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Aionb
Known Hero
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posted March 27, 2016 05:48 PM |
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Edited by Aionb at 17:59, 27 Mar 2016.
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Thank you, Quantomas!
Even if I have no time for Heroes lately (which has been my only game for years) and I haven't opened H3, H5 or HotA in several months, I am totally interested in the development of your project (HotAO?)and I would surely be willing to buy the final product. And I'm sure I'm not alone.
So, please, keep us posted. And a separate thread would really be appropriate, since this one is a dead end, really.
I mean it would be comfortable to know that the appropriate thread exists and that spectacular news might come up there from time to time, independently from the said dead end. So maybe some of the more active members might be willing to create it and let Quantomas know of its existence, if he doesn't do it himself.
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted March 27, 2016 07:17 PM |
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Thanks for the update, much looking forward to the 3.2 alpha release 
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted March 27, 2016 07:47 PM |
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How about just HAO for Heroes of the Ancient Order? That would separate it easily from HOTA and would also be convenient to write.
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What will happen now?
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verriker
Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
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posted March 27, 2016 07:55 PM |
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hey Quantomas man thanks for your updates, I wish you the best with your project man, you have my axe and my £60, please save us from the mediocrity of Team Erwin thanks for your hard work lol
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olorin
Adventuring Hero
tophatchild.blogspot.com
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posted March 27, 2016 09:03 PM |
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Quantomas said:
Galaad said:
So... Quantomas, any news?
Taking things constructively, there are still some lessons to be learned of what fans desire and what a Heroes game ideally should have, which are imperatives for Heroes of the Ancient Order.
Thanks for your efforts, Q. I'm truly grateful, all of us actually.
skill systems, magic, campaigns... It's both funny and odd how people disregard one of the most rewarded elements in HOMM saga: the map editor. A user-friendly, updated and simple yet powerful map editor: kinda that's all I'm asking here... Personally I don't care about campaigns, characters, heroes or pulp-and-cheap fantasy backgrounds, but having the chance to create my own 
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Top Hat Child dixit: http://tophatchild.blogspot.com.es/
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vitirr
Adventuring Hero
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posted March 28, 2016 11:18 AM |
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Well the complexity of map editor boils down to the complexity of your visual representation in the first place. We don't have an easy to use map editor since the game jumped to the 3D and specially as it was taken to more and more complex and realistic representations of the adventure map. I'm not saying you can't have an user friendly editor with a 3D Heroes game, but if you want to have a fully fledged landscape 3D editor to build hills, mountains or even more complex stuff then you need a 3D level designer to make maps instead of a simple user.
Keep the level flat for the most part, and give the user predefined objects for landscape structures like hills or mountains as in the old games. And while you're at it just keep distances short and size and scale in an appropriate proportion for easy visualization and navigation while in game. Then you have achieved the first and perhaps most important step for an easy to use editor.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted March 28, 2016 11:46 AM |
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Yeah, all those terraforming options are pretty but detract from the experience.. It should help to have a default camera angle from a height that keeps everything visible and also avoid locations tall enough to hide things behind them.
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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olorin
Adventuring Hero
tophatchild.blogspot.com
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posted March 28, 2016 01:27 PM |
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vitirr said:
Keep the level flat for the most part, and give the user predefined objects for landscape structures like hills or mountains as in the old games.
Exactly. I just can't see why you're unable to create a user-friendly editor within a 3D environment. Orography? Then standardize the sizes, imitating our oldies  On the other hand, I can't swallow the... modern lust for the 3d graphic engine; let's face it: 2D (or whatever Trimph used to develop AoW SM) is a better option for a turn-based strategy game such as Heroes by faaar.
Heroes V is a good game but the map editor is discouraging... Seriously, that's the 50 % of the appealing to me, so you can imagine my opinion regarding the last two installments 
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Top Hat Child dixit: http://tophatchild.blogspot.com.es/
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Storm-Giant
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
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posted March 28, 2016 01:30 PM |
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That's a great update, Q, truly appreciated
For any future updates you should consider opening a thread elsewhere (in the Altar of Wishes, perhaps?), since here it's outright offtopic 
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted March 28, 2016 02:00 PM |
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olorin said:
let's face it: 2D (or whatever Trimph used to develop AoW SM) is a better option for a turn-based strategy game such as Heroes by faaar.
Disagree. 2D, 2.5D or 3D have nothing to do with it. It's about sizes, patterns and perspective. The maps of AoW3, Civ5, Endless Legend and other games are sufficient proof that 3D works and it's not the core issue. To me it seems to be a crapton of specified complexity with 3D design whereas orderly, patterning complexity would work better. It's just like vitirr said, you want the user to have easy tools with standardized objects and map layouts, not terraforming, real sized, custom this, custom that which take experts to create. Before Ubisoft, Heroes used to be a strategy game where the adventure maps were more like board games where simplicity and iconic representations of models were essential. Now? Have you even seen the maps of Heroes 7? Those are RPG maps, some of them ugly as all hell if I may add, but above all else unpractical. Not the direction that the franchise should've taken.
