|
| Thread: Wishes for future patches (1.6 and 2.2) |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 · «PREV / NEXT» |
|
TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
|
posted March 13, 2007 01:15 PM |
|
|
Quote:
The game was balanced for one town and not two!
Since when was Heroes balanced? 
|
|
Pomo
Famous Hero
The lone peasant
|
|
posted March 13, 2007 01:25 PM |
|
|
I think that's a fairly weak argument to say that the game was only balanced for one town - if that's the case then that's bad balancing, not simply a feature of the game. It should allow for variations in richness, number of towns etc without having an overwhelming effect on the between faction balance.
Also the Nival maps suck , all of them are boring as bat**** - fan made ones are much better. This includes the single town fan maps, they are simply much more interesting on average. My personal preference is for multiple town maps because it gives you more control over your strategy.
____________
linkTouched by His Noodly Appendage
|
|
ZombieLord
Promising
Famous Hero
that wants your brainz...
|
|
posted March 13, 2007 01:37 PM |
|
|
|
Multiple Town maps favor might heroes and that's it! Larger armies = the better the effect of Attack/Defense! You can't balance the game for both kind of maps (1 town and more towns)
|
|
Pomo
Famous Hero
The lone peasant
|
|
posted March 13, 2007 01:44 PM |
|
Edited by Pomo at 13:46, 13 Mar 2007.
|
I agree that maps with more towns favour might heroes - that's an example of how the game is badly balanced... and you can balance the game for multiple town maps - you simply need to provide both might and magic heroes for each faction. 
____________
linkTouched by His Noodly Appendage
|
|
feluniozbunio
Promising
Supreme Hero
|
|
posted March 13, 2007 02:29 PM |
|
|
I don't think its faction balance issue. In my opinion it's just matter of a map.
If u place strong guards and disable instant travel , possibility of rushing is disabled and might factions have advantage. If u place players too close with no guards rushing strategies will rule. I think it is maps which need to be balanced, not factions or mechanics.
____________
|
|
ZombieLord
Promising
Famous Hero
that wants your brainz...
|
|
posted March 13, 2007 02:32 PM |
|
|
Quote:
I don't think its faction balance issue. In my opinion it's just matter of a map.
If u place strong guards and disable instant travel , possibility of rushing is disabled and might factions have advantage. If u place players too close with no guards rushing strategies will rule. I think it is maps which need to be balanced, not factions or mechanics.
Exactly. That's why I think it's silly to call Warlocks useless just because you like to play maps that favor Might heroes
|
|
TowerLord
Promising
Supreme Hero
Hero of Good, Slayer of Evil
|
|
posted March 13, 2007 02:52 PM |
|
|
Quote:
@TowerLord: well, play some Nival-made maps with 1 town and not two and then say Warlock is useless at late-game. I mean, I can create a map with 10 Gold Mines and Haven will be overpowered as well as those that have Artifact Merchants. Or, I can create a map with NO crystal caverns and the factions that need it the most will surely be underpowered. The point is, FAN MADE maps are not BALANCED. The game was balanced for one town and not two!
FAN MADE maps are more balanced than Nivals maps. You just have to understand that with Dungeon/Academy you have to be alot more agressive than your opponent, and use your evil magic to defeat the guards much faster than your might opponent can do it, get the goodies in the middle, make your hero much more powerfull than his and go for tthe kill early. Anyway the keyword when magic is involved is RUSH.
I think it is wrong to say the game is balanced for 1 town ... Surely there are some factions that might have a harder time on certain maps, but generally the better player prevails.
|
|
TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
|
|
posted March 13, 2007 02:53 PM |
|
|
Quote:
FAN MADE maps are more balanced than Nivals maps.
Sure, and my 1000 damage familiar, fan made (by me), is balanced as well, right? 
|
|
ZombieLord
Promising
Famous Hero
that wants your brainz...
|
|
posted March 13, 2007 02:56 PM |
|
|
Quote:
Anyway the keyword when magic is involved is RUSH.
Well, Nival made this game so let them say if magic was meant for rushing ok
|
|
Pomo
Famous Hero
The lone peasant
|
|
posted March 13, 2007 02:59 PM |
|
|
Feluniozbunio - you have a good point, maps do need to be balanced. But at the same time it is not hard to envisage a situation where the factions also are better balanced so as not to depend so heavily on map. Wouldn't it be better to have both, rather than simply rely on the map? Then you could play a much larger selection of maps (variety is the spice of life after all) and still have balance between factions.
____________
linkTouched by His Noodly Appendage
|
|
feluniozbunio
Promising
Supreme Hero
|
|
posted March 13, 2007 03:09 PM |
|
|
Ye but it's easy to say, harder to do.
As for me, all factions besides sylvan are more or less balanced for medium maps.
I haven't played much big closed maps(h8 long games) but i think sylvan and heaven have too much handicap out there.
