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Heroes Community > Heroes 3.5 - WoG and Beyond > Thread: [Official Thread] HoMM 3: Horn of the Abyss - Ideas and Suggestions
Thread: [Official Thread] HoMM 3: Horn of the Abyss - Ideas and Suggestions This thread is 81 pages long: 1 10 20 30 40 50 ... 53 54 55 56 57 ... 60 70 80 81 · «PREV / NEXT»
MKC
MKC

Tavern Dweller
posted January 02, 2019 11:04 AM
Edited by MKC at 09:11, 03 Jan 2019.

RMG editor suggestions / fixes

I had been working with RMG editor for a few months now. And I've compiled a small list of features and fixes that I'd like to see in the future.

1. Option to edit multiple Links, same as with zones.
2. Add sorting by Object type in Objects tab. Sorting by alphabet in Artifacts / Spells tabs.
3. Pandora boxes, quest rewards with creatures need a separate option for upgraded units only.
3.5 Option to force all zones to have different factions (any other than what player chose at the start). And when there's more than 10 zones with at least one town, then it will only repeat factions from the list of those that are not taken by the player.
4. Ability to control game balance. I'm thinking something along the lines of WC3 map editor, where you could pretty much make your own game within it (like dota). This would solve a dilemma for Hota crew where they are sort of hesitant to implement certain changes in the game that might upset some oldschool players, while still giving an option to make such changes for those who want them. Without a need for any external mods and such. I think it's a win win scenario for everyone. So basically people who want alternative game balance would just play different templates. Like even now, personally I much prefer custom templates, because I have more control over what will be in my game.

More specifically:
Edit all stats for units, buildings, heroes and artifacts (including AI values)
Changing spell mechanics, magic school it belongs to, strength and aoe size (maybe even with ability to write your own code to make new effects)
Secondary Skill editing stats and mechanics
Objects - rewards and / or option for mirror rewards, removing terrain restrictions for certain objects, relative distance priority (relative to town, objects of the same type and roads)

Actually now that I'm thinking about it.. I'm probably asking for a lot here. I can't really imagine how much work it would take to implement everything in 4th. And maybe majority of players don't care so much about custom templates to begin with, so there's just not enough incentive to add such extensive features at this point.
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krs
krs


Famous Hero
posted January 03, 2019 10:32 AM
Edited by krs at 10:34, 03 Jan 2019.

Factory idea:
There could be more variation between towns in H3 and some more synergy between creatures of different towns. Make Factory's lineup a little different from your standard 7 creatures faction and in the same time add some synergy with existing ("mechanical") creatures.

Base idea:
Add a building that transforms golems into one of the Factory's higher tier creatures (EG: clockwerk golems). (Similar to Skeleton Transformer but for golems)

It will allow reuse of golems from Golem Factory.
It will allow reuse of golems from a Tower secondary town.
It will allow reuse of golems from a Tower Hero's starting army.
Josephine could apply her golem bonuses to this creature. (If the creature would be a golem).
Golem Factory map object could be a boost.
Golems from a Refugee Camp could be used.

Extended idea:
Once you construct this building you cannot build your level 7 building in Factory! Instead you upgrade this transformation building to allow you to construct here your level 7 units from giants / titans and/or many golems (allowing conversion of a lower tier unit in a level 7)

In addition of the above...
It will allow reuse of Giants from Experimental Shop
It will allow reuse of Giants from a Tower secondary town.

This will probably mean making giants/titans fully non-living. But that's a needed cleanup anyway (same for Gargoyles and Crystal dragons)

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Czarlson
Czarlson


Hired Hero
posted January 03, 2019 05:00 PM
Edited by Czarlson at 17:45, 03 Jan 2019.

Below I added  in my opinion the crucial  stuffs to balance:
1. Secondary Skills like:
Eagle Eye, First Aid, Diplomacy, Learning, Mysticism, Sorcery - needs to be buffed.
2. Earth Magic needs to be nerfed,  especially slow. Some crucial spells should to be added to another schools of magic  e.g. Town Portal.

Developers has so many proposition on this forum to balance H3. I hope that they will do some modifications in the balance of the game sooner than the new expansion come out.

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planetavril
planetavril


Known Hero
posted January 03, 2019 06:38 PM

Czarlson said:
Below I added  in my opinion the crucial  stuffs to balance:
1. Secondary Skills like:
Eagle Eye, First Aid, Diplomacy, Learning, Mysticism, Sorcery - needs to be buffed.
2. Earth Magic needs to be nerfed,  especially slow. Some crucial spells should to be added to another schools of magic  e.g. Town Portal.

