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Heroes Community > Other Side of the Monitor > Thread: Terror night in France.
Thread: Terror night in France. This thread is 11 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 · «PREV / NEXT»
Zenofex
Zenofex


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Kreegan-atheist
posted July 18, 2016 07:09 PM

Quote:
I have hope the People of the West are waking up and will force the "leaders" to take action.
So, what are you gonna do, bomb Riyadh? I'd very much like to see that.

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Salamandre
Salamandre


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posted July 18, 2016 07:14 PM

A good start would be to properly monitor religious activities and  trim immigration from Islamic countries. I think enough people died those year, is time to show some teeth.

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Zenofex
Zenofex


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posted July 18, 2016 07:27 PM

You will have to deport your native Muslims if you want some real effect and I suppose your understand that such a move will be disastrous in multiple areas. The immigration from jihadist breeding grounds should be very closely supervised or stopped altogether (most likely temporarily) but actually most of the existing and potential terrorists are home-made and explicit anti-Muslim policies will only marginalize them. There won't be any long-term solution as long as several countries in the Middle East are in turmoil, financed either directly by the governments which allegedly "fight" terrorism or their local "allies". The real enemy is not some bearded idiot, brainwashed to kill dozens of people and ultimately die for the faith but those who pay for his weapons and training.

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Salamandre
Salamandre


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posted July 18, 2016 07:47 PM

Zenofex said:
You will have to deport your native Muslims if you want some real effect and I suppose your understand that such a move will be disastrous in multiple areas.  


There is no such option as deporting native muslims, and will never be -although I would be more than glad than those showing radicalized signals could be indeed put on some empty island and let to root slowly, but any smart man would agree that it is time to stop bringing in billions more. Physics laws: don't add fresh water before it boils.

Assimilation is not an utopia, but requires rational quotas. Right now we are out of common sense regarding immigration.

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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


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posted July 18, 2016 07:56 PM

Salamandre said:
A good start would be to properly monitor religious activities and  trim immigration from Islamic countries. I think enough people died those year, is time to show some teeth.
That's hysteria talking. Antagonizing the regular muslims is the worst mistake possible. Instead, the dead MUSLIMS of the attacks in Paris and Nice should be stressed - Nice was probably not even a terror attack, like this incident costing 150 lifes. Blaming virtually BILLIONS of people is irresponsible, stupid, short-sighted, and doesn't help in the least.

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Salamandre
Salamandre


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Wog refugee
posted July 18, 2016 08:13 PM

Non sense. Until opposite proof, all terrorists in France are issued from Immigration and all are from Islamic countries. You know the meaning of the word "ALL"? It means 100%, no exception. So, after you, we should not even mention this detail and do what?  Light candles?

As when you advocate prisons are bad so you propose? You are out of this world and read your thoughts in a manual. Get real.
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Zenofex
Zenofex


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Kreegan-atheist
posted July 18, 2016 08:29 PM

Quote:
There is no such option as deporting native muslims, and will never be
That's the problem, as long as you have native Muslims which can be radicalised - and stigmatizing them all just because they're Muslims certainly won't contribute to the opposite - you'll always be threatened with terrorism. France, just like many other "anti-terrorist" countries buys oil from the Wahhabi Qatar and Saudi Arabia which practically both fund and indoctrinate terrorists, how can you hope to stop the attacks when the state which is supposed to protect you actually pays for them?

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Salamandre
Salamandre


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Wog refugee
posted July 18, 2016 08:39 PM

I don't know where you read me "stigmatizing all of them". I say trim immigration which means: control and decide who enters, who gets out, on the real needs of french interests and only them. Like countries as Canada, for example. The bases of a sovereign state, if any of you recall what that means.
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Zenofex
Zenofex


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Kreegan-atheist
posted July 18, 2016 09:16 PM

Don't know, maybe I just can't see how this will be implemented in practice without indirectly (or directly) appearing as an anti-Muslim policy. There's a control over who enters and leaves the EU even at the moment - if you just want this control to be better (but again - how?), I can only agree. Monitoring all locals is impossible without converting into a police state and even then it won't be perfect. What I'm trying to say all the time is that the root cause is completely different and few people actually seem to give a damn about it.

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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


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posted July 18, 2016 09:20 PM

Salamandre said:
Non sense. Until opposite proof, all terrorists in France are issued from Immigration and all are from Islamic countries. You know the meaning of the word "ALL"? It means 100%, no exception. So, after you, we should not even mention this detail and do what?  Light candles?

As when you advocate prisons are bad so you propose? You are out of this world and read your thoughts in a manual. Get real.
Look, wno's talking: Not all terror attacks in France are the work of immigrants or muslims. However, all rapes in France are done by men. YOu know the meaning of the word ALL? So after you we should do what with men? Monitor their sexual behaviour?
Look at the percentage of violent criminals - how many men, how many women? Reason? Testosteron? Solution? Yeah, well.

