1.3 yet. He's much more balanced now.. hopefully they do something about the real problem with haven next (training).
Yes, I know Inferno has many good heroes and I am very fond of Grok and Nebiros. My point was just that Deleb is unreasonably strong at this moment.
Ambidext, this may be off-topic, but why do you think Necro is weaker in III than in II? The H2 Necro had to rely mainly on skeletons, vamps, liches and bone dragons. The mummy wasn't much help IMO, because with the skeletons you don't need another mediocre walker unit. In H3, Necro still had vamps, liches and (cheap) bone dragons, with the nice addition of the dread knight. And they got the necromancy amplifier.
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted September 20, 2006 12:46 PM |
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Quote:
Well diablos, I've always felt that the Necro was too extreme. I loved it so much in H2 and H4 that I wouldn't use it under normal circumstances... it's too powerful compared to the rest. As for H3, it sucked so much I dared not use it. The only worthwhile creatures were the Dread Knights and Vampire Lords. Without them, the Necropolis is trash.
And perhaps that's the reason necro was banned on every serious online play, along with conflux?
Necro was absolutely overpowered in heroes 3, my friend.
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NecroLord
Tavern Dweller
The Chosen One
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posted September 20, 2006 01:51 PM |
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As for H3, it sucked so much I dared not use it.
What?!?   
...Man, I don't think you have been in your right senses when you wrote that sentence... 
Actually, I'm not suprised by the inquiry's results after Necropolis leads it. 
...And now for the towns, ...well for me there are 2 claimants for the 1st place (rulers of the battlefield or whatever you call it) and they are: Dungeon and Necropolis, because:
Dungeon:
 Best 7th level creature (mean stats and immunity to magic)
Best class - warlock - all warlocks have Irresistable Magic skill, so they use empowered spells (from destructive spells)
One of the best 1st level creature - scout/assasin (and their abilities)
One of the 2 Highest level casters-creatures in game (6th level) - Shadow Witch/Matriarch (the other one is the Pit Fiend)
Necropolis:
Mightiest Army comparing with other races (because of the skeletons)
The best 1st level creature - skeleton/skeleton archer (and their abilities)
All creatures are immune to death magic (Decay/Mass Decay, Implosion, Curse of the Netherworld, etc.)
All creatures are affected by the Raise Dead spell and can be revived not just reanimated for the duration of the battle (only they)
The morale not affect all creatures
Their heroes have the chance to gain massive death magic (Implosion/Curse of the Netherworld) for 5th level of their magic guild and use it to destroy all living creatures without been affected
Immortal combination between the spell Phantom Forces and 1st level creature - skeleton/skeleton archer
Cheap and growing army in time
...I can make and the other descriptions but I don't have time right now, I'll just tell you the rest in ranking list:
1.Dungeon/Necropolis
2.Inferno
3.Haven
4.Academy
5.Sylvan
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grobblewobble
Tavern Dweller
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posted September 20, 2006 02:06 PM |
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Necropolis:
Mightiest Army comparing with other races (because of the skeletons)
Nope. Haven has the mightiest army now. With their training, they can buy themselves insane amounts of marksmen. Almost as much as necros can get skellies, but of course marksmen are stronger than skeleton archers. And can be boosted by Dougal, while skeletons have no special hero to boost them.
This topic has been discussed at lengths in the thread called "Heaven superiority??" by Towerlord.
The only faction being (almost?) able to withstand the marksmen hordes is Dungeon, which only shows dungeon is overpowered in itself IMO. With their mage guilds being incredibly cheap now..
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