Heroes of Might and Magic Community
visiting hero! Register | Today's Posts | Games | Search! | FAQ/Rules | AvatarList | MemberList | Profile


Age of Heroes Headlines:  
5 Oct 2016: Heroes VII development comes to an end.. - read more
6 Aug 2016: Troubled Heroes VII Expansion Release - read more
26 Apr 2016: Heroes VII XPack - Trial by Fire - Coming out in June! - read more
17 Apr 2016: Global Alternative Creatures MOD for H7 after 1.8 Patch! - read more
7 Mar 2016: Romero launches a Piano Sonata Album Kickstarter! - read more
19 Feb 2016: Heroes 5.5 RC6, Heroes VII patch 1.7 are out! - read more
13 Jan 2016: Horn of the Abyss 1.4 Available for Download! - read more
17 Dec 2015: Heroes 5.5 update, 1.6 out for H7 - read more
23 Nov 2015: H7 1.4 & 1.5 patches Released - read more
31 Oct 2015: First H7 patches are out, End of DoC development - read more
5 Oct 2016: Heroes VII development comes to an end.. - read more
[X] Remove Ads
LOGIN:     Username:     Password:         [ Register ]
New Server | HOMM1: info forum | HOMM2: info forum | HOMM3: info forum | HOMM4: info forum | HOMM5: info forum | MMH6: wiki forum | MMH7: wiki forum
Heroes Community > Other Side of the Monitor > Thread: Racism, Policing, Political Correctness, and Civil Unrest
Thread: Racism, Policing, Political Correctness, and Civil Unrest This thread is 10 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 · NEXT»
fred79
fred79


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
posted August 11, 2015 06:49 PM
Edited by fred79 at 20:00, 11 Aug 2015.

Racism, Policing, Political Correctness, and Civil Unrest

I haven't seen anything posted about the ongoing civil unrest and racial tension in Ferguson, Missouri, so I made this thread.

First off, the latest development.

Something that happened a year ago, and still there is highly volatile civil unrest over the event. The way I see it, it's not right to use military force(even civilian created) on civilians who obviously see authority as acting unfair. But I also don't think it is right to pull the race card where criminality is involved, which seems to be an ongoing trend in the black communities in the states(from every news station I watch). I'm not saying that racism doesn't exist, especially in the police, or under the guise of any authority, for that matter. Don't get me wrong. But using it as an excuse to cause further unrest is just as bad as the racism the communities of the U.S. want to change.

I also see that the police's hands seem to be tied by political correctness, as far as trying to actually police an area. It doesn't help that they want to use military methods, though. They seem to not understand how to handle a situation without inflaming it. Which is distressing, and worries me as to how everyone will ever be able to regulate their treatment of one another.

To put it simply, I think enough is enough. From both sides of the issue. The media has been feeding off of the hatred they have been exacerbating for months, maybe even a year, now. One would think the general public would have caught on by now. The media deems fit to highlight certain events, while suppressing others; seemingly, to further seperate civilians from the police(and civilians from other civilians as well, using whatever means they can, but that's for another topic). The media seems bent on creating a civil uprising among civilians and police here in the U.S., and everybody seems to be taking the bait.

Before my head is bitten off here, know that I have seen the videos and have read the stories of what has happened, regarding civilians and the police creating situations that exacerbate both general civil, and racial tensions. It is easily apparent to me that the police across the U.S. have been militarizing their forces for years now, and acting like the U.S. is a foreign country, and a hostile zone to boot. I don't see what they do when they're out of line as excusable whatsoever. But I also don't see civilians trashing businesses, blocking highways and other areas of transportation, rioting, and stealing as solving that problem.

That said, criminality on both the civilian side and the authority side, will use opportunities to flourish. That much is obvious, as it is a natural behavior among living things.

But as supposedly advanced and intelligent mammals, how can human beings not come together? Why does everyone always have to have a bad guy? Some whipping boy to lash out at?

Thoughts?

edit: damn, i've never seen that many people writing a reply at one time before. i wonder if it's for this thread. i hope so, i want people weighing in on this. it's not just an american phenomenon, by any means.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
kiryu133
kiryu133

Hero of Order
Highly illogical
posted August 11, 2015 07:20 PM

I've kept glancing over towards the thing several times and as far as i'm concerned, It's pretty damning. For the police/state.