You, see, the general percentage of rapists and violent criminals is fairly low, so you can safely say that being a man is a "risk factor" - but by no means the decisive one, proven by the overwhelming majority of non-violent non-rapist men.
Same with terrorists, OBVIOUSLY.

You are supposedly intelligent. So what happened in Germany (and in France and other countries as well, mind you, just on a different level)? In 1933 life sucked in Germany, but a lot of Jews - and that kind of anti-semitism has been rampant in France as well - were wealthy or at least didn't suffer from the crisis. They owned shops. Banks. They dealt with money. They looked outlandish with their beirds and caps and whatnot, and they spoke a srange quasi-German language. And suddenly all Jews were to blame for everything that had been going wrong in the country. And enough people were prepared to believe that crap.

France is an ex-colonial wold power. The country has had a violent past, which is something that tends to come back to haunt you, is what history teaches - same thing as in Britain. They have to live with their colonial past, and that includes a lot of muslims, who are back 100 years - not 200, as someone said.

What do you think, why there has been NOT ONE muslim terror attack in Germany, never ever although Germany has a relatively high muslim population percentage AND takes refugees by the ten thousands? Can it be, it's not "the muslims"?

What you do in France is up to the French, but I would be very careful. Today it's muslims - tomorrow it's those darn Romanian immigrants that gang up to burgle homes and steal cars.

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Ebonheart
Ebonheart


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posted July 18, 2016 09:21 PM

It's a shame the world can't be so simple that you can devide the ones who want immigration and don't want it, to live in seperate zones in charge of their own politics. Imagine how good everyone must feel knowing they stay with the folk who agrees with them.
Alas, it's just a dream.

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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


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posted July 18, 2016 09:40 PM

Ebonheart said:
It's a shame the world can't be so simple that you can devide the ones who want immigration and don't want it, to live in seperate zones in charge of their own politics. Imagine how good everyone must feel knowing they stay with the folk who agrees with them.
Alas, it's just a dream.
You are not thinking clearly. or one thing, it's more or less a 100% certainty that you yourself have an immigrant in your lineage - in your IMMEDIATE lieage of the last 150 years or so, mind you. When you go farther back - well, you were a people of pillaging, plundering Odin/Walhalla believers, but in the 12 century or so you became Christian and later Protestant. And secondly - what about EMIGRATION? I mean, you don't want IMMIGRANTS - but what if muslim communists take power in Sweden, and you don't want to live under the new regime, forcing you to work 10 hours for minimum wage, pray 5 times per day and forbid internet porn? Then you want to EMIGRATE - but what if no one wants you? Because you speak such a strange language, look silly, and have no drinking manners?

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Salamandre
Salamandre


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posted July 18, 2016 09:49 PM

I am just amazed how muslims advocates are surrealist.

Let's see, what could be some serious reasons to monitor who enters from islamic countries? A little disagreement about Sharia? Or maybe that gays are considered as criminals in such areas? Or women less than an object? What about other people from other religions, they are just hanged at first tree? What about those who accidentally throw a Koran and then get lynched by thousand of enraged men, and this in the very middle of Afghanistan's CAPITAL?

I love how you strut here "look at me the righteous" but you propose NOTHING, just bla bla about how racists others are. Then when terror strikes, you even dare to compare a guy yelling Alahu Akbar while smashing innocents with the psychologically deranged airplane pilot and say "it's an incident", no more no less.

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Ebonheart
Ebonheart


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Rush the rush
posted July 18, 2016 09:57 PM
Edited by Ebonheart at 21:58, 18 Jul 2016.

@JJ
Won't you just please shut yer flytrap about the ancient past already? If you are so keen about looking back, why don't you travel back in time and osculate a princess or something.
You're like a movie organizer ordering in inflatable rocks cause you can't afford real rocks right at the scene.

The bottom line for me is that I do not care what the past may have been anymore. It's the present that matters and the future that comes along with it. I have seen what this immigration and multiculture expirement has done in a very short time to my home, I only look at this in one way now: You either want it or not. I for one do not want this, but perhaps you do and you are welcome to believe that and live after those ways - but not near me, thank you very much.

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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


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posted July 18, 2016 10:15 PM
Edited by JollyJoker at 22:26, 18 Jul 2016.

Salamandre said:
I am just amazed how muslims advocates are surrealist.

Let's see, what could be some serious reasons to monitor who enters from islamic countries? A little disagreement about Sharia? Or maybe that gays are considered as criminals in such areas? Or women less than an object? What about other people from other religions, they are just hanged at first tree? What about those who accidentally throw a Koran and then get lynched by thousand of enraged men, and this in the very middle of Afghanistan's CAPITAL?