Developers has so many proposition on this forum to balance H3. I hope that they will do some modifications in the balance of the game sooner than the new expansion come out.


they'll do what they think is best, if you do not like something, study the reverse engineer for years and then improve the things you do not like

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MKC
MKC

Tavern Dweller
posted January 04, 2019 10:28 AM
Edited by MKC at 10:30, 04 Jan 2019.

Pandora's Box with Spells should be giving a free spell book to a hero. With all the spells it should have, but if said hero doesn't have high enough Wisdom for some of those spells then they should be grayed out. So like they're there but you just can't cast them until you up your Wisdom.
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Lambda
Lambda

Tavern Dweller
posted January 16, 2019 03:31 AM

Hey!

First, I'd like to say thanks for HotA and that I enjoy it a lot.

One thing that got worse (for me) is that enemy stack sizes have changed from few/several/pack to 1-4/5-9/10-19. Is there an option to disable this feature?

Thanks.

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Mordred06
Mordred06


Hired Hero
Grounf
posted January 16, 2019 10:04 AM

Lambda said:
Hey!

First, I'd like to say thanks for HotA and that I enjoy it a lot.

One thing that got worse (for me) is that enemy stack sizes have changed from few/several/pack to 1-4/5-9/10-19. Is there an option to disable this feature?

Thanks.

Hi Lambda,
Not that I know of, I actually like the fact they modified this in the first place.. I used to have a file with the equivalent in numbers that I checked every now and then(bad memory I guess )
How come you prefer the previous way?
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"If you do not like something, change it. If you cannot change it, change your attitude"

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Lth3
Lth3


Known Hero
posted January 16, 2019 02:20 PM
Edited by Lth3 at 23:42, 24 Jan 2019.

Suggestion


more balancing adventure map spells - the boogeyman in the closet


Town Portal:

No Earth Magic - teleport to nearest town once per day and cost 600 movement points
Basic Earth Magic - teleport to chosen town and cost 600 movement points
Advanced Earth Magic - twice per day and cost 400 movement points
Expert Earth Magic - 200 movement points


Dimension Door:

No Air Magic - once per day and cost 800 movement points
Basic Air Magic - 600 movement points
Advanced Air Magic - 400 movement points
Expert Air Magic - 200 movement points


Fly:

No Air Magic - 60% penalty
Basic Air Magic - 40% penalty
Advanced Air Magic - 20% penalty
Expert Air Magic - no penalty


some tweaks may be here and there. most important factors:

1) Town Portal - max twice per day and need Earth Magic to really benefit
2) DD - once per day and also need Air Magic to really benefit (otherwise high cost, hence will not be spammed every turn)
3) Fly - situational without Air Magic and will be spammed with Air Magic (to keep Fly/DD more or less equally useful and benefiting more from Air Magic)

this way Earth=Air and not Earth>Air in my honest opinion !

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Maurice
Maurice

Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
posted January 16, 2019 03:34 PM

My suggestion for either spell would be to increase the effective range with increasing Spell School power.

Town Portal:
None: Teleport to a Town of choice within a radius of 10 tiles around the Hero.
Basic: same as None, but then 15 tiles radius.
Advanced: Same as None, but then 20 tiles radius.
Expert: Same as None, but then 25 tiles radius.

No restriction to the amount of teleports possible. Increasing skill level should reduce movement cost.

Dimension Door:
None: Teleport once per day to a free tile within a radius of 8 tiles around the Hero.
Basic: Same as None, but then 10 tiles radius.
Advanced: Same as None, but then 12 tiles radius.
Expert: Same as None, but then 15 tiles radius.

Note that this means it's possible to teleport to a tile outside the visible window, when centered around the Hero. Scrolling should be allowed when selecting the destination tile.

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The last Reasonable Steward of Good Game Design and a Responsible Hero of HC. - Verriker

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Lambda
Lambda

Tavern Dweller
posted January 16, 2019 04:36 PM

I'm not sure.. I've been playing since HoMM1 and it's always been that way. The number ranges are disturbing.. I imagine a scout reporting back with the enemy forces and they'd say "a few black dragons" not "1-4 black dragons".

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Lth3
Lth3


Known Hero
posted January 16, 2019 06:35 PM
Edited by Lth3 at 18:42, 16 Jan 2019.

Maurice said:
Town Portal:
None: Teleport to a Town of choice within a radius of 10 tiles around the Hero.
Basic: same as None, but then 15 tiles radius.
Advanced: Same as None, but then 20 tiles radius.
Expert: Same as None, but then 25 tiles radius.