The police is corrupt as snow. There is no getting away from that. But it's not just the police but the media as well, only focusing on bringing out the negative in "black culture" and ignoring any and all proof of black communities lacking much of the privilege white americans enjoy. Often without realizing it. Racism is rampant and the big news network amplifies it through selective use of footage and news as well as the police having much less tolerance as well as respect for black citizens.

Ferguson is a revolution long in the waiting and while i disagree with many of the methods I can't say it's undeserved or unexpected. Treat human beings as animals, penning them in and mistreating them and they're going to bite back. Looting, violence should always be condemned but considering most of it comes from police and is aimed at young black people (usually unarmed and barely adult) I can't say i hold much sympathy. There needs to be reforms and investigations off the police.

interesting video about this whole mess: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLgIIjnpZyU

Media needs to stop putting blacks in the villain light. They're being repressed and pushed down by the police and media is enforcing the belief that it's ok by only showing black people rioting and being violent and not showing the black people being shot or assaulted by the people supposed to protect them.
____________
It is with a heavy heart that I must announce that the cis are at it again.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted August 11, 2015 07:39 PM

First conclusion would be that US cops are not enough psychologically and physically trained. Add to this the fact that Americans see weapons as toys, then you have some explosive cocktail of trigger happy and nervous cops who feel a blinked eye is a lethal threat. Almost.

Then a second conclusion would be that asian people really suck. I mean.... oh wait, my bad. There are no asian people being shot, despite important communities.  

Was watching a few videos on Ogrish forum (uncensored forum) and I saw hordes of youths razing, demolishing and burning  everything in sight, to underline their "blacklivesmatter" new devise, that they deserve respect. Strange way to put it. But lets not go into stereotypes, it happened only once. Or twice. Or maybe three times? Anyone still counting?

Racism may be one issue, racism is an inherent instinct and cannot be just swept away. It can be necessary sometimes and if you deny it you have no other way to know the real temperature out there, you lie yourself. Are white americans racists towards blacks? Sure they are, they voted for Obama. Oh wait, that doesn't make any sense...

So, what it remains?

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
fred79
fred79


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
posted August 11, 2015 07:42 PM
Edited by fred79 at 19:46, 11 Aug 2015.

kiryu133 said:
media is enforcing the belief that it's ok by only showing black people rioting and being violent and not showing the black people being shot or assaulted by the people supposed to protect them.


the news networks can't exactly show when cops(or anyone) shoot people, for obvious reasons. but i get your point regardless. like i said, the media doesn't care to show people being nice to one another. it's not good for their precious ratings.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
mvassilev
mvassilev


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
posted August 11, 2015 07:51 PM

As often happens with social movements, the Black Lives Matter movement has become inquisitorial, disrupting the socialist Bernie Sanders's speech during his presidential campaign, accusing the crowd of racism when they booed, etc. (Source for some of this) This is despite him being the candidate closest to their views.
On one hand, there's too much police militarization, and they're too willing to shoot people and use force in general. On the other hand, there was looting in Baltimore and "social justice"-oriented leftists defended it. The two sides deserve each other.
____________
Eccentric Opinion

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted August 11, 2015 08:14 PM
Edited by artu at 20:35, 11 Aug 2015.

"When it gets down to having to use violence, then you are playing the system’s game. The establishment will irritate you – pull your beard, flick your face – to make you fight. Because once they’ve got you violent, then they know how to handle you. The only thing they don’t know how to handle is non-violence and humor."  - John Lennon

Needless to say, this kind of resistance has its limits or should I say, there is a certain spectrum where it works, Jews in 1940's Germany would gain nothing by pacifist behavior, where as it worked for Gandhi because the British cared about how the world would judge their actions, they wanted to be recognized as civilized and humanitarian rulers. (Hitler even has an infamous letter written to the British governor of India, suggesting to immediately shoot Gandhi, "you'll be surprised how quickly things will resolve" he says.)

I think it is impossible to reasonably assume Afro-Americans are in a state or time where violence can be considered their only option left.
Salamandre said:
Are white Americans racists towards blacks? Sure they are, they voted for Obama. Oh wait, that doesn't make any sense...

I am not an expert on the level of racism towards blacks in the U.S. I'm sure it differs from region to region and also according to the wealth level of the neighborhood. But the issue of racism in modern times is never as simple as "they voted for Obama, so all must be swell." Even in times when racism was much more real and direct, there used to be blacks who were considered "distinguished and educated" but that doesn't change the fact that those blacks were seen as exceptions. And they still had to struggle harder to achieve that. If you put aside some very radical and marginal nut cases, nobody is racist today in the sense that they claim their blood or brain is superior to another race for biological reasons. It's rather a layered set of social prejudices.  

