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Heroes Community > Other Side of the Monitor > Thread: Terror night in France.
Thread: Terror night in France. This thread is 11 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 · «PREV / NEXT»
frostysh
frostysh


Bad-mannered
Famous Hero
WHY?
posted July 15, 2016 11:17 PM
Edited by frostysh at 23:18, 15 Jul 2016.

PandaTar, Kayna - Yeah, terrorists acts have less probability in the countries that did not involved in the "muslim conflicts in problem regions". Anyway this "protection" is  a very slithery, because the brains of the anger radicals is a hell dark...

Salamandre - Please sorry me too, because I do not give a .... of whom the post has been created, if there nonsense posted, I will type - this ... is a nonsense.
That is I called "The Internet baby!"

Salamandre said:
When he speaks about civilization destroyed from within, is not about bombs, planes or any weapon. Is about identity loss and cultural dilution.


Oh yeah..... So do you scared that immigrants will cause you too wear a mask on your wife make a beard for yourself? . And What actually your superior "identity" is, and how the darn immigrants killing it? O_O Perhaps the immigrants will cause you too lose a freedom, immigrants will forbid you to use your language, or they will forbid ethnic-festivals or what?

Maurice - looks a very weird, IMHO
+1 Islam brainwashing
+1 Christianity brainwashing
+1 Crusade madness
+1 200 years ago refreshing started (and the Uncle Same was a darn pioneer of this )
-1 Not the only Middle East is still in "dark age", almost the full Africa too.
-1 You somehow forgot about the "COLD WAR", about the export to Middle East and Africa, some brainwashing political ideologies, you forgot about the export of War-technologies, about the export of Industrial Weapons, you forgot about a using of radical Islamic organization and feeding them in the time "Cold War", about the endless , military conflicts poverty, and suffering that all this stuff caused...
+1 For different Islam exists , there are radical Islam, and more modern, the more tolerate Islam (actually I think this Islam is modified from the original nonsense, but still it has a many followers)
-1 From a "firm and hard answer".

1) Not the Islamic radicals came to the "West", The "West" came to the Islamic idiots, to their "areal", and the only thing that they need is an enemy that drops bombs to the rural folks, that in finish became a "Islamic soldiers" .

2) The Democracy, the Freedom of Religion, the Freedom of Speech is DOMINANT CULTURES, it's cannot be bated in the peaceful manner by archaic Islam nonsense... In military manner this is impossible too, Islamic countries cannot conquer Europe in military way.
Your "hard and firm" answer" will produce play for the Islamic radicals opportunity. This is obviously. Or perhaps you have no other way to utilize your expensive army
. I am joking.

3) In general " The Free Open Globalized Culture of West" >>> "Closed Islamic archaic Stuff of East" on the same territory. With time The Islamic folks will be assimilated, but Western Radicals will try to brake this way of things, because they have the same deseasess as their East colleges... IMHO.  

Elodin - Mr. Elodin, please do not wake up my inside troll beast , because you are SO-O-O-O FAR from a real life....

What kind of veteran that saw a WAR! a DARN WAR. Will say such nonsense as you said, I try to hold my beast... inside , where the hell you was in war? Sitting on 3 times food supplying and hitting a single under age idiot that hold AK-riffle with a frigging aircraft strike, only fuel of which cost more than ... a .... a whole village with an inhabitants included, were actually this idiot lives.  . . .
I MUST stop my troll now! STOP!
I have no offense to the Uncle Sam, actually one of my favorite quote maker and the history character is a J. Washington, and I hell have a geloussy about US. freedoms and democracy stuff...

You saying a darn NONSENSE about Islam - Idiotic Koran (especially after X c. A.D. - Ash'ari ) itself can be transcribed like a , I do not know, like a Kamusutra + Hippie + Cookbook.
Because Coran is just AN INSTRUMENT in the hands of radicals.. Because the most of an idiotic dumbness poor rural peoples (in the poor hell holes), hell do not care about any transcriptions, they JUST LISTEN what their "teacher" said...
Omg, use damned goodle.com at least
"Slay Them" - If They Attack You First"

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Galaad
Galaad

Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
posted July 16, 2016 12:54 AM

Kayna said:
France is under terrorist attacks as I write this. Multiple explosions and heavy trucks rolling over people. What do you guys think?


It is just the follow up of Charlie Hebdo and Bataclan, alas, not much to think about -no need to start all over again, same causes, same consequences.
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Maurice
Maurice

Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
posted July 16, 2016 02:37 AM

frostysh said:
-1 Not the only Middle East is still in "dark age", almost the full Africa too.


True enough, but what we're getting out of Africa seems to be mostly illegal immigrants. What happens there is fairly independent of what happens in the Middle East. While Africa is drenched in religious warfare as well, it's much more contained to the continent than the stuff that happens in Iraq and Syria.