____________
|
|
TowerLord
Promising
Supreme Hero
Hero of Good, Slayer of Evil
|
|
posted March 13, 2007 03:16 PM |
|
|
Quote:
Why do you say that? Have you never played against a good warlock with sylvan? Probably.. He had avenger set on deep hydras, minos and lizards, and I had no Dragons, only a bit of matriarchs.. the rest of my army was on avenger's blacklist! Still, I blasted most of his army to pieces and ran away, returned and finished the job.. (albeit with 5 scouts remaining, or so.. but I still did it.) What's so great about sylvan endgame anyway? Even with avenger he couldn't really kill all those hydras THAT fast, even though his stats (A/D) were impressive, both above 12. He also had expert luck and expert leadership. Sorry, but he is no noob. I believe you need to play against a REALLY good warlock someday.
Come on ... No warlock can defeat me in month 3 with just Circle of Winter . That spell would do at most 500-600 dmg empowered (1000 lucky), and only the stack of dragons would be doing much more than that... Even with +50 cold its still very few compared to the damage of my troops. After all the sylvanic troops have acted , it will come your hero's turn, but you will find yourself with 3/4 of his army decimated ... And you won't get to cast a second time. So you will kill at most half stack, max half of two stacks.
I imagine after 3 months(1 town) he had at least 20 Emeralds Dragons , 60 Silver Unicorns , 80 Druids , 140 Master Hunters etc.
|
|
feluniozbunio
Promising
Supreme Hero
|
|
posted March 13, 2007 03:23 PM |
|
|
Actually last time i played warlock i got circle of winter doing 1k dmg without luck . it was 5th week, dead mans lake. But true, i got lucky with arties.
____________
|
|
Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
|
|
posted March 13, 2007 03:45 PM |
|
|
So? Does that prove anything, TowerLord? You can have 200 hunters aswell, the spells will just kill them as good as always, after which I will destroy the dragons and flee.. Now, without the two killers, you're on my mercy anyway.
Circle of winter did ~2k lucky damage, so I don't get where that 600 of yours came from. I wouldn't dare to amuse my enemy with such pitiful damage, don't you think? Now, 2k circle kills 11 of your dragons, and all hunters you have in one hit. How does that sound?
And imagine I had meteor shower with slippers, instead. That would kill all your precious hunters, druids AND most of unicorns in one hit, if I got the lucky spell. Scary? I guess so. I could even play before the hunters&druids with little luck (they have the same dreaded init as my hero) and evaporize them off the field before they could score any damage.. Just don't say wyngaal please, it's a bug as you already know
|
|
TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
|
|
posted March 13, 2007 03:49 PM |
|
Edited by TheDeath at 15:50, 13 Mar 2007.
|
Doomforge: Ice Bolt does 12 damage per spellpower (base damage is around 100, a bit less I think), so 600 is really a good damage fortunately
I can't believe you use spells against Master Hunters with pitiful defense 
|
|
Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
|
|
posted March 13, 2007 03:50 PM |
|
|
It's not icebolt, it's circle of winter. And check the screenies I've posted somewhere, it was 1800 damage if I remember correct, in case you don't believe.
And why not to burn the hunters? They may have pitiful def on their own, but a level 20 (around) ossir with arties and light magic makes that 30+ or even more. I'd say the spells are a *bit* more reliable here. Even when the unicorn aura triggers, they still do half damage.
|
|
ZombieLord
Promising
Famous Hero
that wants your brainz...
|
|
posted March 13, 2007 03:51 PM |
|
|
Ice Bolt deals the same damage as Circle of Winter
maybe you had Ever Cold Icicle and Empowered Spells and a Lucky spell?
|
|
Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
|
|
posted March 13, 2007 03:54 PM |
|
|
yes, why, what's the problem in getting such a common artifact? I always get one of them and use the corresponding spell. And, of course it was empowered, all warlocks use empowered spells by default.. and yeah, it was lucky, true. But I had 5 luck and for some reason, almost every spell I have thrown in that battle was lucky. So, why to say it was less damage?
Ah yes, Circle of winter doesn't do the same damage, cuz against 7 stacks, you will hit more than one for sure ;P
|
|
feluniozbunio
Promising
Supreme Hero
|
|
posted March 13, 2007 04:01 PM |
|
|
i think it goes like this:
30 spellpower *12 +100 = 460
460 *1,5 (empowered) = 690
690 *1,5 ( artifact) = 1035
am i right?
____________
|
|
Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
|
|
posted March 13, 2007 04:03 PM |
|
|
There's the lucky thing you've missed, too.
And 30 power is quite difficult to get, I'd say its 20+, which is more reliable.
With 24 Spellpower and all the things described here the circle of winter does around 1800 lucky damage, and if it triggers the elemental chain, it does 2500. For such a simple spell, not bad.
|
|
|
|