____________
All naughty talking and living are cool - Ghost

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
kiryu133
kiryu133

Hero of Order
Highly illogical
posted August 11, 2015 08:58 PM
Edited by kiryu133 at 21:08, 11 Aug 2015.

Violence and looting should never be excused, encourage or anything similar. But at this point I'm not sure what's left. They've been beaten down, marginalized and pushed down by a system in no way able to change in any foreseeable future. I do not approve of it but at this point it's fighting fire with fire. It needs to stop: violence is not the solution. The saddest part is it's the "solution" they've been subjected to themselves with overzealous, violent, [http://jezebel.com/cops-forcibly-search-womans-vagina-after-smelling-weed-1723207106]Raping[/url] cops way to eager to bring down "justice" on innocent people.

That's what needs to change before anything else.

some extra links:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/zachary-hammond-police-killing_55c0e240e4b0c9fdc75dfda3?ncid=fcbklnkushpmg00000063
Cops being snowty isn't exclusive to Black people. "All lives matter" does not respond.

https://twitter.com/TheQuinnspiracy/status/630625031215714304
snows pretending to be "ferguson looters" in order to spread false information.

P.S: The best extension
____________
It is with a heavy heart that I must announce that the cis are at it again.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
OhforfSake
OhforfSake


Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
posted August 11, 2015 09:03 PM

mvassilev said:
As often happens with social movements, the Black Lives Matter movement has become inquisitorial, disrupting the socialist Bernie Sanders's speech during his presidential campaign, accusing the crowd of racism when they booed, etc. (Source for some of this) This is despite him being the candidate closest to their views.
On one hand, there's too much police militarization, and they're too willing to shoot people and use force in general. On the other hand, there was looting in Baltimore and "social justice"-oriented leftists defended it. The two sides deserve each other.


Reminds me of a scene of downton abbey where suffragette's disrupts some random political candidate's speech (not related to women's right to vote) in an attempt to get their views heard. Talk about an elephant approach..

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted August 11, 2015 09:07 PM

Lol, you watch Downton Abbey, forfy? I also watch it with my grandmother when I visit, she's in love with that show and I download it from the internet for her. It's actually quite a good show.
____________
All naughty talking and living are cool - Ghost

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
OhforfSake
OhforfSake


Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
posted August 11, 2015 09:20 PM

Yes, I got "hooked" for similar reasons.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Kayna
Kayna


Supreme Hero
posted August 13, 2015 12:15 AM

fred79 said:


I also see that the police's hands seem to be tied by political correctness


The police's hands aren't tied by political correctness, they are tied by fear. A cop that gives a testimony against another cop will be harassed for the rest of their lives and also blacklisted whenever possible ( Applying for a government job for example, or trying to give a complaint about something ). It may also apply to their family. So you obey your superior and you don't ask questions.

Some blacks may have been pulling the race card on certain televised occasion, but that's a small problem compared to the actual death of blacks at the hand of racist and trigger happy cops.

It is my firm belief that problems should be tackled on from worse to least, so a few race cards pulled on tv is something I simply disregard.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
fred79
fred79


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
posted August 13, 2015 12:17 AM

Kayna said:
Some blacks may have been pulling the race card on certain televised occasion, but that's a small problem compared to the actual death of blacks at the hand of racist and trigger happy cops.


trigger-happy cops aren't solely a black issue. whites are killed as well. you just never see it on the news, because it can't be construed as a racial issue, which helps ratings.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted August 13, 2015 12:29 AM
Edited by Salamandre at 00:47, 13 Aug 2015.

Following statistics, white deaths by police are the double of blacks. But their lobbies are less vocal. Also in most civilized countries  cops are trained to handle most situations without killing the criminal (yet this video from today in Paris show that when cops are reputed no dangerous, criminals have no fear to harm them). The problem is that US is guns free so the cop is probably highly stressed, the suspect may be armed.

I say "criminals" because all the videos I saw about blacks being killed by cops, the suspects always had long criminal records + they just did some bad thing just before. Sure, cops are to blame if the killing is unjustified but also when a cop asks you to stop or keep your hands up, don't do stupid things.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Ebonheart
Ebonheart


Famous Hero
Rush the rush
posted August 13, 2015 01:07 AM
Edited by Ebonheart at 01:13, 13 Aug 2015.

