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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted September 30, 2014 10:10 AM |
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Avirosb said:
Welp, I guess they lore'd themselves into a corner then 
Nothing left to say other than that I feel single creature bosses are very out place in a turn-based strategy game.
They do that often. Which is why the restrictions are so oppresing. But seeing how often we discuss the topic, I see no need to reitterate everything here again for the umpteenth time.
As for bosses. I don't mind them, I actually think they spice things up on occasion. And for (semi)unique creatures it works. Making fan-favorites unique creatures on the other hand....
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted September 30, 2014 10:21 AM |
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Avirosb said:
War-overlord said:
Thunderbird = Roc/Rukh. Rukh is the way the human natives of Sahaar call a Roc. Rocs are major Air Spirits associated with Thunderstorms (who woulda guessed ). They are incredibly rare and powerfull. They are the Ylath versions of the Dragon Eel, essentially.
Their power and rarity makes them exclusively boss material.
Welp, I guess they lore'd themselves into a corner then
Nothing left to say other than that I feel single creature bosses are very out place in a turn-based strategy game.
AMEN!!!
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fuChris
Promising
Supreme Hero
Master to the Speed of Light
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posted September 30, 2014 10:40 AM |
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Avirosb said:
War-overlord said:
Thunderbird = Roc/Rukh. Rukh is the way the human natives of Sahaar call a Roc. Rocs are major Air Spirits associated with Thunderstorms (who woulda guessed). They are incredibly rare and powerfull. They are the Ylath versions of the Dragon Eel, essentially.
Their power and rarity makes them exclusively boss material.
Welp, I guess they lore'd themselves into a corner then
Nothing left to say other than that I feel single creature bosses are very out place in a turn-based strategy game.
Not necessarily. If the map has time or resource constraints then it can be quite a challenge especially on harder difficulties. Without them they ate useless tho...
However a champion battle against only 1 creature is stupid because it can not be properly scaled with difficulty setting. But a battle against 12 Kraken can easily be scaled simply by adding another 12 on herioic difficulty.
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"Now I am become Chris, the destroyer of worlds." - Robert Oppenheimer.
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Alex_Yakub
Famous Hero
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posted September 30, 2014 11:30 AM |
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Kimarous said:
Alex_Yakub said:
Y'all like to complain, eh? They saw our dislike of swordbearer, changed its name to landsknecht, wich suits it, what with this unit belonging to Germany-based Wolf Duchy and all, and you STILL find something to be angry about 
Pretty sure the thing people didn't care about the swordbearer wasn't its name... >_>
Personally, I might still refer to them as "swordbearer" for both synergy with the upgrade's name and ease of pronunciation.
Also, "Germany-based Wolf Duchy"? I've gotten a much stronger Roman vibe than anything else. I really don't know where the whole Germany basis thing came from, save for this rename.
Well, of course the name wasn't the only complaint, but still a major one And landsknecht isn't hard to pronounce at all Also, it is a known fact that every Duchy is based on a certain European country/group of countries, with Wolf Duchy being based on Germany.
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted September 30, 2014 11:33 AM |
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Alex_Yakub said:
Well, of course the name wasn't the only complaint, but still a major one And landsknecht isn't hard to pronounce at all Also, it is a known fact that every Duchy is based on a certain European country/group of countries, with Wolf Duchy being based on Germany.
And up until Napoleonic times, the collective of German states was known as the Holy Roman Empire.
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Alex_Yakub
Famous Hero
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posted September 30, 2014 11:37 AM |
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War-overlord said:
Alex_Yakub said:
Well, of course the name wasn't the only complaint, but still a major one And landsknecht isn't hard to pronounce at all Also, it is a known fact that every Duchy is based on a certain European country/group of countries, with Wolf Duchy being based on Germany.
And up until Napoleonic times, the collective of German states was known as the Holy Roman Empire.
And Holy Empire of Ashan is very similar to the real Holy Roman Empire indeed
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Maurice
Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
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posted September 30, 2014 12:34 PM |
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Personally, being Dutch, I find the whole "Landsknecht" to sound weird, out of place. It reminds me of Medieval: Total War, the Teuton expansion if I'm not mistaken (been a while since I've played it). I know it's a German name, but since it's the only one, it just sounds weird.
I realise the whole look and feel of the faction is supposed to be more rugged and rough as opposed to the smooth polish it had in Heroes V and VI, so they're (very) loosely based on medieval Northern Europe, which was mostly occupied by the Holy Roman Empire, the predecessor to the current Germany we know, so hence I can understand the name somewhat. But still, it feels a bit odd.
Cuirassier also brings back memories of Total War, but then Napoleon: Total War. Which, by virtue of its namesake, took place around ~1800 - in other words, post-medieval. This one too, feels a bit out of place, in name.
Kimarous said:
On the topic of renames (and no, I'm not going back to "Abbot sounds silly" thing), what about the whole "Magic Bird / Arcane Bird" thing? It sounds so... bland. At the very least, it lacks the majesty that a big glowy Champion tier avian deserves.
One of the first footages of the game - the demo map playthrough - mentions the name of the bird to be "Arcane Eagle". Was that name already discarded by the developers, which I somehow missed? Because everyone only mentions "Magic Bird".