Quote:
-1 You somehow forgot about the "COLD WAR", about the export to Middle East and Africa, some brainwashing political ideologies, you forgot about the export of War-technologies, about the export of Industrial Weapons, you forgot about a using of radical Islamic organization and feeding them in the time "Cold War", about the endless , military conflicts poverty, and suffering that all this stuff caused...


Actually, I didn't. I mentioned the invasions and the like by the Western world into the Middle East. I meant both Gulf Wars, but also for instance the stuff that happened in Afghanistan during the Cold War in the '80s as well as the invasion there about 10 years ago.

Quote:
-1 From a "firm and hard answer".

...

Your "hard and firm" answer" will produce play for the Islamic radicals opportunity. This is obviously. Or perhaps you have no other way to utilize your expensive army
. I am joking.




Not sure what you mean here? Turning a blind eye to the problem won't make it go away. Handling it softly and gently will only create a festering wound. In the Netherlands, we have a saying that literally translates as "soft doctors cause stinking wounds". If you want to cut out the festering wound, you'll have to cut out the rotting flesh. It means you will need to forbid organisations that propose rules that directly undermine the fundamental principles of our modern, Western world.

This goes hand in hand with providing those who are liable to fall into those radical thoughts and beliefs a viable alternative, to hopefully make them break away from it. Hopefully to actually embrace their life as it is, embedded within our society rather than in that backwater dump in the Middle East.

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Elodin
Elodin


Promising
Legendary Hero
Free Thinker
posted July 16, 2016 03:26 AM
Edited by Elodin at 20:18, 16 Jul 2016.

Quote:
If you will mess with Islam and mosques, you will find that numbers of terrorists will rise a VERY quickly... Of course if it's not your goal.. 



It is certainly not wise to allow a mosque to preach jihad and jihadists to organize and plan there.  Islamic terrorists would love to intimidate the West and into ignoring mosques that support them.  

Appeasement does not work but unfortunately the West has spineless leaders at the moment.

Quote:

If the Europe will "push" harder to the immigrants, this will not make a terrorists attack less number, this will have actually opposite effect - IMHO. 



Jihadis have already arrived with the "refugees." Everywhere they go there is mass rape and more acts of terror.

Every nation has an obligation to protect it's people.  Not having a secure border and tight immigration control is an invitation to the jihadists.

Quote:
This is looks like Soviet Union communistic ideology - "the traitor of the peoples



No.  Saying that preaching jihad or planning terror attacks is treason is not " communist ideology."  If a citizen wages jihad or provides material support for jihad on America that fits our definition of treason.

Quote:
Terrorists are muslim radicals - the same radical are in Christianity to



No, there are no Christians waging holy war.  The vast majority of terrorist attacks across the globe are because of someone thinking he is pleasing Allah.  

Point to any New Testament passage that says a Christian can punish any sinner for any sin.  Not there.  Point to any Christian denomination that says to conduct a holy war against anyone.  You can't.  Show me a video of Christian terror groups blowing up airports or hotels or beheading groups of people in the name of Jesus.  You can't.

Jihad is a concept that has been in Islam since it's founding.  Jesus said not to kill unbelievers but to preach to them, to love them, to pray for them, and to do good to them.

Mohammed and his disciples beheaded people and established a kingdom.  Jesus said he has no earthly kingdom and the only act of violence one of his disciples committed got a rebuke.

In your first post you claimed ignorance of Christian teachings now you claim to know Christianity. Strange.

Quote:
Christians and Muslims, this is just a crime, and this is just a criminal habits


No, the mass rapes are jihad designed to terrorize women and force them into Sharia compliant clothing.  The link I posted showed that.

Quote:
 And actually the war like this produce a HELL LOT of suffering = a HELL lot of RADICALS = a hell lot of terrorists that hates anythings, even the muslims who not hates that them hates :"D . 



I know from personal experience the hell of war.  The thing is war is being waged on the West.  The only question is "when will the West begin to wage war?" Destroying the califate of course will not stop terror but it will deny them a place to train and plan and deny income from oil and taxes.  It will also demt them a claim the Allah is blessing them.  Destruction of Islamic State will result in fewer jihadist recruits.

Jihad

Quote:
According to the traditional Muslim outlook, humanity is divided into two groups: the followers of Islam who are called "believers," and all non-Muslims, who are called "infidels." It is the duty of the Muslims to propagate the one true faith -- Islam -- throughout the world. Should the infidels refuse to embrace Islam, jihad is the means to be used to vanquish them. 
 
Among the infidels, Islam distinguishes between two main groups: "idolaters" or "polytheists" on the one hand, and the "People of the Book" -- Jews and Christians -- on the other. The People of the Book are granted special status in Islam, and their fate is different from that of the polytheist infidels. The Muslims are commanded to fight the People of the Book until they either accept Islam or agree to pay the poll tax (jizya). The basis for dealing with them is laid down in the Koran: "Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, of the People of the Book, until they pay the jizya out of hand, in a state of submission..." (Koran 9:29). By paying jizya, the People of the Book indicate that they submit to Muslim rule and accept the status of protected people, called in Arabic ahl al-dhimma. 
 