No restriction to the amount of teleports possible. Increasing skill level should reduce movement cost.


how many towns do you usually have within 25 tile radius? this would make Town Portal nearly useless on bigger maps

Maurice said:
Dimension Door:
None: Teleport once per day to a free tile within a radius of 8 tiles around the Hero.
Basic: Same as None, but then 10 tiles radius.
Advanced: Same as None, but then 12 tiles radius.
Expert: Same as None, but then 15 tiles radius.

Note that this means it's possible to teleport to a tile outside the visible window, when centered around the Hero. Scrolling should be allowed when selecting the destination tile.



basically is the same as 1 or 2 DD per day as it is now

i think is not so easy to program as well, so i would guess it is not worth it if the end result is mostly the same. in my opinion, the aim is to weaken the skill from 2 DD as it is now. the fact that you can use one full DD with each scout heroe without Air Magic is a problem. coupled with at least Advanced Earth Town Portal players can ping-pong around the map very easily and early in the game. it becomes a deciding factor. too much emphasis on Earth Magic. your scouts do not need anything else - just Earth Magic to be able to do this. no need for Air Magic because one full DD for each of your heroes is already possible for only 300 move points. you cannot get that much effectiveness from Town Portal without Earth Magic. hence, now Earth>Air by far

lowering from current range, i.e. 5/7/9 tiles with Basic/Advanced/Expert is not an option as well, because it will be hard to jump mountains etc. unless it would not cost any movement points. i can see that working then, maybe

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Hourglass
Hourglass


Known Hero
posted January 16, 2019 07:20 PM
Edited by Hourglass at 19:24, 16 Jan 2019.

Lth3 said:
Maurice said:
Town Portal:
None: Teleport to a Town of choice within a radius of 10 tiles around the Hero.
Basic: same as None, but then 15 tiles radius.
Advanced: Same as None, but then 20 tiles radius.
Expert: Same as None, but then 25 tiles radius.

No restriction to the amount of teleports possible. Increasing skill level should reduce movement cost.


how many towns do you usually have within 25 tile radius? this would make Town Portal nearly useless on bigger maps


I would say that Maurice's general idea should still be considered. I think overall it would be a very fair way of nerfing Town portal. It would even give counterplay options for opponents to play around otherwise overpowered spell. However, you're right in both of your arguments. Even the 25 tile radius would be not much on anywhere else but small maps. (Had to test this on maps editor) Also, this would of course make the spell not all that useful on big maps. Perhaps the best way would be to make Town Portal scale depending on the map size?


I don't personally see the double Dimension door as a problem, if the Town Portal would actually be less powerfull. Now hero can jump around, and return to town to simply refill his mana, so there isn't any penalty in doing that. One way to limit DD usage would be to make it a Fire spell. I've never understood why DD is an Air spell? Fire lacks an adventure spell, and as Inferno has castle gate and teleporting devils, I have no problem of beliving that "moving throught portals and teleporting" can relate towards fire in HOMM universe. This would of course be a buff towards Fire magic in general.

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Lth3
Lth3


Known Hero
posted January 16, 2019 09:27 PM
Edited by Lth3 at 23:41, 24 Jan 2019.

Hourglass said:
I don't personally see the double Dimension door as a problem, if the Town Portal would actually be less powerfull. Now hero can jump around, and return to town to simply refill his mana, so there isn't any penalty in doing that.


double DD may not be the most obvious problem. but single DD that any heroe scout can use everyday for only 300 points is. you can easily make an army of scouts just transfering army with DD Scroll / Book of Air between each of them. each of them can DD to any place then TP back to town - transfer to next scout and repeat. while opponent may still be looking for his DD - this is too much tempo gained in a short period of time based on one factor only

consider 2 DD per day, but increased movement points for less expertise or no expertise in Air Magic should still stand


for 2x DD i would go for:

Lth3 said:
Dimension Door:

No Air Magic - once per day and cost 1000 movement points
Basic Air Magic - 700 movement points
Advanced Air Magic - twice per day and cost 600 movement points
Expert Air Magic - 500 movement points


otherwise:

Lth3 said:
Dimension Door:

No Air Magic - once per day and cost 800 movement points
Basic Air Magic - 600 movement points
Advanced Air Magic - 400 movement points
Expert Air Magic - 200 movement points