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Minion
Legendary Hero
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posted September 30, 2014 12:36 PM |
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Single creature bosses can easily be incorporated to a turn based game. It could be like a puzzle - you have a pre-set army and you must defeat the boss. You would have to use your creatures/abilities in a specific way to defeat the monster. Or use the terrain, like there are these catapults and whatnot, they could be a part of the battle 
On another occation it could be a timer so you need to move fast and battle the monster before it does something nasty.
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"These friends probably started using condoms after having produced the most optimum amount of offsprings. Kudos to them for showing at least some restraint" - Tsar-ivor
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted September 30, 2014 12:41 PM |
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I think they actually said that fights can have other goals than defeating the enemy army.
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Marzhin
Shaper of Lore
Designer & Writer, Ubisoft
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posted September 30, 2014 12:44 PM |
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War-overlord said:
Their power and rarity makes them exclusively boss material.
Not necessarily. The Thunderbird was a boss in Heroes VI, it doesn't mean it has to be a boss in every single game. Just like Cate was a Black Dragon boss in H6 and that didn't prevent having Balck Dragons in the Dungeon line-up of the add-on.
That said, in any case the bird of the H7 Academy is supposed to be a different kind of creature than the Rokhe/Thunderbird.
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Avirosb
Promising
Legendary Hero
No longer on vacation
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posted September 30, 2014 12:52 PM |
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Edited by Avirosb at 12:58, 30 Sep 2014.
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Minion said:
Single creature bosses can easily be incorporated to a turn based game. It could be like a puzzle - you have a pre-set army and you must defeat the boss. You would have to use your creatures/abilities in a specific way to defeat the monster. Or use the terrain, like there are these catapults and whatnot, they could be a part of the battle
On another occation it could be a timer so you need to move fast and battle the monster before it does something nasty.
Eh, I just don't like singular creature bosses, period. Mutare was a dragon and she still led an army.
Quote:
That said, in any case the bird of the H7 Academy is supposed to be a different kind of creature than the Rokhe/Thunderbird.
Any chance you guys can just , y'know, make something up?
I think most made-up creature names would be preferable to [attribute][animal].
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted September 30, 2014 01:03 PM |
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Marzhin said:
War-overlord said:
Their power and rarity makes them exclusively boss material.
Not necessarily. The Thunderbird was a boss in Heroes VI, it doesn't mean it has to be a boss in every single game. Just like Cate was a Black Dragon boss in H6 and that didn't prevent having Black Dragons in the Dungeon line-up of the add-on.
That said, in any case the bird of the H7 Academy is supposed to be a different kind of creature than the Rokhe/Thunderbird.
I suppose that's good to hear. Though I'd like to hear the sudden abundance of Thunderbirds explained away without major retcons. And without major cop-outs like "Eh, Falagar isn't as smart as he thinks he is. He was wrong on this."
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supertommy
Known Hero
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posted September 30, 2014 01:04 PM |
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Marzhin said:
That said, in any case the bird of the H7 Academy is supposed to be a different kind of creature than the Rokhe/Thunderbird.
While we're at the bird, please consider being a little easier on the paint brush and all the colors ...
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted September 30, 2014 01:08 PM |
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Avirosb said:
Any chance you guys can just , y'know, make something up?
I think most made-up creature names would be preferable to [attribute][animal].
Yeah, if "Swordbearer" and "Horseman" was considered generic, then "Magic Bird" must be generic to the second power.
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DoubleDeck
Promising
Legendary Hero
Look into my eyes...
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posted September 30, 2014 01:18 PM |
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To me a Phoenix IS a Magic bird.
Either have one or the other, not both.
Let's only have one please 
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Marzhin
Shaper of Lore
Designer & Writer, Ubisoft
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posted September 30, 2014 01:35 PM |
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Well Magic Bird was a placeholder, at least
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Brukernavn
Hero of Order
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posted September 30, 2014 01:35 PM |
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Come on guys, they never said the name was magic bird. Erwan said: "so they have for instance this magical bird called an arcane eagle". Let's not make things worse than they are 
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted September 30, 2014 01:39 PM |
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Arcane Eagle isn't that big a step upwards from Magic Bird.
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted September 30, 2014 01:44 PM |
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Marzhin said:
Well Magic Bird was a placeholder, at least
Good to hear.
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What will happen now?
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Steyn
Supreme Hero
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posted September 30, 2014 01:46 PM |
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Edited by Steyn at 13:47, 30 Sep 2014.
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Marzhin said:
War-overlord said:
Their power and rarity makes them exclusively boss material.
Not necessarily. The Thunderbird was a boss in Heroes VI, it doesn't mean it has to be a boss in every single game. Just like Cate was a Black Dragon boss in H6 and that didn't prevent having Balck Dragons in the Dungeon line-up of the add-on.
Yes, and that was really disappointing. You had the black dragon, child of a god, as a boss creature in the vanilla, right where it belonged. Then you demote it to champion tier in the expansion just too please whiny fans, demoting the rightful dungeon champion, the faceless, in the meantime.
For H7 I am fine with the black dragon as champion, but please do it like in H4: high power, high cost and low growth. Make the black dragon the champion of the champions, not just some flying lizard equal in strength to seraphs, cyclopses, etc.
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This MEGA THREAD is pages long: 