Just as humanity is divided into believers and infidels, the world itself is also divided into the abode of Islam (dar al-Islam), namely the region under Muslim rule, and the abode of war (dar al-harb), referring to all lands not yet under Muslim rule, which must be conquered by the sword, i.e., through jihad. 
 

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Galaad
Galaad

Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
posted July 16, 2016 10:53 AM

Elodin said:
The vast majority of terrorist attacks across the globe are because of someone thinking he is pleasing Allah.


Regarding what is currently happening in France, it is just pay back since our beloved politicians started this.
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Kayna
Kayna


Supreme Hero
posted July 16, 2016 06:29 PM

The inspiration wasn't Islam or ISIS, it was Stephen King's Christine. You god damn racists!

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frostysh
frostysh


Bad-mannered
Famous Hero
WHY?
posted July 17, 2016 12:10 AM
Edited by frostysh at 00:12, 17 Jul 2016.

Maurice said:

True enough, but what we're getting out of Africa seems to be mostly illegal immigrants. What happens there is fairly independent of what happens in the Middle East. While Africa is drenched in religious warfare as well, it's much more contained to the continent than the stuff that happens in Iraq and Syria.


Hell no, of course.
Do you know a somethings about Libya - hell hole, Nigeria - hell hole, Algeria - hell hole, and MANY others Boko Haram - madness, ISIS - madness?
Do you think the Boko Haram, and ISIS like stuff is disconected?
Do you think the terr.org. like this ones, "just appear" when you saw its in the News BBC, eating your good food and drinking perfect coffee taht came from Cout di Voar , lol... , 'em sorry for trolling.

And there not only "religious" warfare... IMHO - results of "Cold War" messing warfare, i.e. South West stuff and the bloody, bloody stuff that connected..

Maurice said:

Actually, I didn't. I mentioned the invasions and the like by the Western world into the Middle East. I meant both Gulf Wars, but also for instance the stuff that happened in Afghanistan during the Cold War in the '80s as well as the invasion there about 10 years ago.


And you mentioned nothing about Africa and exporting the destructive, the braindamaging-mass-manipulating things to the Africa, and Middle East from the "West". But perhaps I must read you more carefully,  

Maurice said:


Not sure what you mean here? Turning a blind eye to the problem won't make it go away. Handling it softly and gently will only create a festering wound. In the Netherlands, we have a saying that literally translates as "soft doctors cause stinking wounds". If you want to cut out the festering wound, you'll have to cut out the rotting flesh. It means you will need to forbid organisations that propose rules that directly undermine the fundamental principles of our modern, Western world.



. What a deep look inside the problem .Omg, wtf .
Wow, you are really wondered me..., even more than radical-christian Elodin charity, forgiveness and goodness, with his a "very politics against immigrants..." and the " impotent political buffoons" that cannot look in truth about "war against western civilization by barbarians". wHahhahaw .

What exactly did mentioned by yourself under "firm and hard answer"?

--- The all immigrants living under The Laws of European Unions , i.e. the immigrants in France, lives under - The Law of the France, if the doing something criminal-like = they will get a punishments like all others. This is "hard and firm" for you

--- What the hell you means under it's "to cut out the rotting flesh", what do you want to "cut off"? Or you just dropping your, hmm, your all-honored words like a Elodin and markkur, without any knowledge and without any "hard-back spine" which stands before they words?

--- What do you want "to forbid", do you want to forbid ISIS, there actually the all terr.organizations are forbid .. Or I am wrong. Except ..  , ohh whatever.

Maurice said:

This goes hand in hand with providing those who are liable to fall into those radical thoughts and beliefs a viable alternative, to hopefully make them break away from it. Hopefully to actually embrace their life as it is, embedded within our society rather than in that backwater dump in the Middle East.

Do you want to forbid radical thoughts ? Or what.
>_<.
How do you want to make a deal with those who are "like-minds" of terr.organization? O_O. Another words to nothings....?
In my 1st post there (page 1), I have mentioned the good tactics against terr.org, and I have make an examples - Kurdish folks in Syria.
But you just saying something a very "blurring" and I think this is a full nonsense.

The "backwater dump" - do you think the deport immigrant peoples because of terr. acts will reduce the amount of terr. attacks ? I am have a right understanding of your "blurring stuff"?

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Maurice
Maurice

Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
posted July 17, 2016 01:44 AM
Edited by Maurice at 01:46, 17 Jul 2016.

I admit I am having a hard time actually interpreting your post, but I will try to understand what you're trying to say.

frostysh said:
Do you think the Boko Haram, and ISIS like stuff is disconected?