Replying to your post Sal as the quote system seems to be a bit broken for some reason.(edited)

Which is one of the reasons why I really don't dig into this matter too much. While it is true that the US have loose gun laws and that some users may be stressed, you often need to do something very wrong in order to get shot. Like resist arrest or threaten the police.

I saw this video aswell. I personally think the police acted correctly but I would not have blamed them for killing them one by one until they stopped if they had guns out. As one can see in the video, several of them jumps one of the cops and shows next to no mercy. It is easy to blame a police holding a gun. But one must remember they got friends and families aswell. If the choice comes down in a stressful, potentially harmful situation to shoot or not, I think most people would shoot first and ask questions later.

Follow the instructions and remain calm and only move when they tell you to and you should not get harmed at all. But even if you would get harmed when lying still on the ground, it is still better not to move at all or keep doing what they tell you to do. If one knocks them off and run they have a legit reason to actually harm you.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
DivineClio
DivineClio


Adventuring Hero
posted August 13, 2015 01:18 AM

artu said:

I am not an expert on the level of racism towards blacks in the U.S. I'm sure it differs from region to region and also according to the wealth level of the neighborhood.



I had the opportunity to visit Texas not so long time ago.And God, please help them!The racism level is absurd!I saw a black kicked out a pub with violence just because....was black. I cryied inside

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted August 13, 2015 02:03 AM

How you know he was kicked ONLY because was black? Such things happen in France too with arabs, at first pubs let them in, then when drunk they lose all control and become especially violent and unpleasant. The guys in charge with security have good visual memory, it is their job, so next time a guy with problems asks to go inside, he is not allowed. Ofc he will say because race but he may have a record history in that pub as well.
____________
All my Era II mods

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted August 13, 2015 02:25 AM
Edited by artu at 02:29, 13 Aug 2015.

A black man getting thrown out of a bar only because he's black in 2000's U.S. sounds a little far fetched to me also. (Especially considering, 200 lawyers would be at his doorstep the next day, proposing to make him rich by charges of discrimination.) Maybe American members can comment further on that one. But your comparison is flawed, Arabs in France are recent or second generation immigrants that come from countries where drinking is a taboo, in most of them it is even illegal (at least to natives). Many of them are not used to drinking or socializing in a bar. Extreme majority of Afro-Amaricans, on the other hand, are locals of the United States for centuries, they drink occasionally just like everyone else. If that individual was indeed thrown out because of some history with the security or a recent incident DivineClio was not able to witness, it had nothing to do with his cultural background.
____________
All naughty talking and living are cool - Ghost

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
DivineClio
DivineClio


Adventuring Hero
posted August 13, 2015 02:43 AM

Well, he wasn t drunk for sure. i was doing my own business and suddenly i saw a group all white start started give shoving to a black accompanied with harsh world until he was out of the pub.
What would you think if you was in my place?
I don t remember a security guy.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
fred79
fred79


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
posted August 13, 2015 02:52 AM

never heard of or seen a black person get thrown out of a club/bar, for any reason. but if i ever go to a club, it isn't the rowdy type with stupid people that anyone gets thrown out of, anyway. places where confrontation is common are not places that i care to go, because i don't mesh well with drunken or hostile morons(let alone, regular morons).

i have 0 experiences of racism at clubs. i went to a club that was predominantly black one time in my life(like, i was the only white person there except for my sister), and a fight happened right in front of me, but it was outside. didn't catch any flack from the black dudes for being white, though. and nobody got thrown out. cops came because of the fight, but besides that, all was cool.

so i can't say i have much experience in that aspect. maybe some other american who actually frequents clubs or bars should answer. somehow, i don't think we have many of those at HC.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Kayna
Kayna


Supreme Hero
posted August 13, 2015 02:56 AM

fred79 said:
Kayna said:
Some blacks may have been pulling the race card on certain televised occasion, but that's a small problem compared to the actual death of blacks at the hand of racist and trigger happy cops.


trigger-happy cops aren't solely a black issue. whites are killed as well. you just never see it on the news, because it can't be construed as a racial issue, which helps ratings.


If you're talking about the USA, I disagree. I think they don't show the cops killing whites for some other reason, not sure which. It's not all about the ratings only when talking about mainstream media. It seems to go both ways, when whites are killed and when they kill both. Perhaps it's just a matter of exposing versus laying low, exposed being the worse position of the two.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Jump To: « Prev Thread . . . Next Thread » This thread is 10 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 · NEXT»
Post New Poll    Post New Topic    Post New Reply

Page compiled in 0.1722 seconds