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Guide to a Great Heroes Game
The Young Traveler
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted March 28, 2016 02:09 PM |
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And it's actually a huge improvement over H6. Except H6 maps were a lot prettier. Man those ugly trees..
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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agneslynd
Hired Hero
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posted March 28, 2016 02:22 PM |
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3D doesn't imply the editor has to be difficult, especially since ultimately the world of Heroes is a board. If you want to see an editor for a 3D strategy game that was just perfect in every way, look no further than WC3Edit. Powerful and easy to use, it helped spawn entire game genres.
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olorin
Adventuring Hero
tophatchild.blogspot.com
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posted March 28, 2016 03:52 PM |
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Stevie said:
olorin said:
let's face it: 2D (or whatever Trimph used to develop AoW SM) is a better option for a turn-based strategy game such as Heroes by faaar.
Disagree. 2D, 2.5D or 3D have nothing to do with it. It's about sizes, patterns and perspective. The maps of AoW3, Civ5, Endless Legend and other games are sufficient proof that 3D works and it's not the core issue.
Fair enough, my major point wasn't that anyway Certainly I'd rather prefer 2D over the rest (as a fine retrogamer ), but everything here lies in one single question: Are we able to make a map easily or not?(and by "easily" I'm recalling H1-H3's ways basically). If we are, then the game is so good, otherwise is a failure. That easy.
Ashan, Endor, Middle Earth...? Sorry but I don't care about that. I'd like to enjoy other people's creations. RMGs and tools like that are... fine but I feel that you can't compare them with the all-mighty "human touch".
Mapmakers should prevail, 'cause they are the guys who ensure the franchise's continuity over the years, aren't they?
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EnergyZ
Legendary Hero
President of MM Wiki
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posted March 28, 2016 03:59 PM |
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Edited by EnergyZ at 16:01, 28 Mar 2016.
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Well, there is an argument going on that there just aren't enough people in the world that deal in 2D graphics anymore, for many have transferred to 3D.
I can't help but agree that today that sometimes using 2D is just inferior by using 3D. However, this shouldn't apply to all games (like Heroes, in this case). There is also talk that 2D designers are more expensive than 3D (not sure if I should believe that).
All I am saying is that it is rare enough if you find a man that works with 2D. After all, how many 2D games have been released last year and are well-known and have positive reception?
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Maurice
Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
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posted March 28, 2016 05:11 PM |
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Olorin and Stevie hit the nail on the head. There's a simple but powerful truth in their statements.
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted March 28, 2016 05:37 PM |
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The HOMM series was IMO never intended to be full-3D as if it was an RPG, isometric view is what it needs, for readability, beautiful textures and lower system requirements.
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yogi
Promising
Famous Hero
of picnics
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posted March 28, 2016 06:56 PM |
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Edited by yogi at 19:04, 28 Mar 2016.
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this is probably just another side effect of this issue , pointed out by Brukernavn.
might&magic games were 3d rpg's, heroes games were 2d strategy games. both complicated genres that ubisoft has never been known for; hence the diluted attempt to combine them and compete with kings bounty, and blizzard, in practically every aesthetic including the "strategic map".
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frostymuaddib
Promising
Supreme Hero
育碧是白痴
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posted March 28, 2016 08:06 PM |
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I may be late to the party, but I will just add my two cents about map editor. As it was mentioned earlier, RMG is fine and well but human made map is something different. Another thing that I find necessary for any Heroes game is campaign editor. I always liked making campaigns for my own use (I get some idea, implement it in Heroes game for my own enjoyment), and that was an important part of Heroes games for me. I could easily say that it is 50% of gameplay for me when it comes to HoMM3,4 and 5.
As for 2D vs 3D and editors, I prefer 2D game. But, H4 did good thing IMO with 3D. and with map editor, which was really good, at least from my point of view. So if we really need 3D, and I really think that we don't, maybe H4 style could be a solution (I'm not talking about art style, just implementation of 3D).
One final note, map editor should provide the same functionality that devs had. I always hated that campaign maps in H3 had multiple loose conditions, while you could set only one via editor
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"Occam's shuriken: when the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas." -- Dr. Gordon Freeman (Freeman's Mind)
"lol" -- VERRIKER VON ERWINSSEN
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Gryphs
Supreme Hero
The Clever Title
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posted March 29, 2016 10:30 AM |
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Edited by Gryphs at 10:30, 29 Mar 2016.
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frostymuaddib said:
One final note, map editor should provide the same functionality that devs had. I always hated that campaign maps in H3 had multiple loose conditions, while you could set only one via editor
Didn't the devs say that the current map editor did have this? I mean I do not actually believe them, but still, it was said.
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"Don't resist the force. Redirect it. Water over rock."-blizzardboy
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frostymuaddib
Promising
Supreme Hero
育碧是白痴
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posted March 29, 2016 11:31 AM |
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I was talking about map editor in general I didn't have H7 in mind.
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"Occam's shuriken: when the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas." -- Dr. Gordon Freeman (Freeman's Mind)
"lol" -- VERRIKER VON ERWINSSEN
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This MEGA THREAD is pages long: 