Of course not, both are radical islamic groups that slaughter people by the hundreds. However, ISIS also stimulates a fight taking place in Europe, calling on radical elements to commit acts of terrorism within European countries. Boko Haram is happily slaughtering people by the droves just in Africa. Despite their name, they yet haven't done anything substantial towards Europe.

The mess that happens in Africa - while disheartening and saddening - is a fire burning over there, without actual influence in Europe. The stuff happening in Syria and Iraq does have backlashes into Europe and hence, being European, does concern me a whole lot more.

Quote:
--- What the hell you means under it's "to cut out the rotting flesh", what do you want to "cut off"?


To forbid islamic streams and currents like Salafism from European soil. Such groups should be put on a list of forbidden organisations, on the grounds of undermining Western democracy and the values of freedom and equality that come along with it. By outlawing those organisations you can root out their visibility and thereby (severly) reduce their growth. As of right now, those groups can happily conduct whatever they want, authorities don't really stop them from doing so. In the mean time, they are turning people away from our modern society.

After such groups have been forbidden, national security agencies will have to point out members of those groups, make sure they're apprehended and punished with either jail time (including rehabilitation by forcing them into a de-radicalisation program), exile to a Middle Eastern country (revoking any European passports they might have in the mean time) or both. Given the values and beliefs they hold high, they have no place within our society whatsoever.

Also, they should do a few more things in that light as well:
- Deny foreign imams from entering Europe to give lectures in mosques;
- Deny funding of foreign countries to build mosques in Europe;

Quote:
How do you want to make a deal with those who are "like-minds" of terr.organization? O_O. Another words to nothings....?


No, that's not what I said. I talked specifically about people who are caught in a hopeless situation. Living here in Europe, unable to progress in life due to various obstacles (education, language, cultural misunderstandings, etc ...) and just not having anything to look forward to. Those people are susceptible to people who can manipulate them towards more radical thoughts. What I said was that those desparate people need to get a way out of that hopelessness, to see a better future for themselves.

As it is, most of the terrorist attacks in Europe have been commited by people who have been born and raised in Europe, but who somehow lost touch with our European society and found a listening ear with extreme and radical islamic rethoric, which pointed out the enemy to be that European society in which they couldn't succeed. If we can prevent them from falling into that hopeless situation to begin with, we prevent them from turning into radicals and thereby deny groups like ISIS potential recruits who can slaughter innocents in the name of islam.

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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted July 17, 2016 02:33 AM

Maurice said:
To forbid islamic streams and currents like Salafism from European soil. Such groups should be put on a list of forbidden organisations, on the grounds of undermining Western democracy and the values of freedom and equality that come along with it. By outlawing those organisations you can root out their visibility and thereby (severly) reduce their growth. As of right now, those groups can happily conduct whatever they want, authorities don't really stop them from doing so. In the mean time, they are turning people away from our modern society.

So, in Netherlands, if an imam gives a speech and motivates the listeners to attack the infidels and declares jihad on them, he doesn't face any legal consequence?
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frostysh
frostysh


Bad-mannered
Famous Hero
WHY?
posted July 17, 2016 03:20 AM
Edited by frostysh at 03:33, 17 Jul 2016.

Elodin said:

It is certainly not wise to allow a mosque to preach jihad and jihadists to organize and plan there.  Islamic terrorists would love to intimidate the West and into ignoring mosques that support them.  
Appeasement does not work but unfortunately the West has spineless leaders at the moment.



Most Muslims today interpret Jihad as only a defensive form of warfare.

- - - Knowing the Enemy: Jihadist Ideology and the War on Terror, Mary R. Habeck

Let me think a bit... So in the Europe-Muslim societies, approx 1%  of the radicals .
In nations with significant Muslim populations, much disdain for ISIS
I mean there must be a hell less than in Pakistan hell hole, obviously. ..
This is usually totally enough to make a few terrorist attacks per year. (If the country have no muslims,you can easily send few peoples that is looks not like muslims, and they will make a terrorist attack. )

And when you came to this mass of peoples



And will say to them, that "hello, we will denied to you any praying with word of "Jihad" in this mosque", and this will obviously make a less percentage of radicals inside of muslim societies....
I can imagine the ISIS drull-throwing , brainwashing answer that rapidly become after - "They bomb and killing our childrens, the children of Islam! And now they deny to our brother praying in mosques! Barbarians, kill em' all, Allah with you brothers!"
And that will make a radical ideology less spread...

Dude, nono-no-no, Man, nah, no this one, , wait a minute,  Mister combat-veteran Elodin, pure and all-goodness charity Christian, The all Forgiveness and Peaceful God bless with you, I just want to said that you are genius! Really....

And like always, the "spineless west politicians", have no idea about this ingenious tactics, of course the peaceful and all-forgiveness Christian Mr. Elodin is a far more "spine-hard" , yeah...