Hourglass said:
One way to limit DD usage would be to make it a Fire spell. I've never understood why DD is an Air spell? Fire lacks an adventure spell, and as Inferno has castle gate and teleporting devils, I have no problem of beliving that "moving throught portals and teleporting" can relate towards fire in HOMM universe. This would of course be a buff towards Fire magic in general.



if i had to go to this extreme, i would make Fly a Fire spell instead. water travelling through water and fire through land - in this analogy

this is another topic instead and doesn't change the fact that Dimension Door can be benefited from immensely without any magic school, unlike Town Portal requiring Advanced Earth Magic

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timmysoboy
timmysoboy

Tavern Dweller
posted January 17, 2019 04:42 AM

I'd love to see an option to costomize what characters are allowed / banned in RM games.  I'm a casual who sometimes likes to go ham with Galthran.  Otherwise I'm loving the direction HOTA has gone, and what appears to be getting teased.

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Orrinisthebest
Orrinisthebest


Known Hero
posted January 18, 2019 06:17 AM

timmysoboy said:
I'd love to see an option to costomize what characters are allowed / banned in RM games.  I'm a casual who sometimes likes to go ham with Galthran.  Otherwise I'm loving the direction HOTA has gone, and what appears to be getting teased.

You probably haven't heard of new Template Editor, somehow..

As to Town Portal why not just put the same restriction to it as DD ? I know being able to teleport to any desired town is too OP and makes Inferno's unique building completely useless but im sure most players would be annoyed if radius thing was applied.

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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted January 18, 2019 07:23 AM
Edited by phoenix4ever at 07:24, 18 Jan 2019.

Town Portal could also work like this:
Basic: Brings you to nearest town.
Advanced: Allows you to choose a town, out of 2 you are currently closest to.
Expert: Allows you to choose a town, out of 3 you are currently closest to.

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timmysoboy
timmysoboy

Tavern Dweller
posted January 18, 2019 07:24 PM
Edited by timmysoboy at 22:29, 18 Jan 2019.

Orrinisthebest said:
timmysoboy said:
I'd love to see an option to costomize what characters are allowed / banned in RM games.  I'm a casual who sometimes likes to go ham with Galthran.  Otherwise I'm loving the direction HOTA has gone, and what appears to be getting teased.

You probably haven't heard of new Template Editor, somehow..



*Edit*
So, I fiddled around with this and I believe I got it to work.  What I'd like to see, however, is something stupidly user-friendly and transparent.  For example, have it available under the "more options" tab, then turn that tab red if anything is changed from default.

Old text:
Sure feels good to be wrong...

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Lth3
Lth3


Known Hero
posted January 18, 2019 08:47 PM
Edited by Lth3 at 20:52, 18 Jan 2019.

Orrinisthebest said:
As to Town Portal why not just put the same restriction to it as DD ? I know being able to teleport to any desired town is too OP and makes Inferno's unique building completely useless but im sure most players would be annoyed if radius thing was applied.


that's what i'm talking about. both TP and DD have to be nerfed somehow, since they are the most important things in a full normal game currently

they should remain strong but their usage limited, to keep from swerving the balance to those who acquire it early from those who get it late or don't at all

phoenix4ever said:
Town Portal could also work like this:
Basic: Brings you to nearest town.
Advanced: Allows you to choose a town, out of 2 you are currently closest to.
Expert: Allows you to choose a town, out of 3 you are currently closest to.


still not gonna work on big XL+U templates like 6lm10 since there will be many towns and many portals. each player will be hopping around in portals and sub gates all over the map. the progression will not be linear and so towns will be far away disproportianately. on such template this spell gonna be useless no matter what range you give them if you can't reach your main towns this way

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krs
krs


Famous Hero
posted January 18, 2019 09:46 PM

Good propositions.

As a plus. These will make Town Gates even more desirable.

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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted January 18, 2019 10:15 PM
Edited by phoenix4ever at 22:17, 18 Jan 2019.

Lth3 said:
still not gonna work on big XL+U templates like 6lm10 since there will be many towns and many portals. each player will be hopping around in portals and sub gates all over the map. the progression will not be linear and so towns will be far away disproportianately. on such template this spell gonna be useless no matter what range you give them if you can't reach your main towns this way

Well better "useless" (going to 3 towns is still powerful) than completely game breaking.
A guy with Earth Magic and Town Portal VS a guy without = match already decided.
Town Portal to ALL towns, infinite amounts per day ruins so many things: You only need one hero, you never need to travel by water, you get infinite mana, making Mysticism, Intelligence, Scholar, Eagle Eye completely useless and then it ruins Inferno's expensive Castle Gates.
Town Portal in it's default form is just

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