I love how you strut here "look at me the righteous" but you propose NOTHING, just bla bla about how racists others are. Then when terror strikes, you even dare to compare a guy yelling Alahu Akbar while smashing innocents with the psychologically deranged airplane pilot and say "it's an incident", no more no less.
You call that an answer to a post? More than one, actually, because I already told you that the IRA and the ETA already proved that you cannot avoid terror attacks if there is enough money with a purpose and enough righteous anger stacked against you. Not even, when you KNOW who your opponents are.
And how dare YOU to belittle the death of 150 innocents and the grief of their relatives and friends by a "deranged  pilot" when compared with an incident with a DERANGED TRUCK DRIVER, just because the truck driver was supposedly yelling something, while no one survived to hear what the deranged pilot may have yelled.

People like you are real problem, because they are so afraid that they let themselves fool by those whose only interest is to exploit the situation to their own advantage.

@ Ebonheart
You should emigrate into a better land than Sweden is.

Oh, and let me add something. You see the bold print? That is a primnitive nazi propaganda method: you say something is against the law and not good, and you are a "Jew advocate" - probably anti-occident or whatever crap you can come up with. It's FASCIST, not just racist, you use the same rhetorical tools than English skinheads.
Meanwhile you should know I'm against all organized religion - but I'm also against a lot of other things, racism and fascism amongst them.

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Ebonheart
Ebonheart


Famous Hero
Rush the rush
posted July 18, 2016 10:19 PM

JollyJoker said:
@ Ebonheart
You should emigrate into a better land than Sweden is.

There are only a few to choose from and moving right before a economic collapse is not advisable.
For now, I must remain.

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Salamandre
Salamandre


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posted July 18, 2016 11:04 PM

Deaf talk.

In sum I am the danger because I warn about Islam dangers when imported. But me killed nobody, Islam did. And yes, the driver shouted Allahu Akbar, only those mentally sclerosed can skip and ignore such relevant details.

Did you watch the death of that woman in Kaboul? Those are the people you want to bring in our countries, no less no more. You are the danger and the facts prove it.

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Elodin
Elodin


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posted July 18, 2016 11:07 PM

The Nice truck driver was recruited by ISIS.  

Clicky
Quote:

The uncle of the truck driver who killed 84 people on the French Riviera says his nephew was indoctrinated about two weeks ago by an Algerian member of the Islamic State group in Nice, as anti-terrorism authorities question potential accomplices in the devastating attack.



Yes, it is true that one can' t completely stop all jihadist attacks.  But such attacks can be mitigated to they happen less frequently.

Monitor mosques to see which mosques preach jihad.  Secure the border.  Will some jihadists get through?  Yeah, but if you do it right most will be caught at the border.  

Thouroughly vet immigrants.  Temporarily cease Muslim immigration. Some exceptions, such as well known Muslim businessmen can be allowed.

If an someone says he is a Christian you contact his supposed pastor.  Don't say it can't be done.  Work with religious organizations that know the pastors/rabbis in the area.  

When you root out jihadist networks in the nation and Muslims begin to assimilate then you can think about resuming vetted Muslim immigration.

However, immigration from places where Sharia is the law of the land must always be very closely vetted. Sharia believers will never assimilate and will always be a thorn in your side.  
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Ebonheart
Ebonheart


Famous Hero
Rush the rush
posted July 18, 2016 11:29 PM
Edited by Ebonheart at 23:31, 18 Jul 2016.

Elodin said:
Yes, it is true that one can' t completely stop all jihadist attacks.  But such attacks can be mitigated to they happen less frequently.

But the fact remains we did not have these kind of attacks before this madness started, thus the previous concept worked and this statement of yours becomes somewhat empty. These attacks shall NEVER happen.

Freedom of religion is something Sweden has long prouded itself with, but when the decision was made, this kind of scenario was never intended or could even be predicted because of how Europe looked at that time.
If a religion is bent on destroying those who do not follow it, like Islam, then that rather critical detail changes everything (note that several religions have been bloody in the past, but they have been dealt with).

To simplify it a bit, is there any difference between a cold blooded murderer like Bering Breivik and a radical islamist? Perhaps in terms of reasoning and mind, but the results are the same.
If the question would be phrased as follows "Allow 10000 Berings into the nation every year because of war in his country" then it would be denied without hesitation.
So I must agree with Sal. In the end, it is not we who must prove our trust for Islam, but the other way around. But having read their book, I personally think they have a long way to go. Considering the book remains the same up until this day.

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Salamandre
Salamandre


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Wog refugee
posted July 18, 2016 11:50 PM
Edited by Salamandre at 00:05, 19 Jul 2016.