Elodin said:

Jihadis have already arrived with the "refugees." Everywhere they go there is mass rape and more acts of terror.


You have no idea what exactly this stupid "Jihad" means, do you?

Please read more about this stupid word, somewhere, in Wikipedia i.e., or just ask some muslims that you know to explain it for you, , because you have a no reactions to the resources that I have posted... And a like always, you continuing the "ingenious radical ideas of the pure-Christian-hardspine-combat-veteran" posting...>_<.  


Islam believer, aprroximately through the Earth (2014)

The criminal situation of a "refugees" areas - this is one alone thing, and hell it is have a poor connection with Islam itself..
Islam, actually a well-ordered religion, and the punishment for a crimes there a pretty tough...

When the terrorist became more often? Is this somehow connected to the population of the muslim in Europe or U.S.
Do you really think if the very powerful terrorist organization, that has been planned a terrorist attack to the ~100 millions population country can stop a thing that this country have no muslim immigrants
Mr. combat-veteran, , do even, somehow, somewhere learned how to make a diversion i the enemy camp, I do not know, "Hoo haa, killing machine' , omg my troll became outside... I must stop it.

Now switch ON your super-combat-veteranian brain, and place yourself at point of "General" (terrorists organizations are MILITARY organizations, that all time of their existence doing only things - the war, the terror, etc.... economy and trading of course included) that is planned the terrorist attack...
Do you really believe that it is possible to avoid at least one such attack per year for a victim country that have a NO single muslim inside with ~60 million population and 650,000 km^2 area (France)  

Elodin said:

Every nation has an obligation to protect it's people.  Not having a secure border and tight immigration control is an invitation to the jihadists.


What do you mean whe you saying "a tight" immigration control"
Do you think the "tight immigration control" can stop a professional killer organization like ISIS from a killing of i.e. French peoples O_o.
What about the muslim of France nationality, or what about of the peoples who lives in the France by long time and have a dual nationality


Elodin said:

No.  Saying that preaching jihad or planning terror attacks is treason is not " communist ideology."  If a citizen wages jihad or provides material support for jihad on America that fits our definition of treason.


Yes. This is actually the same methods that Red Ones using, oops, used .
"Preaching Jihad" - What the hell do you mean under it? You are total incompetent in Islam, if I am incompetent in Christianity, and even in Islam, I am asking question in whom knows something about that, but your like, like a pure genius combatant-veteran Christian , you can make a definition of thing that you actually saw only in the "Camelot cartoons" and in the "hollywood cinematography" ?



Elodin said:

No, there are no Christians waging holy war.  The vast majority of terrorist attacks across the globe are because of someone thinking he is pleasing Allah.


With this words, you are blowing up the before words of yourself, because your offense DIRECTLY on the another religion, without a SINGLE darn clue that this stupid religion by ITSELF provocative a "Holy War" against an another one...
And hell the Crusade-cannibals may was a little disagree with you too.
Of course the Islam have some problems, but the roots of terrorism no the Islam itself.. This is obviously.
>_<. Are , hmmm,... mr. combat-veteran Christian Elodin, do you know HOW many muslims in the Earth? ~2 billions . Do you know how many muslim inside the Uncle Sam territory ~60,000,000.
Can you realize with your ingenious combat-veteran's pure-all-forgiveness Christian brain, that if the Islam by itself was a "Holy War" aggressive religion, US then will obtain a local CIVIL WAR instead,.,,

Elodin said:

Point to any New Testament passage that says a Christian can punish any sinner for any sin.  Not there.  Point to any Christian denomination that says to conduct a holy war against anyone.  You can't.  Show me a video of Christian terror groups blowing up airports or hotels or beheading groups of people in the name of Jesus.  You can't.


Point a darn one single passage of New Testament which allow to the "West" countries make a mass-industrial-weapon supply for a radical nationalistic, and the radical islamic organization in Africa, through a Cold War. The same Middle East. Ethiopia vs South Africa, Pakistan vs India, Afghanistan vs Red Ones, Do you remember an apartheid? Do you remember Gulfs Wars? Libya ? - there all on this territories are Islam for many years... And yeah, Islam helps the terrorists to recruit the forces, but this is not the reason of terror exists, as I mentioned this many times...
What the hell you want to obtain when you dropping the bombs via carpet bombardment over the head of a stupid, low civilized, civilian folks in the hell holes, and squashing them under ruins by thousands and thousands? Do you think the dead ones have no friends/families/etc And that friend/families/etc know for thousands of years the meaning of word "bloody revenge".

Your pathetic radicalism, will hurt innocent muslim folks = more terrorists which leading obviously to the more terr. attacks / year. And your pathetic radicalism, will do ABSOLUTELY no harm to the powerful braindamaged terrorists organization like i.e. ISIS are, .  


Elodin said:

Jihad is a concept that has been in Islam since it's founding.  Jesus said not to kill unbelievers but to preach to them, to love them, to pray for them, and to do good to them.


Eat this one - Siege of Ma'arra

- "Yum-yum, a good fresh young saracine, I need more species."
- "Gunter, do you will eat this leg?"
- "Where is my Holy... cookbook?
"

opps, this was my inside troll

Mr. combat-veteran-pure Christian, with allforgiveness God inside , from what a planet you are, this is Earth with a bloody hell Medieval Crusade Madness, the Inquisition's terror, even the darn nazi-stuff!

Quote:
Hitler with Cesare Orsenigo, the Catholic Church's nuncio to Germany, in 1935

Nazism

The religions has been used for thousands of years to make an influence to large masses of peoples, to provoke a wars, a mass-murders, intolerance, etc... Christianity is no exception from this list!
In same way the Islam has been used now

Is this makes any sense for you, Elodin?

Elodin said:

Mohammed and his disciples beheaded people and established a kingdom.  Jesus said he has no earthly kingdom and the only act of violence one of his disciples committed got a rebuke.
In your first post you claimed ignorance of Christian teachings now you claim to know Christianity. Strange.
No, the mass rapes are jihad designed to terrorize women and force them into Sharia compliant clothing.  The link I posted showed that.


Coran, have a pretty brainless thing about women, as Christianity Europe have before ~XVIII-XIX c A.D., the marriage even if the women actually still not borne and under age marriage (do you remember "Romeo and Juliet", the female one was , as I think 12 years old, and she was STILL not married) , the hard punishments for sex with other men, hard dress-code, hard punishments for disobedience to husband, etc..
But this stupid Islamic traditions have few thousands years old, even before Islam was born... And this is of course not a cause of terror, but in general yeah, for women to walk over street of muslim city without proper dress-code, this is something like someone will, I am sorry, make a piss over the Constitution of the United States of America near the White House .

Elodin said:

I know from personal experience the hell of war.  The thing is war is being waged on the West.  The only question is "when will the West begin to wage war?" Destroying the califate of course will not stop terror but it will deny them a place to train and plan and deny income from oil and taxes.  It will also demt them a claim the Allah is blessing them.  Destruction of Islamic State will result in fewer jihadist recruits.


Really , I think are saw war only on tv... Because if you was something like soldier in the poor countries like a Iraq, Libya, Syria, you just cannot write such nonsense...
you see, the History of the Middle East, Africa - is the  90% history of suffering, poverty, war conflict (in which "West" and the Red Ones was involved from the begging...) - Cold War

You see, a good example is Syria , if the Syria has been compared to the ANY of "West" countries.
i.e. France - peace, Syria - war, France - roads, hospitals, cinema, fastfood, Syria - no cinema, no fastfood, hospitals occupied by militants. France - peoples going on their work, playing in games, gym, idknow, restaurants, sex, etc. Syria - horror almost everywhere, death, poverty, suffering, etc..
And the same picture have a many poor hell-holes for decades...

And you are talking that the "west" is waged on war..? The 2nd World War in Europe, this is what I called "waged" . But not what happens now.

Elodin said:

Jihad


DISCOVERTHENETWORKS.ORG
A GUIDE TO THE POLITICAL LEFT


whaaaaaaaahahhaha This is actually what you are posting there - nonsense, radicalism, and propaganda, so the resource is a perfect for you
My "West"  Knowing the Enemy: Jihadist Ideology and the War on Terror, Mary R. Habeck citations
cannot even stand till your superior truth in a roll

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Salamandre
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posted July 17, 2016 03:56 AM

Terror in forum.

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Corribus
Corribus

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posted July 17, 2016 05:04 AM

@frostysh

Welcome to the forums. We are glad to have you here. However please trouble yourself to read the Code of Conduct. Our community is based on mutual respect for other posters. Putting smiley faces after statements aimed at ridiculing other members posts and ideas does not change the fact that they are ridiculing. Try to think of ways you can better draft you replies without the sarcasm and scorn.

You may also consider that the topic of the thread is the recent events in France, so please try not to drag the conversation into a generalized debate about the merits of Christianity vis-à-vis other religions.
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Maurice
Maurice

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posted July 17, 2016 01:46 PM
Edited by Maurice at 13:46, 17 Jul 2016.

artu said:
So, in Netherlands, if an imam gives a speech and motivates the listeners to attack the infidels and declares jihad on them, he doesn't face any legal consequence?


When it's discovered that such a thing happens or has happened, our politicians speak their resentment about it, about how it's counter-productive to integration. If there's enough public upheaval about it, there's a chance that the imam in question is denied a visum and thereby not allowed to enter the country ... but yeah, that's about it. No legal action or anything.

Recently there was a salafistic group wanting to start an islamic school in Rotterdam but there was some controversy about the origin of the funds (shady organisation in Germany, with roots in Saudi Arabia, as it turned out) and only when that issue became known did our politicians decide not to support the formation of the school in question.