JollyJoker said:
Not all terror attacks in France are the work of immigrants or muslims. However, all rapes in France are done by men.


Err? You pull out the list from 1800 and want to have a point?! And whats the comparison with rape being done by men??

Oh dear, I hate losing time on internet to find obvious data, but here is a list for you so you can see full of bias you are, all attacks in France in our century, except two, are reported to have islamic motivations:

20 July 2003 Bombing
Double attack against the regional directorates of customs and the treasury in Nice, claimed by the National Liberation Front of Corsica (FLNC).


8 October 2004 Bombing Bomb attack against the Indonesian Embassy in Paris, claimed by the Front islamique français armé.


1 December 2007 Shooting Killing of two members of the Spanish Civil Guard carrying out surveillance against ETA members in Capbreton, Landes.


11-22 March 2012 Shooting  Toulouse and Montauban shootings, murdering three French paratroopers, a French Rabbi and three French schoolchildren (aged eight, six and three) carried out over a period of 11 days by Mohammed Merah.


23 May 2013 Stabbing  La Défense attack by an Islamist knifeman against a French soldier in the Paris suburb of La Défense.


20 December 2014 Stabbing  Tours police station stabbing. A man yelling "Allahu Akbar" attacked a police office in Joué-lès-Tours with a knife. He was killed and 3 police officers were injured.


21 December 2014 Vehicle ramming   Dijon attack. A man yelling "Allahu Akbar" ran over 11 pedestrians with his vehicle.


22 December 2014 Vehicle ramming  Nantes attack. A man yelling "Allahu Akbar" ran over 10 pedestrians with his vehicle, killing one, then attempted suicide.


7-9 January 2015 Shooting  Île-de-France attacks, a mass shooting at the satirical magazine Charlie Hebdo office in Paris, carried out by Saïd and Chérif Kouachi, two Islamist gunmen who identified themselves as belonging to Al-Qaeda in Yemen.[1] During this period, a third Islamist gunman and close friend of the Kouachi brothers, Amedy Coulibaly was responsible for two shootings and an hostage taking at a Hypercacher kosher market. He said he synchronized his attacks with the Kouachi brothers. Coulibaly had pledged allegiance to the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant.


3 February 2015 Stabbing 3 military men, guarding a Jewish community center in Nice, are attacked by Moussa Coulibaly (not related to the January Coulibaly attacks).


19 April 2015 Shooting Unsuccessful attack against 2 churches in Villejuif by an Algerian jihadist. He killed a woman probably when trying to steal her car but accidentally shot himself in the leg, putting an end to his plans.


26 June 2015 Beheading Saint-Quentin-Fallavier attack. An Islamist delivery driver probably linked to ISIS decapitated a man and rammed a company van into gas cylinders at the Air Products gas factory in an attempt to blow up the building.


21 August 2015 Shooting and stabbing Thalys train attack. An attempted mass shooting occurred on a train traveling from Amsterdam to Paris. Four people were injured, including the islamist assailant who was subdued by other passengers.


13-14 November 2015 Shootings, hostage taking and suicide bombings November 2015 Paris attacks. The single deadliest terrorist attack in French history. Multiple shooting and grenade attacks occurred on a Friday night; among the locations targeted were a music venue, sports stadium and several bar and restaurant terraces. 90 persons were killed during a siege at an Eagles of Death Metal concert inside the Bataclan. French president François Hollande evacuated from a football match between France and Germany at the Stade de France, venue for the UEFA Euro 2016 Final, after three separate suicide bombings over the course of about 40 minutes. ISIS claimed responsibility for the attacks and President Hollande named the Paris attacks an "'act of war'".


1 January 2016 Vehicle ramming  A man rammed his car twice into 4 soldiers protecting a mosque in Valence. He said he wanted to kill troops and jihadi propaganda images were found on his computer.


7 January 2016 Stabbing   Paris police station attack, a jihadist wearing a fake explosive belt attacked police officers in the Goutte d'Or district in Paris with a meat cleaver, while shouting "Allahu Akbar". He was shot dead and one policeman receiving injuries. The ISIS flag and a clearly written claim in Arabic, were found on the attacker.


13 June 2016 Stabbing   Magnanville stabbing, a police officer and his wife, a police secretary, were stabbed to death in their home in Magnanville by a jihadist. ISIS claimed responsibility for the attack.


14 July 2016 Vehicle ramming and shooting Nice attack, an islamic terrorist used a truck to run over people celebrating the 2016 Bastille Day; he also shot into the crowd.


So, is there still no problem with Islam? 12 terror attacks in the last 3 years only, how can you be so blind and not connect the elephant-size dots?

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