Freedom of speech and freedom of religion are at the core of our law system. Those groups are abusing those aspects to undermine them. And our politicians are looking and doing nothing. It's not surprising that right-wing parties are gaining such an amount of support these days in Europe, because the left-wing parties are only bending over even deeper than they have already done in the past.

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Elodin
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posted July 17, 2016 05:00 PM
Edited by Elodin at 17:03, 17 Jul 2016.

jihad at nice
Quote:

Nice terror attack: Bouhlel sent text message minutes before attack asking for more weapons, as couple are reportedly arrested on suspicion of supplying gun



So the jihad by truck had support from a terror cell it appears. I think so far 7 people have been arrested now in connection with the attack.

Quote:
In a pessimistic interview with the Journal du Dimanche, Manual Valls, the French Prime Minister, has warned that terrorism will be a part of the country's daily life for a long time.



Dark days ahead for France.

Twenty five percent of the youth in France are Muslim.   Fourth two percent of French Muslim youth support suicide bombings.  Valls is right to be pessimistic.
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frostysh
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posted July 18, 2016 02:18 AM
Edited by frostysh at 02:18, 18 Jul 2016.

Corribus - okay-dokey smokey, I mean, okay I will try hold on my own troll inside.
But I do not like a guys that is posting nonsense like "the terrorist act has been done by muslim, so the all muslims is bad, the Islam is bad, we must pushing on them harder, not like our impotent politic doing, much more harder bla-bla-bla-bla..." - For me this is looks like a "Lenin on the armored personal carrier" .

Maurice - the freedom of religion, the freedom of speech, etc obviously means that you cannot make an attack on the religion if this religion has no disjointedness with a Law (Civil, Criminal, etc).
Does Islam by itself have this disjointedness? Does muslim is automatically means " a criminal"? What will be if you will push hard on muslims without a reason in Law... ?


Elodin -  

The first - http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/07/17/nice-terror-attack-police-vans-blocking-promenade-withdrawn-hour1/

looks a very WEIRD. "ISIS Soldiers" - like a whole ISIS itself usually are a braindamaged radical religious fanatics..
The thing like "drugs" can lead one of this soldiers to lose his arms...
This "Nice attacker" looks like a casual criminal with hell no connections to the darn ISIS itself.
Obviously any idiot can use a word "jihad" and blow up something, even this particular idiot even not a muslim...

The second link. - http://www.jewishpress.com/news/breaking-news/42-of-french-muslim-youth-support-suicide-bombing-young-us-muslims-not-far-behind/2016/07/15/

Looks like total nonsense or a hard propaganda.



First, WHERE the hell is source of this statistic...
For second: All Uk Muslims lol? The all muslims, really O-o . The hell monumental research has been done

For third: 35% of something + 19% of something + 16% of something + 59% of something = 129% of something, perhaps this is means that the questions in the poll can intersect each others, but still this is a very WEIRD...

And of course the comments of our .... huh, my troll is stopped.., The comments of mr. Elodin makes me believe that Christians are a very smart, a good alignment peoples...

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Maurice
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posted July 18, 2016 10:38 AM

frostysh said:
Maurice - the freedom of religion, the freedom of speech, etc obviously means that you cannot make an attack on the religion if this religion has no disjointedness with a Law (Civil, Criminal, etc).
Does Islam by itself have this disjointedness? Does muslim is automatically means " a criminal"? What will be if you will push hard on muslims without a reason in Law... ?


Are you just trolling me or do you really not understand what I'm saying?
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markkur
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posted July 18, 2016 11:03 AM

Maurice said:
Basically, the whole mess we're seeing is as old as mankind. Religion has been the banner for many centuries, but if it weren't for religion, mankind would have found another excuse to slaughter one another.

The base premise is power. A few people at the top that use brainwashing techniques to manipulate a large crowd of people, indoctrinating them with propaganda as well as threatening them with punishment (not often lethal in nature) if they don't adher to what's being pushed their way. In this particular case, a muslim who turns away from islam is considered a heretic who must die for the treason he commits to what other muslims believe is the true faith.

Europe isn't unfamiliar with this concept either, as the Catholic church performed similar feats back in the Middle Ages. The whole crusade stuff was fueled in the same way, with untold suffering not just in the Holy Land but also in countries on the way there (Byzantium anyone?) or in Eastern Europe / Russia. Keep the people dumb, point out an enemy and send them that way and they will march to war for you, it's that simple.

In Europe this all changed about 200 years ago, when enlightenment started to happen and people started to question some of the doctrine they were being spoonfed. Daring to think outside the box and then finding that it's not all hell and damnation then quickly boosted our technological advancements, as well as giving birth to concepts like democracy and freedom, an abolishment from slavery and equality of man and woman. It's been a long, hard road and despite this being the case for the most part in the modern, Western world, there are still issues that conflict with it. One well-known one is the inequality of salary for a job, where a man generally gets paid more than a woman.

The world in the Middle East is still centuries behind us, in terms of free thinking. We only didn't notice it because for the general population both in the Middle East and in the Western world, there was little to no communication, no interaction, no insight in how the others lived their lives. With the advent of modern communication technologies, we've been given a look into each others' way of life - and there's mutual resentment. For example, we react negatively to the suppression of women in the Middle East, they react negatively to the freedom women have in our world. It's a culture clash.

Couple that to the fact that the islam is still at the stage that it wants to dominate the world, including the mass migration that has taken place after the second World War as well as the current mass migration that's happening, and the people in high places in the Middle East are whipping their followers into a frenzy to go to war. The influence of the Western World with the various wars and invasions in the past few decades haven't done any good either to put us in a good light in their eyes.

And yet, something that's also prevalent, is that we see the islam act and react the way we had with Christianity during the (late) Middle Ages too: various different directions, all claiming to follow the same God, butchering eachother with the claim that the other party is composed of sinners. Catholics, Christians, Protestants, etc ... have all had bloody conflicts among themselves. I'm pretty sure there were numerous religious leaders at the head of those directions who were as fanatical as some imams we see nowadays preaching to kill the sinners and non-believers. It's a bit enlarged though, in our current age, given how much further one can reach nowadays with a message to other people. In the past, you had your immediate region, but these days you can reach the other side of the world.

With our elevated social structure and society compared to what we had back in those days, we now live side by side in relative peace. The islam still has a ways to go to get there. I have no doubt they will get there one day, but that day may still be decades, if not centuries off - and in that time, we'll have to face up to their crusade. Personally, I think we need to come up with a firm and hard answer, otherwise they'll wash over us like a flood. Tolerance should never be given to intolerance and as such, organisations (like salafism) who are preaching against the fundamental values of liberty and equality that we hold for dear in our modern society, attempting to undermine them, should be forbidden and its agents actively being expelled from our Western world.

At the same time, the muslims who are adrift in our society and are looking for guidance should be helped and provided a viable alternative which steers them away from the more dangerous and brainwashing currents that exist within islam. After all, it's usually the group that has no expectations out of life, down in the gutter, who are most liable to fall to the only thing they have left, which is a more radical form of their religion, susceptible to the messages they spew forth as they put the blame of their predicament and failure in our society on our modern Western world, rather than their own shortcomings as part of the cultural differences that exist between our world and theirs.


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Elodin
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posted July 18, 2016 03:18 PM
Edited by Elodin at 15:47, 18 Jul 2016.

I am not a Catholic and would not presume to defend everything the Catholic church has done.  However, the crusades had nothing in common with jihad.  The crusades began when Muslims began conquering Christian lands,in order to push back the Muslim invaders.

Today Muslims are waging jihad (holy war) on the West but the West is not really pushing back.

Islam is mandated to conquer the world.  Christianity is not.

Edit:

French Prime Minister Valls said at the memorial service:  “Times have changed and we should learn to live with terrorism. We have to show solidarity and collective calm. France has been hit in its soul on the 14 July, our national day." He was soundly booed.  I have hope the People of the West are waking up and will force the "leaders" to take action.


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Salamandre
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posted July 18, 2016 03:59 PM

Yep, all over the media we are taught "the day when we will no longer light candles for victims, we will become like Isis".

I only hope we will find enough candles.

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JollyJoker
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posted July 18, 2016 05:17 PM

*Sigh*

I wonder how often obvious things must be repeated:

1) There is no such things as "the Islam" as in some unified front to conquer the world. The overwhelming majority of all people in the world just want to live in peace and quiet.
2) People with enough time and epecially money are necessary to fund "terrorism", which is a shadow war with a specific goal.
3) the goal of terrosrism is destabilization and to provoke harsh reactions against the general population or specific ethnic, religious or other parts to start a spiral of escalation and find followers in the target countries.
4) There is no practical way to stop suicide bombings or attacks, because there is neither a way to avoid illegal border crossings nor a way to stop hateful oil billionaires funding terrorist activity short of the UN troops conquering the Near East - and fast -, which won't happen.

What we already have is that the whole world is under surveillance, including communications and the internet. The real danger that we face is losing or sacrificing our civil and democratic rights on the altar of general "security".

Keep in mind that the Brits did NOT manage in a century to stop or "defeat" the IRA and the threat of exploding bombs everywhere in Britain. Nor did Spain defuse the ETA threat, until the ETA itself declared the fight over (ETA killed nearly 1000 people in 50 years).

Keep also in mind that you cannot conquer anything with suicide bombings, and they don't win you a war - just ask the IRA and the ETA -, which means, all that jihad nonsense is just blowing the actual threat completely out of proportion.

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